Pelosi receives Communion in Vatican amid abortion debate

[Josie]

Pelosi receives Communion in Vatican amid abortion debate

U.S. House Speaker Nancy Pelosi has received Communion during a papal Mass in St. Peter’s Basilica, despite her position in support of abortion rights.

apnews.com

Pelosi met with Francis on Wednesday before the Mass and received a blessing, according to one of the Mass attendees.

While Francis presided over the Mass, he did not distribute Communion himself and Pelosi received the sacrament from one of the many priests who distributed it. From the time he was archbishop in Buenos Aires, Francis has rarely distributed Communion, precisely to prevent the sacrament from becoming politicized.


The Vatican is apparently broadcasting another message about not politicizing abortion. Six Supreme Court Justices are Catholic - John Roberts, Clarence Thomas, Samuel Alito, Sonia Sotomayor, Brett Kavanaugh and Amy Coney Barrett.

I've never understood the Catholic way of giving/refusing Communion. It should be a very personal you-and-God thing, not a priest's decision.

 

[dcsports]

How are morals unrelated to actions?
"Noted for his staunch conservatism, obstinacy in the face of survivors’ pleas for acknowledgment and accountability, and general clericalism, San Francisco Archbishop Salvatore J. Cordileone has firmly resisted publicly releasing an official list of clergy known to be credibly accused of child sexual abuse."

"Because we are dealing with public figures and public examples of cooperation in moral evil, this correction can also take the public form of exclusion from the reception of Holy Communion," writes Cordileone.

Survivors and advocates blast Archbishop for his refusal to disclose dozens of predator priests

Attorneys from Jeff Anderson & Associates will call on San Francisco church officials to publicly release the names, photos, and whereabouts of all credibly accused clerics, and all California bishops to let survivors 'have their day in court' and launch no more legal maneuvers against such...

www.andersonadvocates.com

You said "participated in transferring pedophile priests to other parishes", which isn't the same thing as posting names of accused priests on the website. Neither is related to THIS story.

Note that that's from the website of a law firm.

 

[Peter]

Interesting. Kind of a middle finger to her home bishop.

Sounds like she's enjoying the perks of her office on vacation.

Why would this be?
Surely she's free to visit and talk to anyone she likes within the religion?

She's not an employee of the church who needs to ask permission to book an appointment from the higher-ups.

I very much doubt she's going to try and throw the local church leaders under the bus so why would they care?

 

[dcsports]

Okay, so you acknowledge that the pope was involved. So as I said, if you don't like her getting communion in the Vatican whereas she couldn't here...take it up with the Pope. As I understand it, he's something of an authority figure within the Catholic Church.

I understand that you were trying to do a 'gotcha' question. It was silly and childish, which is why I moved on. The Pope officiated the mass, but didn't present communion, The article even notes that he usually doesn't in order to keep out of these political issues.

 

[Rexedgar]

 

[Mina]

Pelosi gave the finger, not the Pope.

Pelosi merely received the sacrament of the Eucharist.... something that people of her faith believe they were told by Jesus to do in memory of Him. I'm sure she'd be fine getting it from her bishop, too. The issue is that some wingnut bishops in the US have decided to deny the sacrament to politicians they dislike. That abuse of their position is something the Pope has been working to address..

 

[Cardinal]

I understand that you were trying to do a 'gotcha' question. It was silly and childish, which is why I moved on. The Pope officiated the mass, but didn't present communion, The article even notes that he usually doesn't in order to keep out of these political issues.

Nope, sorry! I told you I wouldn't accept you moving the goal posts or using a personalized definition of "involved." The Pope was involved.

And in any case your moving of the goal posts is irrelevant because they met with the Pope, and the Pope himself chastized archbishops not to turn people away, not even to sinners. But I don't say that because I accept your moving of the goal posts (I don't), but that your moving of the goal posts itself is irrelevant.

Unless you want to make the case that the Pope was unaware of the communion? Because that I'd like to see you prove.

 

[SMTA]

I don’t spend tax dollars flying to the Vatican with press in tow. So go ahead and judge me on that basis

What an ignorant ****ing post
I’m not the one who will judge you

 

[dcsports]

Pelosi merely received the sacrament of the Eucharist.... something that people of her faith believe they were told by Jesus to do in memory of Him. I'm sure she'd be fine getting it from her bishop, too. The issue is that some wingnut bishops in the US have decided to deny the sacrament to politicians they dislike. That abuse of their position is something the Pope has been working to address..

Why would this be?
Surely she's free to visit and talk to anyone she likes within the religion?

She's not an employee of the church who needs to ask permission to book an appointment from the higher-ups.

I very much doubt she's going to try and throw the local church leaders under the bus so why would they care?

If you go back to the article, her bishop (from her home diocese) told her she was not entitled to receive communion until she either reversed her position on abortion, or stop using her faith to endorse it. Communion is on an honor system. Hard to picture this as anything other than an insult to her Bishop.

Peter, sure, she is free to go. But you try getting into a mass like this, the VIP section, or a papal audience without connections.

 

[mrjurrs]

You said "participated in transferring pedophile priests to other parishes", which isn't the same thing as posting names of accused priests on the website. Neither is related to THIS story.

Note that that's from the website of a law firm.

He wouldn't tell his congregations, or anyone in the public, who was transferred where or for what reason. Do you believe priests should be criminally prosecuted for child molestation? Or are they exercising god's will?

 

[dcsports]

Nope, sorry! I told you I wouldn't accept you moving the goal posts or using a personalized definition of "involved." The Pope was involved.

And in any case your moving of the goal posts is irrelevant because they met with the Pope, and the Pope himself chastized archbishops not to turn people away, not even to sinners. But I don't say that because I accept your moving of the goal posts (I don't), but that your moving of the goal posts itself is irrelevant.

Unless you want to make the case that the Pope was unaware of the communion? Because that I'd like to see you prove.

No goalposts moved by me. Yes, the Pope was involved in the mass. How very clintonesque of you. Take care.

 

[Cardinal]

No goalposts moved by me. Yes, the Pope was involved in the mass. How very clintonesque of you. Take care.

Excellent! Then if you have a problem with her communion, you can take it up with the Pope.

 

[dcsports]

He wouldn't tell his congregations, or anyone in the public, who was transferred where or for what reason.

According to the link you provided, he hasn't publicly released a list of people accused. The law firm - which litigates these cases - has put together it's own list from public records. Obviously, they want a list of those accused but never charged so they can expand their client base. No mention about what has been told to congregations, nor anything about transfers.

He has released some details on accusations since 2000, and that there has been no credible accusations of molestation since that time. We're talking about very old cases.

Do you believe priests should be criminally prosecuted for child molestation?

If the allegation is substantiated, of course! And current church policy is to turn allegations over to law enforcement.

 

[dcsports]

Excellent! Then if you have a problem with her communion, you can take it up with the Pope.

Again, the pope didn't give her communion, nor did he make any public decision concerning it. But obviously, you are still trying to stir the pot. Take care.

 

[Cardinal]

Again, the pope didn't give her communion

I didn't say he did. You're the one who claimed (as you now acknowledge is untrue) that he was "not involved."

, nor did he make any public decision concerning it.

Actually, yes he did. Go back to the article and try again.

 

[mrjurrs]

According to the link you provided, he hasn't publicly released a list of people accused. The law firm - which litigates these cases - has put together it's own list from public records. Obviously, they want a list of those accused but never charged so they can expand their client base. No mention about what has been told to congregations, nor anything about transfers.

He has released some details on accusations since 2000, and that there has been no credible accusations of molestation since that time. We're talking about very old cases.


If the allegation is substantiated, of course! And current church policy is to turn allegations over to law enforcement.

Enjoy.

How to suck at your religion - The Oatmeal

How to suck at your religion

theoatmeal.com

 

[Mina]

If you go back to the article, her bishop (from her home diocese) told her she was not entitled to receive communion until she either reversed her position on abortion, or stop using her faith to endorse it.

Exactly. That was a terrible abuse of his position. I'm not saying he should now be denied communion for sullying the faith by holding the Eucharist hostage to promote his politics, but that's because punishing him that way would be stooping to his level.

Communion is on an honor system. Hard to picture this as anything other than an insult to her Bishop.

That bishop insulted himself, when he tried to use his influence in an unholy way. Ignoring his impotent attempt to deny someone communion neither adds nor detracts from the harm he did his soul with that evil action.

Peter, sure, she is free to go. But you try getting into a mass like this, the VIP section, or a papal audience without connections.

Wow, are you telling me that there are events where being the leader of the US House of Representatives gets you enhanced access? How can this possibly be? I'm utterly shaken. I'd spent a lifetime convinced that "VIP" was short for "various indistinguishable peons." You've shattered my faith in the egalitarian nature of society in general, and my assumption that the Catholic Church was devoid of hierarchical tendencies! Pardon me while I try to collect myself.

Gee, next you'll tell me that when Trump met the pope, his level of access was different from what any irreligious libertine off the street could get.

 

[Peter]

If you go back to the article, her bishop (from her home diocese) told her she was not entitled to receive communion until she either reversed her position on abortion, or stop using her faith to endorse it. Communion is on an honor system. Hard to picture this as anything other than an insult to her Bishop.

Peter, sure, she is free to go. But you try getting into a mass like this, the VIP section, or a papal audience without connections.

She's an adult she can make her own decisions and by the sounds of it her Bishop is sticking his nose into politics.
Maybe the Bishop should consider another line of work if he's so easily offended and quick to try and order people about.

If that Bishop wants to be a dick then he should be prepared for people to ignore him.

 

[ALiberalModerate]

Meh. It's pretty obvious that, in religion, everybody makes it up as they go. Religious people just take whatever passage or quote they want to justify their position.

For example, many right wingers ignore all the social justice teachings of the Catholic Church.

 

[Peter]

For example, many right wingers ignore all the social justice teachings of the Catholic Church.

Yep, somehow they have to work out how Jesus would absolutely love billionaires and be all in for constantly giving them tax cuts and hating the poor and calling them all moocher class scum.
Yep, that really sounds like opinions Jesus would be totally on board with.

 

[tres borrachos]

She’s a public figure who makes a show of her alleged faith using tax dollars. It is my business.

What the everlasting **** are you complaining about? She's there on business.

She doesn't need the $32 a year you owe in taxes.

 

[tres borrachos]

Interesting. Kind of a middle finger to her home bishop.

Sounds like she's enjoying the perks of her office on vacation.

She isn't on vacation. Do you people ever, ever know what the hell you're talking about?

 

[dcsports]

She isn't on vacation. Do you people ever, ever know what the hell you're talking about?

Very strange. It's not her job to engage in diplomatic discussions with other countries.

 

[ALiberalModerate]

Yep, somehow they have to work out how Jesus would absolutely love billionaires and be all in for constantly giving them tax cuts and hating the poor and calling them all moocher class scum.
Yep, that really sounds like opinions Jesus would be totally on board with.

The Catholic Church is officially in favor of universal healthcare and government anti-poverty programs. They are just "Cafeteria Catholics" wanting to take the churches position on same sex marriage and abortion, and ignore every other social position the church has. If you were to take the entirety of the churches social positions, Nancy Pelosi is far more in line with most of them than most conservative leaders.

 

[ALiberalModerate]

Very strange. It's not her job to engage in diplomatic discussions with other countries.

Whatever, congressman meet with world leaders all the time. There is no issues with it unless they are someone acting as representatives of the state department without state department approval.