Kandahar said:That's ridiculous. We overthrew the Taliban regime in a few days time, and we toppled Saddam's regime in about five weeks. Even if Iran's military strength is a LITTLE bit more than those, it's not THAT much more.
You're comparing apples to oranges. Insurgencies are harder to deal with by their very nature, because you can be attacked at any time. Fighting against the military of another government is much easier, and is what American troops are generally trained to do.
That's not to say that the Iraq insurgency wouldn't spread to Iran, because it almost certainly would. But claiming that an irrational third-world government with no international backing can defeat the American military is absolutely crazy.
Why would they be more likely to pursue WMDs if they saw what happened when Iran pursued WMDs?
That proves my point. North Korea had WMDs and it was not attacked. Iraq did not have WMDs and it was attacked. Iran therefore concluded that they wouldn't be attacked if they obtained WMDs. We need to show them, and other would-be rogue states, that pursuing WMDs will have consequences.
What is with your obsession with the draft? NO ONE wants a draft, not the American people, not the politicians, not the soldiers, not the military leaders. It's not even DESIRABLE from a military perspective.
More nonsense. Israel and the US are liberal democracies that are routinely held accountable for their actions, not fundamentalist theocracies led by people who believe it is their duty to bring about the apocalypse. Who says we don't have any right to tell them they can't have nukes, just because we do? Do you really think that Iran would abandon its nuclear program if the US and Israel abandoned theirs? You're an ideologue.
TimmyBoy said:Kandahar, you live in a fantasy land man. You are applying double standards and you talk about the US and Israel as the perfect saint countries.
TimmyBoy said:That's not true and accountability doesn't always happen in the US or Israel. You remind me of these people that say they hate us because we are so great and perfect. I hate to break the news to you, but the US is not perfect nor saintly
TimmyBoy said:and I also hate to break reality to you, that the all volunteer US military can only do so much and that US power does have it's limits.
TimmyBoy said:You can't win a war simply because you have better technology or a professional army,
TimmyBoy said:sometimes the enemy has the advantage of having the moral high ground and that goes a long way, because they will be fighting from their hearts and the heart is a very tough thing to beat even for a well built up professional army.
TimmyBoy said:Your views and approach to dealing with Iran will only bring more problems, stability and likely a US defeat.
TimmyBoy said:The US would likely get bogged down in a guerrilla war like it is currently in Iraq
TimmyBoy said:and eventually, the US military will get grinded down and will have to leave Iran while on the same token creating an environment which strengthens terrorism and the possibility of nuclear war.
TimmyBoy said:By going into Iraq, the US has strengthened the very terrorists that attacked the US on September 11. Countless CIA and intelligence reports state this time and again. Not to mention, going into Iraq has also made the world a less safer place as other nations scramble to spend more money on their militaries and to develop nuclear weapons to defend themselves from a possible US first strike.
TimmyBoy said:going into Iraq has also made the world a less safer place as other nations scramble to spend more money on their militaries and to develop nuclear weapons to defend themselves from a possible US first strike.
I'll sit back and watch US forces get kicked out of Iran and defeated, because that is exactly what will happen
aquapub said:Like their president has repeatedly indicated, they want to wipe Israel off the map. THAT is why they want nukes. That and the fact that the world will have to take their radical regime more seriously once they have nukes.
oldreliable67 said:In sum, if necessary, the US military could prevail in Iran. It is not something that we would want to do, and it would be considerably more difficult in many ways than Iraq. But make no mistake, it is still eminently do-able. Would there be a follow-on guerilla war? No doubt. Would the Iranian population be against us from the outset in a significantly greater degree than were the Iraqis? Highly likely. Would it be enough to keep us from doing what needs to be done? Absolutely not.
Garza said:Iran has the 8th largest army in the world, one of the world's finest may I add. This is no Iraq, it might even be worse than Vietnam.
Garza said:Look at Pakistan, a radical Islamic country. No-one is demanding nukes from them.
oldreliable67 said:Certainly grant you that Iran today is no comparison with Iraq today. But in '91, Saddam had the which largest army, and it was thought to be battle-hardened after years of conflict with Iran?
In what ways do you think Iran would be 'worse than Vietnam'?
GarzaUK said:I said "maybe" worse.
Iraq was easy as we know where to hit and how to hit it. Flat desert is easy to combat against, even to combat against guerilla warfare. The US has been in Iraq since March 2003, (I mean this in the deepest respects) only just over 2000 have lost their lives.
This is Iran's terrian from CIA factbook: rugged, mountainous rim; high, central basin with deserts, mountains; small, discontinuous plains along both coasts. Tehran itself is thousands of feet above sea level.
Spain has the same terrain and even though Napoleans France conquered them, they managed to "bleed the French white" through a series of guerrila skirmishes.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iranian_Army
Iran's army includes 350,000 active-duty soldiers and 220,000 conscripts.
Iran can also call on substatial numbers of reservists as most males must carry out a full two year millitary service at some point in their lives. It is generally acknowledged that the conscript element of the army is not trained nearly as well as the professional active duty army.
Those substatial numbers of reservists would be a million strong - maybe more. All they need is battle expereince and my dad says its comes quickly.
http://www.odci.gov/cia/publications/factbook/geos/ir.html#Military
Manpower available for military service:
males age 18-49: 18,319,545 (2005 est.)
It might be worse than Vietnam, as unlike the Vietcong who dealt with dense jungle the Iranians would be easily be able to spot an army approaching on a windy hilltop road.
TimmyBoy said:Iran is one place I wouldn't want to fight. Like I said before, the best thing the West can do is pursue nuclear deturrence, and I do believe Iran can be deturred and negotiations to prevent them from getting nuclear weapons and if they do get them to try and get them to keep their numbers down or maybe get rid of them.
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