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My daughter's first spanking

KevinKohler

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Happened today. Up till now it's been nothing but time outs, and the removal of positive reinforcement incentives, like candy, ice cream, or chocolate milk. Which typically works. She's terrified of time out. Oh, she's 4 and a half, by the way. Well, anyway, today's was different. I had them outside, and I was inside cleaning the kitchen, doing dishes, etc. I have a fenced in back yard, so it's minimal supervision. Well, I pop my head up just in time to see that my daughter Grace had somehow gotten the broom portion off of the broom stick, and was waving it around. Then, as I was rinsing my hands to go correct the situation, my two year old son wants a try, and starts walking over to grab the pile. Graces hits him in the face. It looked intentional. Then she saw me, and knew she was in trouble and ran to the corner of the yard. I went to check on Isaac who had been knocked down, and was crying profusely. He had a bruise in the very corner of his eye socket, and cuts with a littler blood. He had got hit by the metal screw end, and the threads had cut him. I got him cleaned up, then grabbed grace, and right there in the yard, gave her 4 good licks on the butt, and sent her to her room.

And then the uncertainty. Is she still too young for spankings? Did I over react? Would an extra long time out have worked just as well? She already knew she did something wrong.

People ask me the biggest thing about parenting, and I have the same answer everytime. Uncertainty. It's like putting together a complicated model without instructions, just going by a picture on the box. You THINK you're doung it right, but you're never quite sure.
 

sawyerloggingon

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Happened today. Up till now it's been nothing but time outs, and the removal of positive reinforcement incentives, like candy, ice cream, or chocolate milk. Which typically works. She's terrified of time out. Oh, she's 4 and a half, by the way. Well, anyway, today's was different. I had them outside, and I was inside cleaning the kitchen, doing dishes, etc. I have a fenced in back yard, so it's minimal supervision. Well, I pop my head up just in time to see that my daughter Grace had somehow gotten the broom portion off of the broom stick, and was waving it around. Then, as I was rinsing my hands to go correct the situation, my two year old son wants a try, and starts walking over to grab the pile. Graces hits him in the face. It looked intentional. Then she saw me, and knew she was in trouble and ran to the corner of the yard. I went to check on Isaac who had been knocked down, and was crying profusely. He had a bruise in the very corner of his eye socket, and cuts with a littler blood. He had got hit by the metal screw end, and the threads had cut him. I got him cleaned up, then grabbed grace, and right there in the yard, gave her 4 good licks on the butt, and sent her to her room.

And then the uncertainty. Is she still too young for spankings? Did I over react? Would an extra long time out have worked just as well? She already knew she did something wrong.

People ask me the biggest thing about parenting, and I have the same answer everytime. Uncertainty. It's like putting together a complicated model without instructions, just going by a picture on the box. You THINK you're doung it right, but you're never quite sure.
Wrong time to spank IMO. Punishing violence with violence? She needed to be shown how much she hurt her little brother and been made to feel like s*** about it.
 

spud_meister

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Eh, as long as you explained why you spanked her, that it was because she could have seriously hurt her brother, then it sounds like you did the right thing.

I personal belief is spanking should only be used if a kid has seriously endangered themselves or someone else, that your other kid could've lost an eye means you were justified IMO.
 

Goshin

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Happened today. Up till now it's been nothing but time outs, and the removal of positive reinforcement incentives, like candy, ice cream, or chocolate milk. Which typically works. She's terrified of time out. Oh, she's 4 and a half, by the way. Well, anyway, today's was different. I had them outside, and I was inside cleaning the kitchen, doing dishes, etc. I have a fenced in back yard, so it's minimal supervision. Well, I pop my head up just in time to see that my daughter Grace had somehow gotten the broom portion off of the broom stick, and was waving it around. Then, as I was rinsing my hands to go correct the situation, my two year old son wants a try, and starts walking over to grab the pile. Graces hits him in the face. It looked intentional. Then she saw me, and knew she was in trouble and ran to the corner of the yard. I went to check on Isaac who had been knocked down, and was crying profusely. He had a bruise in the very corner of his eye socket, and cuts with a littler blood. He had got hit by the metal screw end, and the threads had cut him. I got him cleaned up, then grabbed grace, and right there in the yard, gave her 4 good licks on the butt, and sent her to her room.

And then the uncertainty. Is she still too young for spankings? Did I over react? Would an extra long time out have worked just as well? She already knew she did something wrong.

People ask me the biggest thing about parenting, and I have the same answer everytime. Uncertainty. It's like putting together a complicated model without instructions, just going by a picture on the box. You THINK you're doung it right, but you're never quite sure.



Most definitely NOT excessive at all. In fact, IMHO, there need to be further consequences, including a long "you should be ashamed" talk, loss of privileges for a week, and so on... serious safety issues (like defiance issues) must be handled very stringently.
 

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Sounds like you did right in my book.

I remember the first spanking I gave to my son. I actually walked out and into my bedroom and cried after I did it. Being a parent is not always easy......
 

KevinKohler

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Oh, I explained it to her, I asked her why she hit him, I asked her how she thinks it felt for him, asked her if she would like to GET hit by the pole, etc. I always explain punishments, be it time out, or no treat, etc.
 

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Happened today. Up till now it's been nothing but time outs, and the removal of positive reinforcement incentives, like candy, ice cream, or chocolate milk. Which typically works. She's terrified of time out. Oh, she's 4 and a half, by the way. Well, anyway, today's was different. I had them outside, and I was inside cleaning the kitchen, doing dishes, etc. I have a fenced in back yard, so it's minimal supervision. Well, I pop my head up just in time to see that my daughter Grace had somehow gotten the broom portion off of the broom stick, and was waving it around. Then, as I was rinsing my hands to go correct the situation, my two year old son wants a try, and starts walking over to grab the pile. Graces hits him in the face. It looked intentional. Then she saw me, and knew she was in trouble and ran to the corner of the yard. I went to check on Isaac who had been knocked down, and was crying profusely. He had a bruise in the very corner of his eye socket, and cuts with a littler blood. He had got hit by the metal screw end, and the threads had cut him. I got him cleaned up, then grabbed grace, and right there in the yard, gave her 4 good licks on the butt, and sent her to her room.

And then the uncertainty. Is she still too young for spankings? Did I over react? Would an extra long time out have worked just as well? She already knew she did something wrong.

People ask me the biggest thing about parenting, and I have the same answer everytime. Uncertainty. It's like putting together a complicated model without instructions, just going by a picture on the box. You THINK you're doung it right, but you're never quite sure.
Sounds like natural parenting to me. She scared you and hurt him, and you did the same to her. It's fine for a child running into the street or something like this, just don't make a habit of it. Praise and time-outs work better over the long-term but when you need the nuclear option, there it is. My bet is she doesn't forget this one for a while and that would be a good thing.
 

KevinKohler

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I just hope I don't have too many of those...she's fine now...I'm not.
 

TiredOfLife

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Wrong time to spank IMO. Punishing violence with violence? She needed to be shown how much she hurt her little brother and been made to feel like s*** about it.
I think that's too PC. This sounds like a normal parent to me and your version would have had to have been under far too much control. Sometimes you just do what you have to even if you think I could have dealt with that better. She'll get over it either way, but maybe not for a day or so.
 

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Happened today. Up till now it's been nothing but time outs, and the removal of positive reinforcement incentives, like candy, ice cream, or chocolate milk. Which typically works. She's terrified of time out. Oh, she's 4 and a half, by the way. Well, anyway, today's was different. I had them outside, and I was inside cleaning the kitchen, doing dishes, etc. I have a fenced in back yard, so it's minimal supervision. Well, I pop my head up just in time to see that my daughter Grace had somehow gotten the broom portion off of the broom stick, and was waving it around. Then, as I was rinsing my hands to go correct the situation, my two year old son wants a try, and starts walking over to grab the pile. Graces hits him in the face. It looked intentional. Then she saw me, and knew she was in trouble and ran to the corner of the yard. I went to check on Isaac who had been knocked down, and was crying profusely. He had a bruise in the very corner of his eye socket, and cuts with a littler blood. He had got hit by the metal screw end, and the threads had cut him. I got him cleaned up, then grabbed grace, and right there in the yard, gave her 4 good licks on the butt, and sent her to her room.

And then the uncertainty. Is she still too young for spankings? Did I over react? Would an extra long time out have worked just as well? She already knew she did something wrong.

People ask me the biggest thing about parenting, and I have the same answer everytime. Uncertainty. It's like putting together a complicated model without instructions, just going by a picture on the box. You THINK you're doung it right, but you're never quite sure.
She's DEFINITELY not too young for a spanking and as long as she knows why she got spanked you're fine and dandy in my book.
 

Goshin

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I just hope I don't have too many of those...she's fine now...I'm not.

Yup, it is like that, for parents who really care. We don't WANT to have to discipline our children... it is hard and often painful... but we know we HAVE to if they're going to grow up to be good people.


Sounds like you're on the right track.
 

sawyerloggingon

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I think that's too PC. This sounds like a normal parent to me and your version would have had to have been under far too much control. Sometimes you just do what you have to even if you think I could have dealt with that better. She'll get over it either way, but maybe not for a day or so.
I am anything but PC but I admit it's easy for me to sit here and calmly assess the situation whereas Kevin did not have that luxury. I was raised with the belt and got a whippin for everything and anything and I ended up a violent young man that swung first asked questions later so I may error a bit to far in the other direction now when it comes to child rearing but in this situation I think a spanking sent the wrong message, JMO.
 

opendebate

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Happened today. Up till now it's been nothing but time outs, and the removal of positive reinforcement incentives, like candy, ice cream, or chocolate milk. Which typically works. She's terrified of time out. Oh, she's 4 and a half, by the way. Well, anyway, today's was different. I had them outside, and I was inside cleaning the kitchen, doing dishes, etc. I have a fenced in back yard, so it's minimal supervision. Well, I pop my head up just in time to see that my daughter Grace had somehow gotten the broom portion off of the broom stick, and was waving it around. Then, as I was rinsing my hands to go correct the situation, my two year old son wants a try, and starts walking over to grab the pile. Graces hits him in the face. It looked intentional. Then she saw me, and knew she was in trouble and ran to the corner of the yard. I went to check on Isaac who had been knocked down, and was crying profusely. He had a bruise in the very corner of his eye socket, and cuts with a littler blood. He had got hit by the metal screw end, and the threads had cut him. I got him cleaned up, then grabbed grace, and right there in the yard, gave her 4 good licks on the butt, and sent her to her room.

And then the uncertainty. Is she still too young for spankings? Did I over react? Would an extra long time out have worked just as well? She already knew she did something wrong.

People ask me the biggest thing about parenting, and I have the same answer everytime. Uncertainty. It's like putting together a complicated model without instructions, just going by a picture on the box. You THINK you're doung it right, but you're never quite sure.
Parenting is the hardest thing you will ever do. You will make mistakes, I suppose you know that. You sound like a caring parent. Don't be to hard on yourself. She will recover. Just look at the circumstances and decide if you are comfortable with the punishment you chose, if not, decide how you would have preferred to handle it and do that the next time. The best thing you can do for your child as a parent is recognize when you make a mistake and chose differently when it re-occurs.

Just wait until they are teenagers and try to kill each other. That's loads of fun.
 

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Oh, I explained it to her, I asked her why she hit him, I asked her how she thinks it felt for him, asked her if she would like to GET hit by the pole, etc. I always explain punishments, be it time out, or no treat, etc.
Don't feel bad, it's really for her own good. It's not right what she did and you are teaching her right from wrong by giving her consequences for her bad actions. It so hard I know, but it really pays off when you see how much better your child is than most of these brats these days.
 

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We have boys. They get spanked out of the womb. :2razz:

Actually mom is more the spanker than dad. Dad finds that telling them that they cannot go with him to the store is a very effective punishment as they feel like they have lost out on an opportunity to con him out of stuff they want even if they have no idea what that stuff might be at the moment. Dad however almost lost his poo the other day but had to remind himself it was his fault for not locking them when a certain 3 year old decided to open the window so he could see better when the laser car wash was soaping said window.
 

Goshin

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I am anything but PC but I admit it's easy for me to sit here and calmly assess the situation whereas Kevin did not have that luxury. I was raised with the belt and got a whippin for everything and anything and I ended up a violent young man that swung first asked questions later so I may error a bit to far in the other direction now when it comes to child rearing but in this situation I think a spanking sent the wrong message, JMO.

It depends on whether it is done the right way or the wrong way.

1. The RIGHT way, also known, obviously, as the GOSHIN WAY :mrgreen: : Reserved for only the most serious issues, ie safety and defiance. Proportional to the child's age and the offense and never to excess. The modus is to inflict a moderate amount of temporary pain to ensure the lesson is not forgotten, but no more than that. Never anywhere on the upper body, and NEVER ever striking the face. Preferably never done while the parent is angry; preferably after a cooling-off period if possible and an explanation of why. ALWAYS with an explanation of why. Never done in a manner to inflict actual injury. Parent must be calm: must not be seen as a venting of the parent's anger, but as a coolly deliberate punishment RARELY inflicted only when the child has done something very serious.

2. The WRONG way: in anger, without explanation, to excess, to the point of real injury, for minor misbehaviors... etc, you get the idea.

#1 was my method, and I stand by the results. I actually used spankings ONLY for two things: safety issues, and overt defiance. Lesser offenses merited lesser discipline; loss of privileges, a long discussion on why this was wrong, scolding or "shaming", time outs, etc.

I am pleased with MY results...
 

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I am anything but PC but I admit it's easy for me to sit here and calmly assess the situation whereas Kevin did not have that luxury. I was raised with the belt and got a whippin for everything and anything and I ended up a violent young man that swung first asked questions later so I may error a bit to far in the other direction now when it comes to child rearing but in this situation I think a spanking sent the wrong message, JMO.
I think it sent the message don't ever do anything like that ever again. As I said, it's nuclear option and if it is overused, as on you, bad things result. No one can be the perfect parent in all situations. You'd make yourself nuts trying to be or beating yourself up too much when you've really made a mistake. The rules of this game change as fast as the kids do. I understand your PC response but I still think he was more right than wrong, hitting for hitting regardless.
 

sawyerloggingon

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I think it sent the message don't ever do anything like that ever again. As I said, it's nuclear option and if it is overused, as on you, bad things result. No one can be the perfect parent in all situations. You'd make yourself nuts trying to be or beating yourself up too much when you've really made a mistake. The rules of this game change as fast as the kids do. I understand your PC response but I still think he was more right than wrong, hitting for hitting regardless.
If you accuse me of being PC one more time I'm going to kick the s*** out of you! :lol: Seriously though my answer was not about being PC, it was about 60 years of thinking this stuff over.
 

TiredOfLife

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It depends on whether it is done the right way or the wrong way.

1. The RIGHT way, also known, obviously, as the GOSHIN WAY :mrgreen: : Reserved for only the most serious issues, ie safety and defiance. Proportional to the child's age and the offense and never to excess. The modus is to inflict a moderate amount of temporary pain to ensure the lesson is not forgotten, but no more than that. Never anywhere on the upper body, and NEVER ever striking the face. Preferably never done while the parent is angry; preferably after a cooling-off period if possible and an explanation of why. ALWAYS with an explanation of why. Never done in a manner to inflict actual injury. Parent must be calm: must not be seen as a venting of the parent's anger, but as a coolly deliberate punishment RARELY inflicted only when the child has done something very serious.

2. The WRONG way: in anger, without explanation, to excess, to the point of real injury, for minor misbehaviors... etc, you get the idea.

#1 was my method, and I stand by the results. I actually used spankings ONLY for two things: safety issues, and overt defiance. Lesser offenses merited lesser discipline; loss of privileges, a long discussion on why this was wrong, scolding or "shaming", time outs, etc.

I am pleased with MY results...
When a child runs into the street, and you grab them and swat them, that's anger and fear, and entirely appropriate. If you are no longer angry, don't bother spanking.
 

TiredOfLife

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If you accuse me of being PC one more time I'm going to kick the s*** out of you! :lol: Seriously though my answer was not about being PC, it was about 60 years of thinking this stuff over.
Mine too.
 

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I pretty much disclipined for defiance, and for meanness. Age 4 is fine, because at that age, they can remember when they have been told NOT to do something, assuming they are at least average intelligence.
 

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When a child runs into the street, and you grab them and swat them, that's anger and fear, and entirely appropriate. If you are no longer angry, don't bother spanking.

I don't agree.

Look, if we're talking about a <4yo, then yes a few swats on the butt to get their immediate attention is certainly appropriate for safety issues... even if you're angry and scared at that moment, as long as you can control your feelings and not let it cause you to punish excessively.


However, I totally disagree that "if you're not angry, don't bother spanking". That is, to me, ridiculous as it turns a disciplinary tool for major problems into a mere anger-venting act of violence and sends the totally wrong message. Discipline isn't about venting the parent's feelings, it is about altering the child's attitudes and behaviors.
 

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Oh, I explained it to her, I asked her why she hit him, I asked her how she thinks it felt for him, asked her if she would like to GET hit by the pole, etc. I always explain punishments, be it time out, or no treat, etc.
The explanations are always longer and more painful for the child than the spanking, at least that's the way it should be. If that's the case, you're doing okay.

Also, when it's all done, it's all done. No making it an albatross that the kid gets reminded of every time they mess up.
 

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Is she sorry she got caught in the act....or that she hurt her little brother? Has your little boy been injured like that before?

I wouldn't worry too much, sounds like you're doing a great job raising your kids. I think overall Super Nanny would be very impressed with your parenting.
 

TiredOfLife

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I don't agree.

Look, if we're talking about a <4yo, then yes a few swats on the butt to get their immediate attention is certainly appropriate for safety issues... even if you're angry and scared at that moment, as long as you can control your feelings and not let it cause you to punish excessively.


However, I totally disagree that "if you're not angry, don't bother spanking". That is, to me, ridiculous as it turns a disciplinary tool for major problems into a mere anger-venting act of violence and sends the totally wrong message. Discipline isn't about venting the parent's feelings, it is about altering the child's attitudes and behaviors.
When you are hitting a child you love, it's not that simple, nor should it be. The anger should be there or there's no point. It's cold and calculated otherwise and that's not a good thing. I didn't say rage, I said anger. Don't have it, don't bother.
 
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