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Obama’s new executive order will kill the 110-year-old Civilian Marksmanship Program

ChezC3

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Obama

This man is a menace...
 

Fiddytree

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Re: Obama’s new executive order will kill the 110-year-old Civilian Marksmanship Prog

“Apart from a donation of surplus .22 and .30 caliber rifles in the Army’s inventory to the CMP, the CMP receives no federal funding,” the CMP website states, adding that they have been overwhelmed by requests and orders are taking 30-60 days to ship product.

The rifles that the Executive Order would affect are typically from U.S. allies and are pre-Vietnam era. Without the importation of these rifles, the CMP is likely to become defunct and thus destroying a 110 year tradition of saving military arms and their civilian ownership.



Read more: Obama
I don't know anything about this program, but I immediately thought historical rifles, and thought, "give the program support." I'm not much of a personal gun lover at all, but I had always enjoyed those that go after much older weaponry. Who has been funding it?- and it seems like they are too overwhelmed.

In a Fact Sheet published on Whitehouse.gov today referencing the upcoming executive order the ban on importing military weapons is designed to “keep military-grade firearms off our streets.”
Has there even been a study that is able to conclude that is what is happening in the slightest via this program? According to the article, no, but really, more questions begged.
 
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Beaudreaux

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Re: Obama’s new executive order will kill the 110-year-old Civilian Marksmanship Prog

Obama

This man is a menace...
Once again, the US has started a "War on (fill in the blank)". How well has that War of Drugs turned out? The War on Poverty? Now the War on Guns.

War on Drugs... increase in illegal drugs, killings over drugs, thugs getting rich selling illegal drugs.

War on Poverty... increase in poverty levels, highest number of citizens relying on government dollars.

War on Guns... Prediction: increase in illegal gun trafficking, increase in killings over guns, thugs getting rich selling illegal guns. At least now, you have to register a gun. The only guns you don't have to have a license to sell or buy have to be over 100 years old before they're exempt. When was the last time anyone heard of a bank robber using a flint-lock, or a drive by shooting using a Brown Bess. Most murders committed with guns are committed with illegally acquired guns, not the legal kind.

More ridiculous over reach and wrongfully targeted restrictions by "well meaning" political correctness gone wild.
 

ChezC3

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Re: Obama’s new executive order will kill the 110-year-old Civilian Marksmanship Prog

In my view this is another pathetic attempt to restrict and punish honest, law abiding gun owners because Obama and others of his ilk can't control the beasts of streets nor can they win against the united front of law abiding citizens who won't lie down and allow their 2nd Amendment Rights to be further eroded. I don't know of any studies but I can pretty much guaran-damn-tee that the criminal element knew nothing about this program and not one single criminal gun assault came as a direct result of this program.

Obama is really beginning to piss me off...
 

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Re: Obama’s new executive order will kill the 110-year-old Civilian Marksmanship Prog


so tell us Bob, what is wrong with this organization which was once a GOVERNMENT AGENCY, being able to sell to QUALIFIED americans who pass a BACKGROUND CHECK and have proof of shooting proficiency WWII rifles that we once loaned to allies?
 

Carjosse

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Re: Obama’s new executive order will kill the 110-year-old Civilian Marksmanship Prog

I don't see anyreason to ban the import of things like WWII rifles, how do they differ from buying a modern hunting rifle?
 

Bob N

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Re: Obama’s new executive order will kill the 110-year-old Civilian Marksmanship Prog

so tell us Bob, what is wrong with this organization which was once a GOVERNMENT AGENCY, being able to sell to QUALIFIED americans who pass a BACKGROUND CHECK and have proof of shooting proficiency WWII rifles that we once loaned to allies?
In my opinion I think that it's being done away with because we have a militia of people that trains at gun ranges and since it's chartered by the US government it's no longer needed. If people want to shoot let them shoot the guns they have at gun ranges

Why let imported military-grade firearms get to the streets? Fact Sheet:

Building on the 23 Executive Actions the President and Vice President Unveiled Last January

Last December, the President asked the Vice President to develop a series of recommendations to reduce gun violence. On January 16, 2013, they released these proposals, including 23 executive actions. With the first Senate confirmation of an ATF Director on July 31, 2013, the Administration has completed or made significant progress on 22 of the 23 executive actions. The new executive actions unveiled today build on this successful effort.

Closing a Loophole to Keep Some of the Most Dangerous Guns Out of the Wrong Hands

Current law places special restrictions on many of the most dangerous weapons, such as machine guns and short-barreled shotguns. These weapons must be registered, and in order to lawfully possess them, a prospective buyer must undergo a fingerprint-based background check.
However, felons, domestic abusers, and others prohibited from having guns can easily evade the required background check and gain access to machine guns or other particularly dangerous weapons by registering the weapon to a trust or corporation. At present, when the weapon is registered to a trust or corporation, no background check is run. ATF reports that last year alone, it received more than 39,000 requests for transfers of these restricted firearms to trusts or corporations.
Today, ATF is issuing a new proposed regulation to close this loophole. The proposed rule requires individuals associated with trusts or corporations that acquire these types of weapons to undergo background checks, just as these individuals would if the weapons were registered to them individually. By closing this loophole, the regulation will ensure that machine guns and other particularly dangerous weapons do not end up in the wrong hands.

Keeping Surplus Military Weapons Off Our Streets

When the United States provides military firearms to its allies, either as direct commercial sales or through the foreign military sales or military assistance programs, those firearms may not be imported back into the United States without U.S. government approval. Since 2005, the U.S. Government has authorized requests to reimport more than 250,000 of these firearms.
Today, the Administration is announcing a new policy of denying requests to bring military-grade firearms back into the United States to private entities, with only a few exceptions such as for museums. This new policy will help keep military-grade firearms off our streets.
 

TurtleDude

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Re: Obama’s new executive order will kill the 110-year-old Civilian Marksmanship Prog

In my opinion I think that it's being done away with because we have a militia of people that trains at gun ranges and since it's chartered by the US government it's no longer needed. If people want to shoot let them shoot the guns they have at gun ranges

Why let imported military-grade firearms get to the streets? Fact Sheet:

Building on the 23 Executive Actions the President and Vice President Unveiled Last January

Last December, the President asked the Vice President to develop a series of recommendations to reduce gun violence. On January 16, 2013, they released these proposals, including 23 executive actions. With the first Senate confirmation of an ATF Director on July 31, 2013, the Administration has completed or made significant progress on 22 of the 23 executive actions. The new executive actions unveiled today build on this successful effort.

Closing a Loophole to Keep Some of the Most Dangerous Guns Out of the Wrong Hands

Current law places special restrictions on many of the most dangerous weapons, such as machine guns and short-barreled shotguns. These weapons must be registered, and in order to lawfully possess them, a prospective buyer must undergo a fingerprint-based background check.
However, felons, domestic abusers, and others prohibited from having guns can easily evade the required background check and gain access to machine guns or other particularly dangerous weapons by registering the weapon to a trust or corporation. At present, when the weapon is registered to a trust or corporation, no background check is run. ATF reports that last year alone, it received more than 39,000 requests for transfers of these restricted firearms to trusts or corporations.
Today, ATF is issuing a new proposed regulation to close this loophole. The proposed rule requires individuals associated with trusts or corporations that acquire these types of weapons to undergo background checks, just as these individuals would if the weapons were registered to them individually. By closing this loophole, the regulation will ensure that machine guns and other particularly dangerous weapons do not end up in the wrong hands.

Keeping Surplus Military Weapons Off Our Streets

When the United States provides military firearms to its allies, either as direct commercial sales or through the foreign military sales or military assistance programs, those firearms may not be imported back into the United States without U.S. government approval. Since 2005, the U.S. Government has authorized requests to reimport more than 250,000 of these firearms.
Today, the Administration is announcing a new policy of denying requests to bring military-grade firearms back into the United States to private entities, with only a few exceptions such as for museums. This new policy will help keep military-grade firearms off our streets.
that might be the most moronic bit of nonsense I have ever seen

rather than actually make an argument you just swallowed the administration's swill and crapped it out.

Do you have any idea how stupid it is to use the term "military grade firearms"/
 

spud_meister

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Re: Obama’s new executive order will kill the 110-year-old Civilian Marksmanship Prog

Well done Obama, solving a problem that doesn't exist.
 

TurtleDude

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Re: Obama’s new executive order will kill the 110-year-old Civilian Marksmanship Prog

Obama

This man is a menace...
It shows what a POS that clown is. How many Garands have ever ended up on the street. anyone who used to claim that the Turd in chief is not anti gun can no longer make this claim
 

TurtleDude

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Re: Obama’s new executive order will kill the 110-year-old Civilian Marksmanship Prog

Well done Obama, solving a problem that doesn't exist.
The problem to him is people enjoying shooting sports-which is what the organization promotes you cannot get a gun from them unless you already can prove shooting experience (you have to both belong to a sanctioned gun club and you have to show PROOF of firearms activity) as well as pass a background check


this scumbag and his minions are doing everything possible to destroy the shooting sports
 

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Re: Obama’s new executive order will kill the 110-year-old Civilian Marksmanship Prog

Obama

This man is a menace...
You beat me to it Chez.

I was going to title the thread;

Liberal Fascist President Obama Continues To Dismantle America's Culture:
Obama’s new executive order will kill the 110-year-old Civilian Marksmanship Program

Obama

Couldn't decide if it should have been posted under Breaking News, the Gun Control forum or the Military forum since the purpose of the CMP is national security.

>"The program was created by the U.S. Congress as part of the 1903 War Department Appropriations Act with the purpose of allowing civilians to hone their marksmanship skills, should they later be called into military service."<



"Barack Obama is a national security risk."
 

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Re: Obama’s new executive order will kill the 110-year-old Civilian Marksmanship Prog

The problem to him is people enjoying shooting sports-which is what the organization promotes you cannot get a gun from them unless you already can prove shooting experience (you have to both belong to a sanctioned gun club and you have to show PROOF of firearms activity) as well as pass a background check


this scumbag and his minions are doing everything possible to destroy the shooting sports
I'm nominally for gun control, but this ****s me because they're historical weapons, and the people who goes in for these sorts of guns aren't generally the people who like to shoot other people.
 

TurtleDude

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Re: Obama’s new executive order will kill the 110-year-old Civilian Marksmanship Prog

I'm nominally for gun control, but this ****s me because they're historical weapons, and the people who goes in for these sorts of guns aren't generally the people who like to shoot other people.
several million of these weapons were sold through the DCM and its successor the CMP and the number that have ended up in criminal cases is very slim. John Kennedy joined the NRA (it used to be a requirement) so he could buy one of these rifles many many years ago.
 

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Re: Obama’s new executive order will kill the 110-year-old Civilian Marksmanship Prog

Many CMP rifles end up in the hands of WWII recreators. A boy I used to coach got one (I sold it to his parents). He mainly used it for WWII recreations but he sometimes shot it at the range. What he learned shooting that rifle led to him winning 5 gold medals in another international shooting competition. the CMP promotes "Garand" matches where competitive shooters use WWII issued Garands. I shot Expert as a teenager at one of these Garand styled matches. back in those days, the DCM (then a government agency) would actually issue M2 surplus ammo to the DCM associated clubs for these matches.

Obama and his scumbag minions are trying to ruin an organization that promotes civilian marksmanship. THe idiotic claim that his disgusting schemes are keeping military grade weapons off the street should cause even his most fanatic slurpers to realize what a dishonest POS this president is

I note the one supporter of this stupidity ran off after regurgitating Obama swill
 

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Re: Obama’s new executive order will kill the 110-year-old Civilian Marksmanship Prog

Well the CMP was started back in 1903, back in the days of mass conscript armies where the Infantry was the predominate arm of the military. Massed infantry assaults with huge manpower requirements were the order of the day. It was to pre-train the inductees on basic marksmanship in order to turn out cannon fodder, not snipers.

I'd say the day of any need for a government sponsored marksmanship training of military aged youth in order to quickly gin up a massive infantry heavy military is far behind us. today far more soldiers are civilians who learned to salute rather than grunts, the actual number of shooters is quite low and not a strain on the military to produce.

I don't see why the NRA can't take over the civilian marksmanship program- it stopped being the CMP long ago. The NRA already sponsors a goodly number of matches and has range connections across the nation. Why can't the NRA import and oversee the distribution of Garands?

I would think most would want the government out of the way on civilian marksmanship- with all the 'gun-grabbing' talk that flows so freely.
 

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Re: Obama’s new executive order will kill the 110-year-old Civilian Marksmanship Prog

Well the CMP was started back in 1903, back in the days of mass conscript armies where the Infantry was the predominate arm of the military. Massed infantry assaults with huge manpower requirements were the order of the day. It was to pre-train the inductees on basic marksmanship in order to turn out cannon fodder, not snipers.

I'd say the day of any need for a government sponsored marksmanship training of military aged youth in order to quickly gin up a massive infantry heavy military is far behind us. today far more soldiers are civilians who learned to salute rather than grunts, the actual number of shooters is quite low and not a strain on the military to produce.

I don't see why the NRA can't take over the civilian marksmanship program- it stopped being the CMP long ago. The NRA already sponsors a goodly number of matches and has range connections across the nation. Why can't the NRA import and oversee the distribution of Garands?

I would think most would want the government out of the way on civilian marksmanship- with all the 'gun-grabbing' talk that flows so freely.
I have no clue what the purpose of that comment was. Due you think the clown in office is going to let a group that opposed his presidency twice import these guns our tax dollars paid for? It was Democrats who were upset that NRA membership was required at one time to get a DCM rifle
 

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Re: Obama’s new executive order will kill the 110-year-old Civilian Marksmanship Prog

I have no clue what the purpose of that comment was. Due you think the clown in office is going to let a group that opposed his presidency twice import these guns our tax dollars paid for? It was Democrats who were upset that NRA membership was required at one time to get a DCM rifle
I have to wonder just how many garands are left out there.

Now let us be clear on why the Government started the CMP- to expedite the creation of cannon fodder 'back in the day'. It is not to put military rifles into the hands of those who will never serve. The corporation- it is no longer the CMP- no longer is a matter of national security but a civilian leisure activity. Many rifles will require extensive and expensive rebuilds to be of any use in a match- far better for play acting than shooting. Again that does nothing for national security- just lets some never beens act all salty on the occasional weekend.

Since the last Garand was built in the 50's i'd say we taxpayers have long since gotten our money's worth out of them.

Now when it comes to the re-importation of old military firearms i don't recall any restriction on importing Garands. I do believe several private sector companies are doing just that- importing old mil-sup rifles. Since President Obama can't run a 3rd time what does he care if a few angry old men opposed him? The NRA is a very logical choice to take over civilian marksmanship programs- do believe that was the original intent of the NRA.

Fact is we won't know until the NRA tries what will happen... but they have to stand-up and try first.
 

TurtleDude

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Re: Obama’s new executive order will kill the 110-year-old Civilian Marksmanship Prog

I have to wonder just how many garands are left out there.

Now let us be clear on why the Government started the CMP- to expedite the creation of cannon fodder 'back in the day'. It is not to put military rifles into the hands of those who will never serve. The corporation- it is no longer the CMP- no longer is a matter of national security but a civilian leisure activity. Many rifles will require extensive and expensive rebuilds to be of any use in a match- far better for play acting than shooting. Again that does nothing for national security- just lets some never beens act all salty on the occasional weekend.

Since the last Garand was built in the 50's i'd say we taxpayers have long since gotten our money's worth out of them.

Now when it comes to the re-importation of old military firearms i don't recall any restriction on importing Garands. I do believe several private sector companies are doing just that- importing old mil-sup rifles. Since President Obama can't run a 3rd time what does he care if a few angry old men opposed him? The NRA is a very logical choice to take over civilian marksmanship programs- do believe that was the original intent of the NRA.

Fact is we won't know until the NRA tries what will happen... but they have to stand-up and try first.
that's a completely silly post.
 

TurtleDude

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Re: Obama’s new executive order will kill the 110-year-old Civilian Marksmanship Prog

Masterful debate skills... :roll:
I don't need a flamethrower to toast a post that was the force of a flea
 

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Re: Obama’s new executive order will kill the 110-year-old Civilian Marksmanship Prog

Obama

This man is a menace...
I'm sure he is doing what he thinks is best for the country.
 

notquiteright

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Re: Obama’s new executive order will kill the 110-year-old Civilian Marksmanship Prog

I don't need a flamethrower to toast a post that was the force of a flea
Laughing, save the tuff guy crap Turtle, a few facts would be nice, but then again this isn't a fact thread- it is a rant and rail thread... :2wave:
 

TurtleDude

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Re: Obama’s new executive order will kill the 110-year-old Civilian Marksmanship Prog

Laughing, save the tuff guy crap Turtle, a few facts would be nice, but then again this isn't a fact thread- it is a rant and rail thread... :2wave:
no what is is showing those who have constantly engaged in cyber-fellation of Obama and claimed that he wasn't anti gun, that they were either stupid, ignorant or just plain dishonest. there is no way to justify what the Oval Office clown in chief has done as being anything other than clearly bent on destroying shooting sports in this country

I guess its really tough for those who have their lips firmly on the posterior of this president and who also claim that they respect gun owners' rights in this nation.
 
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