• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!
  • Welcome to our archives. No new posts are allowed here.

OK -- who believes this for more than a second?

Do you believe Pelosi?

  • Yes

    Votes: 16 66.7%
  • No

    Votes: 8 33.3%

  • Total voters
    24
CoffeeSaint said:
Good points, all. Except this last one: do you really equate this attempt to balance airwaves, whether it is intelligent or not, whether it is constitutional of nor, with Nazism? This seems like a good example of Godwin's Law to me.

But you're right. The Fairness Doctrine is not a good idea. I wasn't trying to say that it was, but the idea that it is an attempt to eliminate the free press completely in order to bring about our Glorious Regime is absurd.

I agree. People throw around the word "Nazi" so much I start using it by accident, even though neither party in America is anywhere close to fascism.

I think both sides: liberal and conservative, need to take a step back and look at where were are in the context of history. Things are damn good right now compared to how bad they used to be.
 
Caine said:
No, im not saying that.

Can you tell me how these programs you speak of are against the constitution?

Amendment V


No person shall be held to answer for a capital, or otherwise infamous crime, unless on a presentment or indictment of a grand jury, except in cases arising in the land or naval forces, or in the militia, when in actual service in time of war or public danger; nor shall any person be subject for the same offense to be twice put in jeopardy of life or limb; nor shall be compelled in any criminal case to be a witness against himself, nor be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor shall private property be taken for public use, without just compensation."


Amendment X


The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the states, are reserved to the states respectively, or to the people.

There goes the Federal Income tax, social security, and just about every single federal entitlement program you can think of.
 
Caine said:
Since when did the government limit its abilities to the constitution?
What would be the purpose of a legislative branch then?
Hoot suggested that Pelosi portray her party as "constitutionalists" -- in other words, get the party back to preserving and defending the constitution.

That necessitates that the government limit its abilities to the Constitution, doesnt it?
 
Caine said:
No, im not saying that.
Can you tell me how these programs you speak of are against the constitution?

You mean entitlement programs?
There's nothing in the Constitution that gives Congress the powert o create legislation dealing with retirement, health care, or direct-benefit welfare programs.

If the power isnt granted to create any given piece of legislation, then any such legislation is against the Constitution.
 
Goobieman said:
You mean entitlement programs?
There's nothing in the Constitution that gives Congress the powert o create legislation dealing with retirement, health care, or direct-benefit welfare programs.

If the power isnt granted to create any given piece of legislation, then any such legislation is against the Constitution.

THE PROCESS IS CALLED LAW MAKING, AND ACCORDING TO THE CONSTITUTION, IT IS A FUNCTION OF CONGRESS.

HAVE YOU EVER HEARD THE WORD, ADMENDMENT. FREEDOM OF SPEECH, RELIGION, RIGHT TO ASSEMBLE ARE PART OF AN ADMENTMENT TO THE CONSTITUTION.

SLAVERY USE TO BE LEGAL UNTIL SOMEONE PASSED LAWS AND AN ADMENTMENT.

DON'T FORGET, YOU ARE NOT MENTIONED IN THE EITHER. SHOULD YOU BE ALLOWED TO HAVE AN OPINION?

YOU ARE FUNNY, STRANGE, BUT FUNNY. :rock

Murder is not mentioned in the constitution either. Don't forget that Bush was made president by an act of the Supreme Court. No where in the constitution does it say that the supreme court can elect a president, but it did.
 
Last edited:
dragonslayer said:
THE PROCESS IS CALLED LAW MAKING, AND ACCORDING TO THE CONSTITUTION, IT IS A FUNCTION OF CONGRESS.

Ya and the Congress can not pass unconstitutional laws which expand its powers outside of the scope of the Constitution.

HAVE YOU EVER HEARD THE WORD ADMENDMENT. FREEDOM OF SPEECH, RELIGION, RIGHT TO ASSEMBLE ARE PART OF AN ADMENTMENT TO THE CONSTITUTION.

Yes and Constitutional Amendments did not create entitlement programs those were created by statute and are outside of the powers dilineated to the federal government by the Constitution.

SLAVERY USE TO BE LEGAL UNTIL SOMEONE PASSED LAWS AND AN ADMENTMENT.

An amendment was passed in accordance with the Constitution, statute which expands the power of the government outside of the limits of the Constitution is what we call UNCONSITUTIONAL.

Murder is not mentioned in the constitution either.

That's because the Constitution only creates limits on the powers of the federal government and through incorporation on state governments the Constitution does not institute limits upon the citizenry that is what statute is for, but statute can not create laws which grant the Federal Government more powers than the Constitution allows.

Legislative powers are guaranteed to the Federal Government in Article 1 section 8:

"To make all laws which shall be necessary and proper for carrying into execution the foregoing powers, and all other powers vested by this Constitution in the government of the United States, or in any department or officer thereof."

But he Xth amendment clearly states that all powers not dilineated to the Federal Government by the Constitution shall be left to the states or the people.

Don't forget that Bush was made president by an act of the Supreme Court. No where in the constitution does it say that the supreme court can elect a president, but it did.

Umm the Surpreme Court is charged with deciding the Constitutionality of things they determined that the Fl. recounts violated the equal protections clause of the 14th amendment due to the uneven way in which the recounts were being conducted.
 
Last edited:
dragonslayer said:
THE PROCESS IS CALLED LAW MAKING, AND ACCORDING TO THE CONSTITUTION, IT IS A FUNCTION OF CONGRESS.
Stop yelling, junior.

Yes - making laws is a function of congress.
The Constitutiion spells out in what areas Congress can make laws -- these are listes in Article I Section 8 of the Constitution. It starts out with "Congress shall have the power to..."
If you'll look, you'll note the conspicuous absence of the things I mentioned.

HAVE YOU EVER HEARD THE WORD, ADMENDMENT. FREEDOM OF SPEECH, RELIGION, RIGHT TO ASSEMBLE ARE PART OF AN ADMENTMENT TO THE CONSTITUTION.
SLAVERY USE TO BE LEGAL UNTIL SOMEONE PASSED LAWS AND AN ADMENTMENT.
Yes.
And in order for Congress to pass laws regarding the things I mentioned, there has to be an amendment allowing to to do so.

DON'T FORGET, YOU ARE NOT MENTIONED IN THE EITHER. SHOULD YOU BE ALLOWED TO HAVE AN OPINION?
This is the 2nd stupidest thing I've read today. Good work!!

Don't forget that Bush was made president by an act of the Supreme Court. No where in the constitution does it say that the supreme court can elect a president, but it did.
Gotta admire you -- you aren't at all bashfull about displaying your complete and total ignorance of the issues.
 
I read something interesting today; I'm not sure if this is one of the threads where conservatives were discussing how the Democrats elected on Nov 7 were actually conservatives in disguise, so "Haha, we win after all."
I think it was this thread.

Anyway, here's what I read:

"The officially accepted version of the Democrats' victory was that the party won by deftly running moderates in red states. This argument implied that the presumed incoming speaker of the House, Rep. Nancy Pelosi, D-Calif., had rather tackily seized power on the backs of candidates who actually held her liberalism in high contempt and were just itching to inaugurate a showdown over gay marriage roughly 17 minutes after taking the oath of office.

But that's not quite true.

In fact, of the 27 Democrat candidates for the House who won outright on Nov. 7, only five can truly be called social conservatives. Far more are pro-choice, against the Iraq war and quite liberal. Why, there's even a woman who was tossed out of a presidential event for wearing an anti-Bush T-shirt (New Hampshire's Carol Shea-Porter) and a fellow who ran an alternative newspaper and who proudly supports affirmative action -- in Kentucky, no less (John Yarmuth).

So the experts got it wrong again, which is really not so surprising given that what happened on Election Day was quite nuanced. The Democrats moved to the center and to the left at the same time. In doing so, they became more like the hegemonic Democratic Party of old. And if, in 2008, it turns out that Nov. 7 did, in fact, usher in an era of Democrat resurgence, it will be precisely because the party managed to sustain this left-center coalition and render the distinctions between the two groups less important. "


link

The last sentence is important.
For about six... mmm, maybe almost ten years now, "liberal" has become synonymous with some fictional fringey freak from San Francisco who wants to enter into gay marriage with an illegal alien and have a dozen abortions, each one for "convenience", and all at taxpayer expense.
Either that, or some rich but eccentric Hollywood star, who wants to outlaw guns, ban freedom of speech unless they happen to agree with the opinion being expressed, and force everyone to quit smoking and drive hybrid cars.
Or Cindy Sheehan.
It's gotten to the point where both "Liberal" and "Feminist" are dirty words; you might as well declare yourself a neo-nazi or a child molester, for all the mainstream credibility you're likely to have with either of these labels attached to you.

The fact is, there was a time, not very long ago- in recent memory- when the majority of Americans identified more strongly with the left than the right, and when "Conservative" or "Fundamentalist Christian" were the labels that people wished to avoid, the labels that carried a stigma, the labels that destroyed one's credibility as handily as if they were a klan robe and hood, or a dunce cap and a kick-me sign.

The pendulum swings.
It swung far right this time; now it's headed left again.
The moderates will no longer be creatures of the right; they will belong to the left now, for awhile. The right has become immoderate; it has become something moderates can no longer support.
Meanwhile, the left is welcoming them back into the fold... not by becoming more moderate and less extreme, but by allowing lefties from a variety of points on the spectrum to be seen and heard, rather than drowning them out or denying them the right to call themselves lefties.
It's the "Big Tent" theory that worked so long and so well for the GOP... and continued to work until the GOP went so extreme that conservative fundamentalists were emboldened enough by their apparent sway over the President of the United States to insist that they no longer wanted to share a "big tent" with homosexuals, no matter how conservative and republican said homosexuals might be, or with moderates, who were and always have been the backbone, the meat-and-potatoes, the majority, of any party.
The left, meanwhile, opened its arms to the rejected centrists.

The left- including the capital-L "Liberals"- will be in power for awhile now. Definitely through the 2008 presidential elections (these things go in 5 to 10 year cycles).
Deal wit' it. :mrgreen:
 
Last edited:
Oh this really takes the cake.......Cut throat before elections......sweet innocent and willing to work after? :rofl :rofl :rofl

Anyone who believes that is ah "not right' up top. Not on your life.


Nancy Pelosi probably doesn't get sleep at night planning how she will take Bush and his Administration down. She hates them with every breath in her body.

No other person (ok Teddy Kennedy maybe) is as liberal, is as hateful (ok Cindy Sheehan maybe) towards Bush and Republicans. She has no intention of working with the present administration.

Her agenda was clear before the elections and if she lets on that it has changed she is lying. She is a wolf in sheeps clothing. You noticed she was very quiet during the last month of the campaigns....she was either startin to pick out swatches for the drapes in her new office in Washington or the Democrats told her to shut up that if she let on anymore about their agenda, they wouldnt win.

Nancy would eat her own young.......to advance her causes.
 
Originally posted by Navy Pride:
If she does not continue to do their bidding she will be history........
Did Karl Rove do it again? Did he engineer the Democratic victory this past election in order to seal the Republican win in 2008?
 
ALL Politicians are Liars.

Most Politicians are corrupt.

'nough said?
 
Oh this really takes the cake.......Cut throat before elections......sweet innocent and willing to work after? :rofl :rofl :rofl

Anyone who believes that is ah "not right' up top. Not on your life.

Up to this point of your post, it would be impossible for someone who didn't know you to tell which party you were talking about.

Nancy Pelosi probably doesn't get sleep at night planning how she will take Bush and his Administration down. She hates them with every breath in her body.

No other person (ok Teddy Kennedy maybe) is as liberal, is as hateful (ok Cindy Sheehan maybe) towards Bush and Republicans. She has no intention of working with the present administration.

Her agenda was clear before the elections and if she lets on that it has changed she is lying. She is a wolf in sheeps clothing. You noticed she was very quiet during the last month of the campaigns....she was either startin to pick out swatches for the drapes in her new office in Washington or the Democrats told her to shut up that if she let on anymore about their agenda, they wouldnt win.

Nancy would eat her own young.......to advance her causes.

The rest of this post you could switch the dem and rep names and it would be just as true. It's just one big ad hominem attack. No facts whatsoever. Nothing to see here folks!:2wave:
 
Back
Top Bottom