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One word: Why?

Jesse Booth

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Why are some people so adamantly opposed to letting transgender people use the opposite sex's bathroom? And more importantly, why do transgender people want to use opposite sex bathrooms so badly? It's a bathroom! You go there to take a ****! Why is it such a big deal whether or not you get to go to the bathroom somewhere, or whether or not you get to stop someone from going somewhere?

Questions for the transgender side: Why do you want to use the other restroom so badly? Is the men's room out of soap? Are you sick of the lines for the women's room? Is it some kind of freedom thing? Do freedom ****s pass easier than regular ones?

Questions for the other side: what is so bad about a few transgenders using your bathroom? Are you hoarding all the soap? Are you afraid of the men's room getting short lines as women stampede to the unoccupied stalls? Do freedom ****s smell worse than regular ones?
 

TheGoverness

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Honestly, I have no idea about any of this. This whole gendered bathroom debate has just blown completely out of proportion, on both sides.
 

TheGoverness

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Okay, good. I'm not the only one who's completely lost on why any of this matters.
I mean, I personally don't care for gendered bathrooms to begin with, but I think we've got bigger fish to fry. This just seems like not that important of an issue to me.
 

Jesse Booth

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I mean, I personally don't care for gendered bathrooms to begin with, but I think we've got bigger fish to fry. This just seems like not that important of an issue to me.

Fair enough. I don't care one way or another who's in the stall next to me, and it's a bit unusual that other people are so fixated on it.
 

joG

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Okay, good. I'm not the only one who's completely lost on why any of this matters.

Nope. You are only unique in that you blurted it out.
 

Jesse Booth

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Nope. You are only unique in that you blurted it out.

If there's one thing I'm good at, it's putting my foot in my mouth. In a discussion about public restrooms, that's one of the least awul things to put in one's mouth!
 

Redress

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Why are some people so adamantly opposed to letting transgender people use the opposite sex's bathroom? And more importantly, why do transgender people want to use opposite sex bathrooms so badly? It's a bathroom! You go there to take a ****! Why is it such a big deal whether or not you get to go to the bathroom somewhere, or whether or not you get to stop someone from going somewhere?

Questions for the transgender side: Why do you want to use the other restroom so badly? Is the men's room out of soap? Are you sick of the lines for the women's room? Is it some kind of freedom thing? Do freedom ****s pass easier than regular ones?

Questions for the other side: what is so bad about a few transgenders using your bathroom? Are you hoarding all the soap? Are you afraid of the men's room getting short lines as women stampede to the unoccupied stalls? Do freedom ****s smell worse than regular ones?

I am by no means an expert, but the way I understand it, for a transgender person, using a public bathroom is not a fun experience. They basically feel awkward using either bathroom. They feel less distress(and as I understand it, it can be significant distress) using the bathroom of the gender they...I dunno the right word, you know what I mean. It is also generally less disruptive for others as they go to pains to look like that gender. And of course depending on how far along they are in the process, they may be plumbed as that gender as well.

I stress again I am not an expert, just having some knowledge based on a little reading and having known some transgender people when I was younger(at the time I was like 19, and holy ****ing awkward for me, especially Rikki, who would love to come in and "hey, look how my boobs are coming in" as she took off her top. Knowing she was plumbed as a guy, but those boobs where hot...yeah, that was conflicted emotions).
 

cabse5

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I mean, I personally don't care for gendered bathrooms to begin with, but I think we've got bigger fish to fry. This just seems like not that important of an issue to me.
It's the continued onslaught on American society by achieving 'rights' for minorities using the mis-precedents from concrete thinking judges and ideologues. Yeah, let's read the passage created in 1868, verbatim, then extrapolate that to fit our agendas.. Ultimately, this bathroom 'discrimination' case will be decided by judges who haven't taken the time to ingest the back story to the creation, the passage and the meaning of the 14th amendment. BTW, amendments 13-15 referred to the federal government using it's influence to prevent individual states from preventing former African-American slaves their citizenship.

It's only the beginning. One thinks personal ownership of guns will be the only thing at risk with new, funky, precedents created by ideological (who don't care about the actual meaning of The Constitution) judges? IMO, the biggest threat to our society will be these 'minority' judgements. First, American born is automatically American citizen. Then gay marriage. Then restrooms for transgenders. Then probably all students will receive an A for grade regardless of effort. Then probably every pro baseball team will demand to be in the World Series every season. And on and on and on. American society will no longer be able to set standards, ANYWHERE, because precedents created from the 14th amendment insist everyone be treated/given exactly the same.

We better be getting some judges who actually wish to decide the constitutionality of a law using the real meaning of The Constitution and not some pet ideology of theirs. And for crying out loud, prevent judges from making law.
I'm off my soapbox...for now.
 
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Jesse Booth

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I am by no means an expert, but the way I understand it, for a transgender person, using a public bathroom is not a fun experience. They basically feel awkward using either bathroom. They feel less distress(and as I understand it, it can be significant distress) using the bathroom of the gender they...I dunno the right word, you know what I mean. It is also generally less disruptive for others as they go to pains to look like that gender. And of course depending on how far along they are in the process, they may be plumbed as that gender as well.

That makes sense. I've never viewed public restrooms as something that should be "fun" per say, but I can definitely see how it could be made less awkward for transgenders.

I stress again I am not an expert, just having some knowledge based on a little reading and having known some transgender people when I was younger(at the time I was like 19, and holy ****ing awkward for me, especially Rikki, who would love to come in and "hey, look how my boobs are coming in" as she took off her top. Knowing she was plumbed as a guy, but those boobs where hot...yeah, that was conflicted emotions).

Why does this sound like something out of an anime? Also of note, it's good to know I'm not the only one who conflates erections with emotions.
 

Jesse Booth

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It's the continued onslaught on American society by achieving 'rights' for minorities using the mis-precedents from concrete thinking judges and ideologues. Yeah, let's read the passage created in 1868, verbatim, then extrapolate that to fit our agendas.. Ultimately, this bathroom 'discrimination' case will be decided by judges who haven't taken the time to ingest the back story to the creation and passage of the 14th amendment.

And it's only the beginning. One thinks guns will be the only thing at risk with new, funky, precedents created by ideological (who don't care about the actual meaning of The Constitution) judges? IMO, the biggest threat to our society will be these 'minority' judgements. First American born is automatically American citizen. Then gay marriage. Then restrooms for transgenders. Then probably all students will receive an A for grade regardless of effort. Then probably every pro baseball team will demand to be in the World Series every season. And on and on and on. American society will no longer be able to set standards, ANYWHERE.

We better be getting some judges who actually wish to decide the constitutionality of a law using the real meaning of The Constitution and not some pet ideology of theirs. And for crying out loud, prevent judges from making law.
I'm off my soapbox...for now.

Well, considering that there isn't a single instance of the word "bathroom" anywhere in the constitution, It's going to be really, really difficult to nail down the constitutionality of this issue.
 

Redress

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That makes sense. I've never viewed public restrooms as something that should be "fun" per say, but I can definitely see how it could be made less awkward for transgenders.

Unfortunately for transgender people, it is now a political cause, and they are not really in a position to be neutral. If no one makes any laws, they are just careful and considerate and the odds of a problem with others is almost nil. With the way things are now, with it being a cause, the odds of a problem are large, and likely to be harmful to them in more ways than one.

Why does this sound like something out of an anime? Also of note, it's good to know I'm not the only one who conflates erections with emotions.

Not any anime I have watched. Trap characters, sure, but transgender, not so much. And I am not sure what that last sentence of yours means.
 

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Well, considering that there isn't a single instance of the word "bathroom" anywhere in the constitution, It's going to be really, really difficult to nail down the constitutionality of this issue.
Judges interpretation of the 14th amendment...Don't be so cocky, here. IMO, the BO administration is headed for another overturn of another state's law facilitated by the judiciary's mis-precedents of the 14th amendment.
 

Jesse Booth

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Unfortunately for transgender people, it is now a political cause, and they are not really in a position to be neutral. If no one makes any laws, they are just careful and considerate and the odds of a problem with others is almost nil. With the way things are now, with it being a cause, the odds of a problem are large, and likely to be harmful to them in more ways than one.

Talk about getting the short end of the stick. Bathrooms certainly sound like a significant problem area for them now.

Not any anime I have watched. Trap characters, sure, but transgender, not so much.

Dumb joke. Please ignore it.

And I am not sure what that last sentence of yours means.

Another dumb joke, specifically about the following quoted part. Please ignore that one as well.

Knowing she was plumbed as a guy, but those boobs where hot...yeah, that was conflicted emotions
 

cabse5

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...Also of note, it's good to know I'm not the only one who conflates erections with emotions.
Jesse is attempting to say groups are demanding their 'rights' to be as sexual as they want to be.
 

ttwtt78640

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Well, considering that there isn't a single instance of the word "bathroom" anywhere in the constitution, It's going to be really, really difficult to nail down the constitutionality of this issue.

Sure there is - its in the right to self identify your race, gender, age and ethnicity clause. It is a discriminatory burden to be forced to be defined by your genes or other accidents of birth when in your mind you really, really wish to be seem as something or someone else. Just because you were born a white male in 1952 should not prevent you from presenting yourself as a black female born in 2000. ;)
 

Jesse Booth

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Sure there is - its in the right to self identify your race, gender, age and ethnicity clause. It is a discriminatory burden to be forced to be defined by your genes or other accidents of birth when in your mind you really, really wish to be seem as something or someone else. Just because you were born a white male in 1952 should not prevent you from presenting yourself as a black female born in 2000. ;)

You make a compelling argument, [insert proper sequence of letters and numbers here]. I need to demand my rights! Until this forum puts in an option to list "troll" as my gender, I doubt I'll be able to feel comfortable in my own skin binary code.
 

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You make a compelling argument, [insert proper sequence of letters and numbers here]. I need to demand my rights! Until this forum puts in an option to list "troll" as my gender, I doubt I'll be able to feel comfortable in my own skin binary code.

All you would need is medical and psychological professionals who have studied the issue to agree with you.
 

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my guess is most transgendered people don't want to draw a bunch of attention. And depending on how well they are passing, going into the bathroom of their biological sex may draw a bunch of attention. Especially for trans-men who have undergone hormone therapy.
 

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WHY??? WHY???

Why would you start yet ANOTHER thread on this ?????????????

giphy.gif
 

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Why are some people so adamantly opposed to letting transgender people use the opposite sex's bathroom? And more importantly, why do transgender people want to use opposite sex bathrooms so badly? It's a bathroom! You go there to take a ****! Why is it such a big deal whether or not you get to go to the bathroom somewhere, or whether or not you get to stop someone from going somewhere?

Questions for the transgender side: Why do you want to use the other restroom so badly? Is the men's room out of soap? Are you sick of the lines for the women's room? Is it some kind of freedom thing? Do freedom ****s pass easier than regular ones?

Questions for the other side: what is so bad about a few transgenders using your bathroom? Are you hoarding all the soap? Are you afraid of the men's room getting short lines as women stampede to the unoccupied stalls? Do freedom ****s smell worse than regular ones?

The problem here is where a transgender goes to use the bathroom has become a scapegoat for a much bigger issue. So the questions are more or less moot.

At the end of the say social conservatism does not want to see transgenders obtain anything that might be deemed as acceptance or legitimacy. That is really about it.

The issue on a transgender using a bathroom then becomes just a subset of the larger problem as social conservatism tends to associate what is happening with transgenders today with what homosexuality went through decades ago with their own fighting for acceptance and legitimacy. All the evidence is there. Back then we fought about everything from classifying homosexuality in the DSM guides (Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders by the APA) to even various laws prevalent of the period in question. It took time for homosexuality to obtain a seat at the political table of discussion on matters that impacted them. Like marriage, like adoptions, like medial rights among partners, etc.

Now we have a new social push on dealing with transgenders that arguably has been brought to the front by people like Caitlyn Jenner and Chelsea Manning, but also because of issues with laws like what North Carolina (and others) are pushing for forcing people to abide by the sex identity on a birth certificate no matter how they feel about who they are. The literal push to treat transgenders as negative as possible and a means to add to the political fight between social conservatism and social liberalism (don't confuse social liberalism with modern liberalism, that is another discussion entirely.) Again all the evidence is there as a decade ago no one was really talking about this like they are today, and we see the social conservative backlash suggesting transgenders are some perversion that put others in danger even though we have zero evidence that is the case.

Paranoia, unfounded fears, misinformation, personal attacks, etc. now dominate this subject as there is a vested interest by social conservatism to make transgenders as something to be ashamed of thus humiliated by legislation designed to be in itself an attack. Of what I understand of those dealing with transgender issues, they have more than enough on their plate without adding to it by social conservatives looking to demonize someone anyway they can.

The truth is child predators exist, and they tend to be older white "straight" men far more than anyone who identifies as homosexual or transgender. But that does not stop social conservatism from going after some demographic and calling them anything they can to gain political points from those they encourage to also fear and/or be angry as said demographic.
 
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cabse5

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The problem here is where a transgender goes to use the bathroom has become a scapegoat for a much bigger issue. So the questions are more or less moot.

At the end of the say social conservatism does not want to see transgenders obtain anything that might be deemed as acceptance or legitimacy. That is really about it.

The issue on a transgender using a bathroom then becomes just a subset of the larger problem as social conservatism tends to associate what is happening with transgenders today with what homosexuality went through decades ago with their own fighting for acceptance and legitimacy. All the evidence is there. Back then we fought about everything from classifying homosexuality in the DSM guides (Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders by the APA) to even various laws prevalent of the period in question. It took time for homosexuality to obtain a seat at the political table of discussion on matters that impacted them. Like marriage, like adoptions, like medial rights among partners, etc.

Now we have a new social push on dealing with transgenders that arguably has been brought to the front by people like Caitlyn Jenner and Chelsea Manning, but also because of issues with laws like what North Carolina (and others) are pushing for forcing people to abide by the sex identity on a birth certificate no matter how they feel about who they are. The literal push to treat transgenders as negative as possible and a means to add to the political fight between social conservatism and social liberalism (don't confuse social liberalism with modern liberalism, that is another discussion entirely.) Again all the evidence is there as a decade ago no one was really talking about this like they are today, and we see the social conservative backlash suggesting transgenders are some perversion that put others in danger even though we have zero evidence that is the case.

Paranoia, unfounded fears, misinformation, personal attacks, etc. now dominate this subject as there is a vested interest by social conservatism to make transgenders as something to be ashamed of thus humiliated by legislation designed to be in itself an attack. Of what I understand of those dealing with transgender issues, they have more than enough on their plate without adding to it by social conservatives looking to demonize someone anyway they can.

The truth is child predators exist, and they tend to be older white "straight" men far more than anyone who identifies as homosexual or transgender. But that does not stop social conservatism from going after some demographic and calling them anything they can to gain political points from those they encourage to also fear and/or be angry as said demographic.
Oh come on, which would have the lowest percentage of occurrences? A predator using a transgender bathroom to spy on children or a transsexual actually needing a transgender bathroom? The occurrences of both are astronomically low. Why is the federal government wasting its time on this?
 

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Oh come on, which would have the lowest percentage of occurrences? A predator using a transgender bathroom to spy on children or a transsexual actually needing a transgender bathroom? The occurrences of both are astronomically low.

We are on the same side of this conversation more than you think.
 
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