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Liberalism's true function

keith

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"The function of Liberalism in the past was that of putting a limit to the powers of kings. The function of true Liberalism in the future will be that of putting a limit to the powers of Parliaments."--- Herbert Spencer
 
Unfortunately, the meaning of liberalism in America, as is commonly understood, doesn't really indicate that governments should be limited. It would be nice if that were the case.
 
Let's try another quote:
Liberalism is the philosophy for our time, because it does not try to conserve every tradition of the past, because it does not apply to new problems the old doctrinaire solutions, because it is prepared to experiment and innovate and because it knows that the past is less important than the future. -- Pierre Trudeau
 
Let's try another quote:
Liberalism is the philosophy for our time, because it does not try to conserve every tradition of the past, because it does not apply to new problems the old doctrinaire solutions, because it is prepared to experiment and innovate and because it knows that the past is less important than the future. -- Pierre Trudeau

If liberals are so innovative, why do they need to quote a dead guy to defend their existence?
 
If liberals are so innovative, why do they need to quote a dead guy to defend their existence?
We like to learn from the past but unlike you guys we don't let it dictate the future.
 
Unfortunately, the meaning of liberalism in America, as is commonly understood, doesn't really indicate that governments should be limited. It would be nice if that were the case.

the meaning is still the same as it always was.... it's just that many of the folks that call themselves liberals are not liberal.
 
We like to learn from the past but unlike you guys we don't let it dictate the future.

Well I am not a conservative on most things--I am just an anti-federalist on most things, a distinction autocrats cannot even conceptualize.
 
the meaning is still the same as it always was.... it's just that many of the folks that call themselves liberals are not liberal.

The true meaning is the same. The meaning, as used by Americans is different, and many of those who call themselves liberals here, support a government with a long and strong arm.
 
"The function of Liberalism in the past was that of putting a limit to the powers of kings. The function of true Liberalism in the future will be that of putting a limit to the powers of Parliaments."--- Herbert Spencer


In America, they're doing just the opposite. Unfortunately so are the conservatives, just differing in details.


In short, we're screwed.
 
Liberalism is a godless and insatiable quest for power and other people's property and money.
 
Unfortunately, the meaning of liberalism in America, as is commonly understood, doesn't really indicate that governments should be limited. It would be nice if that were the case.

>" Joseph Schumpeter says: "As a supreme, if unintended, compliment, the enemies of private enterprise have thought it wise to appropriate its label" (i.e.,"liberalism"). In the early 20th century, for instance, the education reformer John Dewey marveled at the achievements of Soviet Bolshevism and urged Americans “to give up much of [their] economic freedom,” to abandon their “individualistic tradition,” and to recognize “the supremacy of public need over private possessions.” And yet Dewey called himself not a Marxist but a liberal -- a "new" liberal; similarly, he referred to his ideas not as collectivism but rather as individualism -- a "new" individualism.

Over the succeeding years and decades, leftists, progressives, and socialists have routinely championed crusades and ideals bearing ever-less resemblance to classical liberalism, yet they invariably have identified both themselves and their evolving causes as “liberal.” Programs that were in fact leftist and socialist were enacted by legislators and social reformers in the name of “liberalism,” whose reputation as a guardian of human freedom served not only to shield those programs from public criticism, but in fact to win wide public approval of them.

In terms of both semantic usage and governmental policy, "liberalism" today is most widely associated with a single concept: the mixed economy, i.e., a state that is neither completely capitalist (laissez faire) nor entirely socialist (totalitarian). It is a union of conflicting -- liberal vs. anti-liberal -- elements. As Friedrich Hayek, the great twentieth-century scholar of liberalism, observed, such inconsistencies raise a host of vital questions:

If we have the redistribution of wealth, then what of private property?
If we enact biased laws to effect economic (or "social") equality, then what of political equality?
If we regard the collective as the essential entity, then what of the primacy of the individual?
Precisely what is the mix of the mixed economy?
When is it capitalist and when is it socialist?
When does it protect property and when does it confiscate it?
When does it leave people alone and when does it coerce them?
When does it adhere to the ethics of individualism and when does it obey the code of collectivism?
Mixed practices (such as the mixed economy) imply mixed principles, which in turn imply mixed, and therefore irrational, premises. And it is precisely that jumble which constitutes the modern "liberal" welfare state. Its exemplar is the "liberal" who supports laissez faire for social issues but statism for economic issues.

Contemporary "liberalism," then, is a parody of its predecessor. It is leftism in disguise. Specifically, it is a stalwart champion of:

group rights and collective identity, rather than of individual rights and responsibilities (e.g., the racial preference policies known as affirmative action, and the left's devotion to identity politics generally);
the circumvention of law rather than the rule of law (as exemplified by the flouting of immigration laws and nondiscrimination laws, and by a preference for judicial activism whereby judges co-opt the powers that rightfully belong to legislators);
the expansion of government rather than its diminution (favoring ever-escalating taxes to fund a bloated welfare state and a government that oversees virtually every aspect of human life); and
the redistribution of wealth (through punitive taxes and, again, a mushrooming welfare state) rather than its creation through free markets based on private property.
In addition, today's "liberalism," unlike classical liberalism, is intolerant of opposing viewpoints, favors the promotion of group-think, and interprets as treason any deviation from its own intellectual orthodoxy. We see this phenomenon manifested with particular clarity by self-identified black "liberals" who excoriate black conservatives as “race traitors,” “house slaves,” “Oreos,” and “Uncle Toms.” <
Liberalism - Discover the Networks
 
Let's try another quote:
Liberalism is the philosophy for our time, because it does not try to conserve every tradition of the past, because it does not apply to new problems the old doctrinaire solutions, because it is prepared to experiment and innovate and because it knows that the past is less important than the future. -- Pierre Trudeau
Situation is, the conservatives attempt to keep that which works, and in our system what our founders laid down as completely new [ Classical Liberalism ] worked. Not perfectly, mind you, but better than anything to date. What liberals are trying to advertise as new and improved is just warmed up left overs from attempts at achieving a "utopia" that we know from past experience turn, fairly quickly, into dystopias.

That would be what? Liberal conservatism? By its real name it is socialism, traveling over the speed limit here, on the interstate that leads to communism. And if you cannot see that, you certainly should not be driving on that interstate.
 
That's the trend of what America's liberals have been morphing into.

...and that's why I say a lot of liberals are not liberal.

labels aren't **** when it comes to reality... what folks call themselves is irrelevant to what they actually are.
lots of conservatives are not conservative, lots of liberals are not liberal, lots of libertarians are not libertarian.. so on and so forth.
 
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