New Texas ‘fetal heartbeat’ bill would outlaw nearly all abortions

[Moot]

Show me where we are given the choice to take a life, without its say.

Without it's say? ZEFs can't say because ZEFs don't have thoughts.

Evolution was kind to us and gave us the chance to become something more than the simple, self destructive animals of today. When humanity learns to get past this, we can truly reach the highest point of human evolution.

The flaw in your arguement is that animals today aren't self destructive. Unless of course, by "animals of today" you meant humans.

 

[choiceone]

Sadly most likely due to Roe V Wade. What they should do is regulate it to hell so that an abortion is so expensive that no one can afford one. Indirectly ban it until we can correct our ethical atrocities.

Here in New York, Canada is pretty much only a 2 1/2 hour drive away from the furthest points from the border. If people in this state can drive to PA or NJ or OH for cigarettes to avoid the extreme NY tobacco tax (though the Indian reservations are closer), then they can drive to Canada or even take a bus there to get abortions, which are probably cheaper there than here even for for US visitors.

 

[choiceone]

This fight will never be close to over without a Constitutional Amendment one way or the other, and even then it will be fought out in legislatures and not courts where it should be decided to begin with.

I'd bet money that there will not be a Constitutional Amendment on abortion, at least, not for many decades and maybe a century or more. There isn't quite that much stupidity in the US.

 

[choiceone]

If you're going to make up lies, don't make up easily refuted ones.

Not every black man or woman in the U.S. at the time of the founding was a slave... but the slaves sure as hell weren't persons.


You can't be "considered a person" and be owned property. That's ridiculous. Persons have a recognized and protected right to liberty.

This is exactly what slavery abolitionists fought against: restrictive personhood, dehumanization, the consideration of human beings to be mere property.

Slaves may have been counted as three-fifths of a person each in the early US Census counts, but they were counted - and no fetus was ever counted, not even at 8 1/2 months. The law enumerated who was to be counted, and in the law, there was a category of "free persons" and a category of "slaves." But the very fact of the first category, where person is adjectivally modified by "free," implies that there were also "unfree persons," and that's a pretty good definition of "slaves" who are counted as persons in a Census.

 

[choiceone]

Show me where we are given the choice to take a life, without its say. We are more than nature, Evolution was kind to us and gave us the chance to become something more than the simple, self destructive animals of today. When humanity learns to get past this, we can truly reach the highest point of human evolution.

Abortion is not the taking of a life. In pregnancy, the embryo receives life from the woman's body, and if she refuses to give life to it, she is not taking its life but refusing to give any of her own. Abortion is the biological disconnection of the embryo from the woman.

 

[iguanaman]

Show me where we are given the choice to take a life, without its say. We are more than nature, Evolution was kind to us and gave us the chance to become something more than the simple, self destructive animals of today. When humanity learns to get past this, we can truly reach the highest point of human evolution.

Denying the human connection with the natural world does not make us better. It makes us primitive fools.

 

[JayDubya]

Slaves may have been counted as three-fifths of a person each in the early US Census counts, but they were counted

It's really special for you to count the South's means of gaining more political power at the expense of its slaves as an indication that the slaves mattered more than the social undesirables you don't like.

"3/5th of an actual person for purposes of representation in Congress" in your mind equals a "person."

In that case, I wish you were "3/5th of an actual person for purposes of representation in Congress," since you apparently don't think there's any difference.

 

[GEIxBattleRifle]

Show me where we are given the choice to take a life.

If we were to remove the artificial barrier some like to put us between non human animals we take lives without their permission also just like we do with the unborn.

And the rest of your comment doesn't need to be addressed either

 

[Lukas105]

We have risen from the prey to the absolute master of Earth. With just how technology went, we are something more than what the natural world originally wanted us to be.

I also found this out now. Abortion Thread = **** Storm

Denying the human connection with the natural world does not make us better. It makes us primitive fools.

 

[davidtaylorjr]

New Texas ‘fetal heartbeat’ bill would outlaw nearly all abortions | The Raw Story

Oh, heck. Just ban them all

---

Just hours after Texas Governor Rick Perry signed a controversial anti-abortion bill into law, Republicans in the state legislature introduced yet another bill intended to prevent a woman from obtaining an abortion.


The new legislation would ban most abortions after a fetal heartbeat is detected, which can be as early as six weeks into pregnancy.


“A person may not knowingly perform or induce or attempt to perform or induce an abortion on a pregnant woman with the specific intent of causing or abetting the termination of the life of the unborn child if it has been determined, in accordance with Section 171.103, that the unborn child has a detectable heartbeat,” the bill states.


The bill was introduced to the Texas House by state Rep. Phil King (R-Weatherford). King was a co-author of the bill signed into law on Thursday, which could close down all but five abortion clinics in the state.

---

I'm serious. They want to outlaw it, why don't they just outlaw it.

Because at the moment, outlawing it has been deemed unconstitutional in error.

 

[choiceone]

It's really special for you to count the South's means of gaining more political power at the expense of its slaves as an indication that the slaves mattered more than the social undesirables you don't like.

"3/5th of an actual person for purposes of representation in Congress" in your mind equals a "person."

In that case, I wish you were "3/5th of an actual person for purposes of representation in Congress," since you apparently don't think there's any difference.

Of course I think there's a difference. However, the fact is that slaves were counted and fetuses were not counted. That means there was already a basis for considering slaves to be persons and recognizing how wrong it was to allow them to be enslaved. There was no basis for considering fetuses to be persons.

 

[Sykes]

The Supreme Court rejected the fetal right to life argument in the Roe vs Wade decision.
The USA does not reconize an embryo or a fetus as a person.

Nor should they.

when do we issue Social Security numbers? Not until there is a person involved.

 

[Strucker]

If the fetus is to be deemed a person with its attendant full array of human rights, then we're going to need a larger, more intrusive...well, "nanny state," as the wags like to put it.

That is, an expectant mother's behavior re her own health must then become a matter of law, complete with criminal proceedings for "abuse" of her own body, as it can affect the Person inside her.

Should be an interesting experiment in defense of a police state.

 

[JayDubya]

Of course I think there's a difference. However, the fact is that slaves were counted and fetuses were not counted. That means there was already a basis for considering slaves to be persons and recognizing how wrong it was to allow them to be enslaved. There was no basis for considering fetuses to be persons.

Which means, once again, that you think that an exploitative means of gaining more power for the South without granting any protections of personhood meant that the social undesirables for some at that bygone time were considered different / better than your social undesirables.

This is incomprehensible nonsense on your part.