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..............NY man who says 4 kids vandalized home is charged

Rocketman

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ONLY IN A LIBERAL STATE!-Rocketman

CLYDE, N.Y. (AP) — A man who says he caught four boys vandalizing his father-in-law's home has been charged with child endangerment after corralling them in a closet until police arrived.

Jesse Daniels was arraigned on four counts of endangering the welfare of a child after authorities say he interrupted the vandalism at the empty home in the Wayne County village of Clyde, midway between Rochester and Syracuse.

Daniels, 53, told WHAM-TV in Rochester that he heard pounding coming from the home next door the night of June 8. The house is empty while Daniels renovates it for his father-in-law.

Daniels said he went to investigate while his wife called 911. He said he found four boys, ages 8 and 10, inside with hammers. He took a hammer from one, then stuck the boys in a closet until officers arrived, he said.

"I was fortunate that they were in that room that had a closet, so I put them in the closet," he said. "I said, 'Listen, you guys are staying here until the police come, period.'"

Their parents said Daniels handled the boys roughly and threatened them with the hammer.

The damage to the home included holes in the walls, broken windows and graffiti derogatory to women spray-painted on walls. Daniels estimated that the damage to his father-in-law's property exceeds $40,000.

He said he believed the boys committed the vandalism in retaliation for Daniels' wife telling them earlier in the day to stay off the couple's property.

The boys have been charged with burglary and criminal mischief. Their cases are being handled in Wayne County Family Court.

Paul Bowler, the father of two of the boys, told the station that there are no excuses for his sons' actions.

"I understand they were in the wrong, but there are other ways to handle it," he said. "He (Daniels) knew who the kids were. It's not like they were strangers. And send the kids home and call the cops then. You don't sit there and torment them and tell them you're going to bash their skulls in with a hammer."

Bowler said Daniels grabbed the neck of one of his sons and left a mark. He said that his boys are traumatized and that Daniels should have faced more charges.

Daniels counters that he was just trying to protect his family.

Daniels is due back in court later this month. It wasn't immediately clear if he has a lawyer.

Wayne County District Attorney Richard Healy told the station that the incident is still under investigation.

NY man who says 4 kids vandalized home is charged
 

MaggieD

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ONLY IN A LIBERAL STATE!-Rocketman

CLYDE, N.Y. (AP) — A man who says he caught four boys vandalizing his father-in-law's home has been charged with child endangerment after corralling them in a closet until police arrived.

Jesse Daniels was arraigned on four counts of endangering the welfare of a child after authorities say he interrupted the vandalism at the empty home in the Wayne County village of Clyde, midway between Rochester and Syracuse.

Daniels, 53, told WHAM-TV in Rochester that he heard pounding coming from the home next door the night of June 8. The house is empty while Daniels renovates it for his father-in-law.

Daniels said he went to investigate while his wife called 911. He said he found four boys, ages 8 and 10, inside with hammers. He took a hammer from one, then stuck the boys in a closet until officers arrived, he said.

"I was fortunate that they were in that room that had a closet, so I put them in the closet," he said. "I said, 'Listen, you guys are staying here until the police come, period.'"

Their parents said Daniels handled the boys roughly and threatened them with the hammer.

The damage to the home included holes in the walls, broken windows and graffiti derogatory to women spray-painted on walls. Daniels estimated that the damage to his father-in-law's property exceeds $40,000.

He said he believed the boys committed the vandalism in retaliation for Daniels' wife telling them earlier in the day to stay off the couple's property.

The boys have been charged with burglary and criminal mischief. Their cases are being handled in Wayne County Family Court.

Paul Bowler, the father of two of the boys, told the station that there are no excuses for his sons' actions.

"I understand they were in the wrong, but there are other ways to handle it," he said. "He (Daniels) knew who the kids were. It's not like they were strangers. And send the kids home and call the cops then. You don't sit there and torment them and tell them you're going to bash their skulls in with a hammer."

Bowler said Daniels grabbed the neck of one of his sons and left a mark. He said that his boys are traumatized and that Daniels should have faced more charges.

Daniels counters that he was just trying to protect his family.

Daniels is due back in court later this month. It wasn't immediately clear if he has a lawyer.

Wayne County District Attorney Richard Healy told the station that the incident is still under investigation.

NY man who says 4 kids vandalized home is charged

Did any of the boys receive hospital treatment? Visit a doctor? It's a bit tricky because these kids are minors. But in the real world I used to live in, they'd be in more trouble at home at the police station. Such, apparently, is not the case today. Sad indeed.
 

What if...?

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ONLY IN A LIBERAL STATE!-Rocketman

CLYDE, N.Y. (AP) — A man who says he caught four boys vandalizing his father-in-law's home has been charged with child endangerment after corralling them in a closet until police arrived.

Jesse Daniels was arraigned on four counts of endangering the welfare of a child after authorities say he interrupted the vandalism at the empty home in the Wayne County village of Clyde, midway between Rochester and Syracuse.

Daniels, 53, told WHAM-TV in Rochester that he heard pounding coming from the home next door the night of June 8. The house is empty while Daniels renovates it for his father-in-law.

Daniels said he went to investigate while his wife called 911. He said he found four boys, ages 8 and 10, inside with hammers. He took a hammer from one, then stuck the boys in a closet until officers arrived, he said.

"I was fortunate that they were in that room that had a closet, so I put them in the closet," he said. "I said, 'Listen, you guys are staying here until the police come, period.'"

Their parents said Daniels handled the boys roughly and threatened them with the hammer.

The damage to the home included holes in the walls, broken windows and graffiti derogatory to women spray-painted on walls. Daniels estimated that the damage to his father-in-law's property exceeds $40,000.

He said he believed the boys committed the vandalism in retaliation for Daniels' wife telling them earlier in the day to stay off the couple's property.

The boys have been charged with burglary and criminal mischief. Their cases are being handled in Wayne County Family Court.

Paul Bowler, the father of two of the boys, told the station that there are no excuses for his sons' actions.

"I understand they were in the wrong, but there are other ways to handle it," he said. "He (Daniels) knew who the kids were. It's not like they were strangers. And send the kids home and call the cops then. You don't sit there and torment them and tell them you're going to bash their skulls in with a hammer."

Bowler said Daniels grabbed the neck of one of his sons and left a mark. He said that his boys are traumatized and that Daniels should have faced more charges.

Daniels counters that he was just trying to protect his family.

Daniels is due back in court later this month. It wasn't immediately clear if he has a lawyer.

Wayne County District Attorney Richard Healy told the station that the incident is still under investigation.

NY man who says 4 kids vandalized home is charged

When I was a kid you could get a spanking from a neighbor.

And woe be unto you if you made a neighbor spank you.

This sends COMPLETELY the wrong message to the kids.

And what are the odds the little.bastards are lying through their teeth? I've seen kids pull the "touch me and go to jail card".
 

Deuce

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Did any of the boys receive hospital treatment? Visit a doctor? It's a bit tricky because these kids are minors. But in the real world I used to live in, they'd be in more trouble at home at the police station. Such, apparently, is not the case today. Sad indeed.

Sad that the police would let criminals slide "in your day," yes.
 

soccerboy22

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Did any of the boys receive hospital treatment? Visit a doctor? It's a bit tricky because these kids are minors. But in the real world I used to live in, they'd be in more trouble at home at the police station. Such, apparently, is not the case today. Sad indeed.

Oh the boys are in enough trouble where the parents concerns are probably towards legal fees right now. Felony burglary charges are no joke.
 

shlunka

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I'm sure those four kids will grow up into human beings of great benefit to society! The parents of the children should be facing charges for contributing to the delinquency of a minor, the home-owner should walk away scotch-free, and the children should face strong disciplinary actions from parents "who probably have no idea how to discipline a child."
 

What if...?

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Sad that the police would let criminals slide "in your day," yes.

I think she was referring to when people sorted things out without involving the state more.

There was a lot more discretion exercised by cops, too. Getting drug home with no report being filed, for instance.

Humans sorted a LOT of stuff out amongst themselves for tens of thousands of years before force monopolies.
 

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If Daniels really did sit outside the door telling the kids he would bash their skulls in with a hammer I could see it. Not that those kids don't deserve to be punished as well.
 

CalGun

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Not exactly. The father of one of the boys said he little child was traumatized. That is code word for "attorney needed." They don't care about the legal fees for juvenile court. These kids will get next to nothing for their crimes due to their age. They will however be suing the property owner and probably will end up with the house - the left reaps what it sows. Wake up America.


Oh the boys are in enough trouble where the parents concerns are probably towards legal fees right now. Felony burglary charges are no joke.
 

Rocketman

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In Texas the homeowner could have legally shot and killed the kids for their vandalism

here too, especially since one had a hammer
 

Eighty Deuce

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Not exactly. The father of one of the boys said he little child was traumatized. That is code word for "attorney needed." They don't care about the legal fees for juvenile court. These kids will get next to nothing for their crimes due to their age. They will however be suing the property owner and probably will end up with the house - the left reaps what it sows. Wake up America.

I hope that all four kids **** their pants !!! Charging the adult is the stuff of liberal stupidity !!
 

soccerboy22

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Not exactly. The father of one of the boys said he little child was traumatized. That is code word for "attorney needed." They don't care about the legal fees for juvenile court. These kids will get next to nothing for their crimes due to their age. They will however be suing the property owner and probably will end up with the house - the left reaps what it sows. Wake up America.

Being charged with a federal offense is still a serious deal. Besides the point, if the son-in-law, did in fact grab one of the boys by the neck and threaten to beat their skulls with a hammer then that is also a crime.
 

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Sad that the police would let criminals slide "in your day," yes.

Really? You honestly are calling this guy a criminal? He locked 4 little douchebags in closet til the cops showed up. There is no "child endangerment" here. These charges are utter BS.

Their parents reaction just what kind of upbrining these little a-holes have.
 

Eighty Deuce

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Being charged with a federal offense is still a serious deal. Besides the point, if the son-in-law, did in fact grab one of the boys by the neck and threaten to beat their skulls with a hammer then that is also a crime.

It should not be. Mild physical restraint of someone trespassing and vandalizing should be allowed. As should threats of force if the perps do not cooperate. To actually hit with a hammer would seem a crime, but that did not happen.
 

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It should not be. Mild physical restraint of someone trespassing and vandalizing should be allowed. As should threats of force if the perps do not cooperate. To actually hit with a hammer would seem a crime, but that did not happen.

Bet you would stretch it beyond the 'mild' if it was a case such as the Zimmerman/Martin case! Let me know and I'll know whether to take you seriously or not.
 

soccerboy22

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It should not be. Mild physical restraint of someone trespassing and vandalizing should be allowed. As should threats of force if the perps do not cooperate. To actually hit with a hammer would seem a crime, but that did not happen.

Grabbing someone by the neck is mild physical restraint?
 

CanadaJohn

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Here in Toronto we've had a few similar cases where "victims" have been charged with crimes against "perpetrators". I think the police do it as a disincentive for people who want to take policing into their own hands. Usually, in the cases here, juries have gotten things rights and it's likely that they will get it right in this case too. We don't have the out of control civil courts you do, so I'll bet the little dears' parents will be suing the home-owners for poor treatment.
 

digsbe

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Detaining kids who are vandalizing property until police arrive shouldn't be child endangerment.
 

Eighty Deuce

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Bet you would stretch it beyond the 'mild' if it was a case such as the Zimmerman/Martin case! Let me know and I'll know whether to take you seriously or not.

Are you truly ignorant to such as Stand Your Ground (SYG) law, and such as the Castle Doctrine, or just being silly ? Do you realize that such as the Castel Doctrine makes it OK for you to shoot intruders WITHOUT them assaulting you to where you are in imminent peril of serious injury ? meanwhile, the Zimmerman-Martin case is one of pure self-defense (alleged). Here in FL, the self-defense statute was incorporated into the SYG statute. But its still simple self-defense, where the SYG concept is a bit more complicated.

Grabbing someone by the neck is mild physical restraint?

Was anyone choked ? Do you know WTF you are talking about ?

As I addressed a bit in the above reply to the uninformed one, we do have laws which allow deadly force in non-deadly situations. So while shooting someone is typically assumed to be a crime, we know that the law allows for situations where it is not. When I said that mild restraint should be allowed, it is in the direct spirit of the Castle Doctrine, where exceptions are made because the presumption is that the perp is already guilty of fomenting a threat upon you, your family, or your property.

These kids were apprehended inside a house, trespassing, and in the act of vandalizing. Is that in doubt ?
 

soccerboy22

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Are you truly ignorant to such as Stand Your Ground (SYG) law, and such as the Castle Doctrine, or just being silly ? Do you realize that such as the Castel Doctrine makes it OK for you to shoot intruders WITHOUT them assaulting you to where you are in imminent peril of serious injury ? meanwhile, the Zimmerman-Martin case is one of pure self-defense (alleged). Here in FL, the self-defense statute was incorporated into the SYG statute. But its still simple self-defense, where the SYG concept is a bit more complicated.



Was anyone choked ? Do you know WTF you are talking about ?

As I addressed a bit in the above reply to the uninformed one, we do have laws which allow deadly force in non-deadly situations. So while shooting someone is typically assumed to be a crime, we know that the law allows for situations where it is not. When I said that mild restraint should be allowed, it is in the direct spirit of the Castle Doctrine, where exceptions are made because the presumption is that the perp is already guilty of fomenting a threat upon you, your family, or your property.

These kids were apprehended inside a house, trespassing, and in the act of vandalizing. Is that in doubt ?

What the kids did are not in doubt. However, this is a defense of property issue, not self-defense since the damage was being done to the house, not the person. Therefore, in NY deadly force is not allowed in those circumstances, as stated in NY Penal law,
Any person may use physical force upon another person when he or
she reasonably believes such to be necessary to prevent or terminate
what he or she reasonably believes to be the commission or attempted
commission by such other person of a crime involving damage to premises.
Such person may use any degree of physical force, other than deadly
physical force, which he or she reasonably believes to be necessary for
such purpose, and may use deadly physical force if he or she reasonably
believes such to be necessary to prevent or terminate the commission or
attempted commission of arson.

So, if grabbing the neck was seen to be deadly force, then the defense of property will not work. And FYI I do not consider a grown man grabbing a 10 year old by the neck, if true, to be mild physical restraint.
 

AliHajiSheik

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Perhaps he didn't have any duct tape to hog tie them with. Closets are scary.
 

What if...?

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What the kids did are not in doubt. However, this is a defense of property issue, not self-defense since the damage was being done to the house, not the person. Therefore, in NY deadly force is not allowed in those circumstances, as stated in NY Penal law,

So, if grabbing the neck was seen to be deadly force, then the defense of property will not work. And FYI I do not consider a grown man grabbing a 10 year old by the neck, if true, to be mild physical restraint.

Did he grab the kid by the throat or on the shoulder or back of the neck?

Was it in the process of disarming the kid with the hammer?

Did the kid brandish the hammer, safe in the knowledge that adults can't touch him?

I can think of scenarios where the guy could be out of line, even enough to rise to the criminal.

I can imagine far more where little bastards parents are covering for their little ****s and trying to avoid footing the bill for the brats escapades.
 
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