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National Archives Sends Criminal Referral to DOJ Over Trump's Handling of WH Documents

The AntiDonald

The AntiDonald

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I know the DOJ seems a little reluctant to investigate certain people connected to Jan. 6th, but I don't see how they can ignore this. Trump's handling of WH documents has been a joke. We've known for years he just tears up stuff he doesn't like.

Trump's habit of ripping up official documents, some of which staff then had to tape back together, was first reported by Politico in 2018.

www.businessinsider.com

The National Archives asked the Justice Department to investigate if Trump broke the law when he took official documents to Mar-a-Lago: report

The National Archives has recovered 15 boxes of White House materials that Trump took with him, potentially violating the Presidential Records Act.
www.businessinsider.com www.businessinsider.com
 
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Wow
 
The AntiDonald said:
I know the DOJ seems a little reluctant to investigate certain people connected to Jan. 6th, but I don't see how they can ignore this. Trump's handling of WH documents has been a joke. We've known for years he just tears up stuff he doesn't like.

Trump's habit of ripping up official documents, some of which staff then had to tape back together, was first reported by Politico in 2018.

www.businessinsider.com

The National Archives asked the Justice Department to investigate if Trump broke the law when he took official documents to Mar-a-Lago: report

The National Archives has recovered 15 boxes of White House materials that Trump took with him, potentially violating the Presidential Records Act.
www.businessinsider.com www.businessinsider.com
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djt is a lawless cockwomble

cockwomble, noun, A person, usually male, prone to making outrageously stupid statements and/or inappropriate behavior while generally having a very high opinion of his own wisdom and importance.
 
Actual patriots to Garland: get off your ****ing ass and appoint a special or independent prosecutor if you won't do it yourself.

There's the Mueller report laying out tons of obstruction, almost cartoonishly hamfisted at that. There's all the election interference. There's this. There are countless things.

I can't even remember all the corrupt/criminal things he did because it was never-ending. Nobody should get a forever pass because they were president when they did it.



I can understand perhaps why Biden wouldn't specifically instruct Garland to bring charges since that would directly contradict criticisms aimed at Trump for using his AG to target enemies and protect friends. But I'm struggling to wrap my mind around Garland's thinking. How does it protect institutional integrity?

It's the Department of Justice. Is it supposed to be "justice" to let a criminal off simply because someone who would always criticize you/the administration claimed it was a "political witch hunt"? Justice is people getting a fair trial and, if they did it, getting convicted. And I have little doubt that if a jury were actually being seated, the judge would grant far more leeway to the lawyers to vet jurors, since there obviously would be a huge amount of bias in each direction: Trumpists looking to protect Trump willing to protect the him no matter what the evidence showed, and non-Trumpists with an equally strong motive to convict.

He would deserve a fair trial, like anyone else. But he does not deserve protection in the name of a political peace that isn't coming anytime soon. And sure, Trumpists would threaten to use their next AG to seek bullshit charges for Democrats. But they threaten that stuff anyway. That's just "look at what you made me do!" And juries aren't guaranteed to do anything in particular.
 
mrjurrs said:
djt is a lawless cockwomble

cockwomble, noun, A person, usually male, prone to making outrageously stupid statements and/or inappropriate behavior while generally having a very high opinion of his own wisdom and importance.
Click to expand...
Or for a shorter definition, A Narcissistic Sociopath.
 
www.law.cornell.edu

18 U.S. Code § 2071 - Concealment, removal, or mutilation generally

www.law.cornell.edu www.law.cornell.edu

18 U.S. Code § 2071 - Concealment, removal, or mutilation generally​


(a)
Whoever willfully and unlawfully conceals, removes, mutilates, obliterates, or destroys, or attempts to do so, or, with intent to do so takes and carries away any record, proceeding, map, book, paper, document, or other thing, filed or deposited with any clerk or officer of any court of the United States, or in any public office, or with any judicial or public officer of the United States, shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than three years, or both.
(b)
Whoever, having the custody of any such record, proceeding, map, book, document, paper, or other thing, willfully and unlawfully conceals, removes, mutilates, obliterates, falsifies, or destroys the same, shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than three years, or both; and shall forfeit his office and be disqualified from holding any office under the United States. As used in this subsection, the term “office” does not include the office held by any person as a retired officer of the Armed Forces of the United States.
(June 25, 1948, ch. 645, 62 Stat. 795; Pub. L. 101–510, div. A, title V, § 552(a), Nov. 5, 1990, 104 Stat. 1566; Pub. L. 103–322, title XXXIII, § 330016(1)(I), Sept. 13, 1994, 108 Stat. 2147.)
Click to expand...
 
azgreg said:
www.law.cornell.edu

18 U.S. Code § 2071 - Concealment, removal, or mutilation generally

www.law.cornell.edu www.law.cornell.edu
Click to expand...
Sure sounds like Trump to me. If the DOJ doesn't move on this one, I'll have a hard time believing they'll move on anything significant.

I could see him taking a box or two from the WH, calling the Archives right away and saying he made a mistake. But 15 boxes almost 13 months after the fact. What Trump took (Stole) he was intending to keep. Someone in his WH staff ratted him out. Give them a medal.
 
You got him now, boys!
 
Mr Person said:
Actual patriots to Garland: get off your ****ing ass and appoint a special or independent prosecutor if you won't do it yourself.

There's the Mueller report laying out tons of obstruction, almost cartoonishly hamfisted at that. There's all the election interference. There's this. There are countless things.

I can't even remember all the corrupt/criminal things he did because it was never-ending. Nobody should get a forever pass because they were president when they did it.



I can understand perhaps why Biden wouldn't specifically instruct Garland to bring charges since that would directly contradict criticisms aimed at Trump for using his AG to target enemies and protect friends. But I'm struggling to wrap my mind around Garland's thinking. How does it protect institutional integrity?

It's the Department of Justice. Is it supposed to be "justice" to let a criminal off simply because someone who would always criticize you/the administration claimed it was a "political witch hunt"? Justice is people getting a fair trial and, if they did it, getting convicted. And I have little doubt that if a jury were actually being seated, the judge would grant far more leeway to the lawyers to vet jurors, since there obviously would be a huge amount of bias in each direction: Trumpists looking to protect Trump willing to protect the him no matter what the evidence showed, and non-Trumpists with an equally strong motive to convict.

He would deserve a fair trial, like anyone else. But he does not deserve protection in the name of a political peace that isn't coming anytime soon. And sure, Trumpists would threaten to use their next AG to seek bullshit charges for Democrats. But they threaten that stuff anyway. That's just "look at what you made me do!" And juries aren't guaranteed to do anything in particular.
Click to expand...
The good news is a DC jury will not be really friendly to Trump. All alleged crimes committed while he was president fall in DCs jurisdiction.
 
Mr Person said:
Actual patriots to Garland: get off your ****ing ass and appoint a special or independent prosecutor if you won't do it yourself.

There's the Mueller report laying out tons of obstruction, almost cartoonishly hamfisted at that. There's all the election interference. There's this. There are countless things.

I can't even remember all the corrupt/criminal things he did because it was never-ending. Nobody should get a forever pass because they were president when they did it.



I can understand perhaps why Biden wouldn't specifically instruct Garland to bring charges since that would directly contradict criticisms aimed at Trump for using his AG to target enemies and protect friends. But I'm struggling to wrap my mind around Garland's thinking. How does it protect institutional integrity?

It's the Department of Justice. Is it supposed to be "justice" to let a criminal off simply because someone who would always criticize you/the administration claimed it was a "political witch hunt"? Justice is people getting a fair trial and, if they did it, getting convicted. And I have little doubt that if a jury were actually being seated, the judge would grant far more leeway to the lawyers to vet jurors, since there obviously would be a huge amount of bias in each direction: Trumpists looking to protect Trump willing to protect the him no matter what the evidence showed, and non-Trumpists with an equally strong motive to convict.

He would deserve a fair trial, like anyone else. But he does not deserve protection in the name of a political peace that isn't coming anytime soon. And sure, Trumpists would threaten to use their next AG to seek bullshit charges for Democrats. But they threaten that stuff anyway. That's just "look at what you made me do!" And juries aren't guaranteed to do anything in particular.
Click to expand...
Now we again know why birds of a feather flock together ........... should not be legal. Once evidence surfaces it should simultaneously bring on a special prosecutor to present the case.

I say there must be interpretations in the constitution or codes or whatever that are then misinterpretations
which prevent prosecution. Yes I fully understand the complexities and realize it will take much time however sweeping crime under the proverbial rug is not preventing further criminal activity.
 
I don’t think Garland is going to do anything about this, but in all seriousness, has a legitimate institution (and not Man On Street) made a criminal referral before this?
 
The AntiDonald said:
I know the DOJ seems a little reluctant to investigate certain people connected to Jan. 6th, but I don't see how they can ignore this. Trump's handling of WH documents has been a joke. We've known for years he just tears up stuff he doesn't like.

Trump's habit of ripping up official documents, some of which staff then had to tape back together, was first reported by Politico in 2018.

www.businessinsider.com

The National Archives asked the Justice Department to investigate if Trump broke the law when he took official documents to Mar-a-Lago: report

The National Archives has recovered 15 boxes of White House materials that Trump took with him, potentially violating the Presidential Records Act.
www.businessinsider.com www.businessinsider.com
Click to expand...

Delish. I don't know if Garland will do anything, but it's still delish.
 
mrjurrs said:
djt is a lawless cockwomble

cockwomble, noun, A person, usually male, prone to making outrageously stupid statements and/or inappropriate behavior while generally having a very high opinion of his own wisdom and importance.
Click to expand...
We use to call them loud mouthed know it all dumbasses.
 
BlueTex said:
en.wikipedia.org

L. Patrick Gray - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org en.wikipedia.org
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Although I meant about Trump, that’s still certainly on point. In today’s climate, it’s hard to imagine that kind of crime getting the kind of traction necessary to prosecute an ex-President. By today’s standards, destroying official government records ranks somewhere between jay walking and not mowing your lawn weekly as required by neighborhood covenant.
 
Cardinal said:
I don’t think Garland is going to do anything about this, but in all seriousness, has a legitimate institution (and not Man On Street) made a criminal referral before this?
Click to expand...

He damn well better do something about something. . . .
 
Here's a little additional detail from the Washington Post. It seems Trump might have kept some gifts and items that are on display at Mara Lago.

In January 2021, in the waning days of the Trump presidency, some administration staffers also raised flags that some of the gifts Trump had received as president still remained in the White House rather than being properly turned over to the National Archives, said two former staffers familiar with the warning who, like others interviewed for this report, spoke on the condition of anonymity to share details of a potentially problematic practice. In the final days of the Trump administration, the packing was rushed and aides were concerned that personal items were being mixed with official items, according to former administration officials.
Click to expand...

“There was quite a bit of concern about the amount of mixing of personal effects with gifts that had been received during his time in office, which I’m sure in a traditional White House would have immediately been processed and given to the Archives,” one of the former staffers said. “But in the Trump White House, it was scattered throughout the West Wing, displayed behind glass, in the private dining room and in the private residence on the second floor.”
The concern now is that many of those gifts and other government documents improperly made their way to Trump’s private Mar-a-Lago Club in Palm Beach, Fla. This former staffer said, for instance, that after leaving the White House, Trump displayed a mini model of one of the black border-wall slats — with an engraved plaque on top — on his desk in his private office at Mar-a-Lago. Previously, as president, Trump had kept the item on the credenza in the private dining room just off the Oval Office, next to some challenge coins he had been given.
Click to expand...

Trump also took with him a model of the Air Force One redesign he had proposed — replacing the Boeing 747’s baby blue with a dark blue belly and a similarly dark red stripe — when he left the White House. As president, Trump displayed the model redesign of Air Force One on a table in the Oval Office; now, it sits in a similar place of honor at his private Florida club, atop a coffee table at the entrance to Mar-a-Lago’s opulent gold-plated lobby room, which guests pass through to get to the patio.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2022/02/09/trump-archives-justice-department/
Click to expand...

The upper portion of the WaPo article and the BI article are the same.
 
Keeps wondering when the scale is going to tip and Trump is finally arrested.
There are a number of illegal and unethical instances that could be used.
And more that are uncovered almost daily.
 
The AntiDonald said:
All we can do is hope and pray. It's too far above my paygrade to make anything happen. All I can do is vote.
Click to expand...
You have to admit that after all the crap trump did in office, it would be ironic if ripping up papers would get him charged with a crime, and prevented from running for office again.
 
 
Mr Person said:
Actual patriots to Garland: get off your ****ing ass and appoint a special or independent prosecutor if you won't do it yourself.

There's the Mueller report laying out tons of obstruction, almost cartoonishly hamfisted at that. There's all the election interference. There's this. There are countless things.

I can't even remember all the corrupt/criminal things he did because it was never-ending. Nobody should get a forever pass because they were president when they did it.



I can understand perhaps why Biden wouldn't specifically instruct Garland to bring charges since that would directly contradict criticisms aimed at Trump for using his AG to target enemies and protect friends. But I'm struggling to wrap my mind around Garland's thinking. How does it protect institutional integrity?

It's the Department of Justice. Is it supposed to be "justice" to let a criminal off simply because someone who would always criticize you/the administration claimed it was a "political witch hunt"? Justice is people getting a fair trial and, if they did it, getting convicted. And I have little doubt that if a jury were actually being seated, the judge would grant far more leeway to the lawyers to vet jurors, since there obviously would be a huge amount of bias in each direction: Trumpists looking to protect Trump willing to protect the him no matter what the evidence showed, and non-Trumpists with an equally strong motive to convict.

He would deserve a fair trial, like anyone else. But he does not deserve protection in the name of a political peace that isn't coming anytime soon. And sure, Trumpists would threaten to use their next AG to seek bullshit charges for Democrats. But they threaten that stuff anyway. That's just "look at what you made me do!" And juries aren't guaranteed to do anything in particular.
Click to expand...
Hear Hear, Bother!!


standing.gif
 
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