North Korea Nuclear Test Suspected After 'Artificial' Quake

The Norks have likely set off another nuke test, after a large artificial quake was detected near their nuclear testing site Punggye-ri, which experts said was caused by a large explosion of some type:

North Korea nuclear test suspected after 'artificial' quake - BBC News

I see China's hand behind this. As soon as the THAAD system was deployed in South Korea, the Chinese started hollering, and the NorthKoreans started increasingly acting up, with a recent sub-launched ballistic missile test.

I bet they just tested a miniaturized warhead that could fit on such a missile.

sanman said:

I see China's hand behind this..

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I'm not sure I can agree with that assessment.

Whatever Chinas feelings may be on THAAD, they still understand the devastating threat to stability a fully nuclear armed North Korea presents and they are as fed up with their antics as anyone is.

This is a game of chess and a decent bargaining chip.

China actually takes stronger actions against North Korea and applies appropriate pressure to stop DPRK from continuing this nonsense and perhaps removing THAAD from the Peninsula is open to negotiation.

sanman said:

The Norks have likely set off another nuke test, after a large artificial quake was detected near their nuclear testing site Punggye-ri, which experts said was caused by a large explosion of some type:

North Korea nuclear test suspected after 'artificial' quake - BBC News

I see China's hand behind this. As soon as the THAAD system was deployed in South Korea, the Chinese started hollering, and the NorthKoreans started increasingly acting up, with a recent sub-launched ballistic missile test.

I bet they just tested a miniaturized warhead that could fit on such a missile.

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Eh. My bet is China is as pissed off as we are - for a variety of reasons, not least of which is that this helps make the likelihood that SKorea ever agrees to give up the THAAD (or a follow-on upgrade) slightly less than "zilch".



Li'l Kim has been far more aggressive than his father or grandfather when it comes to both Nukes and Missile tests. At least he's not a narcissist trapped in a psychotic land of personality-cult reinforcement, otherwise, the potential would be there for him to do something really stupid.

Jetboogieman said:

I'm not sure I can agree with that assessment.

Whatever Chinas feelings may be on THAAD, they still understand the devastating threat to stability a fully nuclear armed North Korea presents and they are as fed up with their antics as anyone is.

This is a game of chess and a decent bargaining chip.

China actually takes stronger actions against North Korea and applies appropriate pressure to stop DPRK from continuing this nonsense and perhaps removing THAAD from the Peninsula is open to negotiation.

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China's been putting pressure on North Korea (in public, no less) for years, yet nuclear development accelerated, and missile tests increased. KJU appears not to care what the Chinese do, so long as they do not threaten his control of the North Korean government.

cpwill said:

China's been putting pressure on South Korea (in public, no less) for years, yet nuclear development accelerated, and missile tests increased. KJU appears not to care what the Chinese do, so long as they do not threaten his control of the North Korean government.

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I believe you meant North Korea, but lets be frank here, as far as the Chinese pressure is concerned, allowing foreign currency to funnel through Macau, sneaking the luxury items KJU and his elite enjoy and the alleged lax enforcement of sanctions on their part, the pressure hasn't been as much as it could have been.

If China doesn't want THAAD on the peninsula they better play ball and produce results, otherwise it's justified in being there and they'd eventually put up or shut up.

Jetboogieman said:

I'm not sure I can agree with that assessment.

Whatever Chinas feelings may be on THAAD, they still understand the devastating threat to stability a fully nuclear armed North Korea presents and they are as fed up with their antics as anyone is.

This is a game of chess and a decent bargaining chip.

China actually takes stronger actions against North Korea and applies appropriate pressure to stop DPRK from continuing this nonsense and perhaps removing THAAD from the Peninsula is open to negotiation.

Click to expand...

It's China which set up the North Koreans in the nuclear blackmail game, and they did this so that they could play the game of GoodCop-BadCop. When China wants to apply pressure on the US, they get their North Korean flunkies to act up, and then when US and its allies want BadCop NorthKorea to back off, then they have to plead with GoodCop China, who gets to look like a friendly sympathetic sweetheart. (Your comments only prove how well the game works.)

In my opinion, China has cultivated North Korea and Pakistan as its twin fists (or twin attack-dogs) to offset China's regional rivals Japan and India. China helped set up both North Korea and Pakistan with their respective shares of WMD technologies, to keep Japan and India on the back foot. Then subsequently, North Korea and Pakistan clandestinely trade in their respective technologies with each other - one hand washes the other - and that allows China to stay out of that loop and serenely claim its hands are clean.

NorthKorea's ahead on missile tech, which it clandestinely proliferates to Pakistan - things like the sub-launched ballistic missile the Norks recently tested, which will no doubt soon make an appearance in Pakistan's naval arsenal. Meanwhile Pakistan's ahead in nuclear-weapons tech, and it proliferates that back to NorthKorea in return. For instance, Pakistan claims to have recently miniaturized its nuclear warheads and fitted them onto its Hatf and Ghauri missiles - that's exactly what the Norks might be testing now in this latest nuclear explosion, in the hopes of fitting it onto their new sub-launched missile.

Jetboogieman said:

I believe you meant North Korea

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Let that be a lesson : Never Twitter While Posting, Kids.

but lets be frank here, as far as the Chinese pressure is concerned, allowing foreign currency to funnel through Macau, sneaking the luxury items KJU and his elite enjoy and the alleged lax enforcement of sanctions on their part, the pressure hasn't been as much as it could have been.

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It hasn't. :shrug: They could, for example, invade.

They have, however, already been putting diplomatic pressure on North Korea for years, to no effect. Li'l Kim see's the world differently than ole Dad, and see's himself as much less restrained. Good Times.

If China doesn't want THAAD on the peninsula they better play ball and produce results, otherwise it's justified in being there and they'd eventually put up or shut up.

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It's already justified in putting it up there. If Canada was A) Insane and B) Nuclear, we'd have such a system every 1,000 meters along the northern border.

cpwill said:

Let that be a lesson : Never Twitter While Posting, Kids.

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Didn't take you for a Tweeter cp.

It hasn't. :shrug: They could, for example, invade.

They have, however, already been putting diplomatic pressure on North Korea for years, to no effect. Li'l Kim see's the world differently than ole Dad, and see's himself as much less restrained. Good Times.

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Adequate economic pressure is needed here and that's something China has never truly applied and I can understand it from their perspective, because that is the one thing that could potentially annihilate the regime, the regime has found clever ways of accruing foreign currency, most notably in recent years using huge amounts of slave labor in foreign countries, largely China and Russia.

Foreign Currency is something it desperately needs to maintain it's gift economy and keep it's elite citizens content (even for a country like NK, their stick, and it is a horrific one can only get them so far).

But for the Chinese, many of the potentially crippling moves they could inflict on DPRK could have major blowback, they're on a highwire doing quite the juggling act on this one.

It's already justified in putting it up there. If Canada was A) Insane and B) Nuclear, we'd have such a system every 1,000 meters along the northern border.

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Good point, we've just got geese so we're good right?

I don't think any of them are nuclear.

But perhaps I'm living in a fantasy world that DPRK would at this point in the game end it's nuclear program and it's missile development... But that essentially means that war is inevitable does it not?

I've believed that for some time though.

Jetboogieman said:

Didn't take you for a Tweeter cp.

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:shrug: social media delivers speed, for all the noise.

Adequate economic pressure is needed here and that's something China has never truly applied and I can understand it from their perspective, because that is the one thing that could potentially annihilate the regime, the regime has found clever ways of accruing foreign currency, most notably in recent years using huge amounts of slave labor in foreign countries, largely China and Russia.

Foreign Currency is something it desperately needs to maintain it's gift economy and keep it's elite citizens content (even for a country like NK, their stick, and it is a horrific one can only get them so far).

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You are right that China is in a no-win situation there - the priority for the CCP is "no legions of North Koreans streaming across the border", and a partial economic collapse could achieve that, especially if enabled by the Kim regime.

But for the Chinese, many of the potentially crippling moves they could inflict on DPRK could have major blowback, they're on a highwire doing quite the juggling act on this one.

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I'd feel sorry for them..... except they are hyper-nationalist bastards who helped create this situation, are militarizing the South China Sea, and attacking US information systems at the cyclic rate.

So instead I think I'm going to wholeheartedly support giving THAAD to South Korea, putting it in Okinawa, advocating for strengthening a mutual-support network between Japan-Philippines-Indonesia-Vietnam-India, at eating this here big bowl of popcorn while they have heartburn

Good point, we've just got geese so we're good right?

I don't think any of them are nuclear.

But perhaps I'm living in a fantasy world that DPRK would at this point in the game end it's nuclear program and it's missile development... But that essentially means that war is inevitable does it not?

I've believed that for some time though.

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There are other scenarios. I spent two years of my life practicing to play against the North Koreans.

Unfortunately, assessing which scenario is most likely is.... a very, very, low-confidence game. The only thing I could really tell you for certain is A) Kim values his high-profile strategic systems and B) everything else in North Korea probably pretty much sucks.

I can see it now, there will be a meeting of the UN Security Council on Monday on they'll vote to impose penalties on Pyongyang. By Wednesday there will be a strongly worded letter drafted up followed by a few revisions on Thursday and a 3 day delay. A week from Monday they'll send Kim an apology for acting so hastily and a nice fruit cake.

Lutherf said:

I can see it now, there will be a meeting of the UN Security Council on Monday on they'll vote to impose penalties on Pyongyang. By Wednesday there will be a strongly worded letter drafted up followed by a few revisions on Thursday and a 3 day delay. A week from Monday they'll send Kim an apology for acting so hastily and a nice fruit cake.

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This one has caught them off guard.

sanman said:

NorthKorea's ahead on missile tech, which it clandestinely proliferates to Pakistan - things like the sub-launched ballistic missile the Norks recently tested, which will no doubt soon make an appearance in Pakistan's naval arsenal. Meanwhile Pakistan's ahead in nuclear-weapons tech, and it proliferates that back to NorthKorea in return. For instance, Pakistan claims to have recently miniaturized its nuclear warheads and fitted them onto its Hatf and Ghauri missiles - that's exactly what the Norks might be testing now in this latest nuclear explosion, in the hopes of fitting it onto their new sub-launched missile.

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Aha - what did I tell you - the Norks were testing a new nuclear warhead which can be fitted onto a missile - gee, I wonder where they magically came up with that from? :roll:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/worl...32c01d-6921-4fe3-8f68-c611dc59f5a9_story.html

They got that from Pakistan, in exchange for giving them the sub-launched missile tech, since Pakistan is eager to develop a submarine-launched portion of a nuclear triad. And the US continues to finance Pakistan, whose proliferation has made this latest NoKo nuke-test possible. Crazy.

sanman said:

Aha - what did I tell you - the Norks were testing a new nuclear warhead which can be fitted onto a missile - gee, I wonder where they magically came up with that from? :roll:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/worl...32c01d-6921-4fe3-8f68-c611dc59f5a9_story.html

They got that from Pakistan, in exchange for giving them the sub-launched missile tech, since Pakistan is eager to develop a submarine-launched portion of a nuclear triad. And the US continues to finance Pakistan, whose proliferation has made this latest NoKo nuke-test possible. Crazy.

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"1:30 p.m. Pakistan has condemned the nuclear test carried out by North Korea and called on it to comply with U.N. Security Council resolutions against its nuclear program." https://www.mail.com/news/world/4593250-latest-pakistan-condemns-north-korean-nuclear-test.html

TheDemSocialist said:

"1:30 p.m. Pakistan has condemned the nuclear test carried out by North Korea and called on it to comply with U.N. Security Council resolutions against its nuclear program." https://www.mail.com/news/world/4593250-latest-pakistan-condemns-north-korean-nuclear-test.html

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China appears pissed, but it remains more important to them to oppose THAAD and provide us with incentives to consider negotiating about it. So they won't do anything but grumble a bit. NK will therefore continue to do as it pleases.


The thing that would scare NK the most is a loss of Chinese support for that broken country. They've never lasted more than about a day on their own....

Mr Person said:

China appears pissed, but it remains more important to them to oppose THAAD and provide us with incentives to consider negotiating about it. So they won't do anything but grumble a bit. NK will therefore continue to do as it pleases.


The thing that would scare NK the most is a loss of Chinese support for that broken country. They've never lasted more than about a day on their own....

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Maybe China will someday decide to topple NK from within. Bring it down, put a new, less freakish puppet in, and then turn it into what China is now. It would still serve the same purpose (a buffer state), but be much less of a headache. And could it be more of a drain to support than it is now?

Reunification would always remain a no-go, but at this point China has to wonder how much longer it can control NK as much as it wants to.