• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

London children fainting in class because parents too poor to feed them

Superfly

~ Road-trippin' musician ~
DP Veteran
Joined
Jul 27, 2011
Messages
41,290
Reaction score
27,927
Location
Tucson to Tucumcari, Tehachapi to Tonapah
Gender
Female
Political Leaning
Independent

Urethra Franklin

Folle
DP Veteran
Joined
Feb 4, 2005
Messages
3,579
Reaction score
980
Location
European Union
Gender
Female
Political Leaning
Undisclosed
Look at the date. Your story is 9 years old.

Child poverty is a worry wherever it rears its head. There are children living in poverty under the Tory government, but since your story "broke" about 109 years ago, much has been done in British schools and wider society to address this: breakfast clubs in school, the increase in the minimum wage, the introduction of the living wage etc. Yes child poverty is sickening and no the Tory government, like many other governments around the world, doesn't go far enough in addressing it. I personally believe in the the extension of free school meals for poorer families and of course, the low wage economy needs to be addressed. Your thoughts?

Now to Russia, where I once saw a harrowing documentary about Moscow's street kids - homeless having been turfed out of their homes by poor parents, alcoholic parents and parents who just didn't give a s*it about them. Yes that was on TV several years ago, but since your own article is from 2012, I thought I'd throw it in.

Note: the once reputable Evening Standard has long fallen into disrepute since being taken over in 2009 (so 3 years before your article) by Evgeni Lebedev, a Russian oligarch. Wonder if this influenced your choice of ancient article, by any chance?
 

Chagos

DP Veteran
Joined
Mar 8, 2015
Messages
32,377
Reaction score
9,564
Location
in expatria
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Private
Look at the date. Your story is 9 years old.

Child poverty is a worry wherever it rears its head. There are children living in poverty under the Tory government, but since your story "broke" about 109 years ago, much has been done in British schools and wider society to address this: breakfast clubs in school, the increase in the minimum wage, the introduction of the living wage etc. Yes child poverty is sickening and no the Tory government, like many other governments around the world, doesn't go far enough in addressing it. I personally believe in the the extension of free school meals for poorer families and of course, the low wage economy needs to be addressed. Your thoughts?

Now to Russia, where I once saw a harrowing documentary about Moscow's street kids - homeless having been turfed out of their homes by poor parents, alcoholic parents and parents who just didn't give a s*it about them. Yes that was on TV several years ago, but since your own article is from 2012, I thought I'd throw it in.

Note: the once reputable Evening Standard has long fallen into disrepute since being taken over in 2009 (so 3 years before your article) by Evgeni Lebedev, a Russian oligarch. Wonder if this influenced your choice of ancient article, by any chance?
It's vengeance time.

Took him nearly 7 hours to retaliate.

To: https://www.debatepolitics.com/europe/345180-lunchless-russian-schoolchildren-fainting-hunger.html#post1069597967
 

lwf

DP Veteran
Joined
Aug 15, 2018
Messages
16,750
Reaction score
10,786
Location
PNW
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Independent

Westphalian

DP Veteran
Joined
Jun 16, 2018
Messages
2,647
Reaction score
286
Location
East
Gender
Undisclosed
Political Leaning
Independent
3 posts in and we get 'whataboutism'. Who'd have thought :roll:


Yes, it was a 2012 story, but let me update you with a report from the UN rapporteur on extreme child poverty.

Things have got worse not better, and the funny thing is, I suspect that many of the right on bleeding heart liberals want to pretend this problem doesn't exist in the UK.



https://schoolsweek.co.uk/schools-forced-to-collect-food-for-hungry-pupils-warns-un-adviser/


The costs of austerity in the UK have fallen “disproportionately” on children, leaving them hungry at school and forcing teachers to collect food and send it home with their pupils, according to a United Nations poverty expert.

Professor Philip Alston, the UN special rapporteur on extreme poverty and human rights, recently spent two weeks in the UK. He visited a primary school, several community groups, a food bank and other public services.

In his damning report, Alston warned that children are “showing up at school with empty stomachs, and schools are collecting food on an ad hoc basis and sending it home because teachers know that their students will otherwise go hungry”.
 

Westphalian

DP Veteran
Joined
Jun 16, 2018
Messages
2,647
Reaction score
286
Location
East
Gender
Undisclosed
Political Leaning
Independent
How is this topical?


Because RV started a thread on the problem in Russia.


I though the same problems affecting children in the West should get equal attention.
 

lwf

DP Veteran
Joined
Aug 15, 2018
Messages
16,750
Reaction score
10,786
Location
PNW
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Independent
Because RV started a thread on the problem in Russia.


I though the same problems affecting children in the West should get equal attention.

'Topical' means of immediate interest due to current events. The article you referenced is from 2012. If the problems of children starving in Russia are happening now, what reason is there to reference a similar problem from 7 years ago?
 

Chagos

DP Veteran
Joined
Mar 8, 2015
Messages
32,377
Reaction score
9,564
Location
in expatria
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Private
They're not even remotely rationally comparable in scope and degree.

Nice fail.
Russian kids largely even go without school lunch.

And this guy talks about whataboutism.

Any thing to troll in the Putinista manner.
 

Urethra Franklin

Folle
DP Veteran
Joined
Feb 4, 2005
Messages
3,579
Reaction score
980
Location
European Union
Gender
Female
Political Leaning
Undisclosed
Things have got worse not better, and the funny thing is, I suspect that many of the right on bleeding heart liberals want to pretend this problem doesn't exist in the UK.



https://schoolsweek.co.uk/schools-forced-to-collect-food-for-hungry-pupils-warns-un-adviser/


The costs of austerity in the UK have fallen “disproportionately” on children, leaving them hungry at school and forcing teachers to collect food and send it home with their pupils, according to a United Nations poverty expert.

Professor Philip Alston, the UN special rapporteur on extreme poverty and human rights, recently spent two weeks in the UK. He visited a primary school, several community groups, a food bank and other public services.

In his damning report, Alston warned that children are “showing up at school with empty stomachs, and schools are collecting food on an ad hoc basis and sending it home because teachers know that their students will otherwise go hungry”.

This is exactly what liberals and people on the left in the UK are saying, so why do you say:

", I suspect that many of the right on bleeding heart liberals want to pretend this problem doesn't exist in the UK." ??

You suspect wrong. However, do you deny that brutal levels of child poverty exist in Russia?
 

oneworld2

Handsome Pitbull
DP Veteran
Joined
Aug 3, 2014
Messages
18,195
Reaction score
2,497
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Libertarian - Left
Having a friend who heads a venture directly involved in the business/field of food poverty ( a UK Leftist btw ) I am shocked and extremely angry about the situations he tells me about on a regular basis regarding the dire straits many people/children are forced to endure wrt to hunger and poverty

I think if we are honest it is a problem all over the world and should try to desist from from using it as a stick with which to beat this or that nation and focus on the reality that it is the result of an extremely unfair socio-economic global system being played out in the majority of countries around the world.

I find it especially hard to read/ listen to those pushing for increased military actions complaining about child poverty seeing as if there where an enforced curtailment of military spending in the countries affected for a year or two the problem might well be eradicated altogether !! BTW I'm not naive enough to think this would happen , just finding it hard to listen to people griping about it but supporting increased military actions ( and thus spending )
 

Chagos

DP Veteran
Joined
Mar 8, 2015
Messages
32,377
Reaction score
9,564
Location
in expatria
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Private
The more important issue in the UK is that a school lunch may alleviate the hunger of those kids coming from households that cannot afford breakfast or a proper supper, but only partly does for nutrition that kids need at that age.

I'd agree that austerity measures that lead to such problems are disgusting if such austerity is not more directed at fields that can far better afford it.

Equally disgusting, however, is when the OP instrumentalizes the issue in the infantile attempt "to get even" for far worse conditions having been addressed in his home country.

This cannot be about whose kids go hungrier and for the longer time, such a state of hunger is a disgrace anywhere.
 

Chagos

DP Veteran
Joined
Mar 8, 2015
Messages
32,377
Reaction score
9,564
Location
in expatria
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Private
Yes, it was a 2012 story, but let me update you with a report from the UN rapporteur on extreme child poverty.

Things have got worse not better,
You are lying.

Since Universal Credit began to be introduced in 2013 more children became (and are becoming) eligible for a free school meal. Which takes nothing from the fact that many miss out on the two important other meals, but also takes nothing from your lie of things having meanwhile become worse.
and the funny thing is, I suspect that many of the right on bleeding heart liberals want to pretend this problem doesn't exist in the UK.
I suggest that you take your suspicions and shove them into the dishonesty pot where the rest of your stuff resides.
 

Manc Skipper

Wrinkly member
DP Veteran
Joined
Jan 25, 2008
Messages
38,850
Reaction score
27,958
Location
Southern England
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Slightly Liberal
Look at the date. Your story is 9 years old.

Child poverty is a worry wherever it rears its head. There are children living in poverty under the Tory government, but since your story "broke" about 109 years ago, much has been done in British schools and wider society to address this: breakfast clubs in school, the increase in the minimum wage, the introduction of the living wage etc. Yes child poverty is sickening and no the Tory government, like many other governments around the world, doesn't go far enough in addressing it. I personally believe in the the extension of free school meals for poorer families and of course, the low wage economy needs to be addressed. Your thoughts?

Now to Russia, where I once saw a harrowing documentary about Moscow's street kids - homeless having been turfed out of their homes by poor parents, alcoholic parents and parents who just didn't give a s*it about them. Yes that was on TV several years ago, but since your own article is from 2012, I thought I'd throw it in.

Note: the once reputable Evening Standard has long fallen into disrepute since being taken over in 2009 (so 3 years before your article) by Evgeni Lebedev, a Russian oligarch. Wonder if this influenced your choice of ancient article, by any chance?

Not only Russian-owned but edited by ex-austerity Chancellor George ****ing Osborne.
 

Urethra Franklin

Folle
DP Veteran
Joined
Feb 4, 2005
Messages
3,579
Reaction score
980
Location
European Union
Gender
Female
Political Leaning
Undisclosed
I think if we are honest it is a problem all over the world and should try to desist from from using it as a stick with which to beat this or that nation and focus on the reality that it is the result of an extremely unfair socio-economic global system being played out in the majority of countries around the world.

Indeed. A worldwide phenomenon:

https://www.feedingamerica.org/hunger-in-america/child-hunger-fact

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-04...-children-suffer-from-food-insecurity/9653532

https://blogs.mediapart.fr/alberteins/blog/110918/un-francais-sur-cinq-ne-mange-pas-sa-faim

Capitalism and policies of austerity are failing poorer families. Corrupt systems are failing poorer families. The UK has its faults. France has its faults. All nations have their failings. Useless pretending Russia is a paradise when it's a hellhole.
 
Last edited:

Westphalian

DP Veteran
Joined
Jun 16, 2018
Messages
2,647
Reaction score
286
Location
East
Gender
Undisclosed
Political Leaning
Independent
Slowly some of you are getting there, and Oneworkd is there already!

Child poverty is a global problem, not a specifically Russian one. Hence RV's thread was disingenuous, like so many.

I was amused to see people jumping on the 2012 story without bothering to question whether this was still a problem in 2019.

The UK has huge problems with not just child poverty but adult poverty, widespread use of food banks, mass inequality and huge social division. It's a disgraceful advert for globalisation.
 

oneworld2

Handsome Pitbull
DP Veteran
Joined
Aug 3, 2014
Messages
18,195
Reaction score
2,497
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Libertarian - Left
Indeed. A worldwide phenomenon:

https://www.feedingamerica.org/hunger-in-america/child-hunger-fact

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-04...-children-suffer-from-food-insecurity/9653532

https://blogs.mediapart.fr/alberteins/blog/110918/un-francais-sur-cinq-ne-mange-pas-sa-faim

Capitalism and policies of austerity are failing poorer families. Corrupt systems are failing poorer families. The UK has its faults. France has its faults. All nations have their failings. Useless pretending Russia is a paradise when it's a hellhole.

TBH I find this whole West v Russia jingoism/brinksmanship tedious , extremely dangerous and ultimately sure to be aiding the diverting of money away from populations further and into the ever expanding pockets of those in the arms trade . Imo , those involved in wanting to see a conflict or are happy to wish to escalate tensions really don't care about the plight of the poorest sectors of their societies and could be guilty of actually exploiting the sufferings of these people to create a situation that is even worse for them
 

Peter King

Supporting Member
DP Veteran
Monthly Donator
Joined
Feb 19, 2012
Messages
29,956
Reaction score
14,648
Location
Netherlands
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Moderate

PeteEU

DP Veteran
Joined
Mar 11, 2006
Messages
37,931
Reaction score
13,545
Location
Denmark
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Centrist
.

The UK has huge problems with not just child poverty but adult poverty, widespread use of food banks, mass inequality and huge social division. It's a disgraceful advert for globalisation.

Has nothing to do with Jews...er I mean globalisation. It has to do with failed right wing Thatcher/Reagan economics.

Scandinavia ain't perfect, but has been part of globalisation for ever and we don't have near the same problems. Same goes for Germany and other countries.

It comes down to domestic policies towards the lower half economy wise of the population and the UK has been hostile to said population for decades...hell you could argue centuries.

Sent from my Honor 8X using Tapatalk
 

bongsaway

DP Veteran
Joined
Jan 16, 2019
Messages
38,238
Reaction score
25,199
Location
Flori-duh
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Progressive
I see this popping up here and there except with different cities cited. Odd.
 
Top Bottom