Militarized police forces throughout the US carry out mass arrests

[VanceMack]

How ****ing stupid would you have to be to believe that the 'violent scumbags' aren't directly related to the War on Drugs and the government funding and running the drug cartels that in turn spawn these violent scumbags?

Who said there wasnt some relation? But now...lets be honest here. Do you believe those violent thugs will just turn to happy jolly law abiding citizens if drugs become legal? Do you have much knowledge of criminal enterprise, organized crime, human trafficking, etc?

 

[VanceMack]

You'd rather we keep going down the path we're going? If we do not stop our government it's going to cause World War 3 and end the world as we know it.

Those protesting in the streets are as likely to trigger riots over violations of safe spaces and harsh words as they are over some farcical black lives matter movement that was built on lies and bigotry. You are trying to shoehorn a pet cause into this and it doesnt fit no matter how hard you squeeze.

 

[Fledermaus]

People won't stop killing cops until the government ends the drug war, which is really a war on citizens (specifically, the black community).
I'm not advocated it, I'm just saying, you're bring unrealistic if you think that dominating the population with brute government force is going to solve anything.
And this isn't a new thing, either.

No, the drug war is not a war against the black community. Ask any SoCal meth head that.

(While I do believe the punishment for various drug violations need to be leveled)

I believe most recreational drugs should be decriminalized.

That won't stop people from killing cops.

What works wonders is doing exactly what one is told during stops. It is not a 100% cure, but has worked every time I or my co-workers and friends and family have tried it.

And yes, I have seen the business end of a 12 guage more than once.

 

[Abbazorkzog]

Those protesting in the streets are as likely to trigger riots over violations of safe spaces and harsh words as they are over some farcical black lives matter movement that was built on lies and bigotry. You are trying to shoehorn a pet cause into this and it doesnt fit no matter how hard you squeeze.

I have not once talked about BLM, but since you brought it up - 'blue' lives are only blue '40 hours a week', black lives are black 24/7.

It has nothing to do with black people, it has everything to do with the police.

 

[Abbazorkzog]

No, the drug war is not a war against the black community. Ask any SoCal meth head that.

(While I do believe the punishment for various drug violations need to be leveled)

I believe most recreational drugs should be decriminalized.

That won't stop people from killing cops.

What works wonders is doing exactly what one is told during stops. It is not a 100% cure, but has worked every time I or my co-workers and friends and family have tried it.

And yes, I have seen the business end of a 12 guage more than once.

I feel the same way about demilitarizing the counter-drug initiative.

 

[blaxshep]

If Black Lives Matter, the best thing the black community could do to save their own lives is teach their kids that, while the gangsta thug culture is fun entertainment, when a cop pulls you over do what they ask you and be respectful.

 

[Casper]

I have not once talked about BLM, but since you brought it up - 'blue' lives are only blue '40 hours a week', black lives are black 24/7.

It has nothing to do with black people, it has everything to do with the police.

Actually a cop is a cop 24/7, or did you not know that.

 

[Abbazorkzog]

If Black Lives Matter, the best thing the black community could do to save their own lives is teach their kids that, while the gangsta thug culture is fun entertainment, when a cop pulls you over do what they ask you and be respectful.

Agreed. But I am under the impression that BLM was mainly trying to get the attention of the country toward police brutality and the militarization of our police forces.
Of course, every orchard has its bad apples.

 

[Abbazorkzog]

Actually a cop is a cop 24/7, or did you not know that.

What a load of bull**** cop is an occupation.

 

[Casper]

What a load of bull**** cop is an occupation.

So you admit that you do not know squat about being a cop or what their occupation entails, I will remember to add that to the list of things you know nothing about but profess to be knowledgeable on.:roll:

 

[Fledermaus]

Agreed. But I am under the impression that BLM was mainly trying to get the attention of the country toward police brutality and the militarization of our police forces.
Of course, every orchard has its bad apples.

More the brutality part, much less the military part.

 

[Fledermaus]

What a load of bull**** cop is an occupation.

A profession is a better term.

Rent-a-Cop is an occupation.

 

[Abbazorkzog]

A profession is a better term.

Rent-a-Cop is an occupation.

I still fail to see how Cops and Black people are comparable in any way.

 

[Abbazorkzog]

So you admit that you do not know squat about being a cop or what their occupation entails, I will remember to add that to the list of things you know nothing about but profess to be knowledgeable on.:roll:

None of this. I was stating the simple fact that BLACK IS NOT A ****ING PROFESSION.

 

[humbolt]

What a load of bull**** cop is an occupation.

Well, so is being a doctor. There are any number of occupations that require dedication around the clock at times. Cops, doctors, soldiers, sailors, pilots, - the list is pretty extensive. While the overwhelming majority of occupations do not have such a requirement, some do, and it's part of the reason we hold those who follow such occupations in high esteem. If you need an emergency appendectomy, you likely will not hear the surgeon tell you to check back in the morning after he's had a good night's sleep, a shower, and breakfast. If you happen to live in Grundy, you may have to settle for a large animal vet, though, who's going to pat you on the head and give you a milkbone after you wake up.

 

[Doppelgangirl]

I don't think that at all. The class bully picks on the skinny kid with the glasses and pocket protector, not the wrestling champ.

IMO, the increase in escalation of violent protestors is directly related to the decrease in cosequences. When the mayor says she's going to allow a couple of days of lootin' shootin', and burnin', expect a couple of days of lootin', shootin', and burnin'.

The Dallas situation is a first. By all accounts, the protest was peaceful on both sides. A lone agitator changed that. I don't have an answer for that.

I completely agree with respect to the Dallas incident.


I think the class bully example you give in this instance is an apple-to-orange comparison, however. The police are the ones that have the authority,here. Not the protesters.

IMHO, protest and civil disobedience is used when groups feel they have not been "heard" through other, more structured channels/ methods already in place. When representatives of the "state" show up in SWAT gear as a first resort, it demonstrates that not only are their grievances not being heard, but that the "state" is only interested in shutting them up.

Much like telling someone angry to "calm down" can have the exact opposite effect, and it only makes them more irritated.

 

[cpwill]

The simple fact that we have a Trump Train and a Hillary Train, and the sane ones like Gary Johnson and Ron Paul are marginalized, does nothing but lend credence to my postulation that this system will never help anyone in the long run, in fact, it would sooner see us enslaved, or better yet, destroyed.

There is a reason our Founding Fathers denoted in the Constitution that it is not only a right, but an obligation, to replace the government when it has failed.
If you cannot see that it has failed, you are not paying attention.

I'd hesitate to put Ron Paul in the "sane ones" category, however, a couple of points:

1. the Founders were deeply opposed to the "complete and utter chaos" that you call for. When people started rioting in a manner that you describe they put them down with the Army.

2. That's because they were well read, and knew full well the destruction that flows from chaos and lack of effective governance.

3. We have a mechanism for replacing the Government when it has failed us. It's called elections. If you are upset that a majority of Americans won't share your voting position on Trump and Hillary, well, that's unfortunate (we are in the same boat), but that doesn't give you the right to override them with violence.

4. The worst forms of destruction and enslavement are (historically) generally the result of a period of chaos. Your cure prescription metastasizes the disease.

 

[VanceMack]

I have not once talked about BLM, but since you brought it up - 'blue' lives are only blue '40 hours a week', black lives are black 24/7.

It has nothing to do with black people, it has everything to do with the police.

Wait...you think this thread is about people protesting drug policy???

 

[Harry Guerrilla]

I completely agree with respect to the Dallas incident.


I think the class bully example you give in this instance is an apple-to-orange comparison, however. The police are the ones that have the authority,here. Not the protesters.

IMHO, protest and civil disobedience is used when groups feel they have not been "heard" through other, more structured channels/ methods already in place. When representatives of the "state" show up in SWAT gear as a first resort, it demonstrates that not only are their grievances not being heard, but that the "state" is only interested in shutting them up.

Much like telling someone angry to "calm down" can have the exact opposite effect, and it only makes them more irritated.

Problem with that is that they're outnumbered, protesters are endangering other people, protesters are endangering themselves, protesters are often violent.

You can't kid glove violence.

 

[Fledermaus]

I still fail to see how Cops and Black people are comparable in any way.

Er, I never said they were.

What I said is that the term profession was preferable to the term occupation.

Profession suggests a deeper meaning and commitment than occupation.

I considered the Marines my profession (at the time).

My time as an IT guy is my occupation.

 

[Abbazorkzog]

I'd hesitate to put Ron Paul in the "sane ones" category, however, a couple of points:

1. the Founders were deeply opposed to the "complete and utter chaos" that you call for. When people started rioting in a manner that you describe they put them down with the Army.

2. That's because they were well read, and knew full well the destruction that flows from chaos and lack of effective governance.

3. We have a mechanism for replacing the Government when it has failed us. It's called elections. If you are upset that a majority of Americans won't share your voting position on Trump and Hillary, well, that's unfortunate (we are in the same boat), but that doesn't give you the right to override them with violence.

4. The worst forms of destruction and enslavement are (historically) generally the result of a period of chaos. Your cure prescription metastasizes the disease.

1. Okay so maybe not rioting, but mass civil-disobedience, the government and its forces need to know we are not happy.
2. This government is not effective governance.
3. Many elections are rigged, not just here, and we are becoming over-reliant upon them.
4. Again, a revolution doesn't have to be chaos. But its looking that way.

 

[calamity]

Irrelevant. When the police and military merge, it means the people have become the enemy of the government.

Only certain people...those who are the enemy of the People.

 

[Doppelgangirl]

Problem with that is that they're outnumbered, protesters are endangering other people, protesters are endangering themselves, protesters are often violent.

You can't kid glove violence.

True. However, I think an over armed response can *sometimes* contribute to the violence that occurs. Perceptions matter, particularly in cases where emotions are already at a boiling point.

As I pointed out earlier in the thread, Atlanta protesters were, IIRC, guess-timated around 10,000. APD had SWAT for back up, not as a first line defense. No injuries, no property damage. At one point, protesters climbed on a semi, and it looked like things would get ugly. The Mayor went, in person, out to Williams St to speak directly to the crowd, and the situation settled down.

While I can't say for certain how much those specific events (lack of riot gear on first line defense, mayor speaking) contributed to keeping the peace, it seems to me to at least play *some* part. Again, I believe perceptions matter a great deal in these scenarios. If nothing else, it certainly contributes to the protestors feeling *heard* on some level.

 

[Harry Guerrilla]

True. However, I think an over armed response can *sometimes* contribute to the violence that occurs. Perceptions matter, particularly in cases where emotions are already at a boiling point.

As I pointed out earlier in the thread, Atlanta protesters were, IIRC, guess-timated around 10,000. APD had SWAT for back up, not as a first line defense. No injuries, no property damage. At one point, protesters climbed on a semi, and it looked like things would get ugly. The Mayor went, in person, out to Williams St to speak directly to the crowd, and the situation settled down.

While I can't say for certain how much the specific event contributed to keeping the peace, it seems to me to at least play *some* part. Again, I believe perceptions matter a great deal in these scenarios.

In Baton Rouge, I'd arm them up too.
Given that it's the heart of one of the situations.

Kaseem Rheed is ok, responded pretty well.
Although they had to stop them from trying to get on the interstate, which he had already told them they couldn't do.

Cops are in a rock and a hard place.
Damned if they do, damned if they don't.
When they don't (like in San Jose) they get rightfully criticized by non-BLM people, when they do they get criticized by BLM people.

 

[RetiredUSN]

Perhaps if governments governed in a lawful manner, there would be no protests?

Nothing wrong with protests at all, and they are proven to be effective.

But if you act like a freaking fool, you can expect to be treated accordingly.