Late-blooming lesbians: women can switch sexualities as they mature

[Hicup]

Not really. You're attracted to who you're attracted to, regardless of your gender. You don't need to know if you have a penis or a vagina, or if you have an xx or an xy chromosome in order to find yourself attracted to another person.

Hehehe.. yeah ok, whatever you say. Are you serious?

I am beside myself with your attempt to nullify.. ")


Tim-

 

[rivrrat]

Hehehe.. yeah ok, whatever you say. Are you serious?

I am beside myself with your attempt to nullify.. ")


Tim-

Very serious. Why would I need to know if I had a vagina in order to find someone attractive? My appendages are irrelevant when it comes to who I'm attracted to.

 

[roguenuke]

Come back to me with peer reviewed, and accepted historical fact. Did you even look at the Wiki pages? Oh yeah you did, you posted excerpts.. LOL

Read it again for the first time..

My lord.. Do you think I would make a claim so easily dismissed by "wiki"...

In both the japanese example, and the chnese example, the author cites one source, and for the Japanese he cites two.. LOL

Grow up, learn to read between the lines..


Tim-

Considering you didn't provide any actual proof at all that there wasn't homosexuality in those cultures, I don't think that it is really appropriate for you to demand peer-reviewed proof that it existed in those societies in earlier times. However, I will provide links besides Wiki that says it did. I have no idea if these are peer-reviewed studies or not, but it might be good for your argument if you find some proof to support it.

Homosexuality in the Japanese Buddhist Tradition
glbtq >> social sciences >> Japan
Wakashudo as a form of homosexuality in old Japan | Samurai Weapons
Japan Glossary - Samurai

History of Chinese homosexuality
SpringerLink - Book Chapter
Homosexuality in China
HOMOSEXUALS IN CHINA - China | Facts and Details

Now, can you provide links with studies that attest that there wasn't homosexual relationships in China or Japan prior to the 1900s? Just because there wasn't a word for "homosexuality" in those societies, doesn't mean the relationships themselves didn't occur. In fact, the actual word "homosexual" in English didn't exist until the early 1900s.

Words on Word History by Phil Baldi

And the term "gay", when referring to homosexuals, first known usage as such was about the same time, but possibly within 20 or 30 years before the turn of the century.

Online Etymology Dictionary

So what was the English word for homosexual relationships in the early 1800s and before?

 

[Hicup]

Considering you didn't provide any actual proof at all that there wasn't homosexuality in those cultures

I'm going to assume you see the error in this request?

I read the first link for Japanese, and the first link for Chinese proof of homosexuality. In the Chinese example it is a opinion piece for a Chinese Paper, and cites no authority, or works. In the Japanese piece, the author is clearly talking about pederastry, which I do not argue, in fact in antiquity pederastry was common. Now, I ask you, is adult homosexual intercourse upon a minor considered homosexuality to you? [wink]

Rivvrat -

Very serious. Why would I need to know if I had a vagina in order to find someone attractive? My appendages are irrelevant when it comes to who I'm attracted to.

If you say so...


Tim-

 

[rivrrat]

I'm going to assume you see the error in this request?

I read the first link for Japanese, and the first link for Chinese proof of homosexuality. In the Chinese example it is a opinion piece for a Chinese Paper, and cites no authority, or works. In the Japanese piece, the author is clearly talking about pederastry, which I do not argue, in fact in antiquity pederastry was common. Now, I ask you, is adult homosexual intercourse upon a minor considered homosexuality to you? [wink]

Rivvrat -

If you say so...


Tim-

Of course I say so. If you think differently, feel free to explain to the class why knowing my "gender" is necessary for having an attraction to someone.

For instance, before we had a word for gender... or even understood what it was, or what a penis was. Or what a vagina was... didn't we still have attractions? Do you think other animals know what a "gender" is? Or that the one appendage they have is a penis? Or that hole is a vagina? Do you think it's relevant to getting turned on?

Send some kids out into the wilderness to be raised sans society and see if they're actually capable of having an atraction to someone even though they don't know what gender they are. I'm quite willing to bet any amount of money that they will.

If you think otherwise, feel free to explain your logic.

 

[Hicup]

Oh just wnated to add that the author of the Japanese pedophile article states clearly that a great deal of his data is re-interpretation of already existing speculation. Just thought I'd throw that out there..

Rivvrat - Attraction by itself isn't anything. It's what we do with the parts we have that matters in the end. Knowing what parts you have is kind of important. But even if I were to say that attraction isn't important, it does become important the minute one finds themselves attracted. Ones gender defines that attraction psychologically, and reconciles the emotion.

You're use of the argument that an understanding of what gender is, example placing a meaning behind it in English, is weak. To the child in the wilderness raised by wolves, their gender is defined. They may call it "rinkydick", but it is what it is.

Try again!


Tim-

 

[rivrrat]

Oh just wnated to add that the author of the Japanese pedophile article states clearly that a great deal of his data is re-interpretation of already existing speculation. Just thought I'd throw that out there..

Rivvrat - Attraction by itself isn't anything. It's what we do with the parts we have that matters in the end. Knowing what parts you have is kind of important. But even if I were to say that attraction isn't important, it does become important the minute one finds themselves attracted. Ones gender defines that attraction psychologically, and reconciles the emotion.

You're use of the argument that an understanding of what gender is, example placing a meaning behind it in English, is weak. To the child in the wilderness raised by wolves, their gender is defined. They may call it "rinkydick", but it is what it is.

Try again!


Tim-

Attraction is everything. What we do with our "parts" only fulfills a desire instilled by the attraction. I don't need to know what my gender is to feel an attraction to someone. I likewise don't need to know what my gender is to fulfill that desire. I need only know how to physically fulfill the desire the attraction instills. That could be with my own hands, or with theirs. Doesn't matter. The attraction exists independent of the fulfillment of physical desire. I don't need to **** someone in order to be attracted to them. Additonally, I don't even need to know HOW to **** someone in order to be attracted to them.

 

[Hicup]

Attraction is everything. What we do with our "parts" only fulfills a desire instilled by the attraction. I don't need to know what my gender is to feel an attraction to someone. I likewise don't need to know what my gender is to fulfill that desire. I need only know how to physically fulfill the desire the attraction instills. That could be with my own hands, or with theirs. Doesn't matter. The attraction exists independent of the fulfillment of physical desire. I don't need to **** someone in order to be attracted to them. Additonally, I don't even need to know HOW to **** someone in order to be attracted to them.

I respectfully disagree. You're using the emotions of the mind in accounting for the attraction, and then dismissing the mind in terms of knowing or understaning in any format, what ones gender is, as if they are separate things. They are not. If the mind is used to reconcile the attraction, part of that reconciliation process of the mind is in the way one identifies with oneself. I imagine that identification comes to the question of ones own gender at some point. In other words, I argue that you can't be attracted to anything without knowing ones self first.


Tim-

 

[rivrrat]

I respectfully disagree. You're using the emotions of the mind in accounting for the attraction, and then dismissing the mind in terms of knowing or understaning in any format, what ones gender is, as if they are separate things. They are not. If the mind is used to reconcile the attraction, part of that reconciliation process of the mind is in the way one identifies with oneself. I imagine that identification comes to the question of ones own gender at some point. In other words, I argue that you can't be attracted to anything without knowing ones self first.


Tim-

And I disagree. I was masturbating to people I found attractive LONG before I "knew myself". And before I even knew what "gender" was or even what a penis was or exactly what my vagina was (or what it was called). I had no idea really how to have sex, or what sex even was. But yet, there I was ... feeling sexual, physical attractions to other people. Now, knowing myself better makes the sex better, for certain. But has little bearing on what person instills feelings of pure lust in me.

 

[Hicup]

And I disagree. I was masturbating to people I found attractive LONG before I "knew myself". And before I even knew what "gender" was or even what a penis was or exactly what my vagina was (or what it was called). I had no idea really how to have sex, or what sex even was. But yet, there I was ... feeling sexual, physical attractions to other people. Now, knowing myself better makes the sex better, for certain. But has little bearing on what person instills feelings of pure lust in me.

I'll concede that there may be some truth in that statement, but I would add the caveat that, in this early stage perhaps both your gender identity, and sexuality are not set. A flux if you will. In your example, one might argue that sexuality isn't even a prerequisit factor in masturbation. Perhaps masturbation in and of itself is required to help the body and the mind reconcile either component. Add it all in with the attraction (the catalyst that prompts the masturbation period) object, and we see, or tend to infer a deep connection to ones identity in all facits.

Interesting discussion Rivvrat. I like talking to you about this sexuality stuff. You seem very reasonable, and rational about it all.

Tim-

 

[rivrrat]

I'll concede that there may be some truth in that statement, but I would add the caveat that, in this early stage perhaps both your gender identity, and sexuality are not set. A flux if you will. In your example, one might argue that sexuality isn't even a prerequisit factor in masturbation. Perhaps masturbation in and of itself is required to help the body and the mind reconcile either component. Add it all in with the attraction (the catalyst that prompts the masturbation period) object, and we see, or tend to infer a deep connection to ones identity in all facits.

Interesting discussion Rivvrat. I like talking to you about this sexuality stuff. You seem very reasonable, and rational about it all.

Tim-

I don't know about it being set, I don't know if it's ever SET. Who we are attracted to changes as we age. I imagine both due to physical and emotiona/psychological changes. I was attracted to both men and women at that young age, and I still am today. There are people that we feel a deeper attraction to based on emotion, and personality, intelligence, etc, etc. But just raw physical, near uncontrollable lust? Doesn't require any such knowledge at all. LOL

Sexuality is not black and white, it's not fixed in stone. It's changing, evolving part of ourselves. As we grow and change, so do our our tastes. Our food tastes, drink tastes, movies, music, hobbies, the TYPE of person we're attracted to, etc. Why wouldn't our sexuality change too?

 

[Gipper]

Oh great, so I could grow up in 5 years and love ****. That would sure be a slight to my future wife, whoever she may be.

 

[Andalublue]

Oh great, so I could grow up in 5 years and love ****. That would sure be a slight to my future wife, whoever she may be.

She could well be a he.

 

[Red_Dave]

I know, but that is the reason why it's so important to people.

Not even that (its mentioned about 10 times in the bible) so why are people so passionate about it? (often leaving the whole fighting injustice, loving your neighbour as yourself thing on the back-burner) It never ceases to fascinate me that something so seemingly innocent can provoke such bile. Maybe the amount of prominent social conservatives caught with rent boys would explain this.

 

[Your Star]

Not even that (its mentioned about 10 times in the bible) so why are people so passionate about it? (often leaving the whole fighting injustice, loving your neighbour as yourself thing on the back-burner) It never ceases to fascinate me that something so seemingly innocent can provoke such bile. Maybe the amount of prominent social conservatives caught with rent boys would explain this.

I never said it was logical. Thats just where it comes from I believe. Heck I don't even think of it as a sin, but what are you gonna do?

 

[LizardofOz]

All women are lesbians, there are just varying degrees. Please, someone ask me to expand on my claim.

 

[spud_meister]

All women are lesbians, there are just varying degrees. Please, someone ask me to expand on my claim.

can you expand on your clam?

 

[Andalublue]

can you expand on your clam?

Pleasure...

 

[spud_meister]

and back on topic, i'll post the same article i posted on the first page of this thread.
Study suggests difference between female and male sexuality ? Science Blog

 

[LizardofOz]

can you expand on your clam?

-Let me give you the typical one: A girls night out what do they do? They change in front of eachother nonchantly and think nothing of it.
-In college (in my experience) it isn't uncommon to just see two girls going at it "for fun" or groping each other in "jest"
-Any woman friend I have ever known has had at least one lesiban experience (be it kissing, touching, etc, etc)
-My girlfriend has "experimented"

Honestly though, I'm not sure if it qualifies as being a lesiban, just all women act very freely around eachother. It probably resides in most of them as they mature, so this claim goes against what I have concluded myself. Of course I'm not a scientist just an eye witness.


Well see spud, you got the proof right there. Either way...it's pretty sweet.

 

[Mustachio]

Late-blooming lesbians: women can switch sexualities as they mature - Telegraph

So Gay ain't genetic it would seem.

A student at Southern Connecticut State University conducted a study by finding women on a website for married lesbians and one third of them reported to have developed sexual attraction to women later in life?

At first, I thought "this study wasn't conducted by anybody with credibility, the method used had no credible scientific backing and the results don't actually prove anything," but then I decided -- you know what? It's good enough for me. Because I don't want to know the truth. I prefer believing things that make me comfortable. So hooray for this study!

 

[LizardofOz]

Like I said, all women are born with a lil' gay in them.