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Mitch McConnell....

bongsaway

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In your opinion is Mitch McConnell helping or hurting the GOP in this shutdown debate?
 

OrphanSlug

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I think McConnell is in such a no-win situation that his political career is over. Into the early December time frame knowing what happened to the House in the midterms he was being helpful, then Trump decided to make matters worse putting McConnell in a position where there is nothing he can do. For now he is siding with Trump and that makes him at least partially responsible for the shutdown, if he decided to side with Congress and come up with some sort of compromise without Trump then he would become the target within the party and odds are Trump would try to veto.

All things considered this is what Trump supporters wanted, a mess. Now they have one.
 

WCH

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I think McConnell is in such a no-win situation that his political career is over. Into the early December time frame knowing what happened to the House in the midterms he was being helpful, then Trump decided to make matters worse putting McConnell in a position where there is nothing he can do. For now he is siding with Trump and that makes him at least partially responsible for the shutdown, if he decided to side with Congress and come up with some sort of compromise without Trump then he would become the target within the party and odds are Trump would try to veto.

All things considered this is what Trump supporters wanted, a mess. Now they have one.

And everything was just lovely before Trump. It takes two (or more) to dance in politics.

Not a single admin or congress has dealt with the border issues in recent history. At least now someone is trying.
 

washunut

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In your opinion is Mitch McConnell helping or hurting the GOP in this shutdown debate?

Probably equal to what Pelosi/Schumer are doing for their team. The real question,does either team care about team America. Any answer to that other than no is naive IMO.
 

bongsaway

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Probably equal to what Pelosi/Schumer are doing for their team. The real question,does either team care about team America. Any answer to that other than no is naive IMO.

Were that true, the polls wouldn't overwhelmingly show trump/republicans are losing in the eye of the public. Even all the polls on here agree.

Trump shut down the government. Trying to blame the democrats too is laughable.
 

bongsaway

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I think McConnell is in such a no-win situation that his political career is over. Into the early December time frame knowing what happened to the House in the midterms he was being helpful, then Trump decided to make matters worse putting McConnell in a position where there is nothing he can do. For now he is siding with Trump and that makes him at least partially responsible for the shutdown, if he decided to side with Congress and come up with some sort of compromise without Trump then he would become the target within the party and odds are Trump would try to veto.

All things considered this is what Trump supporters wanted, a mess. Now they have one.

I agree. Trump and the republicans have painted themselves into a no win corner no matter which way they go.
 

bongsaway

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And everything was just lovely before Trump. It takes two (or more) to dance in politics.

Not a single admin or congress has dealt with the border issues in recent history. At least now someone is trying.

Are you implying the border security we do have, doesn't exist? It got there somehow, I see it on television all the time.
 

WCH

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Are you implying the border security we do have, doesn't exist? It got there somehow, I see it on television all the time.

We had "catch and release", rampant drug and human trafficking, sanctuary cities, DACA kids, visa overstays, etc. long before Trump was ever POTUS. No one was doing crap about it until now.
 

OrphanSlug

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And everything was just lovely before Trump. It takes two (or more) to dance in politics.

Not a single admin or congress has dealt with the border issues in recent history. At least now someone is trying.

I am not really saying much adversarial to what you are saying.

My issue is how this government shutdown came to be and the position it put McConnell in. The truth is we already have a mixture of walls, fences, surveillance, and "border security" to the tune of billions per year, something like we have spent more in the past 5 years than the past several decades on all this.

Before Trump decided to throw his government shutdown temper tantrum there was a deal on the table to spend even more on border security.

But the point of this thread is what McConnell is doing (or not doing.) At this point there is no way out for McConnell and the sharks all realize this. If he continues to side with Trump (and it appears he will,) then he will block anything coming to the floor that is absent wall specific funding and that means he aligns himself with Trump on owning this shutdown. Trump wanted it, warned about it, and then boasted he would be happy to do it. If McConnell decides to break from Trump and secure a deal (that would have to be veto proof) then he would by implication split Republicans from Trump with all the predicted fallout that will occur.

All of this is Trump hijacking government for a wall, and his offer is a slap in the face.

McConnell also accomplished something else that we are not talking much about, he has by effect changed the balance of power Constitutionally. Literally blocking bills from consideration in the Senate because Trump says no, and that speaks to an unwritten Constitutional shift in the balance between legislation and executive. We are hearing news today that McConnell is considering allowing Trump's offer to the floor of the Senate for consideration, confirming that McConnell has literally allowed the Senate to start and stop with Trump's wishes.

I consider that something very worthy of discussion, confirming for me that McConnell is going to have a tough time saving his career.
 

tres borrachos

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We had "catch and release", rampant drug and human trafficking, sanctuary cities, DACA kids, visa overstays, etc. long before Trump was ever POTUS. No one was doing crap about it until now.

What is Trump doing about the Visa overstays? The wall won't help there.

Trump is offering a 3 year kick the can down the road solution to the "DACA kids".

What can Trump do about the sanctuary cities?

So we don't release anyone anymore? Link, please?

What is Trump doing about the "rampant" drug and human trafficking? Drugs mostly come from legal ports of entry.
 

RaleBulgarian

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We had "catch and release", rampant drug and human trafficking, sanctuary cities, DACA kids, visa overstays, etc. long before Trump was ever POTUS. No one was doing crap about it until now.
What is Trump doing about all these ^^ issues? Please be specific explaining his actions for each one you’ve listed.
 

jnug

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And everything was just lovely before Trump. It takes two (or more) to dance in politics.

Not a single admin or congress has dealt with the border issues in recent history. At least now someone is trying.

to bring the Government and the Constitution down around all of our ears.
 

WCH

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RaleBulgarian

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Too many to list. In the mean time all the Left does is bitch. [as in evidence here]
https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/...-in-just-20-months-relentless-promise-keeping
Not what I asked.

I asked for you to provide information on specific actions with regards to the claim you made in the below post.
We had "catch and release", rampant drug and human trafficking, sanctuary cities, DACA kids, visa overstays, etc. long before Trump was ever POTUS. No one was doing crap about it until now.
 

MACS-24

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In your opinion is Mitch McConnell helping or hurting the GOP in this shutdown debate?

Neither but this Kentuckian think it is long past time for McConnell to retire.
 

Irwin Corey

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In your opinion is Mitch McConnell helping or hurting the GOP in this shutdown debate?

IMHO, our self appointed Emperor - President God Almighty Turtle McConnell is damaging the GOP, all American People and the country as a whole.
 

RaleBulgarian

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If you can't read the link maybe you shouldn't post here.
If you aren’t willing/able to back up what you post, you definitely shouldn’t be here.
 

Helix

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I'd say that most people have made up their minds about the Trumpist party by now, so I doubt the Trump / McConnell move to deny pay to federal workers will change it much.
 

NebraskaFtball

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In your opinion is Mitch McConnell helping or hurting the GOP in this shutdown debate?

I think it depends on what parameters you're viewing this through. Is he hurting the GOP with its Trumplican base? No. Definitely not. They have proven themselves to be more of a sycophantic cult-like mentality than objective observers of the pro's and con's of issues such as the shutdown.

Is it hurting the GOP with Independents? I'd say it has to be. Although I would not be surprised if many Independents will eventually tire of both sides of the aisle, given enough time. The advantage Democrats have here, is Independents have been trending away from the GOP for some time, and Trump's form of governance (or lack thereof) kicked this into overdrive.
 

bongsaway

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I think it depends on what parameters you're viewing this through. Is he hurting the GOP with its Trumplican base? No. Definitely not. They have proven themselves to be more of a sycophantic cult-like mentality than objective observers of the pro's and con's of issues such as the shutdown.

Is it hurting the GOP with Independents? I'd say it has to be. Although I would not be surprised if many Independents will eventually tire of both sides of the aisle, given enough time. The advantage Democrats have here, is Independents have been trending away from the GOP for some time, and Trump's form of governance (or lack thereof) kicked this into overdrive.

It really is independents who swing almost every election. I agree with your assessment.
 

NebraskaFtball

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Too many to list. In the mean time all the Left does is bitch. [as in evidence here]

https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/...-in-just-20-months-relentless-promise-keeping

This garbage again? :lol:

One more time, this is propaganda submitted by the Trump administration to the Washington Examiner, and then reported on as if it were their own documenting of events and articulation. Which the Trump administration then points back to in order to say, "See...see guys! Look at all we have accomplished." It is a bogus list. I pointed out a couple of examples of it being bogus to you before, which you were incapable of refuting, which said everything we need to know about the veracity of the claims.
 
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