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Murtha a Kerry clone? (1 Viewer)

Navy Pride

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Did anyone catch Congressman Murtha oh Hardball today?.........Not only is our military broken but it is purposely murdering innocent civilians he claims through the usual unnamed sources......I give him all the credit in the world for his military service but he is really going off the deep end is becoming a Kerry and Sheehan clone..........
 
Navy Pride said:
Did anyone catch Congressman Murtha oh Hardball today?.........Not only is our military broken but it is purposely murdering innocent civilians he claims through the usual unnamed sources......I give him all the credit in the world for his military service but he is really going off the deep end is becoming a Kerry and Sheehan clone..........

Y'all should read Rush's artilce, Murtha's Retreat. It's highly educational.

Oh, and by the way, John Kerry served in Vietnam.;)
 
I just watched Murtha on Hardball. I cannot imagine that Murtha would make this stuff up. When they asked the Marine Corps to comment on these allegations, they refused, stating that there was an investigation going on. So there is something to this. He's not criticizing the soldiers; rather, he is saying that he thinks their behavior was a result of stress.
 
Navy Pride said:
Did anyone catch Congressman Murtha oh Hardball today?.........Not only is our military broken but it is purposely murdering innocent civilians he claims through the usual unnamed sources......I give him all the credit in the world for his military service but he is really going off the deep end is becoming a Kerry and Sheehan clone..........
Here's his "unnamed sources":
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/12838343/
Here's a quote from the article:
"Military officials told NBC News that the Marine Corps' own evidence appears to show Murtha is right."

You really should do your research.
 
aps said:
I just watched Murtha on Hardball. I cannot imagine that Murtha would make this stuff up. When they asked the Marine Corps to comment on these allegations, they refused, stating that there was an investigation going on. So there is something to this. He's not criticizing the soldiers; rather, he is saying that he thinks their behavior was a result of stress.
Your correct, he lays the blame where it belongs:
"He (Murtha) said U.S. forces were under undue pressure in Iraq because of poor planning and allocation of resources by the Bush administration."
 
Navy Pride said:
Did anyone catch Congressman Murtha oh Hardball today?.........Not only is our military broken but it is purposely murdering innocent civilians he claims through the usual unnamed sources......I give him all the credit in the world for his military service but he is really going off the deep end is becoming a Kerry and Sheehan clone..........

NP - You know better than that. No matter how "smart" a bomb is, or how just the cause, innocent civilians get murdered in war. Call it "collateral damage" if it makes you feel better. It was true when Kerry said, it's true when Murtha says it.
 
Donkey1499 said:
Y'all should read Rush's artilce, Murtha's Retreat. It's highly educational.

Oh, and by the way, John Kerry served in Vietnam.;)

Now that he's off the goofballs, Rush is at the top of his game.;)
 
hipsterdufus said:
NP - You know better than that. No matter how "smart" a bomb is, or how just the cause, innocent civilians get murdered in war. Call it "collateral damage" if it makes you feel better. It was true when Kerry said, it's true when Murtha says it.
Unfortunately, I don't think this can be categorized as "collateral damage":

"Military officials say Marine Corp photos taken immediately after the incident show many of the victims were shot at close range, in the head and chest, execution-style. One photo shows a mother and young child bent over on the floor as if in prayer, shot dead, said the officials, who spoke to NBC News on condition of anonymity because the investigation hasn't been completed."

Can you say "Me Lie" in Arabic?
 
hipsterdufus said:
Now that he's off the goofballs, Rush is at the top of his game.;)
I have always considered Rush a reliable source of misinformation. Especially when he was all OxiContoned out of his gourd.
 
Trajan Octavian Titus said:
This from the guy who tells us to go to Chomsky for reliable information on the U.S.. :roll:
Mr. Chomsky is a highly respected intellectual, scholar, author, researcher, and long time MIT professor.
Rush is a loud mouth, right-wing neocon, dope head.
I see no comparison.
 
The_Real_ElRoi said:
Mr. Chomsky is a highly respected intellectual, scholar, author, researcher, and long time MIT professor.
Rush is a loud mouth, right-wing neocon, dope head.
I see no comparison.

Noam Chomsky is a world renowned progandist for the far left, he has supported the Kymer Rouge and Pol-Pot, he made a cheerleading speech for the Vietcong in Hanoi during the Vietnam war, and he is an apologist for Usama Bin-Laden. In my opinion he should be taken out and shot for treason.
 
Trajan Octavian Titus said:
Noam Chomsky is a world renowned progandist for the far left, he has supported the Kymer Rouge and Pol-Pot, he made a cheerleading speech for the Vietcong in Hanoi during the Vietnam war, and he is an apologist for Usama Bin-Laden. In my opinion he should be taken out and shot for treason.
Like I said, you really should do your research:
http://www.zmag.org/chomsky/sam/sam-2-06.html
I believe this will clearly explain Mr. Chomsky's position on such murderous groups as the Khmer Rouge. It also clearly explains the extent of US involvement with such nasties. Here's an excerpt that discusses the Khmer Rouge in particular:

In order to bleed Vietnam, we've supported the Khmer Rouge indirectly through our allies, China and Thailand. The Cambodians have to pay with their blood so we can make sure there isn't any recovery in Vietnam. The Vietnamese have to be punished for having resisted US violence.

Contrary to what virtually everyone -- left or right -- says, the United States achieved its major objectives in Indochina. Vietnam was demolished. There's no danger that successful development there will provide a model for other nations in the region.

Of course, it wasn't a total victory for the US. Our larger goal was to reincorporate Indochina into the US-dominated global system, and that has not yet been achieved.
 
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aps said:
I just watched Murtha on Hardball. I cannot imagine that Murtha would make this stuff up. When they asked the Marine Corps to comment on these allegations, they refused, stating that there was an investigation going on. So there is something to this. He's not criticizing the soldiers; rather, he is saying that he thinks their behavior was a result of stress.

All I ask is if he is going to make statements like that then name his sources......If you are going to accuse our military fighting in Iraq of these horrendous crimes then un named sources ain't going to get it........It seems like Murtha is always relying on un named sources for his information..........He did the same thing when he said our military is broke........
 
The_Real_ElRoi said:
Here's his "unnamed sources":
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/12838343/
Here's a quote from the article:
"Military officials told NBC News that the Marine Corps' own evidence appears to show Murtha is right."

You really should do your research.

Yeah, right..........More liberals slamming our military.when will it stop???????
 
hipsterdufus said:
NP - You know better than that. No matter how "smart" a bomb is, or how just the cause, innocent civilians get murdered in war. Call it "collateral damage" if it makes you feel better. It was true when Kerry said, it's true when Murtha says it.

hips, where you been hiding my friend? collateral damage is one thing but purposely killing innocent civilians like Kerry did is a crime against humanity.....
 
The_Real_ElRoi said:
Mr. Chomsky is a highly respected intellectual, scholar, author, researcher, and long time MIT professor.
Rush is a loud mouth, right-wing neocon, dope head.
I see no comparison.
Chomsky is a left wing whacko and a traitor...He is right up there with Cindy Sheehan and Ward Churchill......
 
Navy Pride said:
Yeah, right..........More liberals slamming our military.when will it stop???????
No, you see right-wing neocons like you always insist on twisting things around. Like I said earlier, Murtha lays the blame where it belongs:
"He (Murtha) said U.S. forces were under undue pressure in Iraq because of poor planning and allocation of resources by the Bush administration."
 
The_Real_ElRoi said:
Like I said, you really should do your research:
http://www.zmag.org/chomsky/sam/sam-2-06.html
I believe this will clearly explain Mr. Chomsky's position on such murderous groups as the Khmer Rouge. It also clearly explains the extent of US involvement with such nasties. Here's an excerpt that discusses the Khmer Rouge in particular:

In order to bleed Vietnam, we've supported the Khmer Rouge indirectly through our allies, China and Thailand. The Cambodians have to pay with their blood so we can make sure there isn't any recovery in Vietnam. The Vietnamese have to be punished for having resisted US violence.

Contrary to what virtually everyone -- left or right -- says, the United States achieved its major objectives in Indochina. Vietnam was demolished. There's no danger that successful development there will provide a model for other nations in the region.

Of course, it wasn't a total victory for the US. Our larger goal was to reincorporate Indochina into the US-dominated global system, and that has not yet been achieved.

Again more propaganda and lies, we agreed to give the Chinese one vote (an abstention actually) in the early to middle 80s as a member of the UN security council regarding the war between Vietnam and Cambodia when the Vietnamese had in fact invaded Cambodia in 1979. Not only did we dislike the Vietnamese but it was, also, a political opportunity to help with the trade relations with the Chinese who supported the Kymer Rouge and disliked Vietnamese expansionism. We did not give the Kymer Rouge any financial or military aid and it was the Vietnamese who had invaded Cambodia in the first place. In fact during the Vietnam war we financially and militarily supported anti-Kymer Rouge/Communist forces led by Sihanouk and for a short time actually sent in troops to route out the Communists.

Let's see what else Mr. Chomsky had to say about the attrocities commited by the Kymer Rouge when they had first taken power and he thought they were good fellow Communists like himself:

Refugees are frightened and defenseless, at the mercy of alien forces. They naturally tend to report what they believe their interlocutors wish to hear. While these reports must be considered seriously, care and caution are necessary. Specifically, refugees questioned by Westerners or Thais have a vested interest in reporting atrocities on the part of Cambodian revolutionaries, an obvious fact that no serious reporter will fail to take into account.​
Refugees are frightened and defenseless, at the mercy of alien forces. They naturally tend to report what they believe their interlocutors wish to hear. While these reports must be considered seriously, care and caution are necessary. Specifically, refugees questioned by Westerners or Thais have a vested interest in reporting atrocities on the part of Cambodian revolutionaries, an obvious fact that no serious reporter will fail to take into account.

the deaths in Cambodia were not the result of systematic slaughter and starvation organized by the state but rather attributable in large measure to peasant revenge, undisciplined military units out of government control, starvation and disease that are direct consequences of the [SIZE=-1]US[/SIZE] war, or other such factors.

http://www.newcriterion.com/archive/21/may03/chomsky.htm
 
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Trajan Octavian Titus said:
Again more propaganda and lies we agreed to give the Chinese one vote (an abstention actually) in the early to middle 80s as a member of the UN security council regarding the war between Vietnam and Cambodia when the Vietnamese had in fact invaded Cambodia in 1979 not only did we dislike the Vietnamese but it was a political opportunity to help with the trade relations with the Chinese who supported the Kymer Rouge and disliked Vietnamese expansionism, we did not give the Kymer Rouge any financial or military aid and it was the Vietnamese who had invaded Cambodia in the first place. In fact during the Vietnam war we financially and militarily supported anti-Kymer Rouge/Communist forces led by Sihanouk.

Let's see what else Mr. Chomsky had to say about the attrocities commited by the Kymer Rouge when they had first taken took power and he thought they were good fellow Communists like himself:

For a group whose history you seem to be completely versed on, I would think you would know the proper spelling of their name. It is spelled "Khmer Rouge." But, please do go on with your interpretation of Indochinese history.
Oh, by the way, I would hazard to guess that I am a bit longer in the tooth than you my intellectually superior friend.
 
The_Real_ElRoi said:
For a group whose history you seem to be completely versed on, I would think you would know the proper spelling of their name. It is spelled "Khmer Rouge." But, please do go on with your interpretation of Indochinese history.
Oh, by the way, I would hazard to guess that I am a bit longer in the tooth than you my intellectually superior friend.

Your age means what to me? As for my spelling wuppedee do that's what spell checks for counter my points not my spelling. Anything relevant to add or just more ad-hominems and fallacies of logic?

And I'm not "completely versed" on any third world tin pot dictator save to know my enemy and I know them well.
 
The_Real_ElRoi said:
For a group whose history you seem to be completely versed on, I would think you would know the proper spelling of their name. It is spelled "Khmer Rouge." But, please do go on with your interpretation of Indochinese history.
Oh, by the way, I would hazard to guess that I am a bit longer in the tooth than you my intellectually superior friend.

Real ElRoi makes a claim, posts a quote that doesnt really back it up.
Trajan corrects him, shows evidence to the contrary, raises a few good points.
Real ElRoi makes fun of a misspelling and then claims that because he's older, he's smarter.

Hmmmmmmmmmmm.....
 
Murtha, an ex-Marine, has taken the extraordinary step of accusing U.S. Marines of war crimes before a joint NCIS/Multi-National Forces investigation has been completed of an incident that occurred on November 19, 2005.

First off, it is unconscionable for any legislator to accuse U.S. military personnel of multiple counts of premeditated murder before an investigation into these charges is complete. Prosecutions must proceed at their own logical pace as evidence in the case dictates. Premature accusations by a public figure (a law-maker yet!) in such a case imposes an artificial timeline, endangering the accuracy and thoroughness of an investigation.

At the same time, such heated rhetoric as charges of murder of "innocent civilians in cold blood" is prejudicial against the defendants, poisoning public opinion against them. This would be an explosive charge in a civilian court, but to make such charges against members of the U.S. Military when they are engaged in military operations in that country is absolutely unforgiveable.

To make such strong charges while our soldiers are in that combat theater of operations is to unnecessarily inflame Iraqi public opinion against our soldiers and place the lives of U.S. servicemen and women in danger of reprisal attacks based upon Murtha’s claims.
 
oldreliable67 said:
To make such strong charges while our soldiers are in that combat theater of operations is to unnecessarily inflame Iraqi public opinion against our soldiers and place the lives of U.S. servicemen and women in danger of reprisal attacks based upon Murtha’s claims.

Have ya been watching the news?
Iraqi public opinion has been inflamed for 3 years.

Can't get too much worse I guess.
 
oldreliable67 said:
To make such strong charges while our soldiers are in that combat theater of operations is to unnecessarily inflame Iraqi public opinion against our soldiers and place the lives of U.S. servicemen and women in danger of reprisal attacks based upon Murtha’s claims.

So we shouldnt say what they're doing until they're done because if people find out they'll be pissed? Not very honest logic to me...
 

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