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Malema; A new Mandela or a new Mugabe?

Infinite Chaos

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His humble origins make him a liberator for poor, black South Africans. His fiery mouth make him feared by some and a nightmare for many others, black and white. Whichever way you look at it, Julius Malema has become one of South Africa's most controversial and influential political figures.

In a recent BBC interview, Malema has defended his behaviour after being disciplined by the ANC over a series of outbursts about race, Zimbabwe and President Jacob Zuma.
BBC Link
Julius Malema has now gone from singing "kill the Boer" to "kiss the Boer" but has been reprimanded by the ANC leadership (though only for criticising Zuma's leadership apparently.) but still seems unrepentant.

It's hard to see where South Africa will go if a man like Julius Malema becomes leader of South Africa. Mugabe's policies have destroyed Zimbabwe so what an ignorant populist like Malema thinks he'll acheive by admiring such failures is beyond me.

There is that horrible old saying about becoming that which you hate - and Malema seems as bad as the white supremacists that Nelson Mandela struggled to remove from power.
 

Areopagitican

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I think South Africa should stop looking towards "liberators" and more toward honest men. Of course, we are talking politicians so I see their dilemma.
 

Jetboogieman

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As a South African, I don't give a **** what Malema says now, I know what he's like, he's an asshat who goes around preaching to poor people what they should think, while he's filthy rich himself and doesn't have to worry about their problems... you know what **** it, that's the whole ANC... Ok calm down Jet... *removes foam from mouth*

The ANC has become so corrupt it cannot even govern anymore. It is running my country into the ground. Taking from the people and giving nothing back. Jacop Zuma and Malema should be arrested TODAY! I believe in Mandela's dream, I have a poster of him on my wall, and the fact that Zuma and Malema are in any sort of power, proves that, that dream is dying, and fast. 20 years to go from Mandela to Zuma! HOLY ****!
 

Infinite Chaos

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-- I believe in Mandela's dream, I have a poster of him on my wall, and the fact that Zuma and Malema are in any sort of power, proves that, that dream is dying, and fast. 20 years to go from Mandela to Zuma! HOLY ****!
That's really sad to read. Malema seems to be being prepared or groomed for eventual leadership. What's unclear is how he was chosen or even why?

There was only one Mandela however aren't there any alternatives to the ANC in South Africa?
 

Jetboogieman

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That's really sad to read. Malema seems to be being prepared or groomed for eventual leadership. What's unclear is how he was chosen or even why?

There was only one Mandela however aren't there any alternatives to the ANC in South Africa?
Well... it's a legacy thing. They're the Heroes of the struggle, they lead South Africa out of apartheid and so will I think always be popular. When Zuma was elected leader of the ANC a bunch of ANC members broke off and formed another political party which might do well next time once people are finally fed up with the way the ANC treats the people. Like ****. The state of all public services is in tatters... you should see the prisons. They're ****ed. When you see people say stuff like this...



You know something has got to give.
 

Harry Guerrilla

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Julius Malema has now gone from singing "kill the Boer" to "kiss the Boer" but has been reprimanded by the ANC leadership (though only for criticising Zuma's leadership apparently.) but still seems unrepentant.

It's hard to see where South Africa will go if a man like Julius Malema becomes leader of South Africa. Mugabe's policies have destroyed Zimbabwe so what an ignorant populist like Malema thinks he'll acheive by admiring such failures is beyond me.

There is that horrible old saying about becoming that which you hate - and Malema seems as bad as the white supremacists that Nelson Mandela struggled to remove from power.
No one will like what I have to say most likely but this is a prime reason why democracy is a foolish endeavor for a developing nation like South Africa.

The populists get everyone all riled up with foolish, pie in the sky, rhetoric and then everything starts to go south ward from there.
 

Baltim

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Jetboogieman, I have a question if you don't mind.

I have a couple of S African friends who've voiced the opinion that SA is still very driven along tribal lines and that although Mandela hasn't been in power for a long time he is still a figurehead that unites the various tribes.

They believe that once Mandela dies the inter tribal unity will quickly collapse and SA will see a period of prolonged violence and tribal warfare.

I'll be honest, I don't know enough about SA politics to have an opinion whether this is correct or not so I'd like to ask your opinion on it.
 

Jetboogieman

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Jetboogieman, I have a question if you don't mind.

I have a couple of S African friends who've voiced the opinion that SA is still very driven along tribal lines and that although Mandela hasn't been in power for a long time he is still a figurehead that unites the various tribes.

They believe that once Mandela dies the inter tribal unity will quickly collapse and SA will see a period of prolonged violence and tribal warfare.

I'll be honest, I don't know enough about SA politics to have an opinion whether this is correct or not so I'd like to ask your opinion on it.
Not sure if I see that being the case.

The uneasy truce between Mandela and Buthelezi (who caused quite a bit of the trouble back in the day) is not really revelent anymore.
The real issue is what will happen between the Zulu and Xhosa's following Mandelas death.

However, the ANC does have Zulus and the Inkhata freedom party (primary Zulu Party) has seats in parlaiment, I can't see there being TOO BIG of an issue.

But then again I had not considered this issue arising. I will have to do a little more research on recent tribal relations.
 

Andalublue

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No one will like what I have to say most likely but this is a prime reason why democracy is a foolish endeavor for a developing nation like South Africa.
So Harry, what would you suggest as an alternative?
 

Infinite Chaos

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-- The real issue is what will happen between the Zulu and Xhosa's following Mandelas death --
Historically (as I remember my mother explaining to me) the Zulu had seen themselves as prime warriors and after successive defeats by white settlers and their advanced weaponry, the zulu became reconciled to a position of seething subjugation. Xhosa peoples being used to continual defeat (but always coming back to fight the zulu again) had an inbuilt persistence to return to combat and so it was they who formed much of the counter white movement, they who carried on fighting against the white settlers and eventually we see not a defeat of white South Africa but a change in the late 1980s leading to sharing of power.

Buthelezi has had an enforced back seat position through the last 20-30 years - I can imagine his resentment that the Xhosa seemingly "won" the struggle and brought about black liberation.

No one will like what I have to say most likely but this is a prime reason why democracy is a foolish endeavor for a developing nation like South Africa.

The populists get everyone all riled up with foolish, pie in the sky, rhetoric and then everything starts to go south ward from there.
I think the problem continuously is that democracy in the west was a hard won battle which took centuries to establish and we now simply expect that former colonies suddenly change their culture and embrace an ideal within a generation. The only true test of whether this is a solution is time, true democracy will take many generations to establish, Africa still suffers in most part from tribalism and the "old man syndrome" where elders cannot be challenged.

What encouraged me was in the strangest and worst case scenario - Zimbabwe, Mugabe is the established "senior grey haired elder" who traditionally would not have his wisdom challenged by younger upstarts within his own tribe - however Tsvangirai is also Shona and he has challenged the elder leader (but only after many years of blind loyalty by indigent Shona villagers) and is in a power sharing govt. It's not perfect and it's not working - but this is better than either of my parents would have hoped for any African country for the next 1-200 years.
 
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