ObamaCare cost is too unbearable [W:271]

[trfjr]

Re: ObamaCare cost is too unbearable

Actually that is false. Anyone making $400 million a year is likely doing so through capital gains and investments, which would be applied a 3.8% additional tax, or $15.2 million a year. So once again you are misinformed.
Besides, how many people actually earn over $400 million a year and how much revenue will be raised from them? I'm willing to bet you it isn't enough to fund even 1% of the law.

how many do you think there are in the US that makes 400 mil a year after taxes give me a number

 

[ReformCollege]

Re: ObamaCare cost is too unbearable

how many do you think there are in the US that makes 400 mil a year after taxes give me a number

I doubt any more then 100, probably half that.

 

[GottaGo]

Re: ObamaCare cost is too unbearable

So you work with the health insurance field, somehow. Yeah, you're representative of the American population... And hasn't the extra hours of work, and learning all the new ACA rules had an impact on your life? Hum?

I'm an office manager for a company that owns multiple stores. I deal with the human resources end also.

When actually applying the ever-changing rules come into play, I'll let you know.

 

[trfjr]

Re: ObamaCare cost is too unbearable

I doubt any more then 100, probably half that.

in 2013 the US had only 425 that had net worth of 1 billion

if you add the income that every one in the US makes a year added together it comes out to be about 9 trillion dollars

If you add up all the expense of local, city, county, state, and federal government all together it comes out to be about 7 trillion a year every one who brings home any type of income would have to pay 77% in taxes just to pay for all of government

 

[ReformCollege]

Re: ObamaCare cost is too unbearable

in 2013 the US had only 425 that had net worth of 1 billion

if you add the income that every one in the US makes a year added together it comes out to be about 9 trillion dollars

If you add up all the expense of local, city, county, state, and federal government all together it comes out to be about 7 trillion a year every one who brings home any type of income would have to pay 77% in taxes just to pay for all of government

Are you advocating such a tax? I certainly wasn't.

 

[trfjr]

Re: ObamaCare cost is too unbearable

Are you advocating such a tax? I certainly wasn't.

not even close
just pointing out that the current government spending levels is unsustainable, because no nation would ever survive making their citizens pay over 70% in taxes
so the answer can not be just tax more like liberals think is the answer to everything. there isn't enough money made from any one to expand government any more then it has

 

[ReformCollege]

Re: ObamaCare cost is too unbearable

not even close
just pointing out that the current government spending levels is unsustainable, because no nation would ever survive making their citizens pay over 70% in taxes
so the answer can not be just tax more like liberals think is the answer to everything. there isn't enough money made from any one to expand government any more then it has

Obvious is obvious.

 

[trfjr]

Re: ObamaCare cost is too unbearable

Obvious is obvious.

but you cant explain that to liberal. they just want to expand more and spend more, expand more and spend more .they do not understand some one has to pay for it in there isn't enough income in the US to pay for it

 

[cabse5]

Re: ObamaCare cost is too unbearable

Look, trfjr, you statement could be hyperbole because, like in the EU, no one might ever be asked to pay for everything.

Liberals' way out of this is single payer. Let the gov't pay for it all. Businesses won't be taxed so the economy will grow. Individuals won't be taxed so there won't be huge public resentment to ObamaCare.

The ones who'll be pizzed are conservatives and Occupy Wall Streeters - minority special interest groups.

 

[clownboy]

Re: ObamaCare cost is too unbearable

Look, trfjr, you statement could be hyperbole because, like in the EU, no one might ever be asked to pay for everything.

Liberals' way out of this is single payer. Let the gov't pay for it all. Businesses won't be taxed so the economy will grow. Individuals won't be taxed so there won't be huge public resentment to ObamaCare.

The ones who'll be pizzed are conservatives and Occupy Wall Streeters - minority special interest groups.

Let the government pay for it but no increased taxes on business or individuals - that's hilarious. Where do you think government money comes from?

 

[Comunitee]

Re: ObamaCare cost is too unbearable

not even close
just pointing out that the current government spending levels is unsustainable, because no nation would ever survive making their citizens pay over 70% in taxes
so the answer can not be just tax more like liberals think is the answer to everything. there isn't enough money made from any one to expand government any more then it has

This nation survived pretty well when it made its wealthiest citizens pay 70 percent or more in taxes.

Should the top tax rate be 73 percent?

Ignorance is a choice. And it is a deviant, perverse, repulsive lifestyle.

 

[Mycroft]

Re: ObamaCare cost is too unbearable

This nation survived pretty well when it made its wealthiest citizens pay 70 percent or more in taxes.

Should the top tax rate be 73 percent?

Ignorance is a choice. And it is a deviant, perverse, repulsive lifestyle.

Typical liberal blindness.

The problem is not making the wealthy pay 70% or more...though that, in itself, is bad enough. The problem is making ALL citizens pay 70% or more and that, eventually, that won't be enough.

 

[WillyPete]

Re: ObamaCare cost is too unbearable

what's the co-pay and deductible on those plans I will tell you its 5 to 10k. does that sound affordable to you? who do you know who is poor enough to get the subsides that can folk 5k out of pocket. A lot of you ignorant libs will be very surprised and pissed when you go see a doctor and then get a bill in the mail you will be like why am I getting a bill I paid my 30 dollars

Perhaps, but the point isn't really to save money for individuals, but to mitigate the costs to the state and federal governments for the uninsured, who go to the emergency room and get the most expensive possible treatment on the governments dime. Now, a significant portion of them will be covered and can go to a doctor's office for treatment.

If they can't pay, the government will still get stuck with the bill, but it will be a much lower rate than an emergency room visit.

Any insurance plan, regardless of the deductible or their ability to pay it, will be more cost effective than continuing to clog our emergencies rooms with every poor jerk with the sniffles.

 

[Oozlefinch]

Re: ObamaCare cost is too unbearable

For curiosity, I just decided I would take a look at the "Government Healthcare" offered to me from the state of California. They want over $17,000 a year! That is almost half my pretax income, and it is way more expensive then what is offered through either Tricare or my employer.

And not by a little amount, this is almost $10,000 more then Tricare, and $6,000 more then from my employer.

I thought this was supposed to save me money?

 

[trfjr]

Re: ObamaCare cost is too unbearable

Perhaps, but the point isn't really to save money for individuals, but to mitigate the costs to the state and federal governments for the uninsured, who go to the emergency room and get the most expensive possible treatment on the governments dime. Now, a significant portion of them will be covered and can go to a doctor's office for treatment.

If they can't pay, the government will still get stuck with the bill, but it will be a much lower rate than an emergency room visit.

Any insurance plan, regardless of the deductible or their ability to pay it, will be more cost effective than continuing to clog our emergencies rooms with every poor jerk with the sniffles.

and how will they do that? they wont have the money for the co-pay or the deductible so they will be right back into the emergency rooms

 

[Oozlefinch]

Re: ObamaCare cost is too unbearable

and how will they do that? they wont have the money for the co-pay or the deductible so they will be right back into the emergency rooms

My "Government healthcare plan" would cost me more then my rent every year, almost half of my paycheck. If I got what they told me I should get I would have money for rent, health insurance, and raman noodles and nothing else.

I only see this as a win if you have no income, for everybody else we get the big shaft.

 

[austrianecon]

Re: ObamaCare cost is too unbearable

The SCOTUS said there's this ability by Congress to tax and that's what, in the SCOTUS's mind, legitimized ObamaCare.

As I've OPed, the tax is just too high.

It didn't legitimized Obamacare.. rather it allows for future challenges. Supreme Court can't rule if it's a valid tax or not until the tax is levied. It's called merit in law. You need merit first.

 

[WillyPete]

Re: ObamaCare cost is too unbearable

and how will they do that? they wont have the money for the co-pay or the deductible so they will be right back into the emergency rooms

Well, we can't save everyone, unless we want to do something bigger.

In California, they have MediCal, which is not especially hard to qualify for (~50,000 salary for a family of two would qualify) and is free. I'm sure other states have similar programs.

This should get many millions of people coverage that didn't have it before, and that will save a significant amount of money for state and federal programs, compared to those same people relying on emergency rooms.

This in turn should improve the quality of emergency room service, as they are freed up from dealing with quite so many non-serious treatments that will now be performed in a doctor's office and at a reduced rate.

I'm not aware of any thing the law does for people who don't pay their deductible. I suppose they lose coverage, take a credit hit, potentially get sued by the insurance company, and then go for a state plan.

 

[Mycroft]

Re: ObamaCare cost is too unbearable

Well, we can't save everyone, unless we want to do something bigger.

In California, they have MediCal, which is not especially hard to qualify for (~50,000 salary for a family of two would qualify) and is free. I'm sure other states have similar programs.

This should get many millions of people coverage that didn't have it before, and that will save a significant amount of money for state and federal programs, compared to those same people relying on emergency rooms.

This in turn should improve the quality of emergency room service, as they are freed up from dealing with quite so many non-serious treatments that will now be performed in a doctor's office and at a reduced rate.

I'm not aware of any thing the law does for people who don't pay their deductible. I suppose they lose coverage, take a credit hit, potentially get sued by the insurance company, and then go for a state plan.

The only thing that will stop people from going to emergency rooms for the sniffles is a law that says hospitals do not have to treat people regardless their ability to pay. Is there anything in Obamacare that says as much? Can hospitals turn away people who don't have the mandated insurance?

 

[WillyPete]

Re: ObamaCare cost is too unbearable

The only thing that will stop people from going to emergency rooms for the sniffles is a law that says hospitals do not have to treat people regardless their ability to pay. Is there anything in Obamacare that says as much? Can hospitals turn away people who don't have the mandated insurance?

Nope. You're right, that will still happen, but this law should reduce those numbers, and direct a significant number of those people into doctor's offices, which will reduce the costs to the state and federal programs that would otherwise be footing the entire bill at emergency room rates.

Time will tell, but if it it works, the savings to the state programs, and gains in efficiency in emergency rooms should be significant.

 

[jimbo]

Re: ObamaCare cost is too unbearable

True. Very true and I won't deny it. I didn't say there weren't moral isues that the Government has every right, and in fact responsibility, to be involved in. What I said is that there is no legitimate Constitutional backing for the Government to be involved in healthcare. I have never had anyone show me the specific point in Article I, Section 8 that gives them that authority.

I'm still waiting for the specific point in Article anything, Section anything that gives the government authority to get involved in marriage, gay, straght, or otherwise, in energy, retirement, labor, education, >>>>>

 

[jimbo]

Re: ObamaCare cost is too unbearable

So you're saying Americans are going to have to get used to not having medical insurance, and business will hold them hostage to make sure they do.

Sound like we need something more radical than Obamacare -- maybe like single payer. It appears our system of for-profit HC insurance is so dysfunctional it won't even pretend to provide health care, if wealthy people have any say in it.

The problem with a single payer plan is that it doesn't exist. It is more accurately everybody with income pays. The government is nothing more than a very powerful consolidator, who gets to decide who pays how much, who gets what services, and, when the well runs dry, how much needs to be borrowed or what we can do without.

Those are all decisions I would prefer to make myself.

 

[Mycroft]

Re: ObamaCare cost is too unbearable

Nope. You're right, that will still happen, but this law should reduce those numbers, and direct a significant number of those people into doctor's offices, which will reduce the costs to the state and federal programs that would otherwise be footing the entire bill at emergency room rates.

Time will tell, but if it it works, the savings to the state programs, and gains in efficiency in emergency rooms should be significant.

You'll pardon me, I'm sure, when I say that I have less faith in people than you do. I don't think the number of people going to emergency rooms will drop very much at all, since there is nothing in Obamacare to cause it. Frankly, I think there will be a lot of people who just can't afford the mandated insurance or who are so used to using the hospitals, that they'll just keep on doing what they've been doing all along.

The result of that is, of course, that Obamacare won't do a thing to reduce costs for anyone...especially for the hospitals. Another pie-in-the-sky notion from the liberals.

 

[jimbo]

Re: ObamaCare cost is too unbearable

You'll pardon me, I'm sure, when I say that I have less faith in people than you do. I don't think the number of people going to emergency rooms will drop very much at all, since there is nothing in Obamacare to cause it. Frankly, I think there will be a lot of people who just can't afford the mandated insurance or who are so used to using the hospitals, that they'll just keep on doing what they've been doing all along.

The result of that is, of course, that Obamacare won't do a thing to reduce costs for anyone...especially for the hospitals. Another pie-in-the-sky notion from the liberals.

Ever notice that liberals causes are always based on might, may, could, should? This applies whether the subject is health care, gun control, environment, or other. Then, when the plan fails, the computer model must need tweaking, we have not yet spent enough, or it is someone elses fault.

 

[Henrin]

Re: ObamaCare cost is too unbearable

Ever notice that liberals causes are always based on might, may, could, should? This applies whether the subject is health care, gun control, environment, or other. Then, when the plan fails, the computer model must need tweaking, we have not yet spent enough, or it is someone elses fault.

It's usually that the plan just needs some tweaking. Crap, that failed, but don't worry, we just need to tweak it some more.