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Liberal chickens coming home to roost

KLATTU

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Or put another way...reason # 1,237 why Donald Trump is now President and my even get re-elected

A workplace hug triggers a possible lawsuit and a judge?s ire against CSUMB. | Local Spin | montereycountyweekly.com

As he tells it, in a document filed in response to Burnes’ restraining order request, Forest on his first day at work “greeted Siphannay Burnes with a quick, friendly hug and thanked her” for making travel and housing arrangements when he interviewed for the job.

“I didn’t think that much of the hug because she hugged me back,” Forest writes. “The culture at CSU-Monterey Bay is very friendly and congenial… hugs are common among colleagues at the university and in the community.”

But Burnes, the administrative and research analyst for the College of Health Sciences and Human Services, told her supervisor, Dean Britt Rios-Ellis, the hug made her uncomfortable. Beyond making her uncomfortable, it also triggered memories of past sexual trauma.

#EYEROLL #TOXIC FEMINISM

She sounds almost as wiftey as Christine Blasey
 

Deuce

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‘As he tells it’
 

OlNate

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Or put another way...reason # 1,237 why Donald Trump is now President and my even get re-elected

A workplace hug triggers a possible lawsuit and a judge?s ire against CSUMB. | Local Spin | montereycountyweekly.com

As he tells it, in a document filed in response to Burnes’ restraining order request, Forest on his first day at work “greeted Siphannay Burnes with a quick, friendly hug and thanked her” for making travel and housing arrangements when he interviewed for the job.

“I didn’t think that much of the hug because she hugged me back,” Forest writes. “The culture at CSU-Monterey Bay is very friendly and congenial… hugs are common among colleagues at the university and in the community.”

But Burnes, the administrative and research analyst for the College of Health Sciences and Human Services, told her supervisor, Dean Britt Rios-Ellis, the hug made her uncomfortable. Beyond making her uncomfortable, it also triggered memories of past sexual trauma.

#EYEROLL #TOXIC FEMINISM

She sounds almost as wiftey as Christine Blasey


Or...I dunno...keep your hands to yourself at work?
 

americanwoman

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Or put another way...reason # 1,237 why Donald Trump is now President and my even get re-elected

A workplace hug triggers a possible lawsuit and a judge?s ire against CSUMB. | Local Spin | montereycountyweekly.com

As he tells it, in a document filed in response to Burnes’ restraining order request, Forest on his first day at work “greeted Siphannay Burnes with a quick, friendly hug and thanked her” for making travel and housing arrangements when he interviewed for the job.

“I didn’t think that much of the hug because she hugged me back,” Forest writes. “The culture at CSU-Monterey Bay is very friendly and congenial… hugs are common among colleagues at the university and in the community.”

But Burnes, the administrative and research analyst for the College of Health Sciences and Human Services, told her supervisor, Dean Britt Rios-Ellis, the hug made her uncomfortable. Beyond making her uncomfortable, it also triggered memories of past sexual trauma.

#EYEROLL #TOXIC FEMINISM

She sounds almost as wiftey as Christine Blasey

I have no idea why a story like this would make you vote for Donald Trump except that he grabs ******s and it's cool or something?

Anyways, what would you tell your daughter/wife/mother/any female in your life if she came home from work and said some guy she didn't really know hugged her and it made her feel uncomfortable?
 

OpportunityCost

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From your source:

In the United States, the common law requires the contact for battery be "harmful or offensive." The offensiveness is measured against a reasonable person standard. Looking at a contact objectively, as a reasonable person would see it, would this contact be offensive? Thus, a hypersensitive person would fail on a battery action if jostled by fellow passengers on a subway, as this contact is expected in normal society and a reasonable person would not find it offensive. Harmful is defined by any physical damage to the body.

Not battery.
 

Slyfox696

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I have no idea why a story like this would make you vote for Donald Trump except that he grabs ******s and it's cool or something?
Because propagandists have to push propaganda.
 

lwf

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From your source:



Not battery.

...says the defendant. Battery says the plaintiff. Is being grabbed and squeezed by a man at work something you would reasonably tolerate? I wouldn't. And I don't imagine most women would have the ability to handle the situation the way I would, so: lawsuit.

I guess we'll have to follow the case if we want to find if it's battery.
 
Last edited:

OpportunityCost

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...says the defendant. Battery says the plaintiff.

She isn't being reasonable. Even in a tort I don't think she could get to 7 jurors that would side with her.
 

RaleBulgarian

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Or put another way...reason # 1,237 why Donald Trump is now President and my even get re-elected

A workplace hug triggers a possible lawsuit and a judge?s ire against CSUMB. | Local Spin | montereycountyweekly.com

As he tells it, in a document filed in response to Burnes’ restraining order request, Forest on his first day at work “greeted Siphannay Burnes with a quick, friendly hug and thanked her” for making travel and housing arrangements when he interviewed for the job.

“I didn’t think that much of the hug because she hugged me back,” Forest writes. “The culture at CSU-Monterey Bay is very friendly and congenial… hugs are common among colleagues at the university and in the community.”

But Burnes, the administrative and research analyst for the College of Health Sciences and Human Services, told her supervisor, Dean Britt Rios-Ellis, the hug made her uncomfortable. Beyond making her uncomfortable, it also triggered memories of past sexual trauma.

#EYEROLL #TOXIC FEMINISM

She sounds almost as wiftey as Christine Blasey
DC848491-6CCD-43D5-97AB-63712E94993F.jpg
 

madasheck

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Is this what's called real news in Wingnutland? :2razz:
 

lwf

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She isn't being reasonable. Even in a tort I don't think she could get to 7 jurors that would side with her.

She is being reasonable if she truly suffered harm. If it was accidental contact then the defendant is protected even if the plaintiff was hypersensitive to such contact, but an unsolicited hug is intentional and could rise to the level of battery if harm can be shown. Not sure how much she could collect in damages, but it's not automatically a frivolous lawsuit.
 

What if...?

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I have no idea why a story like this would make you vote for Donald Trump except that he grabs ******s and it's cool or something?

Anyways, what would you tell your daughter/wife/mother/any female in your life if she came home from work and said some guy she didn't really know hugged her and it made her feel uncomfortable?

I would comfort her and tell her if there's anything else we'll seek legal remedy.

I don't believe that absent intent this kind of thing should destroy lives.

Male/female relationships are in flux right now. Slamming the pendulum the other way will not help.

I was raised that paying compliments to women was a nice thing to do. Not "You've got a nice ass!" but "Thats a nice dress". Now it could destroy my life.

We need to watch the unintended consequences going forward.

At this rate we're going to need contracts to dance with someone at a club lest it potentially destroy one party's life.

We need to address toxic masculinity without sweeping non-toxic masculinity along with it.

Do you really want me to not rescue you from a fire or drowning because it involves touching that wasn't clearly authorized? That's an extreme example, but I think you get the point.

We need to be careful here, is what I'm trying to say.
 

TheParser

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Or put another way...reason # 1,237 why Donald Trump is now President and my even get re-elected

A workplace hug triggers a possible lawsuit and a judge?s ire against CSUMB. | Local Spin | montereycountyweekly.com

As he tells it, in a document filed in response to Burnes’ restraining order request, Forest on his first day at work “greeted Siphannay Burnes with a quick, friendly hug and thanked her” for making travel and housing arrangements when he interviewed for the job.

“I didn’t think that much of the hug because she hugged me back,” Forest writes. “The culture at CSU-Monterey Bay is very friendly and congenial… hugs are common among colleagues at the university and in the community.”

But Burnes, the administrative and research analyst for the College of Health Sciences and Human Services, told her supervisor, Dean Britt Rios-Ellis, the hug made her uncomfortable. Beyond making her uncomfortable, it also triggered memories of past sexual trauma.

#EYEROLL #TOXIC FEMINISM

She sounds almost as wiftey as Christine Blasey






When will men ever learn?

One cannot do or say anything at school, at work, or in public that some female will not complain about.

So do NOT even say "Good morning" unless she says it first. And when you say it, keep your eyes straight ahead.

Of course, never say anything as provocative as "I really like your new sweater." Oh, my! She might find that offensive and dissolve into tears.

Someday, somehow, the MeToo generation is going to get its comeuppance for what it has started, but I do not know how and when.


(P.S. Of course, if you do NOT say "Good morning" first, she might find that in itself harassment. Men cannot win.)
 

MrWonka

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“greeted Siphannay Burnes with a quick, friendly hug and thanked her”

I can say with a high degree of confidence that I have never in my entire life hugged a coworker. Particularly not one I've just met.

Either way, I'd say the scoreboard reads something like...

Women who've been sexually assaulted or harassed with no consequences for the man: 87,567294
Men who were completely innocent who faced serious consequences become a woman lied: 37

Not super worried about it. Don't hug a co-worker you just met. That's very unprofessional at best. It's not rocket science.
 

Praxas

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Or put another way...reason # 1,237 why Donald Trump is now President and my even get re-elected

A workplace hug triggers a possible lawsuit and a judge?s ire against CSUMB. | Local Spin | montereycountyweekly.com

As he tells it, in a document filed in response to Burnes’ restraining order request, Forest on his first day at work “greeted Siphannay Burnes with a quick, friendly hug and thanked her” for making travel and housing arrangements when he interviewed for the job.

“I didn’t think that much of the hug because she hugged me back,” Forest writes. “The culture at CSU-Monterey Bay is very friendly and congenial… hugs are common among colleagues at the university and in the community.”

But Burnes, the administrative and research analyst for the College of Health Sciences and Human Services, told her supervisor, Dean Britt Rios-Ellis, the hug made her uncomfortable. Beyond making her uncomfortable, it also triggered memories of past sexual trauma.

#EYEROLL #TOXIC FEMINISM

She sounds almost as wiftey as Christine Blasey

So what in the world does Trump's "electability" have to do with this? Somehow you read this and said "Trump's going to get re-elected". Connect the dots for us here.

In regards to the article, who the hell hugs a co-worker they just met? I've worked with people for years and never hugged them. Why the need to hug a co-worker?
 

What if...?

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...says the defendant. Battery says the plaintiff. Is being grabbed and squeezed by a man at work something you would reasonably tolerate? I wouldn't. And I don't imagine most women would have the ability to handle the situation the way I would, so: lawsuit.

I guess we'll have to follow the case if we want to find if it's battery.

I don't really like being touched except by those close to me.

But I'm not freaked out by a friendly hug or pat on the back. If I am I say something.

I don't really think humans will fare well in a no touching ever world. Which is where we're heading right now.

I've said before that much of this problem is an unintended Consequence of the state claiming a monopoly on the use of force. Men used to keep other men in check. I've done it more than once.

Force monopolies make asshole a protected class.

So assholery is rampant.

I also know two people whose lives were destroyed by false accusations that were later recanted.

Its only a matter of time before we see a major false accusation. If we're gonna go this route we need strong sanctions for levying a false accusation. Neither of the accusers I mentioned above received any sanction. They were both minors at the time. 14 and 16.
 

DoLoop

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Or put another way...reason # 1,237 why Donald Trump is now President and my even get re-elected

A workplace hug triggers a possible lawsuit and a judge?s ire against CSUMB. | Local Spin | montereycountyweekly.com

As he tells it, in a document filed in response to Burnes’ restraining order request, Forest on his first day at work “greeted Siphannay Burnes with a quick, friendly hug and thanked her” for making travel and housing arrangements when he interviewed for the job.

“I didn’t think that much of the hug because she hugged me back,” Forest writes. “The culture at CSU-Monterey Bay is very friendly and congenial… hugs are common among colleagues at the university and in the community.”

But Burnes, the administrative and research analyst for the College of Health Sciences and Human Services, told her supervisor, Dean Britt Rios-Ellis, the hug made her uncomfortable. Beyond making her uncomfortable, it also triggered memories of past sexual trauma.

#EYEROLL #TOXIC FEMINISM

She sounds almost as wiftey as Christine Blasey

Let's say, for the sake of argument, that you are male.

You'd have no problem with a brand new colleague of yours at work thanking you for help in setting up some workplace logistics and giving you a hug? The new colleague's a male, too.
 

OpportunityCost

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She is being reasonable if she truly suffered harm. If it was accidental contact then the defendant is protected even if the plaintiff was hypersensitive to such contact, but an unsolicited hug is intentional and could rise to the level of battery if harm can be shown. Not sure how much she could collect in damages, but it's not automatically a frivolous lawsuit.

It cannot rise to the level of battery in the US. It can be sued as a tort and my guess is a jury would not agree with her.

Hypersensitive goes directly to the reasonable person clause of all laws.
 

americanwoman

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I would comfort her and tell her if there's anything else we'll seek legal remedy.

I don't believe that absent intent this kind of thing should destroy lives.

Male/female relationships are in flux right now. Slamming the pendulum the other way will not help.

I was raised that paying compliments to women was a nice thing to do. Not "You've got a nice ass!" but "Thats a nice dress". Now it could destroy my life.

We need to watch the unintended consequences going forward.

At this rate we're going to need contracts to dance with someone at a club lest it potentially destroy one party's life.

We need to address toxic masculinity without sweeping non-toxic masculinity along with it.

Do you really want me to not rescue you from a fire or drowning because it involves touching that wasn't clearly authorized? That's an extreme example, but I think you get the point.

We need to be careful here, is what I'm trying to say.

I agree.

From this women's perspective I can totally understand her point of view, I also get uncomfortable with hugs from people I am not close to but I also understand there are people who hug a lot and it doesn't mean a dang thing. The thing here we can do is just firmly stand up and maybe just tell the person that it makes them uncomfortable, end of story. No need to get the law involved or make it more than it probably was.
 

Sampson Simpson

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Who really is the chicken? Oh yeah, the right wingers who live in their rural bubbles, surround thesmleves with only white, christian conservatives, and are so scared of all those brown people and all the boogie men waiting around every corner, and who are so chicken **** they don't feel safe unless they are walking around armed and have an arsenal at home.

Meanwhile those liberals live knee deep in divers people and don't have a gun. how do they manage to survive and feel safe?

yeah, we all know who the real chicken ****s are
 

lwf

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When will men ever learn?

One cannot do or say anything at school, at work, or in public that some female will not complain about.

So do NOT even say "Good morning" unless she says it first. And when you say it, keep your eyes straight ahead.

Of course, never say anything as provocative as "I really like your new sweater." Oh, my! She might find that offensive and dissolve into tears.

Someday, somehow, the MeToo generation is going to get its comeuppance for what it has started, but I do not know how and when.


(P.S. Of course, if you do NOT say "Good morning" first, she might find that in itself harassment. Men cannot win.)

Your ridiculous rant here illustrates the root of the problem IMO. Men aren't used to considering how their actions and words will be perceived because our culture barely teaches boys how to function socially. We're not punished for being crass and aggressive, and because of that, crassness and aggressiveness are necessary survival tactics when dealing with other crass and aggressive men. Girls are punished at a young age for failing to learn when a compliment is appropriate and when it could be construed as offensive, and so develop social intelligence. Boys are not expected to understand this and in many cases are punished if they show social intelligence.

If as a man you feel victimized by the "MeToo" movement, the best course of action is to work on your social intelligence. The first step: Put yourself in a woman's shoes and imagine what it would be like to be approached by a huge ugly dude who probably secretly wants to take your clothes off. Imagine how that dude could speak to you that wouldn't frighten you or piss you off, and then behave that way around women.

For instance: I wouldn't be very happy if a huge ugly dude I've never seen before who probably wants to take my clothes off was leering at me and then approached me and complimented my shirt. If that same dude who probably wants to take my clothes off wasn't staring and simply walked by, smiled, said "good morning," and kept walking, I would be fine with that.
 

Sampson Simpson

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When will men ever learn?

One cannot do or say anything at school, at work, or in public that some female will not complain about.

So do NOT even say "Good morning" unless she says it first. And when you say it, keep your eyes straight ahead.

Of course, never say anything as provocative as "I really like your new sweater." Oh, my! She might find that offensive and dissolve into tears.

Someday, somehow, the MeToo generation is going to get its comeuppance for what it has started, but I do not know how and when.


(P.S. Of course, if you do NOT say "Good morning" first, she might find that in itself harassment. Men cannot win.)

Although its sketchy what women can claim as sexual harassment, and they can use it to abuse it if they wanted to, saying "good morning" and "I like your sweater" is not something that is considered sexual harassment. Even sexual harassment videos say that it is not. now, saying "good morning hot tits" or "man, your tits really pop in that sweater. is
 

lwf

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It cannot rise to the level of battery in the US. It can be sued as a tort and my guess is a jury would not agree with her.

I was referring to the tort of battery since that is the only type of battery that you can sue for damages, which I believe is what the woman in the op did. That's why the article I linked to was for the tort of battery and not the crime of battery. And you may be right that a jury wouldn't agree with her, though there is case law where unsolicited hugs were found to be battery. It's an interesting case either way.

Hypersensitive goes directly to the reasonable person clause of all laws.

Not necessarily. It goes to forseeability of harm, i.e. if I tap someone on the shoulder and they are hypersensitive to touch and suffer damages I may not be liable if my action was reasonable, as a reasonable person wouldn't object to being tapped on the shoulder. But if I punch someone in the face and they have brittle bone disease, I am liable for ALL of their damages. Hypersensitive people can collect more damages if they are found to be the victim of a tort than other people if they suffer more harm.

So the question: Is an unsolicited hug of someone you barely know at work a reasonable action? If it is not, the plaintiff can collect for all damages she suffered, even those that result from her own hypersensitivity. If it is reasonable to hug strangers at work (if you work at a strip club, perhaps,) then there is no battery.
 

What if...?

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So what in the world does Trump's "electability" have to do with this? Somehow you read this and said "Trump's going to get re-elected". Connect the dots for us here.

In regards to the article, who the hell hugs a co-worker they just met? I've worked with people for years and never hugged them. Why the need to hug a co-worker?

Just met in person. They had been communicating regarding his move. Arranging travel and housing, right?

He was grateful. He made the wrong move. But absent malice or reckless disregard I don't think a lawsuit is justified. That should be for patterns of behavior or clear violations of decent behavior. Not a "one off".

That should be handled interpersonally, by an intermediary if she's too sensitive. Then drop the hammer if it happens again, or similar.

Full court press for every little thing is not a good idea, IMO. Not when he may have meant no harm or offense.

(He could actually be a dickhead. But she could just be looking for a payday. My point is more "overall" as to the subject at hand)
 
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