Osama's letter to America.

[Gandhi>Bush]

"What type of government does Vietnam and N. Korea have today?"

What do you care? It's protesters like you that never want a finished job.

I wouldn't have wanted to start it.

The people of both countries wanted our help and aside from fighting communists, we also fought our own protesters and politicians. The war was between Democracy and Communism. Korea, Vietnam, Afghanistan, and other places is where the battle ground took place. The USSR fell because it could not keep up with our convictions and resolve.

Korea, Vietnam, Afghanistan... All communist during and after the war against Communism.

You use these great names to further your ignorance. You glorify their names, yet you undermine their intelligence. They would recognize exactly what is going on in the Middle East and they would recognize that it has nothing to do with the trivial matters that you focus on. They would not be supporters for the war, but they would recognize that it is not us that has waged war on them. They would see through the BS that Bin Laden uses to offer credibility to his mass murder and carnage. It is the Arab world that continue to insist that they are at war with us and it is your failure to see the truths involved that give them legitamacy.

Never in a million years would either of them refuse to communicate with their enemy. Never in a million years would they refuse to see a possible fault in their own nation or it's actions.

 

[cnredd]

Korea, Vietnam, Afghanistan... All communist during and after the war against Communism.

Korea...split in half...South not Communist
Vietnam...split in half...South not Communist
Afghanistan...not Communist...Soviet Union gave up takeover after years of local resistance...

Seriously...I know the textbooks in this country may be outdated...but they're not this flat-out wrong.

 

[Gandhi>Bush]

Korea...split in half...South not Communist
Vietnam...split in half...South not Communist
Afghanistan...not Communist...Soviet Union gave up takeover after years of local resistance...

Seriously...I know the textbooks in this country may be outdated...but they're not this flat-out wrong.

You're absolutely right. That wasn't fair of me to lump everything into the RED BALL OF COMMUNISM. My bad :lol:.

 

[cnredd]

testing...testing...

 

[cnredd]

You're absolutely right. That wasn't fair of me to lump everything into the RED BALL OF COMMUNISM. My bad :lol:.

Good save...

I STILL don't think you're looking at the larger picture though....

I don't know how much geographical space Communism had when it started.

Soviet Union=10%(just a guess...this is for the sake of arguement)
Then it spreads to other places...easturn Europe....now it's at 12%
Then Korea...13%....Vietnam....14%...Then Cuba, then parts of Latin America, and so on and so on...

Keep in mind that most, if not all, of these places, the US led or was behind some sort of resistance...If they weren't, Communism would've gotten stronger and stronger...maybe even to a point where it would become so large that the US would not have been able to contain it. If the US didn't attack every conceivable place to stop Communism, it would still be very alive today and would continue to get stronger.

Same thing with Muslim extremists...you simply can't let it grow.

I know what your thinking...."Iraq is a motivation for more terrorists"...

In one way you are correct in that Iraq may be the "spark" that turns these people into mass murderers...but here's the real issue...

These same people were already programmed for their actions...the terrorism chromosome was already in place;they were just waiting for the Clerics in the Middle East to sound the siren. And through Iraq, this is exactly what has been done. But....

If it wasn't Iraq...it would have been the next big thing the clerics would yell about. Remember, this was going on long before Iraq or 9/11.

continued...

 

[cnredd]

continuation...

Now back to the bigger picture...What would you rather fight?..."X" terrorists now?...or "X" plus thousands more later? These are the only two options...That's it!...This part of the thread is NOT up for debate.

Getting the terrorists out in the open and scrambling like cockroaches when the light gets turned on is better than having them slowly multiplying in the shadows. We'd end up having to fight multitudes more later.

And when more and more Muslims in the Middle East get their eyes opened to a free society, they will understand how they've been lied to by their government and their religion. Then they will take over the fight and we can just sit back and watch the extremists get bottled up by their own brethren.

Another problem people whine about is the timeframe...we live in an age where if it's not done in 10 minutes, it's not worth doing.

 

[Gandhi>Bush]

Same thing with Muslim extremists...you simply can't let it grow.

I don't think the two are anything alike. I don't think it was growing to begin with.

I know what your thinking...."Iraq is a motivation for more terrorists"...

In one way you are correct in that Iraq may be the "spark" that turns these people into mass murderers...but here's the real issue...

These same people were already programmed for their actions...the terrorism chromosome was already in place;they were just waiting for the Clerics in the Middle East to sound the siren. And through Iraq, this is exactly what has been done. But....

If it wasn't Iraq...it would have been the next big thing the clerics would yell about. Remember, this was going on long before Iraq or 9/11.

Indeed. It was happening long before 9/11. I believe that if we chose our actions correctly, their clerics would be nothing more than the village idiots; their words nothing more than air.

Now back to the bigger picture...What would you rather fight?..."X" terrorists now?...or "X" plus thousands more later? These are the only two options...That's it!...This part of the thread is NOT up for debate.

Not up for debate? I don't believe that this is correct. As I said, with the proper choice of actions we could potentialy not have an X to fight later at all.

And when more and more Muslims in the Middle East get their eyes opened to a free society, they will understand how they've been lied to by their government and their religion. Then they will take over the fight and we can just sit back and watch the extremists get bottled up by their own brethren.

Pakistan has been sitting next to a Democracy since 1947(the partition). This has not happened.

Another problem people whine about is the timeframe...we live in an age where if it's not done in 10 minutes, it's not worth doing.

I'm not one of those people. We cannot announce a time table at this point, we cannot pull our troops out at this point.

 

[cnredd]

Not up for debate? I don't believe that this is correct. As I said, with the proper choice of actions we could potentialy not have an X to fight later at all.

I disagree...I would rewrite that to "If a proper choice of actions were taken previously, we wouldn't have to fight X now.

 

[Gandhi>Bush]

I disagree...I would rewrite that to "If a proper choice of actions were taken previously, we wouldn't have to fight X now.

I don't have a time machine. We can't manipulate past actions. I'll stick to my original statement.

 

[Bestial_Pagan]

Sleep Your night at peace. Osama Bin Laden is D as dead. Has been Dead 2 years now. He is buried in the badghis mountains. Anyone that proves osama is alive, I will give 50% (about 900 €) from my next salary. Just show me a video of osama holding newspaper from last 1 month. (with kidneymachine and the doctors of course)

 

[Arch Enemy]

I completely agree...I don't know why you're arguing with me, and I've never said anything implying that they were good leaders. I said bin Laden was a strong leader, meaning that he's brought a bunch of poor people together in a massive terrorist network. I was in no way saying I condoned or would accept him as a leader, but the fact is he is a leader. And a few good points does not a leader make, and I have never thought or said so.

And I'm really confused as to why you're arguing with me.

Damn you Cnredd what did I tell you about Debating on a Debating website!
The nerve.

Haha actually most of it was just debating, arguing is a silly perspective thing!

 

[Arch Enemy]

Sleep Your night at peace. Osama Bin Laden is D as dead. Has been Dead 2 years now. He is buried in the badghis mountains. Anyone that proves osama is alive, I will give 50% (about 900 €) from my next salary. Just show me a video of osama holding newspaper from last 1 month. (with kidneymachine and the doctors of course)

Mind if I just mail Osama Bin Laden to you?

 

[teacher]

?

There it is again.

 

[teacher]

Sleep Your night at peace. Osama Bin Laden is D as dead. Has been Dead 2 years now. He is buried in the badghis mountains. Anyone that proves osama is alive, I will give 50% (about 900 €) from my next salary. Just show me a video of osama holding newspaper from last 1 month. (with kidneymachine and the doctors of course)

If he were dead why wouldn't they create a way to use him a a martyr, no matter the manner of his death.

He's spoken about recent events in some of his messages. Good as a newspaper. He's alive.

 

[teacher]

I've read enough of his vomit to dismiss anything I haven't read.

I have done the same. He makes me sick. I haven't read it all and I posted it. Actions speak louder than words. Like the Muslim community denouncing terrorism. All fine and dandy and worthless in my opinion. When they turn in one of their own then I'll take notice.

Hey Gunny, I got Gandhi to admit once that violence is okay, have you?

 

[Arch Enemy]

He actually could be in an underground apartment complex at FBI headquarters. He gets only a few seconds of air-time then they shove him back in his very cold and painful hole. While there he just so happens to grow 2 more heads, and wings! It's also just a coincidence that Cassius, Brutus, and Judas are all there as well! So he bites onto their face! /end sarcasm.

 

[MSgt]

"Hey Gunny, I got Gandhi to admit once that violence is okay, have you?"

Changing the minds of pascifists is not my goal. It is a futile mission when one decides that the spread of communism, the spread of Bin Laden propaganda, and so on and so on, isn't worth taking up arms. One will never find peace and hold it if one refuses to fight for it. Being a pascifist peace marcher for civil rights is noble. Being a pascifist peace marcher in light of facing a WAR and people that would rather see you dead, is dangerous and suicidal. If some of us were left to our own strengths and convictions to defend our own individual ways of life, some of us would be lost. What frustrates me most (besides our governments half ass attempts to wage war against terror) is that the realization that for an individual to be a pascifist, he/she must be protected by other individuals by doing those dispicable acts he/she protests. I merely wish to vent.

Bin Laden is dead in a cave or he is alive in the mountains amongst Afghanistan and Pakistan. We have to make sure he is dead. Being kept alive will show thousands of Muslims in the Middle East that you can fight "the great satan" and live to do it again. He is a hero as long as he lives or is believed to be alive. In death he would not be such a "martyr" compared to what he is alive. Alive....he is hope to the masses of misdirected angered youths across the Middle East that continue to blame America rather than their own governments for their oppressions. He will continue to be a tool in which dictators and Mullahs use to force blame on others. In the Middle East, blaming others is the narcotic of choice.

 

[Gandhi>Bush]

Hey Gunny, I got Gandhi to admit once that violence is okay, have you?

Refresh my memory.

Changing the minds of pascifists is not my goal. It is a futile mission when one decides that the spread of communism, the spread of Bin Laden propaganda, and so on and so on, isn't worth taking up arms. One will never find peace and hold it if one refuses to fight for it. Being a pascifist peace marcher for civil rights is noble. Being a pascifist peace marcher in light of facing a WAR and people that would rather see you dead, is dangerous and suicidal. If some of us were left to our own strengths and convictions to defend our own individual ways of life, some of us would be lost. What frustrates me most (besides our governments half ass attempts to wage war against terror) is that the realization that for an individual to be a pascifist, he/she must be protected by other individuals by doing those dispicable acts he/she protests. I merely wish to vent.

Is not better to make someone not want you dead than to kill them? Followers don't have agendas. Leaders do. We can break the followers and when we do that we will not have to worry about those that want to kill us. In all honesty, I wouldn't worry about it now. Fear is useless.

When it comes to pascifism and nonviolence it is not cowardice or pessimism or weakness that brings into one's head, it is a choice one makes. I would rather die than be killed. I will not be afraid, I will not strike back, and I will not be turned away. These are the ideas that I will change the world away from such hatred as seen in Islamic terrorism. Not a war in the middle east that gives more substance to the propaganda of Muslim clerics.

Bin Laden is dead in a cave or he is alive in the mountains amongst Afghanistan and Pakistan. We have to make sure he is dead. Being kept alive will show thousands of Muslims in the Middle East that you can fight "the great satan" and live to do it again. He is a hero as long as he lives or is believed to be alive. In death he would not be such a "martyr" compared to what he is alive. Alive....he is hope to the masses of misdirected angered youths across the Middle East that continue to blame America rather than their own governments for their oppressions. He will continue to be a tool in which dictators and Mullahs use to force blame on others. In the Middle East, blaming others is the narcotic of choice.

Imprison him for the rest of his life, but do not kill him. This should not be the ideology of America. Kill us, we kill you back. That only makes two killers. What would an action like that say to the world? What would everyone in the world think if instead of murdering a murderer we let him live?

 

[teacher]

Refresh my memory.

You said you would put foot to ass to help someone being hurt in the street. Can I remember stuff or what? Go teacher. Yea me.

Imprison him for the rest of his life, but do not kill him.

I agree. Dead he's a martyr. Alive he's some jerk in a cage we can go spit on.

 

[teacher]

"Hey Gunny, I got Gandhi to admit once that violence is okay, have you?"

Changing the minds of pascifists is not my goal.

Thanks for raining on my parade bro. A little, "way to go teach" wouldn't have killed you, would it?

 

[MSgt]

"Way to go teach".....nope, still alive. I guess it wouldn't have killed me.


Letting Bin Laden live imprisoned would only incite terrorist attacks in the name of "freedom" for their great leader. Best to be done with him and let the Mullahs of the Middle East use the next reason to blame their failed civilization on America and Israel.

 

[teacher]

"Way to go teach".....nope, still alive. I guess it wouldn't have killed me.

I can't resist. (Pretend I'm a leftie). You should have said, "I guess it didn't kill me". Oh you so lose because you ered grammaticaly GySgt. Na na na na na.

Letting Bin Laden live imprisoned would only incite terrorist attacks in the name of "freedom" for their great leader. Best to be done with him and let the Mullahs of the Middle East use the next reason to blame their failed civilization on America and Israel.

I don't condone imprisoning him. I'm asking is it better let him think he's the man, large and in charge, while we see who he is talking to, and what he is planing, vs. the consequences of his martyrdom. The spitting on him in a cage is just a flight of fancy. I'm surprised you would think I think like that Gunny. Look, it's your CO. :monkey You're right, they do tailor uniforms for officers.

 

[Gandhi>Bush]

You said you would put foot to ass to help someone being hurt in the street. Can I remember stuff or what? Go teacher. Yea me.

Do you remember where it is? Could we go over the scenario again?

I remember a comment about "foot to ass," but I don't remember the exact situation.

 

[vandree]

Gandhi...Vandree, you are a dangerous individuals. If left to your rose tinted visions,

Don't you wonder how he can follow American politics so closely? Lighten up, I just wanted to give Directv the idea to after Osama for piracy! :lol:

 

[teacher]

Do you remember where it is? Could we go over the scenario again?

I remember a comment about "foot to ass," but I don't remember the exact situation.

Wow. I, teacher, of the massive brain, who remembers stuff, is presently experiencing vapor lock. I do remember the scenario though. I was trying to find an instance were you would resort to violence. Went something like this....(four dots, remember that?) If you were walking down the street and you or yours was accosted by bad guys and there was no other apparent help in sight, would it be your "moral obligation" to help. You came back with the now famous "foot to ass" remark, (which I now dub "The Shocking Gandhi Regression" :three to go). Shirley it must be in the archives by now, (and quite calling me Shirley), but I distinctly remember thit. It will come to me, I got into the beer tonight. Now this is gonna bug the shi*t out of me. I spent ten years trying to remember where the saying, "Badges, we don't need no stinking badges" came from. Hit me one day. "The Treasure of Sierra Leone", staring Humphrey Bogart. No lie, ten years. Give me a sec, will ya? It will come. Maybe "Assault weapons", but it don't feel right.