Man Who Fired First Shots Behind Kyle Rittenhouse in Kenosha Has Been Charged

[buck]

So you make up some dramatic big scary man, an imaginary crowd chasing him, as well as one in that crowd firing a gun and I missed? Maybe throw in some hand grenades and machine guns next round. Or better yet, stick to the facts.

That's right. They weren't chasing.. Just happened to be going the same direction. It was all a coincidence.

 

[SkyFox76]

That's right. They weren't chasing.. Just happened to be going the same direction. It was all a coincidence.

I posted the drone photo. Feel free to point out the mob.

 

[dcsports]

Feel free to show me anywhere that Joshua Ziminski is seen or even accused of chasing Rittenhouse. Tons of video so it shouldn't be hard.

I never said he was. You are battling a straw man. Sorry.

 

[SkyFox76]

I never said he was. You are battling a straw man. Sorry.

And you're striking up the band to place some dance music. Directly from your post....

The gunshot is irrelevant in terms of who Rittenhouse shot. It does help frame the situation though, in terms of whether a reasonable person would fear for their life. Rittenhouse was being chased by a group of shouting people, at least one of which was armed with a weapon and fired it.

Who was that?

 

[dcsports]

And you're striking up the band to place some dance music. Directly from your post....



Who was that?

Sigh. OK.

Talk about missing the point.

 

[bluesmoke]

Did I say he committed murder? If not, why are you harping on me?

I understand your perspective on this matter. I truly do! Initially, I saw this as a murder case myself, but I've seen other video footage since then which has led me to believe Rittenhouse acted in self-defense.

It's true that everyone he shot were either trying to disarm him or stop him before he shot anyone else, but when those initial shots were fired in close proximity to Rittenhouse and he realized he was being pursued by the first gun shot victim, I would think it would've been extremely difficult for him to think he wasn't under attack at that point. And then once he's leaving he most definitely comes under physical attack by one guy who hits him with his skateboard and then the other guy who initially halted his approach but then suddenly draws a gun at him. At that point, it's life or death because Rittenhouse has no way of knowing if his third assailant is just there to detain him - firearm-to-firearm - or shot him. So, he fires first on his second lunge toward him.

I want to make it clear: I am defending Rittenhouse based on the series of events that occurred, NOT because I think he acted in good faith. I still believe none of this would have happened had this 17 year old kid not brought a gun (riffle) to a hostile environment and had just stuck to rendering First Aid at the designated station.

Thanks for the edification regarding “murder”.

The details will come out in trial and that takes a while. It is not too unusual that DGU, even of a home, results in arrest of the “defender” and prosecution. You can describe his motivation however you with, Rittenhouse was literally looking for trouble.

 

[ASHES]

Thanks for the edification regarding “murder”.

The details will come out in trial and that takes a while. It is not too unusual that DGU, even of a home, results in arrest of the “defender” and prosecution. You can describe his motivation however you with, Rittenhouse was literally looking for trouble.

Cases like the Arbery murder and many others show that whether or not the alleged defender is arrested relies on officer and prosecutorial discretion as much as the facts of the case.

 

[bluesmoke]

I was speaking about the first Rittenhouse shooting, which is what the bolded part of your quoted post was talking about and is what I was responding to. I was clarifying that it doesn't matter if Rosenbaum was trying to disarm him or kill him, in either case, his response was reasonable.

You called the arrested man's action what you did in your post and the authorities determined it was not so, period. What you said was not so.

Rittenhouse was in a dangerous area, carrying an assault-type rifle, admittedly to "defend and protect" others. He was looking for trouble.

 

[ASHES]

You called the arrested man's action what you did in your post and the authorities determined it was not so, period. What you said was not so.

Rittenhouse was in a dangerous area, carrying an assault-type rifle, admittedly to "defend and protect" others. He was looking for trouble.

I did not say what the arrested man's actions were, I described the first victim's actions. Not the same people. I did not say Ziminski chased Kyle, or attempted to disarm him. I was talking about Rosenbaum, whom you referenced in your post that I responded to. I bolded the part of your post I was responding to, and I even said I was only talking about the bolded part.

 

[ClaraD]

And you're striking up the band to place some dance music. Directly from your post....



Who was that?

He is talking about the Paramedic, but that was well after he had already shot Rosenbaum.

 

[ClaraD]

I did not say what the arrested man's actions were, I described the first victim's actions. Not the same people. I did not say Ziminski chased Kyle, or attempted to disarm him. I was talking about Rosenbaum, whom you referenced in your post that I responded to. I bolded the part of your post I was responding to, and I even said I was only talking about the bolded part.

So, what happens when you hear a gun shot and then just turn and start shooting? You cannot just start shooting people because you heard a gun shot..hell for all he knew it was a firecracker and not a gun shot at all. If people started shooting here in South Carolina, just because they heard a gun shot...half the state would be dead.

 

[ASHES]

So, what happens when you hear a gun shot and then just turn and start shooting? You cannot just start shooting people because you heard a gun shot..hell for all he knew it was a firecracker and not a gun shot at all. If people started shooting here in South Carolina, just because they heard a gun shot...half the state would be dead.

He didn't just turn and shoot in the direction of the gunshot. He turned, reassessed the situation, and was faced with what a reasonable person at the time would consider an imminent threat.

 

[dcsports]

He is talking about the Paramedic, but that was well after he had already shot Rosenbaum.

I was not talking about the guy who later attacked Rittenhouse with a gun (who wasn't a paramedic).

 

[ClaraD]

I was not talking about the guy who later attacked Rittenhouse with a gun (who wasn't a paramedic).

He was the only one that had a gun*that was involved in the incident*. He also was the only one legally carrying a weapon out of the two.

 

[dcsports]

So, what happens when you hear a gun shot and then just turn and start shooting? You cannot just start shooting people because you heard a gun shot..hell for all he knew it was a firecracker and not a gun shot at all. If people started shooting here in South Carolina, just because they heard a gun shot...half the state would be dead.

Rittenhouse didn't 'just turn and start shooting'.

In fact, his restraint has been a subject of discussion. He only shot at people who attacked him directly, and hit only the people he shot at. On two occasions he aimed at people charging him, and didn't shoot when they stopped.

 

[dcsports]

He was the only one that had a gun*that was involved in the incident*. He also was the only one legally carrying a weapon out of the two.

There were several people there with guns, including the one who fired (see the OP for this thread).

It still hasn't been verified that the man you referred to was carrying legally.

 

[ClaraD]

Rittenhouse didn't 'just turn and start shooting'.

In fact, his restraint has been a subject of discussion. He only shot at people who attacked him directly, and hit only the people he shot at. On two occasions he aimed at people charging him, and didn't shoot when they stopped.

Rosenbaum did not attack him, throwing a plastic bag does not require lethal force to defend yourself....good grief....not to mention he has the issue of the statute that says you have to use the least force possible to stop an aggression and even less than that when you yourself are in the process of a crime...and he was...it was illegal for him to open carry. Why are they fighting extradition if they feel they have a solid self defense case?

 

[ClaraD]

There were several people there with guns, including the one who fired (see the OP for this thread).

It still hasn't been verified that the man you referred to was carrying legally.

He was a Paramedic and has a CWP, do you have proof he is lying about having a CWP? The police sure haven't said he was lying and I am betting money that would have come out if he had not had one.

 

[SkyFox76]

He is talking about the Paramedic, but that was well after he had already shot Rosenbaum.

Well the paramedic never fired his weapon (which he says happened) so that doesn't change that he's incorrect.

 

[SkyFox76]

I was not talking about the guy who later attacked Rittenhouse with a gun (who wasn't a paramedic).

So then who chased him and fired a weapon? How hard is it to answer?

 

[SkyFox76]

There were several people there with guns, including the one who fired (see the OP for this thread).

It still hasn't been verified that the man you referred to was carrying legally.

Are you seriously suggesting that Rittenhouse's attorney Lin (sue everybody who blinks at him) Wood wouldn't be raising the roof off the KPD right now if he was carrying illegally? The man has no felonies so what exactly would be the issue of him getting the ccw?

 

[SkyFox76]

Rosenbaum did not attack him, throwing a plastic bag does not require lethal force to defend yourself....good grief....not to mention he has the issue of the statute that says you have to use the least force possible to stop an aggression and even less than that when you yourself are in the process of a crime...and he was...it was illegal for him to open carry. Why are they fighting extradition if they feel they have a solid self defense case?

Wood and Pierce are going to milk this for every penny they can before they are forced to realize Rittenhouse is going to Wisconsin. He's now spent just short of 2 months in jail, while one attorney is giving Trump a run for his money on tweets per day of his dogs and property he's buying, and the other one is making the rounds with mom Rittenhouse so she can sit like a deer caught in the headlights.

 

[dcsports]

Rosenbaum did not attack him, throwing a plastic bag does not require lethal force to defend yourself....good grief....not to mention he has the issue of the statute that says you have to use the least force possible to stop an aggression and even less than that when you yourself are in the process of a crime...and he was...it was illegal for him to open carry. Why are they fighting extradition if they feel they have a solid self defense case?

1) The plastic bag had something in it. Rittenhouse had no idea what it was.
2) Rosenbaum charged him and made contact. Many here have even said 'he was trying to take the weapon'. That's a clear threat.
3) You are making up a statute again. (Please feel free to provide what you are referring to). A person can use deadly force to defend themselves if they reasonably believe they are in danger of death or bodily harm.
4) The minor in possession of a dangerous weapon charge is questionable, and a misdemeanor. Even if valid, it doesn't trigger any felony murder statute. Again, you are trying to infer something that's not there.
5) Contesting the case forces the prosecution to give a preview of their case and the evidence much earlier than they would like to. In this case, they are going to have to show why it isn't self defense when their own probable cause statement supports it. It's a good strategy.

 

[dcsports]

He was a Paramedic and has a CWP, do you have proof he is lying about having a CWP? The police sure haven't said he was lying and I am betting money that would have come out if he had not had one.

I feel like this is a rehash, of a previous conversation. But there's no evidence of that he was ever a paramedic or that he had a concealed carry permit. He did earn his EMT-Basic and worked for an ambulance transport service, as well as statements that his license for that is no longer active. He implied he had a permit in an interview where he lied about what happened that night (contradicted by the video). No one has seen this mysterious permit, so I'm inclined to believe it doesn't exist. He certainly didn't act like he had the training it requires.

 

[dcsports]

Are you seriously suggesting that Rittenhouse's attorney Lin (sue everybody who blinks at him) Wood wouldn't be raising the roof off the KPD right now if he was carrying illegally? The man has no felonies so what exactly would be the issue of him getting the ccw?

Of course not. (1) it doesn't matter in relation to the charges against Rittenhouse. (2) They aren't going to tip their strategy this early.