Origin of Fascism: Humiliation (1 Viewer)

[Lutherf]

No, that's not what she said.

But the fact that you seem to feel humiliated by "the political left" is exactly the point.

I think that a lot of you have a hard time recognizing that just because YOU think you humiliated someone doesn't mean that THEY think you humiliated them.

 

[Gimmesometruth]

He managed to overthrow a brutal dictatorship and stopped a genocidal invasion of his country backed by the United States, who helped carry out chemical weapons attacks on Iranian civilians.

So gee, yeah, he actually was.

The US played both sides of the Iran/Iraq war.

The student created the revolution, and as bad as the Shah was, once the fundamentalists took over, they needed 30 years to get gdp per capita back to 1979 levels.

 

[Dans La Lune]

And Trump is a lifelong success story. So much for this dopey theory.

Where Trump falls into this equation is open for debate, but he's always been a wannabe successful guy who routinely failed at everything and had to be bailed out by his father. After his father passed away, he lost his inheritance in a series of bad business deals. He blew all the money he borrowed from banks and refused to pay back the loans, such that few banks ever did business with him again. He was broke or in debt by the time of he ran for president.

 

[Dans La Lune]

So, essentially, the more you humiliate someone the more justified you are in calling them a Fascist?

No, read it again. Most people fail at some point in their lives, but some people are unable to internalize and reckon with that failure. And not all failures and humiliations are a function of talent, but of circumstance. A society and system that produces failure / humiliation as a function of its operation (like a failing economic system, especially after the 2007 Financial Crisis) is going to mathematically produce a lot of people who end up bitter, resentful, hateful and worse.

How did Germany end up the way it did in the 1930s?

 

[Lutherf]

No, read it again. Most people fail at some point in their lives, but some people are unable to internalize and reckon with that failure. And not all failures and humiliations are a function of talent, but of circumstance. A society and system that produces failure / humiliation as a function of its operation (like a failing economic system, especially after the 2007 Financial Crisis) is going to mathematically produce a lot of people who end up bitter, resentful, hateful and worse.

How did Germany end up the way it did in the 1930s?

Yes, we have seen the liberal/progressive answer to failure and humiliation. It's "blame somebody else and admit nothing!"

 

[Pyrite]

A common element in fascism that cannot be understated, but is often overlooked: Humiliation.

Those who are drawn to extremes often, almost always, suffer some form of humiliation. Many actors who fail and are rejected from the entertainment industry have become right-wing fringe figures. Many artists. The Daily Wire is filled with writers and actors who've been expelled from their industries. Hitler was a failed artist and received brutal criticism before he entered politics. There are people who exploit this sentiment in others, and there are those who are drawn towards extreme right-wing ideology because personal humiliation. This humiliation may be in losing a job and being unable to provide for family, or it could be rejection in relationships (hence the often-fascist nature of the incel communities). Failure and rejection can be a powerful thing, and it can manifest in dark ways if those on the receiving end feel that life has no meaning.

Fascism takes hold of a society when this sentiment is felt by broad swaths of the public, and cannot be averted without equally broad changes to the status quo. Individual grievances easily become nationalist movements when sizeable elements of the population feel the same way, and it's incredibly easy to blame failures the system contributes to on elements within that system (immigrants, minorities, LGBTQ). The hyper-masculinity aspect of fascism is thus pretty easy to understand. It's over-compensation for perceived emasculation.

The Allies indicted they learned the lesson of the foolishness of the winners' imposing humiliation and penury upon the losers when Germany was treated differently after the end of World War II.

 

[gman]

A common element in fascism that cannot be understated, but is often overlooked: Humiliation.

Those who are drawn to extremes often, almost always, suffer some form of humiliation. Many actors who fail and are rejected from the entertainment industry have become right-wing fringe figures. Many artists. The Daily Wire is filled with writers and actors who've been expelled from their industries. Hitler was a failed artist and received brutal criticism before he entered politics. There are people who exploit this sentiment in others, and there are those who are drawn towards extreme right-wing ideology because personal humiliation. This humiliation may be in losing a job and being unable to provide for family, or it could be rejection in relationships (hence the often-fascist nature of the incel communities). Failure and rejection can be a powerful thing, and it can manifest in dark ways if those on the receiving end feel that life has no meaning.

Fascism takes hold of a society when this sentiment is felt by broad swaths of the public, and cannot be averted without equally broad changes to the status quo. Individual grievances easily become nationalist movements when sizeable elements of the population feel the same way, and it's incredibly easy to blame failures the system contributes to on elements within that system (immigrants, minorities, LGBTQ). The hyper-masculinity aspect of fascism is thus pretty easy to understand. It's over-compensation for perceived emasculation.

Have you had your thesis published? You make a false premise based on generalizations.

 

[GIJane]

I'm not a baby boomer, I don't consider the Kennedy's to be mythical.

What that is called is a : Deflection. You can't argue the point so you deflect. Good job.

 

[Dans La Lune]

Have you had your thesis published? You make a false premise based on generalizations.

I'm not a scholar, I just read the work of scholars. Humiliation is a key component:

'Jason Stanley, a professor of philosophy at Yale University, discusses the rise of fascism in his book "How Fascism Works: The Politics of Us and Them." He explains that fascism often relies on a mythic past and a sense of historical humiliation. For Germans, this humiliation was exemplified by the Treaty of Versailles, which imposed harsh penalties on Germany after World War I, leading to a perceived national humiliation that fueled fascist ideologies.

Stanley argues that this historical humiliation narrative is crucial for fascist movements, as it provides a framework for blaming internal enemies for the nation's supposed decline. In the context of Germany, the Treaty of Versailles was used to justify the need for a strong leader to restore the nation's former glory and to combat the perceived threats from within, such as Jews and other minorities.

This narrative of humiliation and the need for restoration is a recurring theme in Stanley's analysis of fascist movements, both historically and in contemporary contexts, highlighting how similar rhetoric can be applied to different national situations to mobilize support for authoritarian leaders.'

...

'Fascism is often associated with feelings of personal humiliation among its supporters. According to Amy Buller's "Darkness Over Germany," ordinary Germans faced difficult decisions as the Nazi party took control, including whether to flee or stay and fight, and their choices were influenced by feelings of humiliation and poverty. These emotions can drive individuals to seek leaders who promise to alleviate their pain and restore national pride, as seen with Hitler's promise to make Germany great again.

In a broader context, humiliation is a common element in fascism that is often overlooked. Many individuals who are drawn to extreme right-wing ideologies suffer from some form of personal humiliation, such as failure and rejection in their careers or relationships. This humiliation can be a powerful force that manifests in dark ways if those experiencing it feel that life has no meaning.

Fascist regimes often use public humiliation as a tactic to instill fear and control, as documented in the study of fascist violence in Italy, where squads carried out numerous raids, personal attacks, and acts of public humiliation.

In summary, personal humiliation plays a significant role in the rise and perpetuation of fascist ideologies and movements.'

 

[j brown's body]

A common element in fascism that cannot be understated, but is often overlooked: Humiliation.

Those who are drawn to extremes often, almost always, suffer some form of humiliation. Many actors who fail and are rejected from the entertainment industry have become right-wing fringe figures. Many artists. The Daily Wire is filled with writers and actors who've been expelled from their industries. Hitler was a failed artist and received brutal criticism before he entered politics. There are people who exploit this sentiment in others, and there are those who are drawn towards extreme right-wing ideology because personal humiliation. This humiliation may be in losing a job and being unable to provide for family, or it could be rejection in relationships (hence the often-fascist nature of the incel communities). Failure and rejection can be a powerful thing, and it can manifest in dark ways if those on the receiving end feel that life has no meaning.

Fascism takes hold of a society when this sentiment is felt by broad swaths of the public, and cannot be averted without equally broad changes to the status quo. Individual grievances easily become nationalist movements when sizeable elements of the population feel the same way, and it's incredibly easy to blame failures the system contributes to on elements within that system (immigrants, minorities, LGBTQ). The hyper-masculinity aspect of fascism is thus pretty easy to understand. It's over-compensation for perceived emasculation.

As a tool of facists, humiliation of others, at which Trump is well practiced, is a form of psychological violence that invites physical violence.

 

[gman]

I'm not a scholar, I just read the work of scholars. Humiliation is a key component:

'Jason Stanley, a professor of philosophy at Yale University, discusses the rise of fascism in his book "How Fascism Works: The Politics of Us and Them." He explains that fascism often relies on a mythic past and a sense of historical humiliation. For Germans, this humiliation was exemplified by the Treaty of Versailles, which imposed harsh penalties on Germany after World War I, leading to a perceived national humiliation that fueled fascist ideologies.

Stanley argues that this historical humiliation narrative is crucial for fascist movements, as it provides a framework for blaming internal enemies for the nation's supposed decline. In the context of Germany, the Treaty of Versailles was used to justify the need for a strong leader to restore the nation's former glory and to combat the perceived threats from within, such as Jews and other minorities.

This narrative of humiliation and the need for restoration is a recurring theme in Stanley's analysis of fascist movements, both historically and in contemporary contexts, highlighting how similar rhetoric can be applied to different national situations to mobilize support for authoritarian leaders.'

...

'Fascism is often associated with feelings of personal humiliation among its supporters. According to Amy Buller's "Darkness Over Germany," ordinary Germans faced difficult decisions as the Nazi party took control, including whether to flee or stay and fight, and their choices were influenced by feelings of humiliation and poverty. These emotions can drive individuals to seek leaders who promise to alleviate their pain and restore national pride, as seen with Hitler's promise to make Germany great again.

In a broader context, humiliation is a common element in fascism that is often overlooked. Many individuals who are drawn to extreme right-wing ideologies suffer from some form of personal humiliation, such as failure and rejection in their careers or relationships. This humiliation can be a powerful force that manifests in dark ways if those experiencing it feel that life has no meaning.

Fascist regimes often use public humiliation as a tactic to instill fear and control, as documented in the study of fascist violence in Italy, where squads carried out numerous raids, personal attacks, and acts of public humiliation.

In summary, personal humiliation plays a significant role in the rise and perpetuation of fascist ideologies and movements.'

Interesting. It all ties well together.

 

[j brown's body]

I'm not a scholar, I just read the work of scholars. Humiliation is a key component:

'Jason Stanley, a professor of philosophy at Yale University, discusses the rise of fascism in his book "How Fascism Works: The Politics of Us and Them." He explains that fascism often relies on a mythic past and a sense of historical humiliation. For Germans, this humiliation was exemplified by the Treaty of Versailles, which imposed harsh penalties on Germany after World War I, leading to a perceived national humiliation that fueled fascist ideologies.

Stanley argues that this historical humiliation narrative is crucial for fascist movements, as it provides a framework for blaming internal enemies for the nation's supposed decline. In the context of Germany, the Treaty of Versailles was used to justify the need for a strong leader to restore the nation's former glory and to combat the perceived threats from within, such as Jews and other minorities.

This narrative of humiliation and the need for restoration is a recurring theme in Stanley's analysis of fascist movements, both historically and in contemporary contexts, highlighting how similar rhetoric can be applied to different national situations to mobilize support for authoritarian leaders.'

...

'Fascism is often associated with feelings of personal humiliation among its supporters. According to Amy Buller's "Darkness Over Germany," ordinary Germans faced difficult decisions as the Nazi party took control, including whether to flee or stay and fight, and their choices were influenced by feelings of humiliation and poverty. These emotions can drive individuals to seek leaders who promise to alleviate their pain and restore national pride, as seen with Hitler's promise to make Germany great again.

In a broader context, humiliation is a common element in fascism that is often overlooked. Many individuals who are drawn to extreme right-wing ideologies suffer from some form of personal humiliation, such as failure and rejection in their careers or relationships. This humiliation can be a powerful force that manifests in dark ways if those experiencing it feel that life has no meaning.

Fascist regimes often use public humiliation as a tactic to instill fear and control, as documented in the study of fascist violence in Italy, where squads carried out numerous raids, personal attacks, and acts of public humiliation.

In summary, personal humiliation plays a significant role in the rise and perpetuation of fascist ideologies and movements.'

Consider the milage they got out of Clinton pointing out that there was a basket of deplorables in MAGA.