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Obama as one of the Greatest Presidents Ever

MrT

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Why Obama Will Go Down as One of the Greatest Presidents of All Time | GQ

Barack Obama will be inducted into the league of Great Presidents.

In fact, and I say this as a Bill Clinton fan, I now feel certain that, in the coming decades, Obama’s star will rise higher than Clinton’s, and he’ll replace Bill in the public mind as the Greatest Democrat since FDR.

This has to do with the nature of Obama’s leadership, which is to play to legacy (and Clinton’s impulse, which is to play to the room). Bill Clinton will long be revered because he’s charismatic, presided over an economic revival, and changed and elevated the view of the Democratic Party. Barack Obama will long be revered because he’s charismatic, presided over an economic revival, and changed and elevated the view of the presidency. He’s simply bigger than Bill.

Consider the fact that Obama was dealt a really ****ty hand and managed to avoid faltering, like Carter or Hoover, and instead dramatically improved the situation, like Reagan and Roosevelt. Consider the fact that Obama has legacy defining achievements in the domestic realm, like the first overhaul to the medical insurance industry in nearly 50 years or overseeing a dramatic improvement for LGBT rights. Not to mention the avoidance of any large scale terrorist attacks on domestic soil. And there are international achievements like the first international agreement with Iran in 40 years and a thawing of diplomatic relations with Cuba for the first time in 40 years. Not to mention overseeing the death of Osama bin Laden.

And then consider the personal attributes - his charisma, his humor, his soaring rhetoric. These are attributes that we can find amongst the greatest presidents.
 
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azgreg

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Need a towelette? You got a little Obama on your chin there.
 

Abbazorkzog

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I disagree. Those who say he's the greatest President ever are just as ignorant as those that say he's the worst.
Our country has been a ****-hole since Vietnam.
 

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Why Obama Will Go Down as One of the Greatest Presidents of All Time | GQ

Consider the fact that Obama was dealt a really ****ty hand and managed to avoid faltering, like Carter or Hoover, and instead dramatically improved the situation, like Reagan and Roosevelt.

Not like Reagan or Harding. But definitely like Roosevelt (though I don't think that means what you think it means). Fortunately/Unfortunately, he lacked Roosevelt's ability to redraw the political map, mostly overseeing the hardening of positions on both sides.

Consider the fact that Obama has legacy defining achievements in the domestic realm, like the first overhaul to the medical insurance industry in nearly 50 years

Which is dying, choking off providers and insurers, and will not survive the next GOP administration.

or overseeing a dramatic improvement for LGBT rights.

SCOTUS made gay marriage the law of the land, not POTUS. Giving him credit is no more intelligent than those on my side who blame him for it. (Hilariously, the Trumpkins are now passing around a list of things Trump will do in his first year in office. One of the items - end gay marriage. cpwill predicts it will shock few informed observers that Trump fans appear to have a very shallow grasp on civics).

Not to mention the avoidance of any large scale terrorist attacks on domestic soil.

Dude. If there is anything that this POTUS is not going to be remembered for, starting (definitely, at least) 25-50 years hence, it is going to be the effectiveness of his CT policies. George W Bush has a better chance of being remembered as an eloquent and incredible public speaker.

And there are international achievements like the first international agreement with Iran in 40 years

Oh yeah. That's gone awesome.

and a thawing of diplomatic relations with Cuba for the first time in 40 years

That actually is something he will be remembered for. Positively or not will depend on part on to what extent the Cuban regime continues to abuse its people.

Not to mention overseeing the death of Osama bin Laden.

I do give Obama credit on that one - that was a gutsy and correct call to make. I can understand why Biden recommended that he not.

And then consider the personal attributes - his charisma, his humor, his soaring rhetoric.

His arrogance, his divisiveness, his strawmen, his vicious personal attacks on the motives of anyone who disagreed with him....
 

Fearandloathing

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Why Obama Will Go Down as One of the Greatest Presidents of All Time | GQ



Consider the fact that Obama was dealt a really ****ty hand and managed to avoid faltering, like Carter or Hoover, and instead dramatically improved the situation, like Reagan and Roosevelt. Consider the fact that Obama has legacy defining achievements in the domestic realm, like the first overhaul to the medical insurance industry in nearly 50 years or overseeing a dramatic improvement for LGBT rights. Not to mention the avoidance of any large scale terrorist attacks on domestic soil. And there are international achievements like the first international agreement with Iran in 40 years and a thawing of diplomatic relations with Cuba for the first time in 40 years. Not to mention overseeing the death of Osama bin Laden.

And then consider the personal attributes - his charisma, his humor, his soaring rhetoric. These are attributes that we can find amongst the greatest presidents.



My assessment is that history will see Obama as 'the first black president' and little more. History concentrates on conflict and so his wars with congress, the dis-honesty of the ACA and so forth will prevent anyone from placing him in the top twenty or more. I think history will see this as the "divided era' where right and left, black and white, pared off against each other more than any other time in history, so who was president won't likely be heralded, and certainly not Barrack "enemies" Obama.
 

Glen Contrarian

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Why Obama Will Go Down as One of the Greatest Presidents of All Time | GQ



Consider the fact that Obama was dealt a really ****ty hand and managed to avoid faltering, like Carter or Hoover, and instead dramatically improved the situation, like Reagan and Roosevelt. Consider the fact that Obama has legacy defining achievements in the domestic realm, like the first overhaul to the medical insurance industry in nearly 50 years or overseeing a dramatic improvement for LGBT rights. Not to mention the avoidance of any large scale terrorist attacks on domestic soil. And there are international achievements like the first international agreement with Iran in 40 years and a thawing of diplomatic relations with Cuba for the first time in 40 years. Not to mention overseeing the death of Osama bin Laden.

And then consider the personal attributes - his charisma, his humor, his soaring rhetoric. These are attributes that we can find amongst the greatest presidents.

I've often said that if Obama'd had an (R) behind his name, given his accomplishments, the GOP would be lobbying to have his face added to Mount Rushmore. But since he's got that (D), well, THAT means that he never has done and never will do anything good for anyone ever.

On my personal list of presidents, the top three are Washington and Lincoln (though I'm not sure which should be #1 or #2), FDR, and #4 and #5 are between Obama and Reagan...and the ONLY reason I include Reagan on the list was because he won the Cold War...quite literally the most dangerous time in recorded human history. He was the one in charge, so he gets the credit.
 

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Why Obama Will Go Down as One of the Greatest Presidents of All Time | GQ



Consider the fact that Obama was dealt a really ****ty hand and managed to avoid faltering, like Carter or Hoover, and instead dramatically improved the situation, like Reagan and Roosevelt. Consider the fact that Obama has legacy defining achievements in the domestic realm, like the first overhaul to the medical insurance industry in nearly 50 years or overseeing a dramatic improvement for LGBT rights. Not to mention the avoidance of any large scale terrorist attacks on domestic soil. And there are international achievements like the first international agreement with Iran in 40 years and a thawing of diplomatic relations with Cuba for the first time in 40 years. Not to mention overseeing the death of Osama bin Laden.

And then consider the personal attributes - his charisma, his humor, his soaring rhetoric. These are attributes that we can find amongst the greatest presidents.

Well let's think about this -

1. He wasn't "dealt" a bad situation. He campaigned to get into that situation.
2. It's PLENTY debatable how much any Obama policy helped the economic situation. The fundamentals were all in place before he took office. The Obama administration's part has consisted primarily of dumping tons and tons of money into the economy and ramping up the debt. You may recall that the bond rating companies weren't too happy about that and dropped our rating.
3. His "overhaul" of the medical industry has been an utter failure. Costs are still skyrocketing, policies are still getting cancelled and people are still pissed off. The ONLY thing he did was get more people on Medicaid. The price he paid for doing that was the loss of a Democrat majority in both houses.
4. There have really only ever been two large scale terror attacks inside the borders of the US. One was Oklahoma City and the other was 9/11. Both of those were spurred by the policies of Bill Clinton's administration. Furthermore, if any credit for protecting the nation is going to be handed out then you really need to consider that Obama merely continued the policies of the Bush administration.
5. You're really going to bring up the Iran deal? That's a special kind of special.
6. Cuba policy...see #5 and add in that he has reestablished diplomatic relations with a regime that imprisons its own people for political dissent.

Obama will go down in history for exactly the same thing he got elected for. His legacy will be as the first Black US president and that's really it.
 

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"One of"? What's up with that? He's the greatestest ever. He's the one who said, "If you like your doctor, you can shove him or her up your ass along with that third rate, loser health insurance policy you have there." I'm paraphrasing here. Takes balls to say something like that.
 

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My assessment is that history will see Obama as 'the first black president' and little more. History concentrates on conflict and so his wars with congress, the dis-honesty of the ACA and so forth will prevent anyone from placing him in the top twenty or more. I think history will see this as the "divided era' where right and left, black and white, pared off against each other more than any other time in history, so who was president won't likely be heralded, and certainly not Barrack "enemies" Obama.

In the Navy, we were taught that when we stand watch, make sure one's watchstation is better off for the one who relieves you than it was when you assumed the watch.

I'd say the same goes for the president - make sure the nation's better off than it was when he (or she) took the helm of the ship of state. As for Obama, the day he took over, our economy was in free fall in the worst economic crisis in 80 years (IIRC we lost 800K jobs that month), and we were stuck in two wars that were costing us upwards of $10B/month of taxpayer dollars, not to mention scores and scores of pine boxes coming home from those wars every month.

Compare that to now, and we're out of those two wars, we're not heavily involved in any war (Syria's a minor sideshow compared to our level of military involvement in Iraq and Afghanistan), and we've had positive private-sector job growth every month since the last quarter of 2010 - that's 66 consecutive months of private-sector job growth, the longest such stretch in ALL American history...and it's reflected in where the Dow is today - just under 18,000, as compared to under 7,000 in March 2009.

These are not "talking points" - these are hard-and-fast metrics to use when determining whether the president was good or bad...and there's more than a few on the Right who would kill to be able to have had a president with the above accomplishments to brag about.
 

TheGoverness

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One was Oklahoma City and the other was 9/11. Both of those were spurred by the policies of Bill Clinton's administration.

Your kidding me right? The Bush Administration had everything[/i] to do with causing 9/11, not Bill Clinton. They had MEMOS that they were going to attack the WTC, but the Bush Administration ignored them.

5. You're really going to bring up the Iran deal? That's a special kind of special.

What's wrong with the deal with Iran? We were successful in making a deal with them, so...what?

6. Cuba policy...see #5 and add in that he has reestablished diplomatic relations with a regime that imprisons its own people for political dissent.

So Obama was wrong to open up relations with Cuba because they in prison people for political dissent, and that they're communists? By that standard we should cut off all of our support from China and Saudi Arabia, in which one is a communist regime and the other commits horrible atrocities to it's citizens if they go against the government.


But still, Obama is not the best president ever. He's a George Bush 2.0 if anything.
 
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Fearandloathing

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Well let's think about this -

1. He wasn't "dealt" a bad situation. He campaigned to get into that situation.
2. It's PLENTY debatable how much any Obama policy helped the economic situation. The fundamentals were all in place before he took office. The Obama administration's part has consisted primarily of dumping tons and tons of money into the economy and ramping up the debt. You may recall that the bond rating companies weren't too happy about that and dropped our rating.
3. His "overhaul" of the medical industry has been an utter failure. Costs are still skyrocketing, policies are still getting cancelled and people are still pissed off. The ONLY thing he did was get more people on Medicaid. The price he paid for doing that was the loss of a Democrat majority in both houses.
4. There have really only ever been two large scale terror attacks inside the borders of the US. One was Oklahoma City and the other was 9/11. Both of those were spurred by the policies of Bill Clinton's administration. Furthermore, if any credit for protecting the nation is going to be handed out then you really need to consider that Obama merely continued the policies of the Bush administration.
5. You're really going to bring up the Iran deal? That's a special kind of special.
6. Cuba policy...see #5 and add in that he has reestablished diplomatic relations with a regime that imprisons its own people for political dissent.

Obama will go down in history for exactly the same thing he got elected for. His legacy will be as the first Black US president and that's really it.



Other than the Cuba reference that is the best recap of Obama's administration I have ever seen. On Cuba we have to disagree, and I have maintained that the human rights issue is a smoke screen for continuing what was a stupid idea in the first place. The US runs at China with hands out, doing business and making loans. China's human rights record is no better than Cuba's, or any one of a dozen countries the US does business with.
 

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I disagree. Those who say he's the greatest President ever are just as ignorant as those that say he's the worst.
Our country has been a ****-hole since Vietnam.

I agree, no different than the neo cons and there adulation of Saint Ronnie
 

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6. Cuba policy...see #5 and add in that he has reestablished diplomatic relations with a regime that imprisons its own people for political dissent.

How is this different than the dozens of other nations we have diplomatic relations with?

Opening up Cuba will be a positive mark for Obama. This is coming from someone who strongly dislikes Obama.
 

MrT

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Not like Reagan or Harding. But definitely like Roosevelt (though I don't think that means what you think it means). Fortunately/Unfortunately, he lacked Roosevelt's ability to redraw the political map, mostly overseeing the hardening of positions on both sides.

The comparison is not perfect of course. But to your point, I would note that Obama certainly flipped the political map relative to 2000 and 2004 (perhaps I am taking your use of the word "map" too literally though).

Which is dying, choking off providers and insurers, and will not survive the next GOP administration.

I sincerely doubt that the next GOP administration will be able to dismantle obamacare - at least not many of the central tenets. They will never be able to win a political debate on returning to a time when pre-existing conditions are a thing.

SCOTUS made gay marriage the law of the land, not POTUS. Giving him credit is no more intelligent than those on my side who blame him for it. (Hilariously, the Trumpkins are now passing around a list of things Trump will do in his first year in office. One of the items - end gay marriage. cpwill predicts it will shock few informed observers that Trump fans appear to have a very shallow grasp on civics).

You forget that Obama was the first president to publicly state that homosexuals should be allowed to marry, that he refused to defend DOMA, and that he was the first to use executive authority to expand LGBT rights in the military and for those employed by the federal government.

Dude. If there is anything that this POTUS is not going to be remembered for, starting (definitely, at least) 25-50 years hence, it is going to be the effectiveness of his CT policies. George W Bush has a better chance of being remembered as an eloquent and incredible public speaker.

I would be willing to agree that his CT policies will not be deemed as successful as his other achievements, but I referenced the lack of major attacks specifically because, at the time of his candidacy, that threat was prominently espoused by numerous critics.

Oh yeah. That's gone awesome.

Considering the fact that Iran has agreed to one of the most invasive and intrusive nuclear inspection regimes in the world and the fact that it has resulted in real world events like filling the nuclear facility with concrete AND the near sweep for the moderate faction of the Iranian politicians, I would agree.

That actually is something he will be remembered for. Positively or not will depend on part on to what extent the Cuban regime continues to abuse its people.

Perhaps. History is a fickle bitch.

I do give Obama credit on that one - that was a gutsy and correct call to make. I can understand why Biden recommended that he not.

Well I would include this event as part of his CT policy.

His arrogance, his divisiveness, his strawmen, his vicious personal attacks on the motives of anyone who disagreed with him....

This thread is not about Trump.
 

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I've often said that if Obama'd had an (R) behind his name, given his accomplishments, the GOP would be lobbying to have his face added to Mount Rushmore. But since he's got that (D), well, THAT means that he never has done and never will do anything good for anyone ever.

On my personal list of presidents, the top three are Washington and Lincoln (though I'm not sure which should be #1 or #2), FDR, and #4 and #5 are between Obama and Reagan...and the ONLY reason I include Reagan on the list was because he won the Cold War...quite literally the most dangerous time in recorded human history. He was the one in charge, so he gets the credit.

Has Obama lost the new cold war? Seems like he is really trying mightily to do so...
 

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Why Obama Will Go Down as One of the Greatest Presidents of All Time | GQ



Consider the fact that Obama was dealt a really ****ty hand and managed to avoid faltering, like Carter or Hoover, and instead dramatically improved the situation, like Reagan and Roosevelt. Consider the fact that Obama has legacy defining achievements in the domestic realm, like the first overhaul to the medical insurance industry in nearly 50 years or overseeing a dramatic improvement for LGBT rights. Not to mention the avoidance of any large scale terrorist attacks on domestic soil. And there are international achievements like the first international agreement with Iran in 40 years and a thawing of diplomatic relations with Cuba for the first time in 40 years. Not to mention overseeing the death of Osama bin Laden.

And then consider the personal attributes - his charisma, his humor, his soaring rhetoric. These are attributes that we can find amongst the greatest presidents.

No, Obama is a completely average president.

Unprecedented persecution and prosecution of whistleblowers.
An utterly inept response to the Middle East. He's been getting schooled hard by Putin.
"If you like your doctor, you can keep your doctor." Regardless of the ACA's end results, Obama fumbled hard with his messaging.
He allowed the weakening of Dodd-Frank to the point where banks are bigger and more powerful than ever before.
Guantanamo still open despite it's closing being one of Obama's pledges since before he entered office. For comparison, Polk got his entire presidential agenda completed in one term and saw no need for another. Obama can't get one thing done even though he's the executive and had the office for Eight years.

Obama is a average president. Not the worst but it's delusional to call him among the greatest.
 

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In the Navy, we were taught that when we stand watch, make sure one's watchstation is better off for the one who relieves you than it was when you assumed the watch.

I'd say the same goes for the president - make sure the nation's better off than it was when he (or she) took the helm of the ship of state. As for Obama, the day he took over, our economy was in free fall in the worst economic crisis in 80 years (IIRC we lost 800K jobs that month), and we were stuck in two wars that were costing us upwards of $10B/month of taxpayer dollars, not to mention scores and scores of pine boxes coming home from those wars every month.

Compare that to now, and we're out of those two wars, we're not heavily involved in any war (Syria's a minor sideshow compared to our level of military involvement in Iraq and Afghanistan), and we've had positive private-sector job growth every month since the last quarter of 2010 - that's 66 consecutive months of private-sector job growth, the longest such stretch in ALL American history...and it's reflected in where the Dow is today - just under 18,000, as compared to under 7,000 in March 2009.

These are not "talking points" - these are hard-and-fast metrics to use when determining whether the president was good or bad...and there's more than a few on the Right who would kill to be able to have had a president with the above accomplishments to brag about.

Why do the Obamabots always hold up ONLY the day he took office and not the preceding 25 years?

Obama's policies made this recession the longest since the Great Depression and the recovery the weakest since WW2.

Obama is hurting this nation to a point at which it will have the same historic impact on the world as Carthage.

Given his hatred of the American presence in the world, all business and the American military, it's difficult to imagine that this is not his ultimate policy goal.
 
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MrT

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Well let's think about this -

1. He wasn't "dealt" a bad situation. He campaigned to get into that situation.

Considering the timing of when he started to run for President and the economic collapse, I stick with the phrase of "dealt." You can argue semantics if you wish.

2. It's PLENTY debatable how much any Obama policy helped the economic situation. The fundamentals were all in place before he took office. The Obama administration's part has consisted primarily of dumping tons and tons of money into the economy and ramping up the debt. You may recall that the bond rating companies weren't too happy about that and dropped our rating.

They dropped the rating, not because of the debt, but specifically because of the inability of Congress to reach an agreement on the debt and an unwillingness on behalf of Congress to add to the debt. The bond agencies don't care about debt unless you can not pay for it.

3. His "overhaul" of the medical industry has been an utter failure. Costs are still skyrocketing, policies are still getting cancelled and people are still pissed off. The ONLY thing he did was get more people on Medicaid. The price he paid for doing that was the loss of a Democrat majority in both houses.

A short term gain at the cost of long term success and the demolition of the Republican party that we currently see. And no, Obamacare is not a total failure. It has flaws, like all legislation, can and will be fixed if Republicans ever decide to stop voting, again and again, to repeal it.

4. There have really only ever been two large scale terror attacks inside the borders of the US. One was Oklahoma City and the other was 9/11. Both of those were spurred by the policies of Bill Clinton's administration. Furthermore, if any credit for protecting the nation is going to be handed out then you really need to consider that Obama merely continued the policies of the Bush administration.

That is a) criticism of Clinton, not Obama and b) a credit to Obama for continuing certain policies.

5. You're really going to bring up the Iran deal? That's a special kind of special.

Just because Trump calls it the worst deal in history does not make it such. The deal has resulted in real world benefits like the decommissioning of a heavy water facility and the recent, near sweep, for the moderate political faction in the Iranian elections.

6. Cuba policy...see #5 and add in that he has reestablished diplomatic relations with a regime that imprisons its own people for political dissent.

Come on man, that's a pathetic criticism.

Obama will go down in history for exactly the same thing he got elected for. His legacy will be as the first Black US president and that's really it.

I specifically avoided referencing his skin tone because I knew that conservatives would jump on that line as their primary criticism of this analysis. Just glad to see you couldn't resist.
 

MrT

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My assessment is that history will see Obama as 'the first black president' and little more. History concentrates on conflict and so his wars with congress, the dis-honesty of the ACA and so forth will prevent anyone from placing him in the top twenty or more. I think history will see this as the "divided era' where right and left, black and white, pared off against each other more than any other time in history, so who was president won't likely be heralded, and certainly not Barrack "enemies" Obama.

I specifically avoided referencing his skin tone because I knew that conservatives would jump on that line as their primary criticism of this analysis. Just glad to see you couldn't resist.
 

MrT

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Why do the Obamabots always hold up ONLY the day he took office and not the preceding 25 years?

Obama's policies made this recession the longest since the Great Depression and the recovery the weakest since WW2.

Obama is hurting this nation to a point at which it will have the same historic impact on the world as Carthage.

Carthage?! Wow.

And I don't suppose the reason that the recovery was the longest since the Great Depression could have been because it was the worst recession since the Great Depression?
 

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Obama was not a great president not even a good president, he was okay as he did the bare minimum. Good and great presidents change America, define what it means to be American.
 

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Why Obama Will Go Down as One of the Greatest Presidents of All Time | GQ



Consider the fact that Obama was dealt a really ****ty hand and managed to avoid faltering, like Carter or Hoover, and instead dramatically improved the situation, like Reagan and Roosevelt. Consider the fact that Obama has legacy defining achievements in the domestic realm, like the first overhaul to the medical insurance industry in nearly 50 years or overseeing a dramatic improvement for LGBT rights. Not to mention the avoidance of any large scale terrorist attacks on domestic soil. And there are international achievements like the first international agreement with Iran in 40 years and a thawing of diplomatic relations with Cuba for the first time in 40 years. Not to mention overseeing the death of Osama bin Laden.

And then consider the personal attributes - his charisma, his humor, his soaring rhetoric. These are attributes that we can find amongst the greatest presidents.

greatest of all time eh?


yeah... No.

at best, he's fair to middlin'
 

Glen Contrarian

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Why do the Obamabots always hold up ONLY the day he took office and not the preceding 25 years?

You mean the years when Reagan tripled the deficit, whereas Obama's cut it in half?
Or how Obama's grown the government the least of any president since Eisenhower?

Obama's policies made this recession the longest since the Great Depression and the recovery the weakest since WW2.

Hm, lemme see here - the economy was melting down, bleeding 800K jobs a month when he took over, but I forget! According to "Code 1211", Obama shoulda been able to just snap his fingers and make everything all better overnight! And of course, the deliberate decision by the GOP to oppose EVERYthing Obama wanted regardless of what it was, even if they'd supported it before, couldn't have stopped Obama from fixing the economy - of course not!

66 consecutive months of private sector job growth - by far the longest in ALL American history. Sorta hard to listen to your doom-and-gloom claims when I see that.

Obama is hurting this nation to a point at which it will have the same historic impact on the world as Carthage.

66 consecutive months of private sector job growth - by far the longest in ALL American history. But I guess that in YOUR book, it was better when America was losing 800K jobs per month....

Given his hatred of the American presence in the world, all business and the American military, it's difficult to imagine that this is not his ultimate policy goal.

"His hatred"? Man, but you just can't pull yourself away from that Kool-Aid, can you? And then there's 66 consecutive months of private sector job growth - by far the longest in ALL American history...sorta hard for you to claim that he "hates all business" when I see that.
 
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