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Milwaukee, Another Case of Blacks Rioting for all the Wrong Reasons

lol...I went to high school and college in the region, and left when the industry decided to begin manufacturing cars and automotive components in the Southern states. Now they manufacture almost everything South of I-40 and build huge plants in Saltillo, Mexico.

The demise of the cities and death of manufacturing in them was a combination of union busting, Reagan starving cities of funds, and local D corruption. Drugs too were a major problem. Damn auto plants in the city during the late 70]s had issues with vice: gambling, drugs loan sharking, prostitution, etc; that rivaled those in the Cass Corridor.

There is still some automotive manufacturing in Illinois, Michigan, Ohio and PA, etc. Wisconsin lost it's big Truck and Bus GM plant back in '08.

The bulk of domestic American automotive manufacturing is now done by small non-union suppliers out in the sticks. Japanese and other foreign car companies are non-union. So, they have huge plants in places like OH, KY, TN and AL. These places are out there for several reasons. Small companies and foreign plants in rural areas are harder to organize; they are almost never located along bus routes; property taxes are low, as are other infrastructure expenses, and regulations are lax. As a result, most of these places are 90% white, with management approaching 100%--unless we're talking about the Japanese transplants, those companies are 50-50 Japanese and White.

Few people build manufacturing plants in the city anymore.

Here's another thing that happens when you have good leadership. You're the mayor of Detroit (Coleman Young) in the 70's and 80's. You get together with the leaders of the unions and the auto companies and say "look guys, we have everything here to make great cars cheaply...thousands of machine shops and plants all around Metro Detroit so shipping alone will be dirt cheap, let's come to an agreement on how we can work well together". How bad of a leader do you have to be for everyone to leave Detroit in droves?
 
The suburbs built up around Detroit and the auto industry. Most of the suburbs are doing fine. Why?

from the post you just quoted

The bulk of domestic American automotive manufacturing is now done by small non-union suppliers out in the sticks. Japanese and other foreign car companies are non-union. So, they have huge plants in places like OH, KY, TN and AL. These places are out there for several reasons. Small companies and foreign plants in rural areas are harder to organize; they are almost never located along bus routes; property taxes are low, as are other infrastructure expenses, and regulations are lax. As a result, most of these places are 90% white, with management approaching 100%...

What you're calling suburbs are really exurbs along I-696, M14 around Plymouth and Ann Arbor, US23 North up toward Brighton and into Fenton, or South along I-275.
 
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from the post you just quoted

Actually, many of those plants and machine shops are in the suburbs, which aren't by any means "the sticks". They're highly populated cities that for some reason for the most part are thriving while Detroit is perpetually struggling.
 
Here's another thing that happens when you have good leadership. You're the mayor of Detroit (Coleman Young) in the 70's and 80's. You get together with the leaders of the unions and the auto companies and say "look guys, we have everything here to make great cars cheaply...thousands of machine shops and plants all around Metro Detroit so shipping alone will be dirt cheap, let's come to an agreement on how we can work well together". How bad of a leader do you have to be for everyone to leave Detroit in droves?

People were voting with their feet during the Young years just as they have been for all my life. It was clear since the 50's that the city was in decline, those who could leave did leave.

detoit-pop.jpg
 
Cops shoot an armed scumbag. So, what happens? THe good people of the area take to the streets and burn their own **** to the ground. Senseless.

Senselessness of it all is exasperated more so even when we see that this scumbag has previously been charged with intimidating witnesses in a shooting case. So, this guy was a "super predator." The cops shot someone who is the exact kind of person who ruins these neighborhoods. And, the residents blame the cops?

This is a death the people in these areas should be cheering. Why are their priorities so ****ed up?


Man shot by Milwaukee police subject of witness intimidation case

That plus the scumbag being armed and dangerous...
Firstly - this guy's record of arrests even though not convicted, and him running from the coppers, would seem to indicate he's dirty with something and until the facts come out further I'm surely not going to defend him.

But much here has been made about him being armed. However, if he has a legit CCW as claimed in the OP piece, he has every right to be armed!

Now that being said, a CCW does not absolve one from misusing a weapon - and suffering the consequences.

But until evidence comes forward describing what he did to require the use of lethal force, this guy had the legit right to be armed it seems, and the presence of a gun alone does not justify lethal force.

It may be justified in this instance, but we do not yet know.

I'm becoming a bit concerned that coppers may be approaching otherwise non lethal situations, seeing an armed individual, and then subsequently ratcheting-up their response.

This may have happened in the Minnesota shoot several weeks ago when the driver of the car reached for his wallet exposing his gun. I'd like to re-iterate "may".

And let's be perfectly honest, in a traffic stop of a car-full of brothers, especially if the bros dress and/or act ghetto, the moment a gun is seen the copper's anxiety is going to go flying through the roof (at least until it's ascertained the guy has a CCW).

The guy here likely was dirty and may indeed have forced the police to shoot. But he did have a legal right to be armed.
 
Here's another thing that happens when you have good leadership. You're the mayor of Detroit (Coleman Young) in the 70's and 80's. You get together with the leaders of the unions and the auto companies and say "look guys, we have everything here to make great cars cheaply...thousands of machine shops and plants all around Metro Detroit so shipping alone will be dirt cheap, let's come to an agreement on how we can work well together". How bad of a leader do you have to be for everyone to leave Detroit in droves?

I'm no fan of Coleman Young or any other Detroit mayor over the past 50 years. But, in his defense, this was way beyond anything the "leadership" of a Coleman Young could do. This was nation wide. Rochester, Buffalo, Eerie, Youngstown, Pittsburgh, Cleveland, Gary, etc etc etc...They don't call it the Rust Belt for nothing. Coleman would have had to have been General Grant at Appomattox to pull that off.
 
Firstly - this guy's record of arrests even though not convicted, and him running from the coppers, would seem to indicate he's dirty with something and until the facts come out further I'm surely not going to defend him.

But much here has been made about him being armed. However, if he has a legit CCW as claimed in the OP piece, he has every right to be armed!

Now that being said, a CCW does not absolve one from misusing a weapon - and suffering the consequences.

But until evidence comes forward describing what he did to require the use of lethal force, this guy had the legit right to be armed it seems, and the presence of a gun alone does not justify lethal force.

It may be justified in this instance, but we do not yet know.

I'm becoming a bit concerned that coppers may be approaching otherwise non lethal situations, seeing an armed individual, and then subsequently ratcheting-up their response.

This may have happened in the Minnesota shoot several weeks ago when the driver of the car reached for his wallet exposing his gun. I'd like to re-iterate "may".

And let's be perfectly honest, in a traffic stop of a car-full of brothers, especially if the bros dress and/or act ghetto, the moment a gun is seen the copper's anxiety is going to go flying through the roof (at least until it's ascertained the guy has a CCW).

The guy here likely was dirty and may indeed have forced the police to shoot. But he did have a legal right to be armed.

I draw the line at intimidating witnesses. That's the exact sort of thing that ruins these neighborhoods. So, as far as I am concerned, this death is good riddance.
 
I'm no fan of Coleman Young or any other Detroit mayor over the past 50 years. But, in his defense, this was way beyond anything the "leadership" of a Coleman Young could do. This was nation wide. Rochester, Buffalo, Eerie, Youngstown, Pittsburgh, Cleveland, Gary, etc etc etc...They don't call it the Rust Belt for nothing. Coleman would have had to have been General Grant at Appomattox to pull that off.

All run by Democrats. If you were given a wealthy city and you started to slowly see your main industry leaving, would you do anything about it?
 
All run by Democrats. If you were given a wealthy city and you started to slowly see your main industry leaving, would you do anything about it?

I live near Cincinnati and Dayton now. Both cities transitioned from heavy dependence on automotive to a mix of aerospace, medical and light automotive manufacturing, mostly components. The old GM Truck plant is now a Chinese owned glass manufacturing plant, for example. North and East of here is Honda country.

Most engineering jobs in the Dayton are now Master's Degree level, be it for advanced bio-medical devices or defense related research positions. Cincinnati is a big home for many German owned manufacturing companies, GE aircraft engines and various consumer goods. Columbus is big on R&D for various things high tech, from medical to electronics and everything in between. Unions never really had that much power around these parts. It shows.
 
I draw the line at intimidating witnesses. That's the exact sort of thing that ruins these neighborhoods. So, as far as I am concerned, this death is good riddance.
Fair enough. (even though alleged, not proven in court)

My concern here is with CCW holders and the police response to them.

A guy with a gun today cannot be assumed to be a bad guy anymore, as was often the case in times past.
 
Cops shoot an armed scumbag. So, what happens? THe good people of the area take to the streets and burn their own **** to the ground. Senseless.

Senselessness of it all is exasperated more so even when we see that this scumbag has previously been charged with intimidating witnesses in a shooting case. So, this guy was a "super predator." The cops shot someone who is the exact kind of person who ruins these neighborhoods. And, the residents blame the cops?

This is a death the people in these areas should be cheering. Why are their priorities so ****ed up?


Man shot by Milwaukee police subject of witness intimidation case

They did not burn their own sh*t down, those doing the rioting and burning probably own nothing. Too bad the shop owners did not learn the lesson Korean shop keepers in Compton showed how to deal with looters.
 
Fair enough. (even though alleged, not proven in court)
Well, yeah. But, of course, one way to beat all those court cases is to intimidate witnesses. :)

My concern here is with CCW holders and the police response to them.

A guy with a gun today cannot be assumed to be a bad guy anymore, as was often the case in times past.
He had the gun out, from what I've read so far. That's the last thing a trained CCW holder would do when confronted with LEO.
 
Well, yeah. But, of course, one way to beat all those court cases is to intimidate witnesses. :)


He had the gun out, from what I've read so far. That's the last thing a trained CCW holder would do when confronted with LEO.
I agree, if true

He'd be trained how to correctly respond in his CCW class, which would be to remain calm with hands visible, and respectfully inform the officer he was a CCW holder and had his weapon on his person.

And please forgive my cynicism, but I spent much of my life in a large city with one of the crookedest police forces in the nation.

It's likely not the case here, but I do have concerns that when bad or gray area shoots happen the police can use the CCW holder's on person weapon as an excuse for their poor actions. When I was a kid coming-up in the city, cops too often carried "drop" guns! And those that didn't, often carried metal combs! It was pretty amazing how often people were shot back then due to turning with a "shiny object", that later turned out to be a metal comb (or Zippo lighter).
 
Unless, something changes it appears we are in for a few more YEARS of the same. Its almost unbelievable to me that the majority of people in the U.S. are ignorant enough to want MORE.

They don't want more. The problem is their only source of information is the media which is so bias it is criminal. Look how John Kerry can joke about assassinating the president and the media is fine with it. Trump doesn't even say it and has words put in his mouth and is accused of saying he wants the Hillary assassinated. Half the idiots I talk to who listen to our corrupt propaganda media actually believe Trump outright said to assassinate Hillary when it was nothing but a twisted interpretation of what he said by sick individuals.

Germany proved how successful a bias media can be towards the peoples opinion of their leaders.

Just take a look.

 
Was there a Republican candidate? If not, how do you expect to change that?

So it is the Republican parties fault because the city is full of Democrats? Victim much?
 
Milwaukee appears to be another Detroit-like donut city--places where there is a strong and vibrant economy in the outer belt and nothing but blight in the city center.

From the PDF above:


There is a lot of blame to go around for why this happens. But, that it may be what lies beneath all these problems is hard to ignore.

Maybe people aren't investing in the core of the city because they don't want their businesses burnt down, burglarized or their employees mugged or shot.
 
Firstly - this guy's record of arrests even though not convicted, and him running from the coppers, would seem to indicate he's dirty with something and until the facts come out further I'm surely not going to defend him.

But much here has been made about him being armed. However, if he has a legit CCW as claimed in the OP piece, he has every right to be armed!

Now that being said, a CCW does not absolve one from misusing a weapon - and suffering the consequences.

But until evidence comes forward describing what he did to require the use of lethal force, this guy had the legit right to be armed it seems, and the presence of a gun alone does not justify lethal force.

It may be justified in this instance, but we do not yet know.

I'm becoming a bit concerned that coppers may be approaching otherwise non lethal situations, seeing an armed individual, and then subsequently ratcheting-up their response.

This may have happened in the Minnesota shoot several weeks ago when the driver of the car reached for his wallet exposing his gun. I'd like to re-iterate "may".

And let's be perfectly honest, in a traffic stop of a car-full of brothers, especially if the bros dress and/or act ghetto, the moment a gun is seen the copper's anxiety is going to go flying through the roof (at least until it's ascertained the guy has a CCW).

The guy here likely was dirty and may indeed have forced the police to shoot. But he did have a legal right to be armed.

You bring up a good point. Here are some statements from the OP article:
Online court records show Smith has one prior conviction for carrying a concealed weapon, a misdemeanor. The rest of the arrests did not result in charges or were dismissed.
Smith was charged with first-degree recklessly endangering safety, a felony, on Feb. 3, 2015. Details of the shooting were not immediately clear from the documents.

While that case was pending, Smith was charged with felony witness intimidation after prosecutors said he was intimidating the victim in the first case.

Why did he have a CCW permit? That seems weird. The only one stating that he had a CCW is his mother. I am not sure she is correct. He might have told her he had one but he had been charged before with having an illegally concealed weapon.
 
Why did this happen? That's the question many are asking in the aftermath of the fury that erupted in the Sherman Park area Saturday night.

As a person who lives less than one mile from where the BP gas station was torched to the ground late Saturday, I can tell you that the neighborhood — once the place in Milwaukee for upwardly mobile, middle-class African Americans — has been balancing on the tipping point for years.

The fatal police shooting of an armed black man around 3:30 p.m. Saturday may have provided the spark, but the neighborhood has been on high simmer, with the temperature rising each year since the Great Recession, as the longed-for recovery never arrives.
Causey: Neighborhood caught in downward spiral

This is a Must Read.

Best paragraph:
I'm describing what I've seen, a cycle of one thing leading to another, how the loss of jobs breaks some people and families, how self-destructive behavior multiplies, how drug use and crime proliferate — how the negative cycle feeds on itself, becoming a whirlpool, sucking a community downward, taking the innocent as well as the guilty.
 
Is it? Blacks have tied themselves to the democrat party to the level of around 95%. So blacks rioting is democrats rioting. Remember, republicans are the party of angry white men. Angry black men are all democrats. Thats just how it is. Dont get mad at me. Get your base under control.

These people have spent a lifetime having the left drum it in their heads that they are less than capable, they need gov't help, GOP'ers are out to enslave them...etc etc etc. This is all the product of liberalism, the entitlement mentality. Decades of failed leftist policy created your Fergusons, Baltimores, and now Milwaukee. And then when things blow up, the left looks at their shoes.

I'm so grateful I don't live in those leftist controlled cesspools.
 
A book was written about this neighborhood, which is no shock because the history is fascinating. So is this review:

This is the story about the organization and experience of a community coming together to create a unique and superlative integrated neighborhood. Realtors attempted to create a block busting landslide in Sherman Park simultaneously with the city devastating much of neighborhood by a freeway boondoggle that flattened some of the best housing stock in Milwaukee. Citizens of Sherman Park decided to turn these event into a 2 decade long celebration of inclusion. They organized to protect property values in a neighborhood of great homes. They became engaged in school politics; they organized soccer before it was a national cliche; they celebrated together; bought a tavern and ran it and more. They showed how an American community could be: vital, successful, effective and integrated. What Americans can do if they want to create community instead of obstruct and exploit differences. My disclaimer, of course, is that I lived there during that time and had 20 years of the most unusual positive life experiences possible in this country. Our children, grown up there, look back and realize that there were only a very few possible places to grow up like they did.
The departure of major employers eventually overrode the ability of the community to maintain. Living wage jobs disappeared and those that could moved away. It is still a model of what could be today if people chose not to be so exclusive. I think we'd be far happier country if we did.
https://www.amazon.com/Sherman-Park...mmary?ie=UTF8&showViewpoints=1&sortBy=helpful

This is a sad tale for liberals and maybe us socialists too all around. All that work done, all that celebrating of diversity...actually inviting the blacks in...but it never really worked. Then the project flat out collapsed, and everyone who could leave did leave.
 
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They did not burn their own sh*t down, those doing the rioting and burning probably own nothing.

Always be wary of the people who feel they've got nothing to lose.
 
It was Sherman Park activists who saved the area from the intrusion of a freeway. The Park West was planned as a link between Interstate 43 and the proposed Stadium North Freeway (Interstate 41). Led by the SPCA, a coalition of seven different neighborhoods vigorously protested the building of the Park West. They succeeded in forcing a court injunction that stopped the freeway's construction. About 10 blocks of Sherman Park's southeast corner fell to the bulldozer, but ultimately the Park West plan was quashed by the federal government due to lack of public support.
OnMilwaukee.com Travel & Visitors Guide: Sherman Park still one of Milwaukee's most vibrant areas

My Uncle was one of the leaders of this effort. I never heard much about it because his brother, my dad, was a pretty hard core liberal hater.....it was one of the things that was not to be talked about at family gatherings. Another thing was how my Uncle did self harm to avoid going to Nam (he broke his foot)

Interesting enough he moved to Minneapolis, and he wanted the Sherman Park experience. Soon after they bought a place in a dicey area it clearly started to suffer white flight, but he held on. His house was worth less than he paid 17 years after when he sold it because the area went completely to hell. He started to fear for his safety, and that of my aunt, so eventually they threw in the towel. They moved to a very nice upper middle class white neighborhood.
 
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Causey: Neighborhood caught in downward spiral

This is a Must Read.

Best paragraph:

I'm describing what I've seen, a cycle of one thing leading to another, how the loss of jobs breaks some people and families, how self-destructive behavior multiplies, how drug use and crime proliferate — how the negative cycle feeds on itself, becoming a whirlpool, sucking a community downward, taking the innocent as well as the guilty.
His description of his community applies to innumerable post-industrial Northern cities.
 
Meanwhile, Milwaukee Alderman Khalif Rainey says:

“This is a warning cry. Do we continue with the inequities, the injustice, the unemployment, the undereducation that creates these byproducts that we seen this evening? Do we continue that… The black people of Milwaukee are tired of living under this oppression… This is what it’s like living under this oppression… No one here can deny the fact that there is problems, racial problems here in Milwaukee, Wisconsin that have to be closely not examined but rectified. Rectify this immediately because if you don’t this vision of downtown, all of that, you one day away. You one day away.”
 
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