NYT: 430,000 People Have Traveled From China to U.S. Since Coronavirus Surfaced

[Visbek]

NYT article today: 430,000 People Have Traveled From China to U.S. Since Coronavirus Surfaced

Since Chinese officials disclosed the outbreak of a mysterious pneumonialike illness to international health officials on New Year’s Eve, at least 430,000 people have arrived in the United States on direct flights from China, including nearly 40,000 in the two months after President Trump imposed restrictions on such travel, according to an analysis of data collected in both countries.

The bulk of the passengers, who were of multiple nationalities, arrived in January, at airports in Los Angeles, San Francisco, New York, Chicago, Seattle, Newark and Detroit. Thousands of them flew directly from Wuhan, the center of the coronavirus outbreak, as American public health officials were only beginning to assess the risks to the United States.
(Emphasis added)

One reason these types of travel restrictions don't work is that they are just too late. When it comes to COVID-19 in particular, as much as 25% of people with the virus may be both contagious and non-symptomatic; meaning by the time the US started any restrictions, it was too late. Once the virus is in a country or state or city, attempts to lock down are just a waste of precious resources that you could use to, for example, track infected individuals.

Another is that the restrictions had more holes than Swiss cheese. Lots of people were allowed to travel to the US, without any enforcement on quarantine requests; some people started in China, went to another country, then to the US; there was basically no screening, either.

Maybe, just maybe, government officials ought to have been prepared, or at least talked to experts, before announcing policies like these. Or maybe, just maybe, "common sense" is dead wrong when it comes to critical aspects of a complex biological phenomenon like an epidemic.

Just a thought.

 

[TypicalRussian]

USA has enjoyed no hardship for the majority of people since the 30's, our preparedness for tough situations is weak

 

[Ahlevah]

Late or not, I'm sure Trump's restrictions saved lives, although the haters who called him a bigot for doing it will never give him credit for it.

 

[Hawkeye10]

NYT article today: 430,000 People Have Traveled From China to U.S. Since Coronavirus Surfaced

Since Chinese officials disclosed the outbreak of a mysterious pneumonialike illness to international health officials on New Year’s Eve, at least 430,000 people have arrived in the United States on direct flights from China, including nearly 40,000 in the two months after President Trump imposed restrictions on such travel, according to an analysis of data collected in both countries.

The bulk of the passengers, who were of multiple nationalities, arrived in January, at airports in Los Angeles, San Francisco, New York, Chicago, Seattle, Newark and Detroit. Thousands of them flew directly from Wuhan, the center of the coronavirus outbreak, as American public health officials were only beginning to assess the risks to the United States.
(Emphasis added)

One reason these types of travel restrictions don't work is that they are just too late. When it comes to COVID-19 in particular, as much as 25% of people with the virus may be both contagious and non-symptomatic; meaning by the time the US started any restrictions, it was too late. Once the virus is in a country or state or city, attempts to lock down are just a waste of precious resources that you could use to, for example, track infected individuals.

Another is that the restrictions had more holes than Swiss cheese. Lots of people were allowed to travel to the US, without any enforcement on quarantine requests; some people started in China, went to another country, then to the US; there was basically no screening, either.

Maybe, just maybe, government officials ought to have been prepared, or at least talked to experts, before announcing policies like these. Or maybe, just maybe, "common sense" is dead wrong when it comes to critical aspects of a complex biological phenomenon like an epidemic.

Just a thought.

The travel ban bought America a month or so to get our **** together.

We wasted the time, but it was still a good idea.

OBVIOUSLY

 

[swing_voter]

USA has enjoyed no hardship for the majority of people since the 30's, our preparedness for tough situations is weak

WWII was pretty bad.


If Trump would've shut down the borders at the first sign of the virus, people would be yelling at him about that.

 

[Ahlevah]

USA has enjoyed no hardship for the majority of people since the 30's, our preparedness for tough situations is weak

What he said about WWII. ^^

 

[trouble13]

NYT article today: 430,000 People Have Traveled From China to U.S. Since Coronavirus Surfaced

Since Chinese officials disclosed the outbreak of a mysterious pneumonialike illness to international health officials on New Year’s Eve, at least 430,000 people have arrived in the United States on direct flights from China, including nearly 40,000 in the two months after President Trump imposed restrictions on such travel, according to an analysis of data collected in both countries.

The bulk of the passengers, who were of multiple nationalities, arrived in January, at airports in Los Angeles, San Francisco, New York, Chicago, Seattle, Newark and Detroit. Thousands of them flew directly from Wuhan, the center of the coronavirus outbreak, as American public health officials were only beginning to assess the risks to the United States.
(Emphasis added)

One reason these types of travel restrictions don't work is that they are just too late. When it comes to COVID-19 in particular, as much as 25% of people with the virus may be both contagious and non-symptomatic; meaning by the time the US started any restrictions, it was too late. Once the virus is in a country or state or city, attempts to lock down are just a waste of precious resources that you could use to, for example, track infected individuals.

Another is that the restrictions had more holes than Swiss cheese. Lots of people were allowed to travel to the US, without any enforcement on quarantine requests; some people started in China, went to another country, then to the US; there was basically no screening, either.

Maybe, just maybe, government officials ought to have been prepared, or at least talked to experts, before announcing policies like these. Or maybe, just maybe, "common sense" is dead wrong when it comes to critical aspects of a complex biological phenomenon like an epidemic.

Just a thought.

By that logic we should not bother with social distancing because its already too late

Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk

 

[Drawdown]

Too bad he couldn't ban travel to and from New York

 

[Drawdown]

By that logic we should not bother with social distancing because its already too late

Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk

Are you mad? Watching the two old people across the road try to remember how to throw a Frisbee has been worth the damage done to our economy.

 

[Visbek]

By that logic we should not bother with social distancing because its already too late

:roll:

The purpose of a travel ban is to stop the virus from getting to an area. COVID-19 has a replication rate (R0) of around 3, i.e. an exponential growth rate where each infected person typically infects 3 other people. That means once it made it to the US undetected, it was already game over.

The purpose of social distancing is to slow the rate of the spread of the virus, thus prevent medical resources from getting overwhelmed. Social distancing should be practiced as early as possible, and maintained as long as necessary. Even when it's applied late in the game, it will still be beneficial. And stopping it too early will just start the exponential growth all over again.

We may be able to relax many restrictions once we have rapid and readily available tests. We're not there yet. We not only need the tests (which will be available fairly soon, hopefully), we also need the supplies, which are still in short supply.

Of course, there's a pretty good chance that China will be a major source of all sorts of medical supplies. Thus, banning transportation between the US and China might not be such a good idea....

 

[Visbek]

Too bad he couldn't ban travel to and from New York

That wouldn't help either. By the time it occurred to anyone to restrict NY residents from travel, it was too late.

 

[Lord Tammerlain]

Late or not, I'm sure Trump's restrictions saved lives, although the haters who called him a bigot for doing it will never give him credit for it.

They failed however to catch potentially infected US citizens. Which would then allow those people to infect others. His policies only delayed the severity of the outbreak rather than stop it.

China right now requires anyone coming onto China to be isolated for 14 days. That would help prevent new infections from outside the country from starting a new outbreak.

 

[Lord Tammerlain]

The travel ban bought America a month or so to get our **** together.

We wasted the time, but it was still a good idea.

OBVIOUSLY

A poorly implemented plan as it assumed Americans would not be among the infected. It slowed the outbreak but did prevent it

 

[Hawkeye10]

A poorly implemented plan as it assumed Americans would not be among the infected. It slowed the outbreak but did prevent it

Trump bought America a month to get our crap together.....That is a good thing.

It did not save us because we did not get our testing going.....which is not Trumps fault in the main....what happened here is that Trump trusted the experts, he trusted the bureaucracy, which was not up to the job.

You cant have it both ways....Trump is called wrong when he does not trust the systems and the experts in place, and he is called wrong when he does.....because according to the crap people Trump is always wrong....he must always be called out as wrong.....because Trump has to go and the ends justify the means with the dregs of humanity.

 

[Ahlevah]

They failed however to catch potentially infected US citizens. Which would then allow those people to infect others.

China right now requires anyone coming onto China to be isolated for 14 days. That would help prevent new infections from outside the country from starting a new outbreak.

That's not altogether true.

U.S. to Quarantine 195 Americans Evacuated from Wuhan - Scientific American

His policies only delayed the severity of the outbreak rather than stop it.

Like I said, his restrictions saved lives.

 

[Lord Tammerlain]

Trump bought America a month to get our crap together.....That is a good thing.

It did not save us because we did not get our testing going.....which is not Trumps fault in the main....what happened here is that Trump trusted the experts, he trusted the bureaucracy, which was not up to the job.

You cant have it both ways....Trump is called wrong when he does not trust the systems and the experts in place, and he is called wrong when he does.....because according to the crap people Trump is always wrong....he must always be called out as wrong.....because Trump has to go and the ends justify the means with the dregs of humanity.

When you value obedience over ability and skill the bureaucracy will value obedience over ability. If the president says it is not a threat, and their is no reason to worry, the bureaucracy will follow. They will not make the testing kits, they will not say in public things that will counter act the leader (they get fired if they do). Trump said it was not a problem and the bureaucracy listened.

Good leadership would have seen a much better response from the beginning. Testing kits were available early (SK had good ones), a good leader could have bought the kits, bought the rights to make some in the US, to allow for mass testing. A good leader would have requested building vast stockpiles of medical supplies early on. I am sure the president was warned early that this could be a huge issue for the US. A good leader would have mandated those infected are quarantined, and those who were exposed to the infected were quarantined as well. A good leader would have seen what some other countries were doing, to see what was working and what was not. He would copy those that were doing a good job, rather than those doing a poor job. Ie follow SK, not Italy. No one ever said Italy is an example of good governance. SK on the other hand from the 90's on has been an example of generally good governance (with some corruption thrown in but overall good)

 

[Lord Tammerlain]

That's not altogether true.

U.S. to Quarantine 195 Americans Evacuated from Wuhan - Scientific American



Like I said, his restrictions saved lives.

Perhaps not, potentially just delayed the deaths

 

[CaughtInThe]

USA has enjoyed no hardship for the majority of people since the 30's, our preparedness for tough situations is weak

yeah. it was a cake walk for minorities from the 30s - 60s.

 

[Hawkeye10]

When you value obedience over ability and skill the bureaucracy will value obedience over ability. If the president says it is not a threat, and their is no reason to worry, the bureaucracy will follow. They will not make the testing kits, they will not say in public things that will counter act the leader (they get fired if they do). Trump said it was not a problem and the bureaucracy listened.

Good leadership would have seen a much better response from the beginning. Testing kits were available early (SK had good ones), a good leader could have bought the kits, bought the rights to make some in the US, to allow for mass testing. A good leader would have requested building vast stockpiles of medical supplies early on. I am sure the president was warned early that this could be a huge issue for the US. A good leader would have mandated those infected are quarantined, and those who were exposed to the infected were quarantined as well. A good leader would have seen what some other countries were doing, to see what was working and what was not. He would copy those that were doing a good job, rather than those doing a poor job. Ie follow SK, not Italy. No one ever said Italy is an example of good governance. SK on the other hand from the 90's on has been an example of generally good governance (with some corruption thrown in but overall good)

The agreement had long been that local officials would lead in a pandemic, that Washington would support....You do know this right?

 

[CaughtInThe]

Are you mad? Watching the two old people across the road try to remember how to throw a Frisbee has been worth the damage done to our economy.

get off this message board and tweet Donald Trump and tell him to send the country back to work.

 

[trouble13]

:roll:

The purpose of a travel ban is to stop the virus from getting to an area. COVID-19 has a replication rate (R0) of around 3, i.e. an exponential growth rate where each infected person typically infects 3 other people. That means once it made it to the US undetected, it was already game over.

The purpose of social distancing is to slow the rate of the spread of the virus, thus prevent medical resources from getting overwhelmed. Social distancing should be practiced as early as possible, and maintained as long as necessary. Even when it's applied late in the game, it will still be beneficial. And stopping it too early will just start the exponential growth all over again.

We may be able to relax many restrictions once we have rapid and readily available tests. We're not there yet. We not only need the tests (which will be available fairly soon, hopefully), we also need the supplies, which are still in short supply.

Of course, there's a pretty good chance that China will be a major source of all sorts of medical supplies. Thus, banning transportation between the US and China might not be such a good idea....

Every argument you made for social distancing can be applied to travel bans as well.

Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk

 

[The AntiDonald]

Late or not, I'm sure Trump's restrictions saved lives, although the haters who called him a bigot for doing it will never give him credit for it.

Not nearly as many as we're losing due to the lack of leadership in the WH. The whole thing is disgusting.

 

[Visbek]

Every argument you made for social distancing can be applied to travel bans as well.

:roll:

Social distancing is like applying a tourniquet. Once you apply it, you can stanch the bleeding long enough to do something more substantial. The later you apply it, the worse it is for the patient. If you remove it too early, the bleeding will start up all over again.

Travel bans are like trying to block a blade... after it's already stabbed you in the forearm.

 

[The AntiDonald]

Trump bought America a month to get our crap together.....That is a good thing.

It did not save us because we did not get our testing going.....which is not Trumps fault in the main....what happened here is that Trump trusted the experts, he trusted the bureaucracy, which was not up to the job.

You cant have it both ways....Trump is called wrong when he does not trust the systems and the experts in place, and he is called wrong when he does.....because according to the crap people Trump is always wrong....he must always be called out as wrong.....because Trump has to go and the ends justify the means with the dregs of humanity.

The bureaucracy is appointed and supervised by Trump. Failure from the top.

 

[Hawkeye10]

The bureaucracy is appointed and supervised by Trump. Failure from the top.

The screen name and avatar you chose are both proof that you are not to be taken seriously by The Better People..