NASA Study confirms that there was no "pause" in the warming

[Verax]

If you don't understand the science you can't appreciate who does.

Oh you have a degree in climate science or the relevant fields? Do you have a job working in the field? Are you a scientist?

Sorry but if you answer no to all those questions I don't understand what makes you think you're an expert who understands the science not just as well as people in the field, but better!

 

[jmotivator]

If you don't understand the science you can't appreciate who does.

When you don't understand the science you make your determination on theory validity using things like bogus head counts.

 

[LowDown]

Oh, I get it. You've been led to believe that somewhere there is some theory that is not in the mainstream, and that isn't being published for purely political reasons. So then, what is this magic theory that your entire point depends upon? Who wrote it? Who rejected it unfairly, and when?

Or is this just yet another load of crapola from Denierstan that has not one shred of actual evidence behind it?

Maybe you should consider camping out in the conspiracy theory section, where lack of evidence is not a hindrance for the tin-foil hat crowd.

Your insults are tiresome. Good day to you.

 

[LowDown]

Oh you have a degree in climate science or the relevant fields? Do you have a job working in the field? Are you a scientist?

Sorry but if you answer no to all those questions I don't understand what makes you think you're an expert who understands the science not just as well as people in the field, but better!

Why should I answer your questions? You will just call me liar.

Good day to you.

 

[Verax]

Why should I answer your questions? You will just call me liar.

Good day to you.

Simply asking you what makes you think you are qualified to critique climate scientists causes you to throw a fit and run off? Perhaps it's because you realized you don't actually have any credible background to be making the claims that you do?

 

[code1211]

It's known as "dark money" for a reason

Okay, so you can't identify the money, and you can't identify the amounts or who recieved it, but you know it is there, there's plenty of it and it is perverting the thinking of the public.

Can you point to anything that was done with the money that shows you have a leg to stand on in this conspiracy theory?

A commercial? A campaign? A well know jingle?

What is the basis of your assertion?

Why would anyone selling anything that everyone needs just to survive need to do what you are saying is being done?

 

[code1211]

"If there were aliens guiding the activities and planning of the Egyptians, then isn't it more a plausible explanation for why the Pyramids have Pi included in every measurement than to believe that this stone age culture had actually discovered Pi?"

Why don't you go ahead and elaborate on why this is a proper analogy to my argument wherein I relied on a peer-reviewed study published by the Jet Propulsion Lab at NASA which used 20 years of observational data to track an increase in thermal energy in the deeper ocean consistent with the "missing" heat energy that certain models predicted would have further increased the surface temperatures over the last 18 years.

The tracking was done absent the presence of instruments to track.

This is a neat trick and is not anything more or less than conjecture.

Instead of quoting me, why not link to the article that reveals the imaginary instruments that made the measurements?

There are no instruments that can make these measurements. They are assuming that the conjecture regarding the heat trapping is correct and therefore the heat MUST be somewhere on Earth so it has to be in the only place they cannot check to find it.

That's not science. That is AGW Science.

 

[Poor Debater]

The tracking was done absent the presence of instruments to track.

This is a neat trick and is not anything more or less than conjecture.

Instead of quoting me, why not link to the article that reveals the imaginary instruments that made the measurements?

There are no instruments that can make these measurements. They are assuming that the conjecture regarding the heat trapping is correct and therefore the heat MUST be somewhere on Earth so it has to be in the only place they cannot check to find it.

That's not science. That is AGW Science.

meanwhile, in Denierstan, it's perfectly OK to violate conservation of energy and call it "science".

 

[code1211]

Simply asking you what makes you think you are qualified to critique climate scientists causes you to throw a fit and run off? Perhaps it's because you realized you don't actually have any credible background to be making the claims that you do?

The question is not who is qualified to question the authority of those that are wrong and have demonstrated that they are wrong.

The question is why do these folks who are wrong all agree with each other's wrongness consistently and why do others applaud the wrongness in concert?

I have said before that I don't need to know why a rotting fish stinks to know it stinks. There is evidence in the real world and no amount of wrong headed theorizing is going to make the carcass smell like a rose.

 

[Poor Debater]

The question is not who is qualified to question the authority of those that are wrong and have demonstrated that they are wrong.

The question is why do these folks who are wrong all agree with each other's wrongness consistently and why do others applaud the wrongness in concert?

I have said before that I don't need to know why a rotting fish stinks to know it stinks. There is evidence in the real world and no amount of wrong headed theorizing is going to make the carcass smell like a rose.

Apparently it is evidence that you are unable to actually present.

 

[code1211]

meanwhile, in Denierstan, it's perfectly OK to violate conservation of energy and call it "science".

I see. Asking a question is denying. You guys are an interesting mix of dogmatic allegiance and bullying name callers.

The conservation of energy as it applies to the climate is based on assumptions that seem to be erroneous.

If all of the assumptions were perfectly accurate, the models that result from them would be correct. They are not.

What is in error? The assumptions that the models are based on or the real world that departs from the models?

 

[code1211]

If you know more than actual climate scientists why don't you write papers and correct them? I'm sure the fossil fuel industry would be glad to pay you millions to disprove mainstream climate science.

Why are obsessed with this conspiracy theory?

If the use of Fossil Fuels was to cease today, upwards of 6 billion people would be dead before the football season started.

They don't need to fool us into not banning their products. If we do so, we die. Period.

 

[code1211]

So instead of making millions of dollars and being in the scientific history books as one of the guys that was right when everybody else was wrong you instead don't do it because "they don't respond well to criticism"? Gimme a break.

Sorry but I have no reason to believe you or any of the other deniers on this forum have any more than a crude understanding of basic climate science and I've seen you all be extremely wrong about simple subjects many times. You might trick a few of the more ignorant people but it's pretty obvious to most what you guys do. You're not experts and you never will be.

The experts can be referenced with this simple set of charts.

What they predicted:




What actually happened:




You don't need to be a climate scientist to see that they were wrong. In truth, it might help to see it if you're NOT a climate scientist. Despite the evidence that there's a hole in the thinking, they are still locked in group think.

 

[Fenton]

The consequences -- which is mitigation of climate change -- is exactly what the population does want. Trading schemes are just one way to accomplish that, and not necessarily the best way. Tax and subsidy works too, and is more comprehensive and easier to administer.

A number of Countries have " decarbonized " their Power plants.

Unfortunately for their citizens its been a unmitigated disaster.

Germany comes to mind. There's all the reason in the world we shouldn't do it.

 

[code1211]

Take your criticism up with the Jet Propulsion Lab at NASA. I am sure they will appreciate the educational lesson.

Does it seem at all odd to you that Obama would like to have the temperatures reflect more warming than they did when he was elected and they are suddenly doing just that?

What do you think when odd coincidences occur under Republican Presidents that happen to support their goals?

 

[code1211]

If space aliens built the pyramids, don't you think they would have a better value for pi than 22/7, which is what the Egyptians used?

I watched a show on one of the historical/scientific channels that we trying to answer that particular question and they assume that the use of the wheel to measure the distances is the reason that Pi shows up everywhere.

The Pi-Ramid

The point is that the climate guys are citing a correlation that leads to the richest corporations on the planet and the governments are sensing a payday in the near future if they can just con enough dupes into the right wrong headedness.

 

[code1211]

Thanks, I was wondering where the large jump came from.
I wonder if they count it for the total warming, or does it just count as a artifact of the switch?

That would depend solely on whether it was a warming or a cooling that was noted.

 

[code1211]

The most correct way to determine how much warming has occurred is to smooth the data, so you don't get fooled by statistical outliers or statistical noise. By that measure, the switch is insignificant over the long term.

And another chart of ocean temperature that seems different:

GRAPH UPDATED*


​

 

[code1211]

Apparently it is evidence that you are unable to actually present.

Evidence of what? that they made erroneous predictions? I have shown you that.

I don't need to be able to present evidence to ask questions. That is the honest revelation that I want to know the answers.

The answers from you and others who claim you know the Truth is what is lacking.

If you have the Truth with a capital T, then please present it. So far, you have not done so.

 

[Jack Hays]

GISS / Global Temperature Update
[h=1]The Three Faces of the GISS Land-Ocean Temperature Index (LOTI)[/h] Guest Post by Bob Tisdale This is the first of a series of posts about the impacts of NOAA’s new pause-buster sea surface temperature data on the global temperature products from GISS and NCEI (formerly NCDC). In this post, we’re going to compare the three recent versions of the GISS Land-Ocean Temperature Index from 1979…

 

[Poor Debater]

I see. Asking a question is denying. You guys are an interesting mix of dogmatic allegiance and bullying name callers.

When one says ridiculous things, one can expect to be ridiculed.

The conservation of energy as it applies to the climate is based on assumptions that seem to be erroneous.

And that's a perfect example. Conservation of energy is the most central theory in all of science. It's not based on assumptions, it's based on centuries of observations that always hold true. If you think CoE doesn't hold, anywhere at any time, you're so far off the reservation you can't call it science. You're in deep, deep into Denierstan.

If all of the assumptions were perfectly accurate, the models that result from them would be correct. They are not.

Yes they are. You have been lied to.

 

[Poor Debater]

A number of Countries have " decarbonized " their Power plants.

Unfortunately for their citizens its been a unmitigated disaster.

Germany comes to mind. There's all the reason in the world we shouldn't do it.

Germany has not decarbonized, and isn't even close. Most of their power comes from coal.

Countries that have already decarbonized (or nearly so) include France, Sweden, Finland, Norway, Paraguay, Zambia, Iceland, and the province of Ontario.

What disasters have occurred in those countries? I'd really like to know.

 

[Poor Debater]

And another chart of ocean temperature that seems different:

GRAPH UPDATED*


​

Do you know where the guy who made this graph got the data for what rate of temperature rise is predicted by climate models for the deep ocean?

I don't either. I think he's lying.

 

[Poor Debater]

Evidence of what? that they made erroneous predictions? I have shown you that.

In the two weeks or so that I've been on this board, you have not once cited a peer-reviewed scientific paper. And you certainly haven't cited one that shows any evidence that models are wrong.

If all you've got is a blog post, you've got nothing.

I don't need to be able to present evidence to ask questions.

If all you did were ask questions, I wouldn't be asking for evidence. But that's not all you've been doing. You've also been making statements. False ones that you cannot support. And every time you make such a statement, I'm going to demand evidence for it.

If you can't stand the heat, get out of the kitchen. Science is not for sissies.

That is the honest revelation that I want to know the answers.

The answers from you and others who claim you know the Truth is what is lacking.

If you have the Truth with a capital T, then please present it. So far, you have not done so.

So apparently you've forgotten all of theses graphs, which I have already presented and which were unrebutted by you:

 

[Fenton]

Germany has not decarbonized, and isn't even close. Most of their power comes from coal.

Countries that have already decarbonized (or nearly so) include France, Sweden, Finland, Norway, Paraguay, Zambia, Iceland, and the province of Ontario.

What disasters have occurred in those countries? I'd really like to know.

Lol !!

Do you know WHY they're so dependant on coal ??

Its because they stupidly decided to be the first Nation to be completely powered by renewable energy sources.

Yup ! They called it the " Green revolution " , and it was a complete failure.

We, the people with common sense, are trying to marginalize people like YOU ( highly gullible ) so what happened in Germany NEVER happens here, in America.

What next ? Are you going to tell us that the Hockey Stick graph is a legitimate representation and not a glaring piece of propaganda ?

Because thats what it is.