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Oh Flori-duh!

Yes Trump knows better I'm sure. He knows everything better. :D


So you don't remember when CDC told us it was no big deal, and that we didn't need masks? Or how surprised they were when they found out it was human to human transferable?
 
So you don't remember when CDC told us it was no big deal, and that we didn't need masks? Or how surprised they were when they found out it was human to human transferable?
No I don't. Why don't you refresh my memory?
 
I don't want anyone to die. But we can't hide from this and eventually are going to have to come out. Do you have an acceptable number for drinking and driving deaths? cancer from tobacco? drug use? obesity? criminal activity? and on and on... I hope you carry the same passion for these as you seem to for Covid.

It is irrelevant if they do not. And it is inaccurate to say there’s no point in which to end a shutdown. I’ve yet to read or hear anyone advocate for a perpetual shutdown or a shutdown with no measurement of when and how to end the shutdown.

A positivity rate of less than 5% for, IIRC, 14 days, with a phased in reopening, and mandates for masks, social distancing, expansive testing, and enforcement, is a very wise point to end a shutdown.

The problem is too many to governors have refused to resort to any sense of tenacity in achieving those points and instead hastily reopen, while mind numbingly refusing mask mandates and enforcement.

The factors to safely reopen isn’t some arcane knowledge. The factors to safely reopen isn’t esoteric, known only to a few god-like people huddled away from the rest of humanity in a temple. Simply, governors, the president, and people have been incorrigible, recalcitrant, and resilient to the measures needed to safely reopen.


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At least 14,000 dead is nothing approaching a "Stellar job" We have had more Covid 19 cases then Italy too. NYC had 21% of its population infected before we even knew it was here. They were blindsided, what is our governors excuse?
Not my Governor. I live in a different state, but deSantis showed the way. That's because Florida paid attention to the science and New York didn't. There is a reason New York's deaths per million is almost three times what Florida's is, in spite of Florida have more at risk population.

The basic fear, initially, was that the medical resources could have been swamped by a massive outbreak. We now know that the virus is both more infectious but less virulent than originally thought. With our current knowledge, we should treat it like we treat other serious but not catastrophic threats, eg H1N1.
 
The term "Admitting" is pointed to people like yourselves who want things shut down but cannot provide an end date. When will you be happy to open things back up? When it's is it acceptable to resume life? Instead of screaming someone is an idiot for doing this or that, what's your solution? I would accuse you of playing political games yourself but that would be juvenile wouldn't it?
Your misuse of words is a you problem. When I admit something I will be clear about it.

While I do often comment on idiotic comments made by idiotic people, I rarely “scream”.

And pretending knowledge/expertise isn’t my thing either.

You’re trying, foolishly, to pin down those who disagree with fully opening up as DeSantis is telling Floridian’s to do, with a ludicrous demand that we (me, in this case) provide you with a specific number/% for the entire very diversified state (FYI, I was born and raised in Pinellas County, so I know of what I speak).

Stupid and dishonest debate tactic.

Factually, DeSantis has already made the same mistake of trying to open up the state all at once after being warned by experts not to, and was forced to shut down when sickness and death rates spiked.

Nothing has changed to justify doing the same reckless thing again.

Unless you’re ready to deal in facts, not politics, don’t bother answering.
 
Your misuse of words is a you problem. When I admit something I will be clear about it.

While I do often comment on idiotic comments made by idiotic people, I rarely “scream”.

And pretending knowledge/expertise isn’t my thing either.

You’re trying, foolishly, to pin down those who disagree with fully opening up as DeSantis is telling Floridian’s to do, with a ludicrous demand that we (me, in this case) provide you with a specific number/% for the entire very diversified state (FYI, I was born and raised in Pinellas County, so I know of what I speak).

Stupid and dishonest debate tactic.

Factually, DeSantis has already made the same mistake of trying to open up the state all at once after being warned by experts not to, and was forced to shut down when sickness and death rates spiked.

Nothing has changed to justify doing the same reckless thing again.

Unless you’re ready to deal in facts, not politics, don’t bother answering.

I don't care if you disagree with me. I'm not trying to persuade anyone. If people don't approve of Fla's handling, then they are free to stay far away. Keep wearing masks and do what you think is best for you.

Not that it matters in the slightest, but I too was born and raised in Fla (Bay County).
 
I don't want anyone to die. But we can't hide from this and eventually are going to have to come out. Do you have an acceptable number for drinking and driving deaths? cancer from tobacco? drug use? obesity? criminal activity? and on and on... I hope you carry the same passion for these as you seem to for Covid.
Same here. We are not hiding by any means, there never was a full blown lockdown, that was BS from day one. Everything you listed was a Choice. Not so much with a Pandemic, hence why we need to do what the Experts are telling us, SD, Masks, Handwashing, nothing hard but yet we have Millions of Idiots that cannot seem to manage it. So long as that is true and until everyone is vaccinated we will be living with this pandemic, want to see how it ignoring it works out watch Florida, in the next 30 days their numbers are going to skyrocket, it is just simple logic.
 
I don't care if you disagree with me. I'm not trying to persuade anyone. If people don't approve of Fla's handling, then they are free to stay far away. Keep wearing masks and do what you think is best for you.

Not that it matters in the slightest, but I too was born and raised in Fla (Bay County).
You’re still missing the point. Both of us are irrelevant. I only mentioned my connection with FL to make clear that my assertion regarding my home state’s very diversified populace wasn’t just a uninformed notion that I yanked of my ass.

And whether or not you disagree, doesn’t change facts. Verifiable and irrefutable facts, are what I have been posting.

If DeSantis goes forward, many more people will needlessly die.
 
Not my Governor. I live in a different state, but deSantis showed the way. That's because Florida paid attention to the science and New York didn't. There is a reason New York's deaths per million is almost three times what Florida's is, in spite of Florida have more at risk population.

The basic fear, initially, was that the medical resources could have been swamped by a massive outbreak. We now know that the virus is both more infectious but less virulent than originally thought. With our current knowledge, we should treat it like we treat other serious but not catastrophic threats, eg H1N1.
Um no.
 
I don't care if you disagree with me. I'm not trying to persuade anyone. If people don't approve of Fla's handling, then they are free to stay far away. Keep wearing masks and do what you think is best for you.

Not that it matters in the slightest, but I too was born and raised in Fla (Bay County).
Florida will just tell people who become sick stay home do not test.
 
Our governor announced as of today bars and restaurants are to be fully opened and cities or counties can no longer fine people for not wearing a mask.

Business is obviously much more important than people's health in the middle of a pandemic in flori-duh. How long until we see another spike? How many people have to die each day so businesses can have their restrictions lifted until it is considered a bad idea?
This is literally insanity!

Firstly, Europe is experiencing a strong second wave going into the winter flu season, which could be a harbinger of where we will soon be.

Secondly, pretty much every healthcare expert in the country is scared crap-less with the prospect of what the U.S. flu season may bring.

(CNN) Experts are warning of coming coronavirus surge

Finally, FL has 700K cases! That's literally 10% of the cases in the U.S.! Why? DeSantis' record is terrible, among the very worst in the country. Why make it worse?
 
No, not at first. But they devolved one and have done better than us by leaps and bounds. You do realize that almost 1000 people a day are still dying here and we have leveled off at about 40,000 cases a day. Do you thing we're doing well? Only by Trump and Kushner standards.

Also keep in mind that testing has slowed way down, just as the con man has asked. So the case numbers are well below what they should be.

Nothing stops this virus other than herd immunity. It burns out due to a majority of people getting it and recovering, or a vaccine. So tell me, what "plan" changes that other than the plan already in place to fast track a vaccine? You think more paper masks makes this go away? It doesn't, and the scientists told as that in the beginning.

American make choices. People who don't want to risk getting this should stay isolated. People who aren't willing to do that, are willing to take the risk , many people need to work. But there is not cure for this thing, not yet. So stop with the infantile attitudes and the "we want what we want NOW" and face the reality of how pandemics work in nature.

Even if Trump had sealed off all borders and airports, made every American lock down in their homes for a year, none of that would have stopped this pandemic. It will do what it will do no matter who was or is the president.
 
Three weeks.

With all the seniors down there, this is unconscionable.
Probably be more like two months to really see the carnage, though. Five good weeks until the election probably won't quite be enough to see the worse of it. Sadly.
 
No national plan and lack of testing was the main issue.
A better early-pandemic response apparatus, which Trump disbanded, wouldn't have hurt - either.

But mainly it's just Trump being an arrogant dick, causing us to be forced into a catastrophic lock-down because he let everythying get out-of-hand to the point he was compelled to use the nuclear option. The selfish, self-centered, narcissistic idiot.
 
It will continue to ramp up until Nov 4.. then it will feel very slow with flu shots but really it will be a quick transition back to norm by Turkey day.
Weeks later, folks will ask what happened to Covid? Must have been the vaccine...
Without my bowing to the conspiracy here, that may indeed be how it works-out of sorts. Though I think there's the possibility for a rough-ride this coming winter & spring, I do believe by the end of next year we will be substantially coming-out of this.
 
Probably be more like two months to really see the carnage, though. Five good weeks until the election probably won't quite be enough to see the worse of it. Sadly.


Yes, for some reason we seem to only care about the deaths, which will take about 6 weeks, not all the suffering and all the long term affects.
 
Florida has done a stellar job with the pandemic. Compare the results to, say, New York which has a similar population.

Why are you picking nits?
New York got hit early, hard, and heavy, as the federal government left us unawares. but since the early initial wave, New York's response has been exemplary. Pretty much the best in the states, and the premier model on how to deal with this stuff.
 
Yes, for some reason we seem to only care about the deaths, which will take about 6 weeks, not all the suffering and all the long term affects.
We care about all of it, or we should. This thing is novel, and we're constantly learning about more long-term consequences. But yeah, deaths get highest consideration by their very nature. Death is final.
 
I realize I'll never get anyone to admit an acceptable percentage. This is here to stay. At some point we will settle into an acceptable percentage as we have will all other viruses. That of course will be determined politically I'm afraid, not medically.


We do agree on one thing it seems, this whole event has been politicized to the hilt.
I very much agree.

The difficult part with this is we are seeing such high numbers while strongly mitigating! That's the amazing part.
 
Florida is not a hot spot. There are no hot spots nationally. We are long past the point where hospitals can be overwhelmed, so we should be treating this like, say, N1H1.


Yes, I call that nit picking.

The bad job is call New York/New Jersey.


Glad you agree.
Absolutely not! Covid is turning-out to be far more lethal!
 
It is irrelevant if they do not. And it is inaccurate to say there’s no point in which to end a shutdown. I’ve yet to read or hear anyone advocate for a perpetual shutdown or a shutdown with no measurement of when and how to end the shutdown.

A positivity rate of less than 5% for, IIRC, 14 days, with a phased in reopening, and mandates for masks, social distancing, expansive testing, and enforcement, is a very wise point to end a shutdown.

The problem is too many to governors have refused to resort to any sense of tenacity in achieving those points and instead hastily reopen, while mind numbingly refusing mask mandates and enforcement.

The factors to safely reopen isn’t some arcane knowledge. The factors to safely reopen isn’t esoteric, known only to a few god-like people huddled away from the rest of humanity in a temple. Simply, governors, the president, and people have been incorrigible, recalcitrant, and resilient to the measures needed to safely reopen.


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Yep. It's not rocket science. We understand the basics pretty well. Hell, you & I do, along with many others on this board - much less the exports.

It's our political will, that's the problem. We are suffering a crisis of leadership.
 
Same here. We are not hiding by any means, there never was a full blown lockdown, that was BS from day one. Everything you listed was a Choice. Not so much with a Pandemic, hence why we need to do what the Experts are telling us, SD, Masks, Handwashing, nothing hard but yet we have Millions of Idiots that cannot seem to manage it. So long as that is true and until everyone is vaccinated we will be living with this pandemic, want to see how it ignoring it works out watch Florida, in the next 30 days their numbers are going to skyrocket, it is just simple logic.
The only hope for some of the incorrigibles will be the vaccine. But then this same crowd probably won't vaccinate, either (can't say I'll blame them with the initial roll-out doses, though). Pandemics are team sports. We're all going to all swim together, or sink together. For better, or worse.
 
The only hope for some of the incorrigibles will be the vaccine. But then this same crowd probably won't vaccinate, either (can't say I'll blame them with the initial roll-out doses, though). Pandemics are team sports. We're all going to all swim together, or sink together. For better, or worse.
Well, I think already know how good we are at this Team Sport, I just never thought we would be this bad, Meh....
 
These numbers on the survival rate of folks who get Covid-19 came out this week from the CDC:

survival_rate_covid-jpg.67296403


I'm sorry, but with numbers like this the government (aka states) should end all mandatory shut-downs and restrictions. It's time to restore individual freedom and allow people to choose how they want to live their lives and how they want to address Covid-19.

.

🤷 Yeah, the science isn't hard. Everyone should be allowed to make their own risk assessemnt of their situation.
 
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