NYT: U.S. Coronavirus Death Toll Is Far Higher Than Reported, C.D.C. Data Suggests

[Visbek]

U.S. Coronavirus Death Toll Is Far Higher Than Reported, C.D.C. Data Suggests - The New York Times

Total deaths in seven states that have been hard hit by the coronavirus pandemic are nearly 50 percent higher than normal for the five weeks from March 8 through April 11, according to new death statistics from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention. That is 9,000 more deaths than were reported as of April 11 in official counts of deaths from the coronavirus.

The new data is partial and most likely undercounts the recent death toll significantly. But it still illustrates how the coronavirus is causing a surge in deaths in the places it has struck, probably killing more people than the reported statistics capture. These increases belie arguments that the virus is only killing people who would have died anyway from other causes. Instead, the virus has brought a pattern of deaths unlike anything seen in recent years.

View attachment 67279284

This is a standard method for determining the impact of these types of events.

 

[Mycroft]

U.S. Coronavirus Death Toll Is Far Higher Than Reported, C.D.C. Data Suggests - The New York Times

Total deaths in seven states that have been hard hit by the coronavirus pandemic are nearly 50 percent higher than normal for the five weeks from March 8 through April 11, according to new death statistics from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention. That is 9,000 more deaths than were reported as of April 11 in official counts of deaths from the coronavirus.

The new data is partial and most likely undercounts the recent death toll significantly. But it still illustrates how the coronavirus is causing a surge in deaths in the places it has struck, probably killing more people than the reported statistics capture. These increases belie arguments that the virus is only killing people who would have died anyway from other causes. Instead, the virus has brought a pattern of deaths unlike anything seen in recent years.

View attachment 67279284

This is a standard method for determining the impact of these types of events.

I wish the CDC would make up their minds what actually constitutes a COVID-19 death.

 

[Metric Mouse]

Paywall; was this peer reviewed data published in an appropriate medical journal, or just unsubstantiated bunk like the studies that show the death rate of Covid 19 is far lower?

 

[Lutherf]

U.S. Coronavirus Death Toll Is Far Higher Than Reported, C.D.C. Data Suggests - The New York Times

Total deaths in seven states that have been hard hit by the coronavirus pandemic are nearly 50 percent higher than normal for the five weeks from March 8 through April 11, according to new death statistics from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention. That is 9,000 more deaths than were reported as of April 11 in official counts of deaths from the coronavirus.

The new data is partial and most likely undercounts the recent death toll significantly. But it still illustrates how the coronavirus is causing a surge in deaths in the places it has struck, probably killing more people than the reported statistics capture. These increases belie arguments that the virus is only killing people who would have died anyway from other causes. Instead, the virus has brought a pattern of deaths unlike anything seen in recent years.

View attachment 67279284

This is a standard method for determining the impact of these types of events.

Yeah. It's REALLY important to get as many deaths out of this thing as possible before the elections in November.

 

[CaughtInThe]

Yeah. It's REALLY important to get as many deaths out of this thing as possible before the elections in November.

or, you know, the actual number.

 

[Ikari]

Yeah. It's REALLY important to get as many deaths out of this thing as possible before the elections in November.

Not everything is political. It's important to have an accurate count to understand how virulent this virus actually is, to know the risks of reopening economies and businesses, and better diagnose those with it to aid in treatment etc..

But sure, let's just make it about politics. It seems that a certain group is determined to play off the response as a hoax instead of taking it seriously.

 

[Visbek]

Paywall; was this peer reviewed data published in an appropriate medical journal, or just unsubstantiated bunk like the studies that show the death rate of Covid 19 is far lower?

Sorry, NYT is not applying the paywall to some COVID-19 articles.

Non-paywall article:
How accurate is the US coronavirus death count? Some experts say it'''s off by '''tens of thousands''' - ABC News

CDC link:
Provisional Death Counts for Coronavirus Disease (COVID-19)

It's not a research paper, it is the CDC calculating excess mortality, just like it does with natural disasters and similar event

 

[Visbek]

Yeah. It's REALLY important to get as many deaths out of this thing as possible before the elections in November.

Meaning what, the CDC shouldn't release more accurate information, just like it does with other major events like this, because of... your electoral preferences?

 

[Metric Mouse]

Sorry, NYT is not applying the paywall to some COVID-19 articles.

Non-paywall article:
How accurate is the US coronavirus death count? Some experts say it'''s off by '''tens of thousands''' - ABC News

CDC link:
Provisional Death Counts for Coronavirus Disease (COVID-19)

It's not a research paper, it is the CDC calculating excess mortality, just like it does with natural disasters and similar event

Thank you!

 

[Lutherf]

Not everything is political. It's important to have an accurate count to understand how virulent this virus actually is, to know the risks of reopening economies and businesses, and better diagnose those with it to aid in treatment etc..

But sure, let's just make it about politics. It seems that a certain group is determined to play off the response as a hoax instead of taking it seriously.

The response is ABSOLUTELY political! What we are seeing here is government at all levels asserting authority over the citizenry and that is the very essence of politics. The current debate is with regard to how accepting people will be of those assertions of power and the people MUST question the statistics those who want the power are basing their authority on.

 

[Ikari]

The response is ABSOLUTELY political! What we are seeing here is government at all levels asserting authority over the citizenry and that is the very essence of politics. The current debate is with regard to how accepting people will be of those assertions of power and the people MUST question the statistics those who want the power are basing their authority on.

lol

So that means that accurate counting is even more important if "people MUST question the statistics". Though I'm not sure many people understand science or statistics. But whatever.

The response is global, so it's not quite "political". That's just an excuse Trumpeteers use to try to remove any responsibility for our lackluster response from Trump.

 

[Herkamer63]

I wish the CDC would make up their minds what actually constitutes a COVID-19 death.

In the end, no one really knows what the real numbers are because what they admitted was anyone with the Chinese Virus but dies from something else, they count it as if they did die from it. If I had to take a shot in the dark, whatever the numbers being reported now, they're more than likely 50-75% lower. I'm not trying to downplay how serious it can be to a certain group(s), but it's not this world ending virus that the media and government agencies love to hype up to be. If it's proven to be anything, it's more like on the same level as influenza than it is with Swine Flu. I could be wrong, but I can say that it wasn't worth shutting down the economy over (a Leftist would tell you otherwise).

 

[MrPeanut]

I don't think anyone should be surprised by this. It's hard to get accurate numbers in real time.

 

[TU Curmudgeon]

U.S. Coronavirus Death Toll Is Far Higher Than Reported, C.D.C. Data Suggests - The New York Times

Total deaths in seven states that have been hard hit by the coronavirus pandemic are nearly 50 percent higher than normal for the five weeks from March 8 through April 11, according to new death statistics from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention. That is 9,000 more deaths than were reported as of April 11 in official counts of deaths from the coronavirus.

The new data is partial and most likely undercounts the recent death toll significantly. But it still illustrates how the coronavirus is causing a surge in deaths in the places it has struck, probably killing more people than the reported statistics capture. These increases belie arguments that the virus is only killing people who would have died anyway from other causes. Instead, the virus has brought a pattern of deaths unlike anything seen in recent years.

View attachment 67279284

This is a standard method for determining the impact of these types of events.

Yes, the "Excess Death Count" data is starting to come on line and it does appear that the numbers are likely to be revised upwards.

Not only that, but if one looks at the "Excess Death" graph, it also looks like the beginning of the COVID-19 situation was actually in November 2019 and not January 2020.

 

[TU Curmudgeon]

In the end, no one really knows what the real numbers are because what they admitted was anyone with the Chinese Virus but dies from something else, they count it as if they did die from it. If I had to take a shot in the dark, whatever the numbers being reported now, they're more than likely 50-75% lower. I'm not trying to downplay how serious it can be to a certain group(s), but it's not this world ending virus that the media and government agencies love to hype up to be. If it's proven to be anything, it's more like on the same level as influenza than it is with Swine Flu. I could be wrong, but I can say that it wasn't worth shutting down the economy over (a Leftist would tell you otherwise).

QUICK SUMMARY OF Comparative COVID-19 (Total Deaths/Total Cases) Mortality Rates

20/04/15 – World (128,011/2,017,174) 6.35% / USA (26,064/* 614,246) 4.24% / Canada (* 903/27,063) 3.34%
20/04/16 – World (147,598/2,197,968) 6.72% / USA (34,641/* 678,210) 5.11% / Canada (1,195/30,106) 3.97%
20/04/17 – Still looking for this one – if you see it please let me know where – thanks.
20/04/18 – World (156,104/2,275,782) 6.86% / USA (37,154/* 709,735) 5.23% / Canada (1,310/31,927) 4.10%
20/04/19 – World (161,275/2,345,338) 6.88% / USA (39,015/* 738,923) 5.30% / Canada (1,470/33,383) 4.40%
20/04/20 – World (166,271/2,430,733) 6.84% / USA (40,743/* 767,189) 5.31% / Canada (1,587/35,056) 4.53%
20/04/21 – World (171,735/2,501,898) 6.86% / USA (42,518/* 792,938) 5.36% / Canada (1,690/36,831) 4.59%
20/04/22 – World (179,032/2,578,205) 6.94% / USA (45,343/* 819,175) 5.54% / Canada (1,834/38,422) 4.77%
20/04/23 – World (185,451/2,658,794) 6.98% / USA (47,684/* 849,092) 5.62% / Canada (1,974/40,190) 4.89%
20/04/24 – World (192,262/2,752,692) 6.98% / USA (50,283/* 887,622) 5.66% / Canada (2,147/42,110) 5.10%
20/04/25 – World (198,073/2,850,387) 6.95% / USA (52,217/* 925,758) 5.64% / Canada (2,302/43,888) 5.25%
20/04/26 – World (203,814/2,940,731) 6.93% / USA (54,265/* 960,893) 5.65% / Canada (2,465/45,354) 5.44%
20/04/27 – World (207,906/3,014,073) 6.90% / USA (55,415/* 987,322) 5.61% / Canada (2,560/46,895) 5.46%
20/04/28 – World (212,522/3,084,801) 6.89% / USA (56,803/1,010,507) 5.62% / Canada (2,707/48,500) 5.58%
20/04/29 – World (219,265/3,160,779) 6.94% / USA (59,266/1,035,765) 5.72% / Canada (2,859/50,026) 5.71%
​

More Americans have now died from COVID-19 than died due to​

-the Normandy Campaign (29,204),

influenza in an average year (~35,000),

the Korean War (36,516)-

the Vietnam War (58,209).

The next ”Grim Mortality Milestone” is the number of American deaths​

-in the Normandy Campaign (29,204),

from influenza in an average year (~35,000),

in the Korean War (36,516),

in the Vietnam War (58,209)-

in World War I (116,516).

 

[Herkamer63]

QUICK SUMMARY OF Comparative COVID-19 (Total Deaths/Total Cases) Mortality Rates

20/04/15 – World (128,011/2,017,174) 6.35% / USA (26,064/* 614,246) 4.24% / Canada (* 903/27,063) 3.34%
20/04/16 – World (147,598/2,197,968) 6.72% / USA (34,641/* 678,210) 5.11% / Canada (1,195/30,106) 3.97%
20/04/17 – Still looking for this one – if you see it please let me know where – thanks.
20/04/18 – World (156,104/2,275,782) 6.86% / USA (37,154/* 709,735) 5.23% / Canada (1,310/31,927) 4.10%
20/04/19 – World (161,275/2,345,338) 6.88% / USA (39,015/* 738,923) 5.30% / Canada (1,470/33,383) 4.40%
20/04/20 – World (166,271/2,430,733) 6.84% / USA (40,743/* 767,189) 5.31% / Canada (1,587/35,056) 4.53%
20/04/21 – World (171,735/2,501,898) 6.86% / USA (42,518/* 792,938) 5.36% / Canada (1,690/36,831) 4.59%
20/04/22 – World (179,032/2,578,205) 6.94% / USA (45,343/* 819,175) 5.54% / Canada (1,834/38,422) 4.77%
20/04/23 – World (185,451/2,658,794) 6.98% / USA (47,684/* 849,092) 5.62% / Canada (1,974/40,190) 4.89%
20/04/24 – World (192,262/2,752,692) 6.98% / USA (50,283/* 887,622) 5.66% / Canada (2,147/42,110) 5.10%
20/04/25 – World (198,073/2,850,387) 6.95% / USA (52,217/* 925,758) 5.64% / Canada (2,302/43,888) 5.25%
20/04/26 – World (203,814/2,940,731) 6.93% / USA (54,265/* 960,893) 5.65% / Canada (2,465/45,354) 5.44%
20/04/27 – World (207,906/3,014,073) 6.90% / USA (55,415/* 987,322) 5.61% / Canada (2,560/46,895) 5.46%
20/04/28 – World (212,522/3,084,801) 6.89% / USA (56,803/1,010,507) 5.62% / Canada (2,707/48,500) 5.58%
20/04/29 – World (219,265/3,160,779) 6.94% / USA (59,266/1,035,765) 5.72% / Canada (2,859/50,026) 5.71%
​

More Americans have now died from COVID-19 than died due to​

-the Normandy Campaign (29,204),

influenza in an average year (~35,000),

the Korean War (36,516)-

the Vietnam War (58,209).

The next ”Grim Mortality Milestone” is the number of American deaths​

-in the Normandy Campaign (29,204),

from influenza in an average year (~35,000),

in the Korean War (36,516),

in the Vietnam War (58,209)-

in World War I (116,516).

Oh, there you are, and ignoring the recent history again, I see, because we just need to turn our heads the other way after Dr Birx a few weeks ago admitted, two days in a row, they're counting deaths of people who contracted the Chinese Virus but didn't die as a result of the virus (but rather of something else unrelated) so numbers are inflated and making it seem worse than what it actually is... Good for you!
:mrgreen:

 

[Slavister]

In the end, no one really knows what the real numbers are because what they admitted was anyone with the Chinese Virus but dies from something else, they count it as if they did die from it. If I had to take a shot in the dark, whatever the numbers being reported now, they're more than likely 50-75% lower. I'm not trying to downplay how serious it can be to a certain group(s), but it's not this world ending virus that the media and government agencies love to hype up to be. If it's proven to be anything, it's more like on the same level as influenza than it is with Swine Flu. I could be wrong, but I can say that it wasn't worth shutting down the economy over (a Leftist would tell you otherwise).

Don't worry, someone dying from car crashes are not counted toward CV19 if they have CV19. Only cases where it's reasonable to assume CV19 was a real contributing factor are correctly counted as such by SOME places but most still don't even do that.

What's NOT counted are people who are not tested - and there is still plenty of those. Testing supplies are still short and dead people are still not a priority for testing. Plus CV19 deaths are more paperwork and have more scrutiny, so in many cases they are still under-reported.

If you read the OP, there is clear evidence that we are UNDER-counting deaths by a decent amount.

But I understand it's politically inconvenient for you.

As for shutting down economy... this is with UNDERcounted deaths

 

[Lutherf]

lol

So that means that accurate counting is even more important if "people MUST question the statistics". Though I'm not sure many people understand science or statistics. But whatever.

The response is global, so it's not quite "political". That's just an excuse Trumpeteers use to try to remove any responsibility for our lackluster response from Trump.

An accurate count is absolutely necessary. What we are looking at here is what criteria to use when adding someone to that count.

 

[apdst]

They have to get that body count as high as possible so the "experts" don't end up looking stupid.

 

[apdst]

QUICK SUMMARY OF Comparative COVID-19 (Total Deaths/Total Cases) Mortality Rates

20/04/15 – World (128,011/2,017,174) 6.35% / USA (26,064/* 614,246) 4.24% / Canada (* 903/27,063) 3.34%
20/04/16 – World (147,598/2,197,968) 6.72% / USA (34,641/* 678,210) 5.11% / Canada (1,195/30,106) 3.97%
20/04/17 – Still looking for this one – if you see it please let me know where – thanks.
20/04/18 – World (156,104/2,275,782) 6.86% / USA (37,154/* 709,735) 5.23% / Canada (1,310/31,927) 4.10%
20/04/19 – World (161,275/2,345,338) 6.88% / USA (39,015/* 738,923) 5.30% / Canada (1,470/33,383) 4.40%
20/04/20 – World (166,271/2,430,733) 6.84% / USA (40,743/* 767,189) 5.31% / Canada (1,587/35,056) 4.53%
20/04/21 – World (171,735/2,501,898) 6.86% / USA (42,518/* 792,938) 5.36% / Canada (1,690/36,831) 4.59%
20/04/22 – World (179,032/2,578,205) 6.94% / USA (45,343/* 819,175) 5.54% / Canada (1,834/38,422) 4.77%
20/04/23 – World (185,451/2,658,794) 6.98% / USA (47,684/* 849,092) 5.62% / Canada (1,974/40,190) 4.89%
20/04/24 – World (192,262/2,752,692) 6.98% / USA (50,283/* 887,622) 5.66% / Canada (2,147/42,110) 5.10%
20/04/25 – World (198,073/2,850,387) 6.95% / USA (52,217/* 925,758) 5.64% / Canada (2,302/43,888) 5.25%
20/04/26 – World (203,814/2,940,731) 6.93% / USA (54,265/* 960,893) 5.65% / Canada (2,465/45,354) 5.44%
20/04/27 – World (207,906/3,014,073) 6.90% / USA (55,415/* 987,322) 5.61% / Canada (2,560/46,895) 5.46%
20/04/28 – World (212,522/3,084,801) 6.89% / USA (56,803/1,010,507) 5.62% / Canada (2,707/48,500) 5.58%
20/04/29 – World (219,265/3,160,779) 6.94% / USA (59,266/1,035,765) 5.72% / Canada (2,859/50,026) 5.71%
​

More Americans have now died from COVID-19 than died due to​

-the Normandy Campaign (29,204),

influenza in an average year (~35,000),

the Korean War (36,516)-

the Vietnam War (58,209).

The next ”Grim Mortality Milestone” is the number of American deaths​

-in the Normandy Campaign (29,204),

from influenza in an average year (~35,000),

in the Korean War (36,516),

in the Vietnam War (58,209)-

in World War I (116,516).

Look how you left out the Civil War...lol

 

[Linc]

An accurate count is absolutely necessary. What we are looking at here is what criteria to use when adding someone to that count.

The Florida Governor has now stated what we already knew was happening with states run by gops. Florida will no longer report cases or deaths due to coronavirus. You’re on the team that owns this economy, owns the response to the virus, and has to defend the boi wonder kushner.

 

[Linc]

Look how you left out the Civil War...lol

Started by your state et al.

 

[Northern Light]

You know how screwed up your country is when politics even affect an accurate death count.

In some areas, doctors are putting a different cause of death on the death certificate, if the person died from a comorbid condition. For example, if you come in with hypertension and covid19, and you die from a heart attack, they will put heart failure as cause of death.

The problem continues to be that we have a non-uniform healthcare system. Regardless if you favor private or a universal health care system, a lot of our hospitals and regional health care authorities don't talk to one another. Innovations and approaches are not efficiently distributed. Look at how long it took us to get mobilized in the first place -- way too late. Other countries that have unified systems rolled out protocols very fast and that's why their death counts per capita remain much lower than ours.

The countries with UHC are doing the best. Look at Canada, right above us. They mobilized immediately nation wide and as a result most of their deaths have been in senior's care homes. The general public has been barely effected. It also helps that they have a culture of cooperating with the government. Most people self-isolated right away. In the U.S., we still have protesters who believe that covid19 is a conspiracy.

Of course the death toll is higher than stated. The protocols around cause of death determinations are not uniform. We don't have access to rapid testing in most areas. In NYC, hospitals are only testing people who show symptoms and are being admitted. Most others are being turned away and told to go home to self-isolate.

It's hard to gather proper statistics when the system is such a mess. It also doesn't help that we have a President who constantly downplays the seriousness of what's going on, and a jerk VP who does PR appearances in hospitals not wearing a mask because "I don't have covid19 so why would I wear one". Give your heads a shake.

 

[poweRob]

U.S. Coronavirus Death Toll Is Far Higher Than Reported, C.D.C. Data Suggests - The New York Times

Total deaths in seven states that have been hard hit by the coronavirus pandemic are nearly 50 percent higher than normal for the five weeks from March 8 through April 11, according to new death statistics from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention. That is 9,000 more deaths than were reported as of April 11 in official counts of deaths from the coronavirus.

The new data is partial and most likely undercounts the recent death toll significantly. But it still illustrates how the coronavirus is causing a surge in deaths in the places it has struck, probably killing more people than the reported statistics capture. These increases belie arguments that the virus is only killing people who would have died anyway from other causes. Instead, the virus has brought a pattern of deaths unlike anything seen in recent years.

View attachment 67279284

This is a standard method for determining the impact of these types of events.

I've been expecting the red states to lie and hide numbers. Seems I was right.

 

[apdst]

Started by your state et al.

And how is that relevant? Or, is it just a random triggering?