Palestinians Cheer Carnage Thread

[oneworld2]

So, have you anything to add about (not all) Palestinians cheering carnage?

You appear to be mute on the subject.

Ive given my thoughts in the other hate thread about this same subject. I'm hardly " mute " on it because I have shown in that thread, that you wish to see the same thing done when palestinians are murdered in terror attacks and want to see the " subsequent celebration of the murders "

 

[oneworld2]

More to the point, I believe, is the source of hatred. Ideology that promotes hatred. You don't have to go to the West Bank to find it. Just go to Dearborn Michigan or Minneapolis, Minn. It's commonly known as Islam.

But oh yes, Islamophobia is just another form of hatred. No need to deal with truth here.

Hatred is everywhere, in case you hadn't noticed, IE it's not just to be found in some Muslims

 

[Fledermaus]

You obviousl don't have anything to add about (not all) Palestinians cheering carnage? A blatant show of hatred.

You continue to be mute on the subject.

You are willing to call threads that expose (not all) Palestinian hatred "hate threads". That isn't addressing the actual hatred.

 

[oneworld2]

You obviousl don't have anything to add about (not all) Palestinians cheering carnage? A blatant show of hatred.

You continue to be mute on the subject.

You are willing to call threads that expose (not all) Palestinian hatred "hate threads". That isn't addressing the actual hatred.

They expose your own hatred and you don't even have anywhere near the same right to feel so abused nor as to sink so low.

Their hatred is based on their unjust and sytematic abuse at the hands of the state of Israel. It's a sign of how that systematic abuse has degraded the behaviour of some people on the Palestinian side. But the truth is that we see similar displays of moral decline on the other side of the conflict too. You remain quiet on this imo and have defended/denied much of the abuses suffered by the Palestinians.

All of the above is relevant to the debate, you just don't want to see it included, that's all.

 

[Evilroddy]

I used that piece because it covers a number of acts of (not all) Palestinians cheering murder and destruction. There is another thread titled "Palestinians cheering Tel Aviv murders - 2016" that addresses more current celebrations of terrorism.

Fledermaus:

You seem to have missed the point I was trying to make. More than half the Gaza Palestinian population wasn't alive to celebrate the Hebrew University bombing. You're tarring more than half of Gazan Palestinians for acts their ancestors did. Other threads don't mitigate that tactic.

And do you seriously believe the situation in Gaza has improved over years of Hamas beating the "Hate Israel" drum? Their TV shows even promote terror.

No. Hamas and Islamic Jihad decision makers and militant ants are as bad as the militarists and expansionists driving Israeli State policy. A pox on both leaderships.

And lets speak of the killings in "Right of Return Marches". Show me the crowds in Tel Aviv, Jerusalem and Haifa cheering those deaths. Perhaps Tel Aviv was awash in celebrants during Operation Cast Lead cheering the deaths of Gazans.

The fact that a large bloc of Israelis don't come out and celebrate the killings of Palestinians does not excuse them for re-voting in the same people in charge of the sniper policy at the marches and other atrocities in several elections since then. Their (the bloc) complicity in their state's policy of killing by reelectiing homicidal leaders is as obscene to me as Palestinians cheering the deaths of others like Israelis and Americans caused by acts of terrorism done by Palestinian militants. Neither ghoulish joy nor calculated bloody-mindedness is an acceptable position in my opinion. The decisions and resulting acts, not the reactions of third parties to these acts, defines the evil behind the atrocities of both sides in this multigenerational conflict. Therefore I blame both Hamas/Islamic Jihad and the State of Israel for the decisions and acts which have resulted in these atrocities and I certainly don't blame the children and the unborn for the sins of their fathers and mothers. That kind of thinking will only perpetuate the hate and violence, effectively blocking any solution being acceptable to both sides.

Cheers and be well.
Evilroddy.

 

[Fledermaus]

Fledermaus:

You seem to have missed the point I was trying to make. More than half the Gaza Palestinian population wasn't alive to celebrate the Hebrew University bombing. You're tarring more than half of Gazan Palestinians for acts their ancestors did. Other threads don't mitigate that tactic.

No. Hamas and Islamic Jihad decision makers and militant ants are as bad as the militarists and expansionists driving Israeli State policy. A pox on both leaderships.

The fact that a large bloc of Israelis don't come out and celebrate the killings of Palestinians does not excuse them for re-voting in the same people in charge of the sniper policy at the marches and other atrocities in several elections since then. Their (the bloc) complicity in their state's policy of killing by reelectiing homicidal leaders is as obscene to me as Palestinians cheering the deaths of others like Israelis and Americans caused by acts of terrorism done by Palestinian militants. Neither ghoulish joy nor calculated bloody-mindedness is an acceptable position in my opinion. The decisions and resulting acts, not the reactions of third parties to these acts, defines the evil behind the atrocities of both sides in this multigenerational conflict. Therefore I blame both Hamas/Islamic Jihad and the State of Israel for the decisions and acts which have resulted in these atrocities and I certainly don't blame the children and the unborn for the sins of their fathers and mothers. That kind of thinking will only perpetuate the hate and violence, effectively blocking any solution being acceptable to both sides.

Cheers and be well.
Evilroddy.

How many Israelis do you honestly believe vote for a politician specifically because of the deaths in Gaza?

And the last time I checked it is a coalition government meaning they did not vote as a bloc.

 

[Evilroddy]

How many Israelis do you honestly believe vote for a politician specifically because of the deaths in Gaza?

And the last time I checked it is a coalition government meaning they did not vote as a bloc.

Fledermaus:

Enabling evil can come from both supporting it or being indifferent to its practice. If the voters know the platform of the party and its leadership and still vote for it then in my mind they are culpable for that party's decisions and acts. As citizens of the State of Israel they are all responsible for the acts of the IDF and other state agents and agencies. That's why it's called "responsible government". They don't get a pass from me for ignoring what the party and leaders they vote for stand for.

A bloc is a significant fraction of a political body, not necessarily a majority. The blocs I am talking about are the Israeli voters who repeatedly backed the policies of expansionist Zionism and pervasive militarism. That is somewhere between 26-30 percent for Likud and an indeterminable amount for Blue and White because Gantz and his cohorts defected from the party to support Likud. There are also another 5-10% of Israeli voters who support these kinds of policies but not necessarily the Likud leadership. Those are the Israelis I blame, not all Israelis.

Cheers and be well.
Evilroddy.

 

[oneworld2]

Fledermaus:

You seem to have missed the point I was trying to make. More than half the Gaza Palestinian population wasn't alive to celebrate the Hebrew University bombing. You're tarring more than half of Gazan Palestinians for acts their ancestors did. Other threads don't mitigate that tactic.



No. Hamas and Islamic Jihad decision makers and militant ants are as bad as the militarists and expansionists driving Israeli State policy. A pox on both leaderships.



The fact that a large bloc of Israelis don't come out and celebrate the killings of Palestinians does not excuse them for re-voting in the same people in charge of the sniper policy at the marches and other atrocities in several elections since then. Their (the bloc) complicity in their state's policy of killing by reelectiing homicidal leaders is as obscene to me as Palestinians cheering the deaths of others like Israelis and Americans caused by acts of terrorism done by Palestinian militants. Neither ghoulish joy nor calculated bloody-mindedness is an acceptable position in my opinion. The decisions and resulting acts, not the reactions of third parties to these acts, defines the evil behind the atrocities of both sides in this multigenerational conflict. Therefore I blame both Hamas/Islamic Jihad and the State of Israel for the decisions and acts which have resulted in these atrocities and I certainly don't blame the children and the unborn for the sins of their fathers and mothers. That kind of thinking will only perpetuate the hate and violence, effectively blocking any solution being acceptable to both sides.

Cheers and be well.
Evilroddy.

Good luck trying to reason out that which was never reasoned in , it's better to just expose it for what it is

 

[OlNate]

You obviousl don't have anything to add about (not all) Palestinians cheering carnage? A blatant show of hatred.

You continue to be mute on the subject.

You are willing to call threads that expose (not all) Palestinian hatred "hate threads". That isn't addressing the actual hatred.

They expose your own hatred and you don't even have anywhere near the same right to feel so abused nor as to sink so low.

Their hatred is based on their unjust and sytematic abuse at the hands of the state of Israel. It's a sign of how that systematic abuse has degraded the behaviour of some people on the Palestinian side. But the truth is that we see similar displays of moral decline on the other side of the conflict too. You remain quiet on this imo and have defended/denied much of the abuses suffered by the Palestinians.

All of the above is relevant to the debate, you just don't want to see it included, that's all.

Just the objective view, knowing both of you a little ... my guess is that you're not as far apart as you seem. The hardest part of this discussion is being the one to blink first - that's the ME conflict in a nutshell, to be honest.

You have both acknowledged each other's position at different times, if not to each other. It would be interesting to see a conversation between you guys where the goal was to reach consensus, rather than burying each other.

 

[oneworld2]

Just the objective view, knowing both of you a little ... my guess is that you're not as far apart as you seem. The hardest part of this discussion is being the one to blink first - that's the ME conflict in a nutshell, to be honest.

You have both acknowledged each other's position at different times, if not to each other. It would be interesting to see a conversation between you guys where the goal was to reach consensus, rather than burying each other.

That's a nice post Olnate. Now mind your own business !! lol ( only joking }

Serious mode.

It's hard to reach a consensus with people who have such an entrenched down on the one side, it's impossible in fact but I respect the effort of peacemaking you have made in the above. As I said, I think it's shows you are a nice person.

 

[OlNate]

That's a nice post Olnate. Now mind your own business !! lol ( only joking }

Serious mode.

It's hard to reach a consensus with people who have such an entrenched down on the one side, it's impossible in fact but I respect the effort of peacemaking you have made in the above. As I said, I think it's shows you are a nice person.

LMAO... I make it my business never to mind my own business, it's too terrifying...why do you think I hang out here so much? lol

And, honestly, it's not that hard...you just have to be willing to listen, and leave your assumptions at the door. I find that most people are willing to accept a temporary reset, if you indicate that you are willing to try a different approach, and refuse, even if it's just for that one conversation, to revert to old behaviors.

The irony I see in this sub forum is that the same people have the same fights over and over again, demonstrating exactly the same behavior that keeps this conflict going in the real world. We have the luxury and the privilege to discuss these things without being in the situation. We can be academic about it. Yet we fall into the same traps. Both you and Fled are smart guys...has this not dawned on you guys as well?

Also...don't trust the niceness of Canadians. We're polite, but we also invented hockey, which, without equal to be found in the modern world, is the sport of drunken, miserable, violent assholes. Something to bear in mind with any future Canadians you meet... lol

 

[oneworld2]

LMAO... I make it my business never to mind my own business, it's too terrifying...why do you think I hang out here so much? lol

And, honestly, it's not that hard...you just have to be willing to listen, and leave your assumptions at the door. I find that most people are willing to accept a temporary reset, if you indicate that you are willing to try a different approach, and refuse, even if it's just for that one conversation, to revert to old behaviors.

The irony I see in this sub forum is that the same people have the same fights over and over again, demonstrating exactly the same behavior that keeps this conflict going in the real world. We have the luxury and the privilege to discuss these things without being in the situation. We can be academic about it. Yet we fall into the same traps. Both you and Fled are smart guys...has this not dawned on you guys as well?

Also...don't trust the niceness of Canadians. We're polite, but we also invented hockey, which, without equal to be found in the modern world, is the sport of drunken, miserable, violent assholes. Something to bear in mind with any future Canadians you meet... lol

I think you make a whole host of very good observations in that post Olnate. Maybe being a overtly nosey parker has its rewards after all lols

Without trying to be smug, I have thought of these things myself on many occasions and am acutely aware of how lucky I am not to live in many situations, not just the ME. I won't expand on this because I don't give too much in the way of personal info out in places like this BUT I have had a lot of personal tragedies over the last 10 years and my friends ( I know, I know , but I assure you I do ) have, over that time , asked me how I've coped. I tell them how lucky I am not to live in Gaza or Mogadishu. I recount a story from the Rwanda genocide about a young boy tracked and murdered in the jungle by a band of men. I recount a story of a doctor in France during the plague who, because he treated plague victims ,brought it into his own home and watched his wife and all his kids die from it. This is how I think, so I fully understand the lucky position I am in compared to many souls past annd present.

I have liked most Canadians I have encountered online and I can forgive you all for inventing rollerball on ice, just not for Jim Carey

 

[Evilroddy]

LMAO... I make it my business never to mind my own business, it's too terrifying...why do you think I hang out here so much? lol

And, honestly, it's not that hard...you just have to be willing to listen, and leave your assumptions at the door. I find that most people are willing to accept a temporary reset, if you indicate that you are willing to try a different approach, and refuse, even if it's just for that one conversation, to revert to old behaviors.

The irony I see in this sub forum is that the same people have the same fights over and over again, demonstrating exactly the same behavior that keeps this conflict going in the real world. We have the luxury and the privilege to discuss these things without being in the situation. We can be academic about it. Yet we fall into the same traps. Both you and Fled are smart guys...has this not dawned on you guys as well?

Also...don't trust the niceness of Canadians. We're polite, but we also invented hockey, which, without equal to be found in the modern world, is the sport of drunken, miserable, violent assholes. Something to bear in mind with any future Canadians you meet... lol

OlNate:

Shush, you're giving away our secrets. Next you'll be giving classified intel on the mental conditioning necessary to play Lacrosse well. We're supposed to be sending out the harmless vibes of ice skating and curling. The world is not ready to learn the dark truths of Canada. Stick to the party line of maple syrup, poutine and Tim Hortons.

Apologies for the tangent.

Cheers and be well.
Evilroddy.

 

[OlNate]

OlNate:

Shush, you're giving away our secrets. Next you'll be giving classified intel on the mental conditioning necessary to play Lacrosse well. We're supposed to be sending out the harmless vibes of ice skating and curling. The world is not ready to learn the dark truths of Canada. Stick to the party line of maple syrup, poutine and Tim Hortons.

Apologies for the tangent.

Cheers and be well.
Evilroddy.

DUDE! Lacrosse was the trap! You reel them in with something they're familiar with, let them think that's as bad as it gets, and then ambush them with something much worse! You messed up the whole damn thing, now they're googling lacrosse, and understanding that Trump was right, we ARE a national security threat!!!!

Hope you're happy with yourself. CSIS will be at your door momentarily, you bloody traitor. No more maple syrup for you....EVER!

 

[OlNate]

I think you make a whole host of very good observations in that post Olnate. Maybe being a overtly nosey parker has its rewards after all lols

Without trying to be smug, I have thought of these things myself on many occasions and am acutely aware of how lucky I am not to live in many situations, not just the ME. I won't expand on this because I don't give too much in the way of personal info out in places like this BUT I have had a lot of personal tragedies over the last 10 years and my friends ( I know, I know , but I assure you I do ) have, over that time , asked me how I've coped. I tell them how lucky I am not to live in Gaza or Mogadishu. I recount a story from the Rwanda genocide about a young boy tracked and murdered in the jungle by a band of men. I recount a story of a doctor in France during the plague who, because he treated plague victims ,brought it into his own home and watched his wife and all his kids die from it. This is how I think, so I fully understand the lucky position I am in compared to many souls past annd present.

I have liked most Canadians I have encountered online and I can forgive you all for inventing rollerball on ice, just not for Jim Carey

Well, at least you didn't mention Justin Bieber or Celine Dion...

Yeah, we bring our stuff into these debates, for sure. And I'm certainly not claiming innocence on that front. Hell, I know that some of this is therapy...hehe... And, to be honest, I'm not even telling you stop brawling - I like reading you and Fled go at it, it's good stuff. But once in a while it's cool to see something different, and all bluster and bravado aside, I have reason to believe, as I said before, that you guys are not as far apart as you may think. I'm sorry for sticking my nose in, just thought I might toss a request in - consider it from a fan of you both.

 

[Fledermaus]

Well, at least you didn't mention Justin Bieber or Celine Dion...

Yeah, we bring our stuff into these debates, for sure. And I'm certainly not claiming innocence on that front. Hell, I know that some of this is therapy...hehe... And, to be honest, I'm not even telling you stop brawling - I like reading you and Fled go at it, it's good stuff. But once in a while it's cool to see something different, and all bluster and bravado aside, I have reason to believe, as I said before, that you guys are not as far apart as you may think. I'm sorry for sticking my nose in, just thought I might toss a request in - consider it from a fan of you both.

Do not apologize for your posts.

I cannot agree about oneworld2 and I agreeing on much.

 

[oneworld2]

Well, at least you didn't mention Justin Bieber or Celine Dion...

Yeah, we bring our stuff into these debates, for sure. And I'm certainly not claiming innocence on that front. Hell, I know that some of this is therapy...hehe... And, to be honest, I'm not even telling you stop brawling - I like reading you and Fled go at it, it's good stuff. But once in a while it's cool to see something different, and all bluster and bravado aside, I have reason to believe, as I said before, that you guys are not as far apart as you may think. I'm sorry for sticking my nose in, just thought I might toss a request in - consider it from a fan of you both.

I forgot about those two lol


You , I think, will know my view on our being subject to our own biases with pure objectivity being something of a fantasy wrt the human condition. So, yep, we all bring along our own isms to the table to greater or lesser degrees .

I am a little surprised that anyone enjoys reading our polemics though and even flabbergasted that anyone would consider themselves a fan lol. I think they should be compulsory reading for people who work shifts and who struggle to sleep on the night shift

Your efforts have not been totally in vain though. You have at least made us agree on one thing .............. no need for any apologies regarding your suggestions/participation. I think the good will/cheer they have offered will be something of a beam of light in a dark space wrt the likely content that this thread might attract, so thanks for that too.

 

[Evilroddy]

DUDE! Lacrosse was the trap! You reel them in with something they're familiar with, let them think that's as bad as it gets, and then ambush them with something much worse! You messed up the whole damn thing, now they're googling lacrosse, and understanding that Trump was right, we ARE a national security threat!!!!

Hope you're happy with yourself. CSIS will be at your door momentarily, you bloody traitor. No more maple syrup for you....EVER!

Oh. Damn. They're here now!