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Obama is fighting for something

code1211

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Obama is fighting for policies that will make the USA into Detroit.

He is fighting against policies that will make the USA of 2013 into the USA of 1998.

What's wrong with this picture.

Right now in North Dakota, people are moving to there and sleeping in truck stops and rest stops because there is not enough housing. Thousands are moving there every month. The McDonald's is paying $15.00/hour because it just can't find workers.

North Dakota is the template for what Obama opposes. Detroit is the template for what Obama is striving to achieve for us all.

Has anyone heard of, seen, read anything about the Earthquakes, the ground water pollution and the horrors of Fracking that Obamabots are are complaining about from the haven of their parent's basements?

Wouldn't it be nice if this posturing, pontificating blow hard would just get the hell out of the way and let the American people do what the American people do?

Unemployed? Go to North Dakota - 1 - oil jobs & fracking - MSN Money
 

CalGun

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Great OP comparing Detroit to the Dakota boom. Capitalism solves so many problems. Sure you need to police it some, but it's sure better then hating on it so much and using the crony versions
 

code1211

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Great OP comparing Detroit to the Dakota boom. Capitalism solves so many problems. Sure you need to police it some, but it's sure better then hating on it so much and using the crony versions


Call it Capitalism or pragmatism or whatever. When there was a gold rush, the government was pretty much an observer. If that had happened today, the Obama led stop progress gang would have built walls around the gold fields to keep people out.

We need to do everything we can do to become energy independent. THAT could be Obama's legacy and THAT would actually create a country where there was enough money to do what this short sighted, myopic, constantly campaigning for re-election petty tyrant with no clue, no plan and no ideas says he wants to achieve.

What I don't understand is why the Republican establishment is not standing on their collective desk and shouting this at the tops of their lungs. This is the entrepreneurial America that Obama is dismantling vs the Obama America that Obama is trying to create.

It is the New World vs the Old World. The failed policies of the past, all of the past including the Dark Ages, vs. the policies that created the richest society in the history of the world.

Economic success for the country right now given everything that we have to work with does not require a grand plan. It only requires only that the government get the Hell out of the way.

For once in his meddling, intrusive, know it all, can't STFU, please just go away and leave me alone life, can't this moronic sap just do nothing? Everytime he opens his mouth or makes a new plan, he hurts the progress toward something better.
 
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Joe Steel

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Conservatism destroyed Detroit.

It did it by demanding public policies which sent good American manufacturing jobs offshore. It did it by attacking good American union jobs, jobs paying middle class wages to American workers. Now those jobs are in third world hellholes paying slave wages to workers who are so desperate they have no choice but working for slave wages.

If you want America to be a third world hellhole, vote for conservatives.
 

fmw

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Conservatism destroyed Detroit.

It did it by demanding public policies which sent good American manufacturing jobs offshore. It did it by attacking good American union jobs, jobs paying middle class wages to American workers. Now those jobs are in third world hellholes paying slave wages to workers who are so desperate they have no choice but working for slave wages.

If you want America to be a third world hellhole, vote for conservatives.
It wouldn't be hard to provide a list of liberal CEO's who have sent jobs to "hellholes."
 

Gimmesometruth

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Obama is fighting for policies that will make the USA into Detroit.

He is fighting against policies that will make the USA of 2013 into the USA of 1998.
Hmm....taxes are lower, interest rates are lower, S&P/DJI are higher, GDP is higher....and it would be great if employment was higher, but then his predecessor screwed the pooch.

What's wrong with this picture.
Employment, but as I said, we know how that got to where it is....and your solution....is for everyone to have an oil deposit underneath their feet:

Right now in North Dakota, people are moving to there and sleeping in truck stops and rest stops because there is not enough housing. Thousands are moving there every month. The McDonald's is paying $15.00/hour because it just can't find workers.

North Dakota is the template for what Obama opposes.
Obama opposes having oil deposits underground? (pssst:you can't argue that oil leases are being restricted)



Detroit is the template for what Obama is striving to achieve for us all.
The President is trying to destroy the auto industry? Weird, I think I have read argument from cons calling for the dissolution of GM.

Has anyone heard of, seen, read anything about the Earthquakes, the ground water pollution and the horrors of Fracking that Obamabots are are complaining about from the haven of their parent's basements?
Gee, I dare you to watch Gasland. Netflix has it as an instant watch.

Wouldn't it be nice if this posturing, pontificating blow hard would just get the hell out of the way and let the American people do what the American people do?

Unemployed? Go to North Dakota - 1 - oil jobs & fracking - MSN Money
[video]http://www-tc.pbs.org/now/video/NOW-613-stream.mp4[/video]
 

CRUE CAB

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He is not fighting for anything, he is campaigning for something.
 

code1211

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Hmm....taxes are lower, interest rates are lower, S&P/DJI are higher, GDP is higher....and it would be great if employment was higher, but then his predecessor screwed the pooch.

Employment, but as I said, we know how that got to where it is....and your solution....is for everyone to have an oil deposit underneath their feet:

Obama opposes having oil deposits underground? (pssst:you can't argue that oil leases are being restricted)



The President is trying to destroy the auto industry? Weird, I think I have read argument from cons calling for the dissolution of GM.

Gee, I dare you to watch Gasland. Netflix has it as an instant watch.

[video]http://www-tc.pbs.org/now/video/NOW-613-stream.mp4[/video]

Taxes are lower. Obama wants them higher.

Interest rates are lower because the Fed is keeping them that way. Same with the stock markets. Eliminate the Fed meddling and the stock market crashes and the interest rates sky rocket.

Are we still blaming Bush? I thought we were supposed to blame the guy who was in the ****e House during the previous term. isn't that what the Big 0 did?

It figures that you would think that the only thing that can correct the obama blight is an act of God, we all know this. Or, it might also work if he just stopped trying to sabotage anything that resembled a good idea. Has he subsidized any more Solyndras this week? Driven any more coal mines out of business? Idled any more Non-union shops?

Is it your assertion that obama supports the exploitation of the fossil fuels? That will be a scoop.

Oil leases on Federal land are being restricted.

The president supports the expansion of Unions, central control by government and nationalizing all of the policies that have ruined Detroit.

If the president was interested in ending this great recession, all he would need to do is STFU and let the American people work at the things that are before them to exploit.

If he wants to prolong the great recession, he need only continue his failed policies that have prolonged it thus far.

New Report Chronicles Oil and Gas Production on Federal Lands Declining Under Obama
<snip>
CRS Finds Oil and Gas Production Fell on Federal Lands Despite Increases on State and Private Lands - ALL Increases in Oil Production Since 2007 Have Occurred on Non-Federal Lands
<snip>
 

Gimmesometruth

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Taxes are lower. Obama wants them higher.
On upper incomes....to 1998 levels.

Interest rates are lower because the Fed is keeping them that way.
The FED was controlling interest rates in 98.
Same with the stock markets.
The FED is controlling the stock markets? Mmm, no not so much.
Eliminate the Fed meddling and the stock market crashes and the interest rates sky rocket.
LOL...is that an argument for ending the FED?

Are we still blaming Bush? I thought we were supposed to blame the guy who was in the ****e House during the previous term. isn't that what the Big 0 did?
The crash started under Bush and ended a few months after Obama was sworn in.

It figures that you would think that the only thing that can correct the obama blight is an act of God, we all know this.
Me? Your argument rests on the fact that ND has a huge, cheap to access oil reserve. If that is not an act of "god", I don't know what is. You don't even understand your premise.


Or, it might also work if he just stopped trying to sabotage anything that resembled a good idea. Has he subsidized any more Solyndras this week?
Since when did subsidizing a new energy source become a bad thing? Oil was subsidized greatly at its beginning.
Driven any more coal mines out of business?
Thats what we need, dirtier energy sources.
Idled any more Non-union shops?
Umm, the recession did that.

Is it your assertion that obama supports the exploitation of the fossil fuels? That will be a scoop.
Record numbers of off-shore leases granted...but you don't know that.

Oil leases on Federal land are being restricted.


The president supports the expansion of Unions, central control by government and nationalizing all of the policies that have ruined Detroit.
Detroit saw massive declines in 2000 in manufacturing and along with it massive declines in population with some of the highest levels of unemployment. Manufacturing in the US has tumbled in the same time period, unions existed long before 2000. Find a better meme

If the president was interested in ending this great recession, all he would need to do is STFU and let the American people work at the things that are before them to exploit.
Ah, I see, Obama has caused the declines in demand.

If he wants to prolong the great recession, he need only continue his failed policies that have prolonged it thus far.
You mean you want an end to QE....which will cause less investment, tighten credit market, decrease demand further......
 

solletica

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Great OP comparing Detroit to the Dakota boom. Capitalism solves so many problems. Sure you need to police it some, but it's sure better then hating on it so much and using the crony versions
Yes, that's why it would be nice to live in a capitalist country where oil/energy cos. aren't shielded, by legislation, from liability for whatever environmental damage they cause to communities, a lesson learned by konservative state waaay too late. . .

FYI, Arkansas won't see a dime from the lawsuit, compliments of the dolts they voted for.
 

code1211

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That's good. Detroit is currently the USA's most Libertarian city :)

I'm not sure I follow your line of logic.

The last time there was not a Democrat Mayor in Detroit, John Kennedy was still President.

Since before Nixon was elected to his second term, there has been only one non-Democrat City Councilman elected by the good folks of Detroit.

In other words, the Democrat Party has governed this city for longer than most Americans have been alive.

You'll have to flesh out your meaning for me. I don't understand what it is you are saying.
 

code1211

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On upper incomes....to 1998 levels.

The FED was controlling interest rates in 98. The FED is controlling the stock markets? Mmm, no not so much. LOL...is that an argument for ending the FED?

The crash started under Bush and ended a few months after Obama was sworn in.

Me? Your argument rests on the fact that ND has a huge, cheap to access oil reserve. If that is not an act of "god", I don't know what is. You don't even understand your premise.


Since when did subsidizing a new energy source become a bad thing? Oil was subsidized greatly at its beginning. Thats what we need, dirtier energy sources. Umm, the recession did that.

Record numbers of off-shore leases granted...but you don't know that.





Detroit saw massive declines in 2000 in manufacturing and along with it massive declines in population with some of the highest levels of unemployment. Manufacturing in the US has tumbled in the same time period, unions existed long before 2000. Find a better meme

Ah, I see, Obama has caused the declines in demand.

You mean you want an end to QE....which will cause less investment, tighten credit market, decrease demand further......



Yes the Federal Reserve does affect the Stock market. Bernanke hinted that he might reduce the QE at some point in the future and the market had a mini crash.

QE is the result of the work of the Federal Reserve. Are you saying that the president controls the Federal Reserve, another crime by the president? It wouldn't surprise me since he doesn't think that laws apply to him.

I don't know what your chart is supposed to show. It is a chart of things sought, not things approved, started or actually real.

The rest is just more Obamabot rationalization and justification of failure. Household income is down, full time Jobs are way down, employed college graduates in their field are as common as Solar Power panel Company success stories.

Please provide a link to the handouts you claim that oil received from the government.

That you and Obama are STILL blaming Bush after 5 years of Obama failure is the real revealing point in this whole whine fest.

Next you'll be saying that Detroit is an economic dynamo.
 
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Gimmesometruth

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Yes the Federal Reserve does affect the Stock market.
Straw, I said "control", the fed does not control the stock markets, there is not a 1 to 1 relation to interest rates/money supply and the indices.
Bernanke hinted that he might reduce the QE at some point in the future and the market had a mini crash.
There have been crashes without fed moves, again, not 1 to 1.

QE is the result of the work of the Federal Reserve. Are you saying that the president controls the Federal Reserve, another crime by the president? It wouldn't surprise me since he doesn't think that laws apply to him.
Weird, now you are back to using "control". No, the POTUS can influence the FED decisions, he can put his man or woman in charge, he can ask that they use their influence to effect credit/banking stabilization, interest and money supply.

I don't know what your chart is supposed to show. It is a chart of things sought, not things approved, started or actually real.
Sorry, I missed the part where you showed it to be false.

The rest is just more Obamabot rationalization and justification of failure. Household income is down, full time Jobs are way down, employed college graduates in their field are as common as Solar Power panel Company success stories.
Actually, they are up since the bottoming of the Bush Recession.

Please provide a link to the handouts you claim that oil received from the government.
Good grief, here you are, Mr. Oil, asking me to educate you on the history of US oil corporations.
Hint: Look it up for yourself.

That you and Obama are STILL blaming Bush after 5 years of Obama failure is the real revealing point in this whole whine fest.
This is the typical denier response still not coming to term with the depths of the Bush Recession.

Next you'll be saying that Detroit is an economic dynamo.
Now I see why you don't know about the early history of oil industry subsidization (and probably not the current amounts either), it is because you don't read what is in front of you. Here, let me repeat and see if you get it the second time:

Detroit saw massive declines in 2000 in manufacturing and along with it massive declines in population with some of the highest levels of unemployment. Manufacturing in the US has tumbled in the same time period, unions existed long before 2000. Find a better meme.


PS....I see you have abandoned the whole "Has anyone heard of, seen, read anything about the Earthquakes, the ground water pollution and the horrors of Fracking that Obamabots are are complaining about" meme.

Was not that the a main argument point along with the denial that oil deposits are not an act of "god"?
 

Objective Voice

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You folks who complain so loudly about the Federal Reserve's involvement in the marketplace, particularly the bond market, really don't have a clue what you're talking about.

First off, the Federal Reserve has long had control of the prime interest rate on Treasuries - government bonds whether savings bonds, treasury bills or treasury bonds. The reason the interest rate on bonds has remained low is because the money supply isn't tight right now. No, I'm not referring to the government printing press. I'm referring to flow of U.S. currency on the open market. Doubt me? Read this article from news.comau, "US shares soar to record high," dated August 2, 2013.

QE is necessary in order to keep the revenue stream going at the Treasury considering how the GOP won't raise taxes on those who could afford to pay more or remove tax loopholes as they promised one year ago in the run-up to the 2012 presidential election. I mean, it was such a good, acceptable plan when their guy, Mitt Romney, endorsed it as the GOP presidential candidate. But suddenly now that Pres. Obama was re-elected, they've hedged on the idea.

Folks are right to complain about joblessness. The GOP is also correct when they suggest that the best and possibly the fastest way to replenish revenue in the Treasury is for more people to be employed and, thus, pay federal income taxes. It's the multiplier effect in full taxation mode! But when these same people do everything they can not to spur job growth, it's kinda defeatist to talk about job growth on the one hand yet do everything possible not to approve those measures that would incentivize hiring and thus, spur job growth. But how about this as an alternative...

Don't want to pay higher taxes on the rich? Don't want the rich to lose tax loopholes! Don't want the government to raise the minimum wage rate? Then the rich should pay higher wages and let the people decide what to do with their earnings - spend it as consumption calls for, splurge and take on more debt also as consumption calls for but through the credit markets or invest it!! Now, there's an idea!!!
 
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CalGun

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I guess you failed to read "you need to police it some" but you'd prefer a socialist wet dream like those in Eastern Europse, the middle east or Africa? Maybe you'd like to impose the nationalization of Venezuela to "insure" your prestine little environment isn't polluted? Yeah that's the ticket - look to the socialist left for policing environmental problems - check on China while your at it. What a truly horrible argument you make against capitalism. It is the only system that CARES one ounce about the environment and all you can do it trash it.


Yes, that's why it would be nice to live in a capitalist country where oil/energy cos. aren't shielded, by legislation, from liability for whatever environmental damage they cause to communities, a lesson learned by konservative state waaay too late. . .



FYI, Arkansas won't see a dime from the lawsuit, compliments of the dolts they voted for.
 

Objective Voice

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Yes the Federal Reserve does affect the Stock market. Bernanke hinted that he might reduce the QE at some point in the future and the market had a mini crash.
And do you understand why that happened? The answer is simple: If you raise the interest rate on bonds while the money supply is still fluid, people will begin to migrate to those investment vehicles that stand to yield them the fastest rate of return. In short, they'll start shorting the markets - speculating - looking for a quick buck.

QE is the result of the work of the Federal Reserve. Are you saying that the president controls the Federal Reserve, another crime by the president?
As stated above, the Fed Resv controls the interest rate on Treasuries. So, you are correct where QE is concerned. But just for emphasis, the President has absolutely nothing to do with QE. The Fed Chairman may advise him on such matters where economic policy/conditions are concerned, but the decision whether or not to raise the interest rate on government bonds is the responsibility of the Fed Resv.

It wouldn't surprise me since he doesn't think that laws apply to him.
Oh, brother...can we stop with the hyper-partisan absurdity already?

I don't know what your chart is supposed to show. It is a chart of things sought, not things approved, started or actually real.
Apparently, you glossed over the title of the chart, "Onshore Federal lands sought by oil and gas industry for leasing, 2006-2012". Clearly, the chart is in response to an earlier poster who questioned the Obama Administration's approval of domestic oil leases. Granted, the numbers are down compared to where they were in 2009 and especially since 2006, but as the chart clearly illustrates such leases have been on the up-swing since 2010.

The rest is just more Obamabot rationalization and justification of failure. Household income is down, full time Jobs are way down, employed college graduates in their field are as common as Solar Power panel Company success stories.
And you blame President Obama for all that? Really? Oh, no...you don't blame him for creating the mess...just not cleaning it up fast enough. Ah...got it. Because acknowledging the truth of who caused most of these problems - much of which even pre-date GWB and WJClinton - most Right-Wing conservatives couldn't handle it because it would mean they'd have to acknowledge that their conservative hero's long-term economic policies were all wrong!

Please provide a link to the handouts you claim that oil received from the government.
He already did! See the chart of oil leasing since 2006.

That you and Obama are STILL blaming Bush after 5 years of Obama failure is the real revealing point in this whole whine fest.
All I can say to that is if the shoe fits. Of course, history will tell just how affective or destructive GWB's economic and foreign policies were to the nation.

Next you'll be saying that Detroit is an economic dynamo.
More hype...:roll:
 

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Obama is fighting for policies that will make the USA into Detroit.

He is fighting against policies that will make the USA of 2013 into the USA of 1998.

What's wrong with this picture.

Right now in North Dakota, people are moving to there and sleeping in truck stops and rest stops because there is not enough housing. Thousands are moving there every month. The McDonald's is paying $15.00/hour because it just can't find workers.

North Dakota is the template for what Obama opposes. Detroit is the template for what Obama is striving to achieve for us all.

Has anyone heard of, seen, read anything about the Earthquakes, the ground water pollution and the horrors of Fracking that Obamabots are are complaining about from the haven of their parent's basements?

Wouldn't it be nice if this posturing, pontificating blow hard would just get the hell out of the way and let the American people do what the American people do?

Unemployed? Go to North Dakota - 1 - oil jobs & fracking - MSN Money
Yea, $15hr and $2000 month rent for a tiny Apt. Sounds GREAT...........
 

solletica

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I guess you failed to read "you need to police it some" but you'd prefer a socialist wet dream like those in Eastern Europse, the middle east or Africa? Maybe you'd like to impose the nationalization of Venezuela to "insure" your prestine little environment isn't polluted? Yeah that's the ticket - look to the socialist left for policing environmental problems - check on China while your at it. What a truly horrible argument you make against capitalism. It is the only system that CARES one ounce about the environment and all you can do it trash it.
Correct. Capitalism does care about the environment. And I'm still waiting for someone to tell me where there is evidence of any capitalism in the konservative* states.

(* - synonym for taxpayers picking up the tab for massive environmental damage)
 

solletica

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I'm not sure I follow your line of logic.

The last time there was not a Democrat Mayor in Detroit, John Kennedy was still President.

Since before Nixon was elected to his second term, there has been only one non-Democrat City Councilman elected by the good folks of Detroit.

In other words, the Democrat Party has governed this city for longer than most Americans have been alive.

You'll have to flesh out your meaning for me. I don't understand what it is you are saying.
Define Libertarianism for us, in your own words .

Then tell us how much government there currently exists in Detroit.
 

CalGun

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Oh so BP didn't spend any money cleaning up its mess in the gulf, nope, nota dime! Are you serious? Or just (never mind)


Correct. Capitalism does care about the environment. And I'm still waiting for someone to tell me where there is evidence of any capitalism in the konservative* states.

(* - synonym for taxpayers picking up the tab for massive environmental damage)
 

Dooble

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Conservatism destroyed Detroit.

It did it by demanding public policies which sent good American manufacturing jobs offshore. It did it by attacking good American union jobs, jobs paying middle class wages to American workers. Now those jobs are in third world hellholes paying slave wages to workers who are so desperate they have no choice but working for slave wages.

If you want America to be a third world hellhole, vote for conservatives.
What we can take from this nonsense is, never trust a liberal to explain anything.

This version makes a helluva lot more sense:

5 Ways Liberalism Destroyed Detroit - John Hawkins - Page full
 

code1211

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Conservatism destroyed Detroit.

It did it by demanding public policies which sent good American manufacturing jobs offshore. It did it by attacking good American union jobs, jobs paying middle class wages to American workers. Now those jobs are in third world hellholes paying slave wages to workers who are so desperate they have no choice but working for slave wages.

If you want America to be a third world hellhole, vote for conservatives.



Jobs are like water. They flow to where the work is.

If you want jobs to appear in a place, then create the conditions that attract jobs.

The conditions that you desire repel jobs.
 

code1211

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He is not fighting for anything, he is campaigning for something.


True.

But the side effect of his campaign is that he is fighting against the conditions that promote a strong economy like the one in north Dakota and fighting to wreck our economy to make it as much like Detroit as he can.
 
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