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Liberal EU leaders behave like 5 year olds over Brexit.

blaxshep

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The fiery exchanges took place as the EU Parliament convened for an extraordinary plenary session in Brussels Tuesday, with European and British delegates meeting to discuss the UK's complicated and potentially messy divorce from the bloc.

At one point, a German MEP accused Farage and fellow Leave campaigners of misleading the British public over the vote.

"The worst liars can be found among UKIP," said Manfred Weber, leader of the European People's Party, to loud applause.

"Mr. Farage, if you had an ounce of decency in you, you would apologize today to the British. Shame on you."

During his speech, Jean-Claude Juncker, the president of the European Commission, turned to confront Farage and said he was surprised he was there.

"That's the last time you are applauding here," he said to the British Brexiters.

"You were fighting for the exit, the British people voted in favor of the exit. Why are you here?"

Brexit clashes: Jean-Claude Juncker to Nigel Farage -- 'Why are you here?' - CNN.com
 

RJApple

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The fiery exchanges took place as the EU Parliament convened for an extraordinary plenary session in Brussels Tuesday, with European and British delegates meeting to discuss the UK's complicated and potentially messy divorce from the bloc.

At one point, a German MEP accused Farage and fellow Leave campaigners of misleading the British public over the vote.

"The worst liars can be found among UKIP," said Manfred Weber, leader of the European People's Party, to loud applause.

"Mr. Farage, if you had an ounce of decency in you, you would apologize today to the British. Shame on you."

During his speech, Jean-Claude Juncker, the president of the European Commission, turned to confront Farage and said he was surprised he was there.

"That's the last time you are applauding here," he said to the British Brexiters.

"You were fighting for the exit, the British people voted in favor of the exit. Why are you here?"

Brexit clashes: Jean-Claude Juncker to Nigel Farage -- 'Why are you here?' - CNN.com

Of course they are behaving like children. How dare the people of Britain not bow to their will. How dare they actually want to have their own, independent nation rather than merge with the failing European continent. How dare they have a differing opinion!
 

cpwill

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Of course they are behaving like children. How dare the people of Britain not bow to their will. How dare they actually want to have their own, independent nation rather than merge with the failing European continent. How dare they have a differing opinion!

It's the EU. They're probably upset to learn that they won't be allowed to keep re-having the vote until the people respond as they are directed.
 

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The BBC is now devoting it's resources to denouncing the Leave vote in hopes of ushering in "the correct vote result" on a re-vote.
Globalist, elitist propaganda at it's worst.

The "Establishment" is not just a USA phenomenon, the British are also oppressed by "The Establishment" and their self interests at the expense of working schnooks everywhere.
The Establishment is a global Western problem for all who are not wealthy enough to BUY their favorite politicians and courts.

But, people ARE beginning to see through the charade in spite of the propaganda as evidenced in the Leave vote. I suspect it won't be long now until the charade of freedom is revoked and the true ugly nature of Western politics reveals it's ubiquitous and evil nature. I would say prepare for a rough ride in the near future. The Globalists and elitist are used to getting their way....at any cost....a cost they have always been able to afford.
 

ocean515

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The BBC is now devoting it's resources to denouncing the Leave vote in hopes of ushering in "the correct vote result" on a re-vote.
Globalist, elitist propaganda at it's worst.

The "Establishment" is not just a USA phenomenon, the British are also oppressed by "The Establishment" and their self interests at the expense of working schnooks everywhere.
The Establishment is a global Western problem for all who are not wealthy enough to BUY their favorite politicians and courts.

But, people ARE beginning to see through the charade in spite of the propaganda as evidenced in the Leave vote. I suspect it won't be long now until the charade of freedom is revoked and the true ugly nature of Western politics reveals it's ubiquitous and evil nature. I would say prepare for a rough ride in the near future. The Globalists and elitist are used to getting their way....at any cost....a cost they have always been able to afford.

I just finished watching "Brexit: The Movie", which is available on YouTube. It clearly was done by pro-leave people, but the details of how the EU works, along with trade, etc., are interesting.

I encourage people to watch it. Yes, it's no doubt slanted, but it does provide some interesting details. It's a bit long, but it is enlightening.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UTMxfAkxfQ0
 

Mason66

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Maybe they should get together with the Dems from this side and have a play date.
 

joG

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The fiery exchanges took place as the EU Parliament convened for an extraordinary plenary session in Brussels Tuesday, with European and British delegates meeting to discuss the UK's complicated and potentially messy divorce from the bloc.

At one point, a German MEP accused Farage and fellow Leave campaigners of misleading the British public over the vote.

"The worst liars can be found among UKIP," said Manfred Weber, leader of the European People's Party, to loud applause.

"Mr. Farage, if you had an ounce of decency in you, you would apologize today to the British. Shame on you."

During his speech, Jean-Claude Juncker, the president of the European Commission, turned to confront Farage and said he was surprised he was there.

"That's the last time you are applauding here," he said to the British Brexiters.

"You were fighting for the exit, the British people voted in favor of the exit. Why are you here?"

Brexit clashes: Jean-Claude Juncker to Nigel Farage -- 'Why are you here?' - CNN.com

There is certainly a lot of friendship and goodwill on display there.
 

joG

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It's the EU. They're probably upset to learn that they won't be allowed to keep re-having the vote until the people respond as they are directed.

I think it is more that they want to be rid of the UK, because the UK has over and again put their finger in wounds and stopped regulation the EU wanted. Where the EU went on anyway, as with the Euro and the the open boarders treaty, the UK opted out. This is extremely embarrassing and the EUMEPs feel double-bind.
 

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Keep in mind that they know that if Britain leaves and succeeds they will be only the first to leave. The EU will be what's left after the big boys have left the party - weak sauce.
 

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There is certainly a lot of friendship and goodwill on display there.

Honestly, though, why is UKIP there? Isn't the whole point to have nothing to do with the Euros?
 

joG

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Honestly, though, why is UKIP there? Isn't the whole point to have nothing to do with the Euros?

Having nothing to do with them is not the point. The point is getting off a sinking ship in an orderly way. Of course, rubbing their noses in it, does not make them want to be rational.
 

joG

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Keep in mind that they know that if Britain leaves and succeeds they will be only the first to leave. The EU will be what's left after the big boys have left the party - weak sauce.

Yes. Farage was kind enough to remind them of that.
 

Carjosse

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UKIP and the Leave campaign did lie and mislead the public, they have even said most of the things they said will not come true. Then they removed they removed some of the evidence they said that in the first place. It is also Farage's turn to be insulted, because that is almost all he has done to the European parliament is insult their members in a way that would probably get him thrown out of most national assemblies. The UK is leaving why are going to have to deal with the consequences.
 

Carjosse

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I just finished watching "Brexit: The Movie", which is available on YouTube. It clearly was done by pro-leave people, but the details of how the EU works, along with trade, etc., are interesting.

I encourage people to watch it. Yes, it's no doubt slanted, but it does provide some interesting details. It's a bit long, but it is enlightening.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UTMxfAkxfQ0

Except even that blatantly lies and misleads. In the first part where it talks about the pillow regulations is a lie, a lot of those are EU patents for pillows or devices that use them as well as common sense regulations like you can't make them out of garbage. The UK will still have to follow those regulations regardless if they want to trade with the EU.
 

joG

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UKIP and the Leave campaign did lie and mislead the public, they have even said most of the things they said will not come true. Then they removed they removed some of the evidence they said that in the first place. It is also Farage's turn to be insulted, because that is almost all he has done to the European parliament is insult their members in a way that would probably get him thrown out of most national assemblies. The UK is leaving why are going to have to deal with the consequences.

You mean there is no free speech in the Canadian assembly and the true must not be said? That is disappointing. ;)
 

Carjosse

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You mean there is no free speech in the Canadian assembly and the true must not be said? That is disappointing. ;)

If you start actually insulting someone, calling them useless and worthless garbage of a human being for example you will be kicked out by the speaker. There is free speech then there is being disorderly. That is what Farage has done in the past to EU officials.
 

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Except even that blatantly lies and misleads. In the first part where it talks about the pillow regulations is a lie, a lot of those are EU patents for pillows or devices that use them as well as common sense regulations like you can't make them out of garbage. The UK will still have to follow those regulations regardless if they want to trade with the EU.

The problem is that in almost every point Farange touches upon in his speech he hits the truth right on. Every one of those sitting there knows this and they all know that the EU must change radically, if the EU is to survive. They have know this for a good number of years. At first, they thought that they could handle the change in self-induced crisis after crisis. A few years ago it began dawning on them, that they had been wrong and the critics right. I know a number of these guys and have followed their development.

Their dilemma is that most know the alternatives of what must be done. Of the two possible alternative clusters one means returning to something like an advanced EEC. The other is to install a central government. The scenarios of number one are the opposite of where the EU elite wants to be. The advantage is, however, that they are realistically attainable and legal. The number two alternative is where they have seen themselves since before the Constitutional Convent and dream of being. Getting there is not as easy nor legal without convincing the populations. From experience they know that the convincing is tough and know also that it would be nearly impossible now that the populations have seen the careless destruction the EU has caused and that a large member nation is saying "Enough!".

But the time for muddle on is over, because the story has run its course and it is about to fall apart. This is why all those faces look so morose.
Now that is where Merkel seems to have a plan. If changes are made and the UK can decide that they are enough convincing to remain a member, the populations might be placated and the EU elite could gain enough time to sneak through the sovereignty transfers necessary. Whether this is really her plan is hard to say. What one can say it that her actions have been consistent this the hypothesis.
 

joG

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If you start actually insulting someone, calling them useless and worthless garbage of a human being for example you will be kicked out by the speaker. There is free speech then there is being disorderly. That is what Farage has done in the past to EU officials.

Really. That is not very good. I mean, calling someone garbage is not very polite. But it is not their job to be polite. I have never been able to agree to the concept that insults should be forbidden, though, I do understand the discussion and implications.
 

Carjosse

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The problem is that in almost every point Farange touches upon in his speech he hits the truth right on. Every one of those sitting there knows this and they all know that the EU must change radically, if the EU is to survive. They have know this for a good number of years. At first, they thought that they could handle the change in self-induced crisis after crisis. A few years ago it began dawning on them, that they had been wrong and the critics right. I know a number of these guys and have followed their development.

Their dilemma is that most know the alternatives of what must be done. Of the two possible alternative clusters one means returning to something like an advanced EEC. The other is to install a central government. The scenarios of number one are the opposite of where the EU elite wants to be. The advantage is, however, that they are realistically attainable and legal. The number two alternative is where they have seen themselves since before the Constitutional Convent and dream of being. Getting there is not as easy nor legal without convincing the populations. From experience they know that the convincing is tough and know also that it would be nearly impossible now that the populations have seen the careless destruction the EU has caused and that a large member nation is saying "Enough!".

But the time for muddle on is over, because the story has run its course and it is about to fall apart. This is why all those faces look so morose.
Now that is where Merkel seems to have a plan. If changes are made and the UK can decide that they are enough convincing to remain a member, the populations might be placated and the EU elite could gain enough time to sneak through the sovereignty transfers necessary. Whether this is really her plan is hard to say. What one can say it that her actions have been consistent this the hypothesis.

I agree the EU does have to change but I think a lot of their problems could be solved by actually communicating what they do, Farage is not right on everything. He complains about things the EU has nothing to do with, they have very little control over, things that the EU standardized but every country would have anyways, or things only something like the EU or some other bloc could do. The EU needs to do much better job at communicating what they actually control and what they do as well as being more transparent.
 

Carjosse

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Really. That is not very good. I mean, calling someone garbage is not very polite. But it is not their job to be polite. I have never been able to agree to the concept that insults should be forbidden, though, I do understand the discussion and implications.

It has no place in civil debate in a government chamber. All it does is prevent actual the debate from going forward.
 

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I agree the EU does have to change but I think a lot of their problems could be solved by actually communicating what they do, Farage is not right on everything. He complains about things the EU has nothing to do with, they have very little control over, things that the EU standardized but every country would have anyways, or things only something like the EU or some other bloc could do. The EU needs to do much better job at communicating what they actually control and what they do as well as being more transparent.

Communication is certainly one of the major problems of the EU. You are very right. As things stand, however, the EU cannot communicate many things, because the populations would not accept, what the EU has done or is doing. And too much of it would land in court to risk.
 

joG

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It has no place in civil debate in a government chamber. All it does is prevent actual the debate from going forward.

Of course it wouldn't have a place in most discourse. But so what. The state should not be allowed to judge, what may be said and which opinion must be curbed.
 

Carjosse

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Communication is certainly one of the major problems of the EU. You are very right. As things stand, however, the EU cannot communicate many things, because the populations would not accept, what the EU has done or is doing. And too much of it would land in court to risk.

What the hell are you talking about? The EU has a lot less control than you think it does, and what they have done has been in the interest of Europeans. They also have judicial supremacy, they are the court. The only court decisions they have forced upon its members are things like the Human Rights Act in the UK because they lack a Bill of Rights kind of deal and pro-consumer policies. What I mean is they actually need to inform people what free movement actually is and what it does for example. It only applies to EU citizens not just anyone physically in the EU. It also needs to explain how it allows investment and goods to flow throughout the entire union and how that is beneficial to all its members. All this anti-EU rhetoric is born form misunderstanding what the EU actually is.
 

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The EU has a lot less control than you think it does,

They have judicial supremacy, they are the court.
It also allows (controls) how investments and goods to flow throughout the entire union.

Oh is that all?
 

Carjosse

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Oh is that all?

Those are examples but those are its main functions. Promoting cooperation and peace in Europe, regulating and promoting trade in the EU, and improving the lives and protecting the rights of Europeans. It does this through things like freedom of movement, standardization, human rights legislation, etc. It deals with big things that affect Europeans.
 
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