• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every persons position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

Meanwhile in China

jbi

Active member
Joined
Sep 20, 2012
Messages
401
Reaction score
46
Gender
Undisclosed
Political Leaning
Undisclosed
One type 075 LHD, one 055 Destroyer and one type 094 Ballistic missile submarine all commissioned on the same day.

The drum beat grows louder in Asia

 

Fabiusbile

Active member
Joined
Jun 8, 2020
Messages
299
Reaction score
45
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Other
And instead of cooperating with Russia to contain China, Western countries are doing everything to create a new eastern bloc.
 

SayMyName

Live, Love, Laugh.
DP Veteran
Joined
Aug 17, 2013
Messages
1,102
Reaction score
571
Location
Shanghai, China
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Undisclosed
One type 075 LHD, one 055 Destroyer and one type 094 Ballistic missile submarine all commissioned on the same day.

The drum beat grows louder in Asia

I live and work in China. I work in marketing and advertising these days making China look good. I can tell you now that just about every video production and news release, especially any video produced in mainland Han communist China, is not to be taken seriously. Over the last month, because of US fleet activity near Taiwan, nearly every ship of the PLAN (Peoples Liberation Army Navy) has stayed in port, from Xiamen to Qingdao. Economic activity will never return to what it was, and that was what built up the fleet they do have today. They are spending money saved on yesterday's economic progress. Those days are gone. Industry is struggling here. Their fleet is still no where near the tonnage of the American. They would need at least parity to take on the Americans, and remember, that is when experience and training come in. The Americans have a long history of battle at mondern sea combat. Mainland China has none, except for that of harassing fishing boats belonging to neighboring states. And, lest we forget, they would not only take on the Americans. Out of self interest and common hatred of the mainland Han communist regime, nearly every country surrounding China would join in, if not to help the Americans, then to take advantage of the situation and get back. These videos and many like them from the CCP Propaganda department, most of which is filled with writers and others from the west cutting their teeth, are made mostly for internal consumption to keep Chinese on the mainland in line through feelings of nationalism. They are not taken seriously by anyone outside China, though they are used by military officers of senior rank to gain more funding.
 
Last edited:

fortune

New member
Joined
Jun 10, 2020
Messages
40
Reaction score
5
Location
earth
Gender
Undisclosed
Political Leaning
Other
I live and work in China. I work in marketing and advertising these days making China look good. I can tell you now that just about every video production and news release, especially any video produced in mainland Han communist China, is not to be taken seriously. Over the last month, because of US fleet activity near Taiwan, nearly every ship of the PLAN (Peoples Liberation Army Navy) has stayed in port, from Xiamen to Qingdao. Economic activity will never return to what it was, and that was what built up the fleet they do have today. They are spending money saved on yesterday's economic progress. Those days are gone. Industry is struggling here. Their fleet is still no where near the tonnage of the American. They would need at least parity to take on the Americans, and remember, that is when experience and training come in. The Americans have a long history of battle at mondern sea combat. Mainland China has none, except for that of harassing fishing boats belonging to neighboring states. And, lest we forget, they would not only take on the Americans. Out of self interest and common hatred of the mainland Han communist regime, nearly every country surrounding China would join in, if not to help the Americans, then to take advantage of the situation and get back. These videos and many like them from the CCP Propaganda department, most of which is filled with writers and others from the west cutting their teeth, are made mostly for internal consumption to keep Chinese on the mainland in line through feelings of nationalism. They are not taken seriously by anyone outside China, though they are used by military officers of senior rank to gain more funding.
I am only recently comming to understand China's economy. Thanks for that cogent explanation.
 

fortune

New member
Joined
Jun 10, 2020
Messages
40
Reaction score
5
Location
earth
Gender
Undisclosed
Political Leaning
Other
I live and work in China. I work in marketing and advertising these days making China look good. I can tell you now that just about every video production and news release, especially any video produced in mainland Han communist China, is not to be taken seriously. Over the last month, because of US fleet activity near Taiwan, nearly every ship of the PLAN (Peoples Liberation Army Navy) has stayed in port, from Xiamen to Qingdao. Economic activity will never return to what it was, and that was what built up the fleet they do have today. They are spending money saved on yesterday's economic progress. Those days are gone. Industry is struggling here. Their fleet is still no where near the tonnage of the American. They would need at least parity to take on the Americans, and remember, that is when experience and training come in. The Americans have a long history of battle at mondern sea combat. Mainland China has none, except for that of harassing fishing boats belonging to neighboring states. And, lest we forget, they would not only take on the Americans. Out of self interest and common hatred of the mainland Han communist regime, nearly every country surrounding China would join in, if not to help the Americans, then to take advantage of the situation and get back. These videos and many like them from the CCP Propaganda department, most of which is filled with writers and others from the west cutting their teeth, are made mostly for internal consumption to keep Chinese on the mainland in line through feelings of nationalism. They are not taken seriously by anyone outside China, though they are used by military officers of senior rank to gain more funding.
following up as you seem so informed. Are you a Chinese citizen? Do you have the safety not to be hurt if you jus type the words "Tiananmen Square" without getting arrested? Would like to discuss SCS here with someone tuned in but you could be a spy LOL
 

SayMyName

Live, Love, Laugh.
DP Veteran
Joined
Aug 17, 2013
Messages
1,102
Reaction score
571
Location
Shanghai, China
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Undisclosed
following up as you seem so informed. Are you a Chinese citizen? Do you have the safety not to be hurt if you jus type the words "Tiananmen Square" without getting arrested? Would like to discuss SCS here with someone tuned in but you could be a spy LOL
1. I am American.
2. I will never type that and other sensitive words in a Chinese search engine, or on Wechat, TikTok and other social media here.
3. You could well be right. But, I am not.
 

Tangmo

DP Veteran
Joined
Jun 15, 2014
Messages
17,007
Reaction score
3,244
Location
VPN @ PRC/HKG/SPORE/JPN/LA/UK/CANADA/INDIA/ EU
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Progressive
I live and work in China. I work in marketing and advertising these days making China look good. I can tell you now that just about every video production and news release, especially any video produced in mainland Han communist China, is not to be taken seriously. Over the last month, because of US fleet activity near Taiwan, nearly every ship of the PLAN (Peoples Liberation Army Navy) has stayed in port, from Xiamen to Qingdao. Economic activity will never return to what it was, and that was what built up the fleet they do have today. They are spending money saved on yesterday's economic progress. Those days are gone. Industry is struggling here. Their fleet is still no where near the tonnage of the American. They would need at least parity to take on the Americans, and remember, that is when experience and training come in. The Americans have a long history of battle at mondern sea combat. Mainland China has none, except for that of harassing fishing boats belonging to neighboring states. And, lest we forget, they would not only take on the Americans. Out of self interest and common hatred of the mainland Han communist regime, nearly every country surrounding China would join in, if not to help the Americans, then to take advantage of the situation and get back. These videos and many like them from the CCP Propaganda department, most of which is filled with writers and others from the west cutting their teeth, are made mostly for internal consumption to keep Chinese on the mainland in line through feelings of nationalism. They are not taken seriously by anyone outside China, though they are used by military officers of senior rank to gain more funding.

You post almost as much as I do lol except you get a response, ie, few if anyone replies to my regularly lengthy posts about the CCP-PRC.

I'm an American too but I'm in Shenzhen and have been in GuangDong (province) off and on since January 2008, to include GuangZhou which in addition to being provincial capital is Ye Olde Canton, and Chaoshan in central GD where a lot of folk in Singapore originated in addition to substantially populating Hong Kong.

I've posted a lot to China threads and forums so the Security Bureau Police know who I am and they leave it at that. Public Security Bureau flatfoot censors harass my computer and network connections continually so I use a superb VPN, Express VPN in USA, which includes a China specialty to beat 'em every time. PSB flatfoot censors can defeat the low hanging fruit VPNs but not Express VPN.

I started out teaching English full time for private language schools, became foreign services director at one and then another, moved on to a university in GZ, and transitioned to privately owned business groups in Chaoshan and now Shenzhen, although I also do some private tutoring for kids of industrialists. I have a ten year visa (expires '26) but had to quit doing visa runs to HKG when Covid hit cause they quarantine Americans on sight there.

I've learned that the overriding characteristic of the Chinese is that every dynasty fails. China continues while its dynasties fail, one after the other, every one. The CCP is a dynasty in business suits and florsheims; it's a young and therefore a nervous dynasty that is determined to live forever hence its repressive political and communications apparatus.

CCP dynasty sufferers the identical fatal flaw that causes each Chinese dynasty to fail, ie, when the going gets tough they give more power and authority to the emperor and his gang who are the ones mucking up the works to begin with. Exhibit A is Xi Jinpingpong who's made himself emperor for life in a business suit. So in China dynastic failure is a matter of when, not if.
 

fortune

New member
Joined
Jun 10, 2020
Messages
40
Reaction score
5
Location
earth
Gender
Undisclosed
Political Leaning
Other
You post almost as much as I do lol except you get a response, ie, few if anyone replies to my regularly lengthy posts about the CCP-PRC.

I'm an American too but I'm in Shenzhen and have been in GuangDong (province) off and on since January 2008, to include GuangZhou which in addition to being provincial capital is Ye Olde Canton, and Chaoshan in central GD where a lot of folk in Singapore originated in addition to substantially populating Hong Kong.

I've posted a lot to China threads and forums so the Security Bureau Police know who I am and they leave it at that. Public Security Bureau flatfoot censors harass my computer and network connections continually so I use a superb VPN, Express VPN in USA, which includes a China specialty to beat 'em every time. PSB flatfoot censors can defeat the low hanging fruit VPNs but not Express VPN.

I started out teaching English full time for private language schools, became foreign services director at one and then another, moved on to a university in GZ, and transitioned to privately owned business groups in Chaoshan and now Shenzhen, although I also do some private tutoring for kids of industrialists. I have a ten year visa (expires '26) but had to quit doing visa runs to HKG when Covid hit cause they quarantine Americans on sight there.

I've learned that the overriding characteristic of the Chinese is that every dynasty fails. China continues while its dynasties fail, one after the other, every one. The CCP is a dynasty in business suits and florsheims; it's a young and therefore a nervous dynasty that is determined to live forever hence its repressive political and communications apparatus.

CCP dynasty sufferers the identical fatal flaw that causes each Chinese dynasty to fail, ie, when the going gets tough they give more power and authority to the emperor and his gang who are the ones mucking up the works to begin with. Exhibit A is Xi Jinpingpong who's made himself emperor for life in a business suit. So in China dynastic failure is a matter of when, not if.
you may get more replies from people like me who want learn if you did not assume we knew the language of capital letters
 

Tangmo

DP Veteran
Joined
Jun 15, 2014
Messages
17,007
Reaction score
3,244
Location
VPN @ PRC/HKG/SPORE/JPN/LA/UK/CANADA/INDIA/ EU
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Progressive
I am only recently comming to understand China's economy.
I know. You're among the vast many.

I would offer as a further starting point that Xi and his prime minister Li Kejiang who's an English fluent lawyer in Chicom law and something of a wit had the Central Committee's overriding purpose on coming to power in 2012-13 the overhaul of household spending.

The two of 'em had to take household spending from the low to mid 40s percentile of GDP to the EU-USA norm of the low to mid 60th percentile. While the CCP-PRC economy was heavy on exports, domestically produced goods and domestic consumption of 'em was paltry on each accounting. China needed its own domestic economy beyond being the world's factory floor.

After several years of Xi and Li plugging away at it they'd barely moved the needle. Household spending was at 46% last time I looked a few years ago and that was after Xi and Li had given up on it. Chinese will spend but only up to a point because they are hard core savers. They save for the proverbial rainy day of which there are numerous categories in China, number one being the inevitable collapse of the ruling dynasty and the attendant chaos.

Along the way I rarely hesitated to disabuse the Chinese of their myths that their abundant quality products were exported abroad and their paltry lousy stuff was sold domestically. I advised my Chinese friends and colleagues that their exported junk was exactly that, junk, and that their domestic goods were even worse cheap junk than the super cheap junk they exported.

When the CCP-PRC want quality stuff in comparison to domestically produced goods they buy imports from EU and USA. A Chinese friend for instance picks me up at my building in his Lincoln and messages to me WeChat via his Apple. Another drops me off in his Ford and calls me on his Huawei because he's convinced it's a quality product which it is not, certainly not in China. Indeed my own Huawei was junk so I went ahead to junk it and buy an Apple.

The bottom line is that the CCP-PRC Chinese have a domestic economy that's both small given the population numbers and crap. After Trump's so called trade war it's smaller and crappier yet as it wasn't a trade war but was instead a strategic design by Peter Navarro to shrink the domestic economy even more. Capital is fleeing China at $1 Trillion a year to low wage countries that have more stable relationships with EU-USA such as Vietnam, Philippines, Kenya and some others in Africa; Nicaragua and a dozen others.

Xi meanwhile avoids it all by building and reinforcing islands in the SCS, violating the Taiwan ADIZ and crossing the center line in the Strait, violating the Japan ADIZ and aggravating the Chinese at home by sending billions to corrupt black guys in Africa which the racist Han absolutely cannot stand. Etc. Indeed, Chinese reject absolutely the Out of Africa theory because it's impossible for the Chinese masters of the universe to have originated from "those people."
 

Tangmo

DP Veteran
Joined
Jun 15, 2014
Messages
17,007
Reaction score
3,244
Location
VPN @ PRC/HKG/SPORE/JPN/LA/UK/CANADA/INDIA/ EU
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Progressive
you may get more replies from people like me who want learn if you did not assume we knew the language of capital letters
The only languages and alphabets on Earth that have upper case and lower case letters are: Roman, Cyrillic (used for Russian, some other Slavic and also many Central Asian languages), Greek; and Armenian.

The rest of 'em to include each of the more than 200 Chinese languages used on mainland China blurb along sans spaces except for the occasional period or other punctuation mark. In Chinese languages the punctuation mark is placed at the center of the space rather than at the bottom of it.

So in English Shanghai is in the Chinese characters shanghai or sometimes shang hai.

Still further, most countries have more than one system of transliteration by which the sounds of the local language(s) is put in our case the Roman (Latin) alphabet sound. Chinese shanghai becomes in English Shanghai as the trend of recent decades is to take separated sounds such as shang hai and join 'em with the semi-appropriate capitals.

Thus guang zhou city where I used to live and work just north of Hong Kong has become guangzhou which we capitalize as Guangzhou. I prefer GuangZhou because they are two sounds and meanings joined. Likewise, Zhongnanhai in Beijing just off Tiananmen Square and the Forbidden City and that is the CCP equivalent of the Kremlin is still presented in print as Zhong Nan Hai or as ZhongNanHai in addition to Zhongnanhai (tia nan men).

xi jin ping has become Xi Jinping. I myself like Xi Jinpingpong given since Xi Jinping came to power Chinese have been directed to say table tennis instead of ping pong. xi is of course the family name and jin ping is one single given name. Hence in English we combine jinping as Jinping and get the Xi Jinping.

pong.

All Chinese languages used in China have only the singular and only the present tense. This is true of most languages of the world. Thus a Chinese can say to me, "Last week I go to Beijing." Saying this is a combination of the native Chinese language and English. It is Chinese English, aka Chinglish lol. There's also Japlish, Korlish, Gerlish, Russlish and so on. After working with a bunch of Australians in Bangkok for several years and interacting with 'em daily I like to say there's also Auslish due to their pronunciations lol.
 
Last edited:

Tangmo

DP Veteran
Joined
Jun 15, 2014
Messages
17,007
Reaction score
3,244
Location
VPN @ PRC/HKG/SPORE/JPN/LA/UK/CANADA/INDIA/ EU
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Progressive
Fear not....

The Best Navy in Asia? That Big Honor Goes to Japan​

China won't be happy.

Japan-navy-officers-attend-maritime-security-ceremony-in-South-Korea.jpg

The Japan Naval Ensign and the USA Stars and Stripes criss cross during joint exercises in the East Sea. USN and Japan Self Defense Force have interoperability to include English which all SDF officers learn at academy and OCS, to include JSDF interoperability with NATO. While the integrated Maritime SDF focuses on defense the USN focuses on offense. The Ministry of Defense in Tokyo recently identified China as its principal adversary and said it would necessarily assist Taiwan as part of its own national security against Beijing.



The best navy in Asia has a total of 114 warships and 45,800 volunteer personnel. It has a large fleet of fast, powerful destroyers, thoroughly modern diesel-electric attack submarines, and amphibious ships that can haul tanks and other ground forces. It can hunt submarines, square off against invasion fleets, and shoot down enemy ballistic missiles. Technically, the Japan Maritime Self-Defense Force is a “self-defense force” designed to overcome the country’s constitutional limits on armed forces. It is, ship for ship, the best navy in Asia.

The main component of the MSDF are its fleet of forty-six destroyers and frigates—more than that those fielded by the United Kingdom and France combined. Organized into escort flotillas, Japan’s tin-can navy is designed to defend the country from invasion, help retake Japanese territory and keep the sea-lanes open. At 4,100 tons submerged, the Soryu submarines are Japan’s largest submarines since the I-400 class of World War II. The subs are equipped with Stirling air independent propulsion systems, capable of powering the submarine silently underwater for up to two weeks, and can make thirteen knots surfaced and twenty knots submerged. The Soryus are equipped with six 533-millimeter bow-mounted torpedo tubes, with a mix of twenty Type 89 heavyweight homing torpedoes and American-made Sub-Harpoon missiles. They can also lay mines to block the many straits an invasion force would attempt to force.




History of the Chinese Navy is that of an internal riverboat navy while Japan the island nation is oriented to the sea, the oceans and fleets. The Chinese have always worshiped the good earth while the Japanese have the salt of the sea air in their blood and lungs. Moreover what Japan classifies as destroyers are more like light cruisers.

Japan also has the most highly regarded Air (Self Defense) Force in Asia along with SK, Taiwan, Singapore.

It's a measurement of civilizational quality and historical experience, ie, democracy and its outward looking view versus dictatorship and its focus on internal repression and robotic control.
 

fortune

New member
Joined
Jun 10, 2020
Messages
40
Reaction score
5
Location
earth
Gender
Undisclosed
Political Leaning
Other
The only languages and alphabets on Earth that have upper case and lower case letters are: Roman, Cyrillic (used for Russian, some other Slavic and also many Central Asian languages), Greek; and Armenian.

The rest of 'em to include each of the more than 200 Chinese languages used on mainland China blurb along sans spaces except for the occasional period or other punctuation mark. In Chinese languages the punctuation mark is placed at the center of the space rather than at the bottom of it.

So in English Shanghai is in the Chinese characters shanghai or sometimes shang hai.

Still further, most countries have more than one system of transliteration by which the sounds of the local language(s) is put in our case the Roman (Latin) alphabet sound. Chinese shanghai becomes in English Shanghai as the trend of recent decades is to take separated sounds such as shang hai and join 'em with the semi-appropriate capitals.

Thus guang zhou city where I used to live and work just north of Hong Kong has become guangzhou which we capitalize as Guangzhou. I prefer GuangZhou because they are two sounds and meanings joined. Likewise, Zhongnanhai in Beijing just off Tiananmen Square and the Forbidden City and that is the CCP equivalent of the Kremlin is still presented in print as Zhong Nan Hai or as ZhongNanHai in addition to Zhongnanhai (tia nan men).

xi jin ping has become Xi Jinping. I myself like Xi Jinpingpong given since Xi Jinping came to power Chinese have been directed to say table tennis instead of ping pong. xi is of course the family name and jin ping is one single given name. Hence in English we combine jinping as Jinping and get the Xi Jinping.

pong.

All Chinese languages used in China have only the singular and only the present tense. This is true of most languages of the world. Thus a Chinese can say to me, "Last week I go to Beijing." Saying this is a combination of the native Chinese language and English. It is Chinese English, aka Chinglish lol. There's also Japlish, Korlish, Gerlish, Russlish and so on. After working with a bunch of Australians in Bangkok for several years and interacting with 'em daily I like to say there's also Auslish due to their pronunciations lol.
I am glad I gave to the opportunity to show your knowledge of language but now I am forced to try to explain that I was referring to your use of "initialism".
In the English language I read and write it is appropriate to define an initialism at the earliest opportunity so that you may then continue using it without worry.

For example I may write something like "Using the Untied States Auto Club (USAC) rules you have to use a manifold check to be legal on that track. However USAC has a way around that with turbo charging."
 

fortune

New member
Joined
Jun 10, 2020
Messages
40
Reaction score
5
Location
earth
Gender
Undisclosed
Political Leaning
Other
Fear not....

The Best Navy in Asia? That Big Honor Goes to Japan​

China won't be happy.

Japan-navy-officers-attend-maritime-security-ceremony-in-South-Korea.jpg

The Japan Naval Ensign and the USA Stars and Stripes criss cross during joint exercises in the East Sea. USN and Japan Self Defense Force have interoperability to include English which all SDF officers learn at academy and OCS, to include JSDF interoperability with NATO. While the integrated Maritime SDF focuses on defense the USN focuses on offense. The Ministry of Defense in Tokyo recently identified China as its principal adversary and said it would necessarily assist Taiwan as part of its own national security against Beijing.



The best navy in Asia has a total of 114 warships and 45,800 volunteer personnel. It has a large fleet of fast, powerful destroyers, thoroughly modern diesel-electric attack submarines, and amphibious ships that can haul tanks and other ground forces. It can hunt submarines, square off against invasion fleets, and shoot down enemy ballistic missiles. Technically, the Japan Maritime Self-Defense Force is a “self-defense force” designed to overcome the country’s constitutional limits on armed forces. It is, ship for ship, the best navy in Asia.

The main component of the MSDF are its fleet of forty-six destroyers and frigates—more than that those fielded by the United Kingdom and France combined. Organized into escort flotillas, Japan’s tin-can navy is designed to defend the country from invasion, help retake Japanese territory and keep the sea-lanes open. At 4,100 tons submerged, the Soryu submarines are Japan’s largest submarines since the I-400 class of World War II. The subs are equipped with Stirling air independent propulsion systems, capable of powering the submarine silently underwater for up to two weeks, and can make thirteen knots surfaced and twenty knots submerged. The Soryus are equipped with six 533-millimeter bow-mounted torpedo tubes, with a mix of twenty Type 89 heavyweight homing torpedoes and American-made Sub-Harpoon missiles. They can also lay mines to block the many straits an invasion force would attempt to force.




History of the Chinese Navy is that of an internal riverboat navy while Japan the island nation is oriented to the sea, the oceans and fleets. The Chinese have always worshiped the good earth while the Japanese have the salt of the sea air in their blood and lungs. Moreover what Japan classifies as destroyers are more like light cruisers.

Japan also has the most highly regarded Air (Self Defense) Force in Asia along with SK, Taiwan, Singapore.

It's a measurement of civilizational quality and historical experience, ie, democracy and its outward looking view versus dictatorship and its focus on internal repression and robotic control.
I read that article some time ago and tend to agree on some but not all points spoken or un spoken.
Thanks
 

Tangmo

DP Veteran
Joined
Jun 15, 2014
Messages
17,007
Reaction score
3,244
Location
VPN @ PRC/HKG/SPORE/JPN/LA/UK/CANADA/INDIA/ EU
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Progressive
I am glad I gave to the opportunity to show your knowledge of language but now I am forced to try to explain that I was referring to your use of "initialism".
In the English language I read and write it is appropriate to define an initialism at the earliest opportunity so that you may then continue using it without worry.

For example I may write something like "Using the Untied States Auto Club (USAC) rules you have to use a manifold check to be legal on that track. However USAC has a way around that with turbo charging."
Not only are you worried that I not worry about something I don't worry about, you're overwrought to the point of wasting a post on it that you'd have done better to give a pass to lol. The long and the short of it is that the topic is China. Your continued views on the people, place and its things are welcome as far as I'm concerned thx anyway.
 

Antiwar

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 4, 2020
Messages
9,333
Reaction score
1,582
Gender
Undisclosed
Political Leaning
Undisclosed
One type 075 LHD, one 055 Destroyer and one type 094 Ballistic missile submarine all commissioned on the same day.

The drum beat grows louder in Asia
 

Tangmo

DP Veteran
Joined
Jun 15, 2014
Messages
17,007
Reaction score
3,244
Location
VPN @ PRC/HKG/SPORE/JPN/LA/UK/CANADA/INDIA/ EU
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Progressive
Japan began last year to convert two of its four multi purpose anti submarine destroyer helicopter carriers into aircraft carriers. Each of the two will support a yet unannounced number of F-35B vertical takeoff attack fighter planes along an expanded defensive perimeter from the Philippines to Japan. The expanded defensive perimeter includes the Ruyku island chain that extends from Japan to Taiwan.

Japan commences “aircraft carrier” conversions


Japan has begun modifying the first of two Japan Maritime Self-Defense Force (JMSDF) Izumo-class multi-purpose destroyers/helicopter carriers into aircraft carriers to support the operations of the short take-off and vertical landing-capable Lockheed Martin F-35B Joint Strike Fighter .

JS-Izumo-JR-Ng-768x576.jpg

Images of the JS Izumo undergoing refit work at Japan Marine United’s Isogo shipyard in Yokohama City, with its island covered by scaffolding and the foredeck-mounted Phalanx close-in weapon system removed.


The two 24,000 tonne Izumo-class vessels JS Izumo and JS Kaga, which were commissioned in 2015 and 2017 respectively, measure 248 metres long and have been built with several features that would support F-35B operations – such as the elevators, flight deck, and stowage area. Modifications would likely include a new aircraft approach and landing system, strengthening of flight deck for the additional weight as well as heat-resistant coatings for vertical landings, and others. It is not known whether the ships will be fitted with ski-jumps, although the US Navy’s Wasp-class amphibious assault vessels – which are only less than 10 metres longer – have proven to be more than adequate to deploy and recover F-35B aircraft.



The conversion is a direct response to China's constant naval and military expansion and increase in tonnage, personnel and firepower.

The Ruyku islands include the heavily fortified by the U.S. and Japan Miyako Strait just north of Taiwan and that is the PLA Navy's only direct route to the open western Pacific. The only other PLAN direct route to the western Pacific is the Bushi Channel between Taiwan and the Philippines that is also controlled by U.S. Navy and air forces with increasing support from the Japan Maritime SDF.

Miyako is a serious obstacle to the PLAN Central Fleet while the Bushi Channel is yet another serious obstacle to the PLAN South Fleet based in Hainan island in the South China Sea. Indeed, both Japan and the USA have extensive historical experience in Pacific island warfare the Chinese do not have.
 

Tangmo

DP Veteran
Joined
Jun 15, 2014
Messages
17,007
Reaction score
3,244
Location
VPN @ PRC/HKG/SPORE/JPN/LA/UK/CANADA/INDIA/ EU
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Progressive
India's navy is quite competitive as well.

Indeed after Beijing told India the Indian Ocean "is not Indian" but the South China Sea "is Chinese" New Delhi went and constructed a huge naval base and a large air force base on the Andaman islands at the north of the Malacca Strait.

The Andaman islands are positioned between the Strait and Myanmar where the Chinese are building naval and commercial port facilities that are trying to establish an overland transit of oil to China from the ME.

India has ignored Beijing's hollering and jumping up and down about India's drilling in the Vietnam EEZ of the SCS at the request of Hanoi. India has done naval exercises in the SCS and in the Pacific around Taiwan with Japan and the USN.

India joined the annual naval exercises of the USN, Australia, Singapore to form a new "Quad" grouping of allied or partner nations in the region.

It's what former prime minister of Japan Shinzo Abe called the "Democracy Diamond" to the USA, Australia, India and back up through the SCS and Taiwan to Japan and SK. Yet Xi Jinping still has no clue his loud and bellicose mouth is his own worst enemy.
 

fortune

New member
Joined
Jun 10, 2020
Messages
40
Reaction score
5
Location
earth
Gender
Undisclosed
Political Leaning
Other
I live and work in China. I work in marketing and advertising these days making China look good. I can tell you now that just about every video production and news release, especially any video produced in mainland Han communist China, is not to be taken seriously. Over the last month, because of US fleet activity near Taiwan, nearly every ship of the PLAN (Peoples Liberation Army Navy) has stayed in port, from Xiamen to Qingdao. Economic activity will never return to what it was, and that was what built up the fleet they do have today. They are spending money saved on yesterday's economic progress. Those days are gone. Industry is struggling here. Their fleet is still no where near the tonnage of the American. They would need at least parity to take on the Americans, and remember, that is when experience and training come in. The Americans have a long history of battle at mondern sea combat. Mainland China has none, except for that of harassing fishing boats belonging to neighboring states. And, lest we forget, they would not only take on the Americans. Out of self interest and common hatred of the mainland Han communist regime, nearly every country surrounding China would join in, if not to help the Americans, then to take advantage of the situation and get back. These videos and many like them from the CCP Propaganda department, most of which is filled with writers and others from the west cutting their teeth, are made mostly for internal consumption to keep Chinese on the mainland in line through feelings of nationalism. They are not taken seriously by anyone outside China, though they are used by military officers of senior rank to gain more funding.
did you do the ad about Asian farm girl?
 

fortune

New member
Joined
Jun 10, 2020
Messages
40
Reaction score
5
Location
earth
Gender
Undisclosed
Political Leaning
Other
India's navy is quite competitive as well.
India's navy was built and sailor trained by the British Navy over a few hundred years.

But perhaps the Chinese navy consisting of 3500 incomparable vessels would rank higher?
 

Lord Tammerlain

DP Veteran
Joined
Jan 25, 2010
Messages
20,724
Reaction score
9,047
Gender
Undisclosed
Political Leaning
Undisclosed
India's navy was built and sailor trained by the British Navy over a few hundred years.

But perhaps the Chinese navy consisting of 3500 incomparable vessels would rank higher?

The Indian navy left a hatch open on a submarine and nearly caused it to sink.

Training 70 years ago, has little impact on training today if it is not maintained or updated
 

Tangmo

DP Veteran
Joined
Jun 15, 2014
Messages
17,007
Reaction score
3,244
Location
VPN @ PRC/HKG/SPORE/JPN/LA/UK/CANADA/INDIA/ EU
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Progressive
In 2018 the PLA Navy sub that had been tracked continuously by the Japanese for two dayze and nights finally surfaced, showed the flag and returned to base. If it had been wartime the flag would have been white.

n-chinaships-a-20180116-870x535-1517253804.jpg

Are China’s Nuclear Subs Too Noisy for Their Own Good?​

An incident in the East China Sea has observers wondering if China’s nuke boats have a noise problem.

JAN 29, 2018

In 2003, all 70 Chinese sailors aboard a Chinese diesel electric submarine died during a training accident. The submarine reportedly drifted for days before a fishing boat came upon the lifeless vessel. Regardless, the fact that Japanese forces were able to track China’s latest nuclear attack submarine continuously for two days does not exactly instill confidence in the submarine’s abilities.



Chinese subs continue to do what they need to do, ie, improve.
 
Top Bottom