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Ok, I was WRONG.

Howler63

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I posted earlier today that 1200 deaths last year from police shootings was horrendous and that is represents a bigger problem of police militarization. I was wrong. The numbers do NOT bear that out.

http://www.bjs.gov/content/pub/pdf/cpp08.pdf

According to the Justice department, there were abound 40 million interactions between police and citizens for the last year the data has been crunched. Which, by the way, is a decrease from the year before. based on that number, the total number of citizens killed by the police is .0003. What in normally called statistically insignificant. Now I'd love to see some new numbers, but I can't imagine that they'd be vastly different except for actually being lower.

For the most part, far and away, the police are professional, courteous and fair. There is no evidence to support the notion that they are systemically racist or violent toward any racial group.

Now, are there tragedies? Yes. Alton Sterling, Philando Castille, Tamir rice, Oscar Grant. These were horrible tragedies that we could all regret and mourn. However, they are NOT representative of even tjhe tiniest portion of police interactions.
 

Casper

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I posted earlier today that 1200 deaths last year from police shootings was horrendous and that is represents a bigger problem of police militarization. I was wrong. The numbers do NOT bear that out.

http://www.bjs.gov/content/pub/pdf/cpp08.pdf

According to the Justice department, there were abound 40 million interactions between police and citizens for the last year the data has been crunched (2012). Which, by the way, is a decrease from the year before. based on that number, the total number of citizens killed by the police is .0003. What in normally called statistically insignificant. Now I'd love to see some new numbers, but I can't imagine that they'd be vastly different except for actually being lower.

For the most part, far and away, the police are professional, courteous and fair. There is no evidence to support the notion that they are systemically racist or violent toward any racial group.

Now, are there tragedies? Yes. Alton Sterling, Philando Castille, Tamir rice, Oscar Grant. These were horrible tragedies that we could all regret and mourn. However, they are NOT representative of even tjhe tiniest portion of police interactions.

Good for you. The truth will set you free, glad you found it and are man enough to admit it.
 

X Factor

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I posted earlier today that 1200 deaths last year from police shootings was horrendous and that is represents a bigger problem of police militarization. I was wrong. The numbers do NOT bear that out.

http://www.bjs.gov/content/pub/pdf/cpp08.pdf

According to the Justice department, there were abound 40 million interactions between police and citizens for the last year the data has been crunched. Which, by the way, is a decrease from the year before. based on that number, the total number of citizens killed by the police is .0003. What in normally called statistically insignificant. Now I'd love to see some new numbers, but I can't imagine that they'd be vastly different except for actually being lower.

For the most part, far and away, the police are professional, courteous and fair. There is no evidence to support the notion that they are systemically racist or violent toward any racial group.

Now, are there tragedies? Yes. Alton Sterling, Philando Castille, Tamir rice, Oscar Grant. These were horrible tragedies that we could all regret and mourn. However, they are NOT representative of even tjhe tiniest portion of police interactions.

Was what happened in Dallas a horrible tragedy as well? I'm getting mixed reviews.
 

Harry Guerrilla

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I posted earlier today that 1200 deaths last year from police shootings was horrendous and that is represents a bigger problem of police militarization. I was wrong. The numbers do NOT bear that out.

http://www.bjs.gov/content/pub/pdf/cpp08.pdf

According to the Justice department, there were abound 40 million interactions between police and citizens for the last year the data has been crunched. Which, by the way, is a decrease from the year before. based on that number, the total number of citizens killed by the police is .0003. What in normally called statistically insignificant. Now I'd love to see some new numbers, but I can't imagine that they'd be vastly different except for actually being lower.

For the most part, far and away, the police are professional, courteous and fair. There is no evidence to support the notion that they are systemically racist or violent toward any racial group.

Now, are there tragedies? Yes. Alton Sterling, Philando Castille, Tamir rice, Oscar Grant. These were horrible tragedies that we could all regret and mourn. However, they are NOT representative of even tjhe tiniest portion of police interactions.

It's ok to be wrong.
We're all wrong, a lot of the time.

Kudos to keeping an open mind.
 

Howler63

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Good for you. The truth will set you free, glad you found it and are man enough to admit it.
?
Now the question becomes...why isn't this information being put out to counteract the BLM folks? And why would the President say that there is a systemic racism?
 

calamity

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I posted earlier today that 1200 deaths last year from police shootings was horrendous and that is represents a bigger problem of police militarization. I was wrong. The numbers do NOT bear that out.

http://www.bjs.gov/content/pub/pdf/cpp08.pdf

According to the Justice department, there were abound 40 million interactions between police and citizens for the last year the data has been crunched. Which, by the way, is a decrease from the year before. based on that number, the total number of citizens killed by the police is .0003. What in normally called statistically insignificant. Now I'd love to see some new numbers, but I can't imagine that they'd be vastly different except for actually being lower.

For the most part, far and away, the police are professional, courteous and fair. There is no evidence to support the notion that they are systemically racist or violent toward any racial group.

Now, are there tragedies? Yes. Alton Sterling, Philando Castille, Tamir rice, Oscar Grant. These were horrible tragedies that we could all regret and mourn. However, they are NOT representative of even tjhe tiniest portion of police interactions.

Alton Sterling is not a tragedy. It is a case of an armed felon resisting arrest. I'd call it expected.

But, nice mea culpa. Although, i have no idea what you said earlier. It is nice to own up to one's mistakes.
 

ajn678

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Now the question becomes...why isn't this information being put out to counteract the BLM folks? And why would the President say that there is a systemic racism?

Because it doesn't fit their narrative. Without the narrative they can't divide as easily.
 

Henrin

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Using that logic I can say Black on black crime is not a problem since the majority of the time blacks interact no crime happens. Lol
 

Casper

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Now the question becomes...why isn't this information being put out to counteract the BLM folks? And why would the President say that there is a systemic racism?
Because the Media has become too PC for their and societies own good. Good grief, stating the facts is identifying the problem and without doing so the problem cannot be solved.
 

Aunt Spiker

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I posted earlier today that 1200 deaths last year from police shootings was horrendous and that is represents a bigger problem of police militarization. I was wrong. The numbers do NOT bear that out.

http://www.bjs.gov/content/pub/pdf/cpp08.pdf

According to the Justice department, there were abound 40 million interactions between police and citizens for the last year the data has been crunched. Which, by the way, is a decrease from the year before. based on that number, the total number of citizens killed by the police is .0003. What in normally called statistically insignificant. Now I'd love to see some new numbers, but I can't imagine that they'd be vastly different except for actually being lower.

For the most part, far and away, the police are professional, courteous and fair. There is no evidence to support the notion that they are systemically racist or violent toward any racial group.

Now, are there tragedies? Yes. Alton Sterling, Philando Castille, Tamir rice, Oscar Grant. These were horrible tragedies that we could all regret and mourn. However, they are NOT representative of even tjhe tiniest portion of police interactions.

You know - some of these travesties have to do more with a failed judicial system.

Take Eric Garner (man strangled by police). The officer used unjustified and unapproved forced against a man, ignored his effort to communicate about being unable to breathe, the man was strangled to death on a sidewalk.

And yet no trial?

Why so? Just what more does an officer have to do, wrong, in order to be put on trial or found guilty? Soldiers have been found guilty for killing unjustly IN the THEATER of war. Is our judicial system SO broken? Apparently it is.

When people are killed during such incidences - it may ultimately be a statistical low. But when each individual is looked at separately and put to trial and, time and again, gets a walk... you really have to wonder what's really going on.

So to me - it's not a matter of statistical averages and spikes. It's a matter of individual cases and the end results: was justice truly dealt? Time and again the answer is no. That's a SERIOUS problem.
 

Henrin

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How are the two things related?

Why do they have to be? The vast majority of the time people interact no one is hurt, but we don't say silly things like crime is insignificant because of it.
 

Harry Guerrilla

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You know - some of these travesties have to do more with a failed judicial system.

Take Eric Garner (man strangled by police). The officer used unjustified and unapproved forced against a man, ignored his effort to communicate about being unable to breathe, the man was strangled to death on a sidewalk.

And yet no trial?

Why so? Just what more does an officer have to do, wrong, in order to be put on trial or found guilty? Soldiers have been found guilty for killing unjustly IN the THEATER of war. Is our judicial system SO broken? Apparently it is.

When people are killed during such incidences - it may ultimately be a statistical low. But when each individual is looked at separately and put to trial and, time and again, gets a walk... you really have to wonder what's really going on.

So to me - it's not a matter of statistical averages and spikes. It's a matter of individual cases and the end results: was justice truly dealt? Time and again the answer is no. That's a SERIOUS problem.

There are certainly individual issues that should be addressed, like that.
With that said, people are losing their **** on something so incredibly uncommon.
 

calamity

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You know - some of these travesties have to do more with a failed judicial system.

Take Eric Garner (man strangled by police). The officer used unjustified and unapproved forced against a man, ignored his effort to communicate about being unable to breathe, the man was strangled to death on a sidewalk.

And yet no trial?

Why so? Just what more does an officer have to do, wrong, in order to be put on trial or found guilty? Soldiers have been found guilty for killing unjustly IN the THEATER of war. Is our judicial system SO broken? Apparently it is.

When people are killed during such incidences - it may ultimately be a statistical low. But when each individual is looked at separately and put to trial and, time and again, gets a walk... you really have to wonder what's really going on.

So to me - it's not a matter of statistical averages and spikes. It's a matter of individual cases and the end results: was justice truly dealt? Time and again the answer is no. That's a SERIOUS problem.

EG was killed while resisting arrest. His morbid obesity probably played more of a role in his death than that choke hold.
 

MaggieD

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I posted earlier today that 1200 deaths last year from police shootings was horrendous and that is represents a bigger problem of police militarization. I was wrong. The numbers do NOT bear that out.

http://www.bjs.gov/content/pub/pdf/cpp08.pdf

According to the Justice department, there were abound 40 million interactions between police and citizens for the last year the data has been crunched. Which, by the way, is a decrease from the year before. based on that number, the total number of citizens killed by the police is .0003. What in normally called statistically insignificant. Now I'd love to see some new numbers, but I can't imagine that they'd be vastly different except for actually being lower.

For the most part, far and away, the police are professional, courteous and fair. There is no evidence to support the notion that they are systemically racist or violent toward any racial group.

Now, are there tragedies? Yes. Alton Sterling, Philando Castille, Tamir rice, Oscar Grant. These were horrible tragedies that we could all regret and mourn. However, they are NOT representative of even tjhe tiniest portion of police interactions.

Good job, Howler. We always tend to give props for honesty.
 

calamity

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Nice excuse.

Not really. Just the facts, Ma'am.

On August 1, Garner's death was found by the New York City Medical Examiner's Office to be a result of "compression of neck (chokehold), compression of chest and prone positioning during physical restraint by police."[48][49][50] Asthma, heart disease, and obesity were cited as contributing factors.[51] There was no damage to the windpipe or neckbones.[52] The medical examiner ruled Garner's death a homicide. According to the medical examiner's definition, a homicide is a death caused by the intentional actions of another person or persons, which is not necessarily an intentional death or a criminal death.[53]
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_of_Eric_Garner#Investigation
 

gdgyva

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Now the question becomes...why isn't this information being put out to counteract the BLM folks? And why would the President say that there is a systemic racism?

now that sir is the 64k question

and a really really good question
 

Aunt Spiker

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Not really. Just the facts, Ma'am.

Did you read your quote? "The medical examiner ruled Garner's death a homicide ... a homicide is a death caused by the intentional actions of another person or persons, which is not necessarily an intentional death or a criminal death."

So we're not even taking a homicide to trial?

The TRIAL is where the evidence would all be presented and the facts of the case would be determined - and then a verdict passed.

You can fall back on his health as an excuse not to have a trial all you'd like (no justice if you're overweight?) - but it doesn't alter the reality of what really took place (or rather, what failed to).

But my overall point is that it's very case-by-case. Statistics being 'low' doesn't mean that there isn't something more that should be done.
 

1751Texan

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I posted earlier today that 1200 deaths last year from police shootings was horrendous and that is represents a bigger problem of police militarization. I was wrong. The numbers do NOT bear that out.

http://www.bjs.gov/content/pub/pdf/cpp08.pdf

According to the Justice department, there were abound 40 million interactions between police and citizens for the last year the data has been crunched. Which, by the way, is a decrease from the year before. based on that number, the total number of citizens killed by the police is .0003. What in normally called statistically insignificant. Now I'd love to see some new numbers, but I can't imagine that they'd be vastly different except for actually being lower.

For the most part, far and away, the police are professional, courteous and fair. There is no evidence to support the notion that they are systemically racist or violent toward any racial group.

Now, are there tragedies? Yes. Alton Sterling, Philando Castille, Tamir rice, Oscar Grant. These were horrible tragedies that we could all regret and mourn. However, they are NOT representative of even tjhe tiniest portion of police interactions.

You were incorrect the number is not 1,200; it is 12,000/

40,000,000 x .0003% = 12,000. Not 1,200.
 

calamity

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Did you read your quote? "The medical examiner ruled Garner's death a homicide ... a homicide is a death caused by the intentional actions of another person or persons, which is not necessarily an intentional death or a criminal death."

So we're not even taking a homicide to trial?

The TRIAL is where the evidence would all be presented and the facts of the case would be determined - and then a verdict passed.

You can fall back on his health as an excuse not to have a trial all you'd like (no justice if you're overweight?) - but it doesn't alter the reality of what really took place (or rather, what failed to).

But my overall point is that it's very case-by-case. Statistics being 'low' doesn't mean that there isn't something more that should be done.

Did you read my earlier assertion? I said his morbid obesity probably had more to do with his death than the choke hold. The coroner found no damage to his windpipe or neckbones. Gardner died because he could not regain his breath after the choke was released due to exertion resulting from the fight with cops, all of which came about because of his resistance to arrest.
 

calamity

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You were incorrect the number is not 1,200; it is 12,000/

40,000,000 x .0003% = 12,000. Not 1,200.

Cops do not kill 12,000 US citizens per year. Sheesh.

Despite public protests, occupations, direct action, and increased public scrutiny, U.S. police killed more people in 2015 than in 2014. While numbers vary from source to source — the Washington Post cites 975, while the Guardian puts the tally at 1,125 — the website killedbypolice.net found that police have killed 1,186 people in 2015 (the U.S. government currently does not track how many people are killed in police encounters.)

Here's How Many People Police Killed In 2015 | ThinkProgress
 
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