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Obamacare can't be defunded ever

solletica

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So the House voted to defund ObamaCare. . .

House GOP launches shutdown battle by voting to defund Obamacare - CNN.com

Hooray? OMG, finally we got rid of the great fiscal boondoggle?

Nope

First, very obviously, the Senate won't vote to defund it. The tactic used by the GOP is basic political posturing--acting in a certain way merely to create the impression that one favors/is against something (to score political points) while in reality, knowing that that the action won't amount to anything real (similar to O's claim that he wanted to bomb Syria).

Second, as has been known for thousands of years, the US is a plutocracy. In a plutocracy, corporations (i. e. insurance cos.) hold ultimate power (similar to Iran, where the Ayatollah holds ultimate power). Insurance cos. want mandatory purchase of their products, and therefore, that's what they will get.

Theoretically, ObamaCare may be modified (in terms of coverage requirements), but the mandate can never be repealed.

FYI, democracies are better than plutocracies, but socialist democracies are also better than plutocracies.

Americans who want better health care should therefore consider moving to Europe or Canada.
 
So the House voted to defund ObamaCare. . .

House GOP launches shutdown battle by voting to defund Obamacare - CNN.com

Hooray? OMG, finally we got rid of the great fiscal boondoggle?

Nope

First, very obviously, the Senate won't vote to defund it. The tactic used by the GOP is basic political posturing--acting in a certain way merely to create the impression that one favors/is against something (to score political points) while in reality, knowing that that the action won't amount to anything real (similar to O's claim that he wanted to bomb Syria).

Second, as has been known for thousands of years, the US is a plutocracy. In a plutocracy, corporations (i. e. insurance cos.) hold ultimate power (similar to Iran, where the Ayatollah holds ultimate power). Insurance cos. want mandatory purchase of their products, and therefore, that's what they will get.

Theoretically, ObamaCare may be modified (in terms of coverage requirements), but the mandate can never be repealed.

FYI, democracies are better than plutocracies, but socialist democracies are also better than plutocracies.

Americans who want better health care should therefore consider moving to Europe or Canada.

The President can fund it himself with an Executive Order. That's the purpose of them -- to facilitate approved legislation.
 
So the House voted to defund ObamaCare. . .

House GOP launches shutdown battle by voting to defund Obamacare - CNN.com

Hooray? OMG, finally we got rid of the great fiscal boondoggle?

Nope

First, very obviously, the Senate won't vote to defund it. The tactic used by the GOP is basic political posturing--acting in a certain way merely to create the impression that one favors/is against something (to score political points) while in reality, knowing that that the action won't amount to anything real (similar to O's claim that he wanted to bomb Syria).

Second, as has been known for thousands of years, the US is a plutocracy. In a plutocracy, corporations (i. e. insurance cos.) hold ultimate power (similar to Iran, where the Ayatollah holds ultimate power). Insurance cos. want mandatory purchase of their products, and therefore, that's what they will get.

Theoretically, ObamaCare may be modified (in terms of coverage requirements), but the mandate can never be repealed.

FYI, democracies are better than plutocracies, but socialist democracies are also better than plutocracies.

Americans who want better health care should therefore consider moving to Europe or Canada.

you also forget that most of the programs in the affordable care act cannot be defunded.

With the shift in Washington’s political order, there’s been increasing talk about dismantling Federal health care reform. Outright repeal is highly unlikely. First, it would face opposition from the Democratic majority in the Senate. Even more critically, President Obama would almost certainly use his veto pen on any repeal legislation and a supermajority needed to overturn a veto is doubtful.

Another strategy that has received attention is for Congress to use its power of the purse to starve health care reform of funding it needs to take hold. But a closer look at the law reveals that many of the provisions central to implementing health care reform already have access to funding and do not require going back to Congress for more.

The pillars of the law’s health insurance expansion strategy—increased eligibility for Medicaid and the new premium and cost-sharing subsidies for private health insurance—are exempt from the annual appropriations process. These so-called “mandatory” or “entitlement” programs are permanent and have permanent funding authority. Furthermore, the Department of Health and Human Services has the ability to fund related provisions without seeking additional appropriations from Congress. For example, Federal grants to states to plan and build the new health insurance exchanges fall into this category. It also includes funding necessary to immediately lower insurance costs for uninsured individuals with preexisting conditions and early retirees.

Funding For Key Health Reform Provisions: Less Endangered Than You Might Think – Health Affairs Blog
 
So the House voted to defund ObamaCare. . .

House GOP launches shutdown battle by voting to defund Obamacare - CNN.com

Hooray? OMG, finally we got rid of the great fiscal boondoggle?

Nope

First, very obviously, the Senate won't vote to defund it. The tactic used by the GOP is basic political posturing--acting in a certain way merely to create the impression that one favors/is against something (to score political points) while in reality, knowing that that the action won't amount to anything real (similar to O's claim that he wanted to bomb Syria).

Second, as has been known for thousands of years, the US is a plutocracy. In a plutocracy, corporations (i. e. insurance cos.) hold ultimate power (similar to Iran, where the Ayatollah holds ultimate power). Insurance cos. want mandatory purchase of their products, and therefore, that's what they will get.

Theoretically, ObamaCare may be modified (in terms of coverage requirements), but the mandate can never be repealed.

FYI, democracies are better than plutocracies, but socialist democracies are also better than plutocracies.

Americans who want better health care should therefore consider moving to Europe or Canada.

it is to get the senate democrats on record voting to fund the train wreck that the majority of America are against and the red and purple state senators are scared ****less voting to fund it because they know they will get beat over the head with it come 2014 and lose their job
 
it is to get the senate democrats on record voting to fund the train wreck that the majority of America are against and the red and purple state senators are scared ****less voting to fund it because they know they will get beat over the head with it come 2014 and lose their job

funny thing about saying the people are against The affordable care act, because when democrats and liberals argued that the people supported immigration reform and gun control, Conservative cried foul.
 
it is to get the senate democrats on record voting to fund the train wreck that the majority of America are against and the red and purple state senators are scared ****less voting to fund it because they know they will get beat over the head with it come 2014 and lose their job

If conservatives truly believe that Obamacare is a trainwreck waiting to happen, then they should let it go forth, and then sit back and reap the rewards of voters shifting from the left to the right. But of course they don't truly believe that. They realize that Obamacare is going to effect only a few percent of voters, and that most of us really won't notice any difference at all.

If it becomes fully implimented and doesn't turn into a trainwreck, conservatives are going to be screwed in the next election. They will be made out to look like fools and idiots.

Thats part of the reason that they want to find a way to stop Obamacare so bad. If they can stop it, then they can claim that they saved us from the pending trainwreck (whether or not such a trainwreck would have actually happened).

If I was a republican right now, I would be praying for an Obamacare trainwreck and a TERRIBLE economy during the next three years. It's republicans best hope of staying in power.
 
IMO, the best the GOPs can get while promoting defunding of ObamaCare resolutions is a new party controlling the Senate and a new party in the White House (since ObamaCare is so unpopular with Americans in general).
 
If conservatives truly believe that Obamacare is a trainwreck waiting to happen, then they should let it go forth, and then sit back and reap the rewards of voters shifting from the left to the right. But of course they don't truly believe that. They realize that Obamacare is going to effect only a few percent of voters, and that most of us really won't notice any difference at all.

If it becomes fully implimented and doesn't turn into a trainwreck, conservatives are going to be screwed in the next election. They will be made out to look like fools and idiots.

Thats part of the reason that they want to find a way to stop Obamacare so bad. If they can stop it, then they can claim that they saved us from the pending trainwreck (whether or not such a trainwreck would have actually happened).

If I was a republican right now, I would be praying for an Obamacare trainwreck and a TERRIBLE economy during the next three years. It's republicans best hope of staying in power.

and also that does not explain why Republicans are also sabotaging the affordable care act. if it really is a trainwreck, won't republican sabotage only make it worse?
 
If conservatives truly believe that Obamacare is a trainwreck waiting to happen, then they should let it go forth, and then sit back and reap the rewards of voters shifting from the left to the right. But of course they don't truly believe that. They realize that Obamacare is going to effect only a few percent of voters, and that most of us really won't notice any difference at all.

If it becomes fully implimented and doesn't turn into a trainwreck, conservatives are going to be screwed in the next election. They will be made out to look like fools and idiots.

Thats part of the reason that they want to find a way to stop Obamacare so bad. If they can stop it, then they can claim that they saved us from the pending trainwreck (whether or not such a trainwreck would have actually happened).

If I was a republican right now, I would be praying for an Obamacare trainwreck and a TERRIBLE economy during the next three years. It's republicans best hope of staying in power.
because no matter if it is a train wreck name one social program that has been implemented that later was repealed
 
it is to get the senate democrats on record voting to fund the train wreck that the majority of America are against and the red and purple state senators are scared ****less voting to fund it because they know they will get beat over the head with it come 2014 and lose their job

Don't we already know who in Congress voted for it the first time around?

This seems stupid and potentially dangerous gamesmanship.
 
If conservatives truly believe that Obamacare is a trainwreck waiting to happen, then they should let it go forth, and then sit back and reap the rewards of voters shifting from the left to the right. But of course they don't truly believe that. They realize that Obamacare is going to effect only a few percent of voters, and that most of us really won't notice any difference at all.

If it becomes fully implimented and doesn't turn into a trainwreck, conservatives are going to be screwed in the next election. They will be made out to look like fools and idiots.

Thats part of the reason that they want to find a way to stop Obamacare so bad. If they can stop it, then they can claim that they saved us from the pending trainwreck (whether or not such a trainwreck would have actually happened).

If I was a republican right now, I would be praying for an Obamacare trainwreck and a TERRIBLE economy during the next three years. It's republicans best hope of staying in power.

I probably should have read some of your post before I made my previous post, but, IMO, <your bolded> ObamaCare has already turned into a train wreck 'cause it's impeding the growth of private economies. And ObamaCare will lead to more economies controlled by the gov't (and, therefore, a sluggish economy).
 
Don't we already know who in Congress voted for it the first time around?

This seems stupid and potentially dangerous gamesmanship.

they can always claim they didn't read the bill and didn't know how bad it was and if they would have known their vote would have been different now if they vote for it again there is no excuses
 
I probably should have read some of your post before I made my previous post, but, IMO, <your bolded> ObamaCare has already turned into a train wreck 'cause it's impeding the growth of private economies. And ObamaCare will lead to more economies controlled by the gov't (and, therefore, a sluggish economy).

There is no evidence to indicate that. The stock market is booming, we are creating jobs, and incomes are rising (although most of the income growth is going to the top few percent). The economy was quite sluggish well before Obamacare was passed into law, and downright a disaster Bush left office. There is nothing at all to indicate that the looming Obamacare is causing the sluggishness.

What really matters is what people perceive, because nothing is actually provable. As long as our economy keeps chugging along, and dosen't take a big dip in the next year or two, people will not attribute the sluggish economy to Obamacare.

From the viewpoint of most employers, they either already offer insurance, or they are too small to be required to offer insurance. Despite anti-Obamacare rhetoric, it's highly unlikely that Obamacare is keeping them from hiring. Either you need more employees because business is good, or business is slow due to a lack of demand and you don't need more employees. Right now, demand is failing to increase at the same rate as productivity per work hour, so there's not a lot of businesses that need lots of new employees.

By the way, I am not an Obamacare supporter. But I don't believe it's the cause of our current economic funk, nor do I believe that it will cause the next Great Recession like Rush and Hannity have predicted. Jan 1st 2014 is going to come and go, and most of us aren't going to notice any difference in our personal finances, the cost of insurance or medical treatment, or the condition of the economy.
 
The President can fund it himself with an Executive Order. That's the purpose of them -- to facilitate approved legislation.

Legally, he can't. Something explicitly defunded by legislation can't be refunded by Executive Order. But it doesn't matter. The federal govt. must defer to insurance co. lobbyists, who want it funded. So therefore, it will always be funded.
 
If conservatives truly believe that Obamacare is a trainwreck waiting to happen, then they should let it go forth, and then sit back and reap the rewards of voters shifting from the left to the right. But of course they don't truly believe that. They realize that Obamacare is going to effect only a few percent of voters, and that most of us really won't notice any difference at all.

If it becomes fully implimented and doesn't turn into a trainwreck, conservatives are going to be screwed in the next election. They will be made out to look like fools and idiots.

Thats part of the reason that they want to find a way to stop Obamacare so bad. If they can stop it, then they can claim that they saved us from the pending trainwreck (whether or not such a trainwreck would have actually happened).

If I was a republican right now, I would be praying for an Obamacare trainwreck and a TERRIBLE economy during the next three years. It's republicans best hope of staying in power.

ObamaCare will definitely be a trainwreck solely because of one reason: it keeps the insurance co. oligopoly in place.

Contrary to popular belief, regulation of insurance cos. will be virtually non-existent. Patients will find themselves w/policies that appear to amount to something valuable, but will become a headache (and practically useless) when they try to use it for major expenses (i. e. chronic illnesses, emergencies, etc.)

And when they try to complain about insurance co. abuses to the feds, nothing will happen.

This will be the case because insurance cos. will just lobby pols to water down patient benefit provisions.

ObamaCare is nothing more than a piece of legislation written exclusively for the purpose boosting insurance co. profits, nothing more. It was just marketed as universal healthcare.
 
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because no matter if it is a train wreck name one social program that has been implemented that later was repealed

welfare.

1996. POOF all gone.
 
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