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Man of the 20th Century/2nd Millenium

alphamale

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Man of the 20th Century: Sir Winston Churchill

Man of the 2nd Millenium: Leonardo da Vinci
 

ngdawg

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alphamale said:
Man of the 20th Century: Sir Winston Churchill

Man of the 2nd Millenium: Leonardo da Vinci
Are you asking for a debate on your choices or other people's choices?

Eh, kill two birds with one stone....
Albert Einstein or Thomas Edison for 20th century.
Can't say I'd disagree with DaVinci, after all, he did draw a simplistic helicopter several centuries before it became reality.
Churchill didn't invent anything or change concepts. How did you arrive at that decision?
 

Willoughby

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Churchill didn't invent anything or change concepts. How did you arrive at that decision?
he fancy's bald men with cigars!
 

alphamale

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ngdawg said:
Are you asking for a debate on your choices or other people's choices?

Eh, kill two birds with one stone....
Albert Einstein or Thomas Edison for 20th century.
Can't say I'd disagree with DaVinci, after all, he did draw a simplistic helicopter several centuries before it became reality.
Churchill didn't invent anything or change concepts. How did you arrive at that decision?
Sir Winston was the key man in the victory of the democracies in WWII. Without him, Britain would have fallen to the fascists, later the U.S., and then the rest of the world.
 

Willoughby

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Sir Winston was the key man in the victory of the democracies in WWII. Without him, Britain would have fallen to the fascists, later the U.S., and then the rest of the world.
of course he was important but the problem with these sort of things is the fact that maybe somebody else could have done the same job. Stalin was pretty important in defeat of nazism but like churchill he wasn't a very nice person!
 

alphamale

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Willoughby said:
of course he was important but the problem with these sort of things is the fact that maybe somebody else could have done the same job. Stalin was pretty important in defeat of nazism but like churchill he wasn't a very nice person!
Stalin defeating the nazis is neither here nor there, he subtituted one form of oppression for another. Churchill was castigated as a warmonger before the war, until the nazi invasion of poland brought the political classes in the UK back to their senses. Churchill provided the only defense of the western world for the key period 1940-41. His determination to fight on, and encourage the British people against all odds, until the U.S. was brought in, saved the day. In fact, saved western civilization.
 

Willoughby

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Stalin defeating the nazis is neither here nor there, he subtituted one form of oppression for another. Churchill was castigated as a warmonger before the war, until the nazi invasion of poland brought the political classes in the UK back to their senses. Churchill provided the only defense of the western world for the key period 1940-41. His determination to fight on, and encourage the British people against all odds, until the U.S. was brought in, saved the day. In fact, saved western civilization
you seem to be contridicting yourself here a little. You base Churchill's greatness on helping to defeat the nazis but you ignore stalin's "greatness" in this matter
 

alphamale

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Willoughby said:
you seem to be contridicting yourself here a little. You base Churchill's greatness on helping to defeat the nazis but you ignore stalin's "greatness" in this matter
Churchill stopped the nazis in the west in defense of western civilization. Stalin did not represent western civilization, and was only interested in replacing nazism with stalinism. The nazis attacked the soviet union only after the UK, under Churchill's leadership, proved to hard a nut to crack. Without churchill, western europe would have ended up under either the nazi's or stalin's heel.
 

millsy

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ngdawg said:
Churchill didn't invent anything or change concepts. How did you arrive at that decision?
I'm shooting from the hip here and may be little off, but..........

I believe that you may be wrong when saying that Churchill didn't change concepts.

After the fighting had ended in WWI during the Paris Peace Conference Churchill was campaigning to avoid the west putting Germany under sanctions or forcing them to pay reparations. The Treaty of Versailles basically crippled Germany and put them in an impoverished state which created the kind of despair in which radical leaders can gain a foot hold. WWII was largely due to the Treaty of Versailles. In contrast, the end of WWII, the Marshall plan is largely responsible for the prosperous and unified Europe that exists today.

The Marshall plan is sort of what Churchill was pushing for in 1919.
 

millsy

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alphamale said:
Man of the 2nd Millenium: Leonardo da Vinci
did you think that even before you read dan brown?
 

-Demosthenes-

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ngdawg said:
Are you asking for a debate on your choices or other people's choices?

Eh, kill two birds with one stone....
Albert Einstein or Thomas Edison for 20th century.
Can't say I'd disagree with DaVinci, after all, he did draw a simplistic helicopter several centuries before it became reality.
Churchill didn't invent anything or change concepts. How did you arrive at that decision?
Einstein? How did theoretical physics even affect the world very much any way? He was very eccentric, very smart, and very interesting, but he didn't effect the 20th century as much as Edison did (of course his lightbulbs were made in the 1870's, 19th century not 20th :D).
 

nkgupta80

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-Demosthenes- said:
Einstein? How did theoretical physics even affect the world very much any way? He was very eccentric, very smart, and very interesting, but he didn't effect the 20th century as much as Edison did (of course his lightbulbs were made in the 1870's, 19th century not 20th :D).

Einstein's relativity: the technological progress we have today, space travel, quantum physics, a complete understanding of classical electromagnetics would not exist. Edison invented a fkn lightbulb (although his inventions obviously had a great impact). Einstein ushered a new era for physics and technology, changed science's view of the universe.
 

-Demosthenes-

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Re: Man of the 20th Century/2nd Millennium

nkgupta80 said:
Einstein's relativity: the technological progress we have today, space travel, quantum physics, a complete understanding of classical electromagnetics would not exist. Edison invented a fkn lightbulb (although his inventions obviously had a great impact). Einstein ushered a new era for physics and technology, changed science's view of the universe.
True, but I think he riding a little too much of the stigma of the "eccentric genius." We do look at physics differently, and that's good, but I'm not sure how pertinent it was to actual space travel.

Looking at light as photons, light fastest speed, and relativity, I don't question their profoundness or their pure genius, just how much they actually affect us.
 
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