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Just when I was about to become a Melissa Harris-Perry groupie...this.

Smeagol

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I can't find the video clip online but she basically ridiculed the late democratic Sen. Daniel Moynihan and conservative newspaper columnist George Will for talking about the adverse affect unmarried single parent homes have had on the black community. In her response, she made it seem all they were saying is a ring around the finger is the only distinction between homes where there are two parents raising kids alone vs. female parent. I really like Harris-Perry and have found myself gravitating more to liberal pundits because of what I consider to be greater level of intellectual honesty than what I've seen on the right as of late. Needless to say, I think on this topic she is allowing her feminist agenda biases to trump the truth and this is more than disappointing.

Harris-Perry who is a professional educator must be aware of the sad statistics that show overwhelmingly the poor educational outcomes from kids raised by single mothers. Then there are the crime statistics, the incarceration rates, the drug use, the teen pregnancy rate, the poverty rates that have become multi-generational and on and on. And please don't feed me the line about the one in a million (exaggerating) kid who made it despite insurmountable odds so because it didn't make a difference with them, it doesn't make a difference with any kid; that's what the conservative pundits who I've lost faith in do. I'm talking about the overwhelming majority.

Its not about whether or not there's a piece of metal on her left hand finger. Its about children who need the discipline of a strong but loving and protective father along with the loving nurturing of a mother to have the best possible life outcomes, some more than others depending on their dispositions. I love and honor mothers, especially my own but I'm honest enough to acknowledge the vast majority of kids do best when they have both their mother and father living under the same roof.

I still like her, will keep watching and think the braids are bangin'! I just felt I needed to say something.
 

lolabird

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I can't find the video clip online but she basically ridiculed the late democratic Sen. Daniel Moynihan and conservative newspaper columnist George Will for talking about the adverse affect unmarried single parent homes have had on the black community. In her response, she made it seem all they were saying is a ring around the finger is the only distinction between homes where there are two parents raising kids alone vs. female parent. I really like Harris-Perry and have found myself gravitating more to liberal pundits because of what I consider to be greater level of intellectual honesty than what I've seen on the right as of late. Needless to say, I think on this topic she is allowing her feminist agenda biases to trump the truth and this is more than disappointing.

Harris-Perry who is a professional educator must be aware of the sad statistics that show overwhelmingly the poor educational outcomes from kids raised by single mothers. Then there are the crime statistics, the incarceration rates, the drug use, the teen pregnancy rate, the poverty rates that have become multi-generational and on and on. And please don't feed me the line about the one in a million (exaggerating) kid who made it despite insurmountable odds so because it didn't make a difference with them, it doesn't make a difference with any kid; that's what the conservative pundits who I've lost faith in do. I'm talking about the overwhelming majority.

Its not about whether or not there's a piece of metal on her left hand finger. Its about children who need the discipline of a strong but loving and protective father along with the loving nurturing of a mother to have the best possible life outcomes, some more than others depending on their dispositions. I love and honor mothers, especially my own but I'm honest enough to acknowledge the vast majority of kids do best when they have both their mother and father living under the same roof.

I still like her, will keep watching and think the braids are bangin'! I just felt I needed to say something.

How are those kids faring who had Sandusky for a father figure?
 

Kal'Stang

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I can't find the video clip online but she basically ridiculed the late democratic Sen. Daniel Moynihan and conservative newspaper columnist George Will for talking about the adverse affect unmarried single parent homes have had on the black community. In her response, she made it seem all they were saying is a ring around the finger is the only distinction between homes where there are two parents raising kids alone vs. female parent. I really like Harris-Perry and have found myself gravitating more to liberal pundits because of what I consider to be greater level of intellectual honesty than what I've seen on the right as of late. Needless to say, I think on this topic she is allowing her feminist agenda biases to trump the truth and this is more than disappointing.

Harris-Perry who is a professional educator must be aware of the sad statistics that show overwhelmingly the poor educational outcomes from kids raised by single mothers. Then there are the crime statistics, the incarceration rates, the drug use, the teen pregnancy rate, the poverty rates that have become multi-generational and on and on. And please don't feed me the line about the one in a million (exaggerating) kid who made it despite insurmountable odds so because it didn't make a difference with them, it doesn't make a difference with any kid; that's what the conservative pundits who I've lost faith in do. I'm talking about the overwhelming majority.

Its not about whether or not there's a piece of metal on her left hand finger. Its about children who need the discipline of a strong but loving and protective father along with the loving nurturing of a mother to have the best possible life outcomes, some more than others depending on their dispositions. I love and honor mothers, especially my own but I'm honest enough to acknowledge the vast majority of kids do best when they have both their mother and father living under the same roof.

I still like her, will keep watching and think the braids are bangin'! I just felt I needed to say something.

Don't know her. But I basically agree with your basic premise that two adults are needed to raise children. What I don't agree with you on is the "strong but loving and protective father along with the loving nurturing of a mother" bit. It just needs two loving and strong adults. Doesn't matter the gender.
 

mpg

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MSNBC acknowledges their bias, so unless they get caught lying, threads about them don't really belong in this sub-forum. This is a very important topic, but it belongs somewhere else.
 

Fisher

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I can't find the video clip online but she basically ridiculed the late democratic Sen. Daniel Moynihan and conservative newspaper columnist George Will for talking about the adverse affect unmarried single parent homes have had on the black community. In her response, she made it seem all they were saying is a ring around the finger is the only distinction between homes where there are two parents raising kids alone vs. female parent. I really like Harris-Perry and have found myself gravitating more to liberal pundits because of what I consider to be greater level of intellectual honesty than what I've seen on the right as of late. Needless to say, I think on this topic she is allowing her feminist agenda biases to trump the truth and this is more than disappointing.

Harris-Perry who is a professional educator must be aware of the sad statistics that show overwhelmingly the poor educational outcomes from kids raised by single mothers. Then there are the crime statistics, the incarceration rates, the drug use, the teen pregnancy rate, the poverty rates that have become multi-generational and on and on. And please don't feed me the line about the one in a million (exaggerating) kid who made it despite insurmountable odds so because it didn't make a difference with them, it doesn't make a difference with any kid; that's what the conservative pundits who I've lost faith in do. I'm talking about the overwhelming majority.

Its not about whether or not there's a piece of metal on her left hand finger. Its about children who need the discipline of a strong but loving and protective father along with the loving nurturing of a mother to have the best possible life outcomes, some more than others depending on their dispositions. I love and honor mothers, especially my own but I'm honest enough to acknowledge the vast majority of kids do best when they have both their mother and father living under the same roof.

I still like her, will keep watching and think the braids are bangin'! I just felt I needed to say something.

Your observation is part of the history as to why Cornel West and the entire review panel denied her a full professorship in the African-American studies department she had been recruited to initially. They did not consider her scholarly and I think she ended up getting her professorship in the Women's Studies Department until she moved to Tulane. There is a history with her not being honest in her analysis which is why West has called her a fraud and a fake (Dr. Cornel West Calls Melissa Harris-Perry A “Fraud” | News One ; the basis for the piece: Diverse February 2, 2012 )
 

sawyerloggingon

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One of the main problems in our society is these young women who go around spreading their legs for every man that looks at them twice. What we end up with is illegitimate young boys that look to gangs for male role models and young girls who follow their moms example and perpetuate the cycle. At one time "bastard" children and women that had them were ostracized but unfortunately it has become accepted as a norm now and IMO this is one of if not the biggest threat our society faces.
 

Smeagol

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Don't know her. But I basically agree with your basic premise that two adults are needed to raise children. What I don't agree with you on is the "strong but loving and protective father along with the loving nurturing of a mother" bit. It just needs two loving and strong adults. Doesn't matter the gender.

I personally don't think the relatively new family dynamic of gay adoption has enough history to observe any trusted data. You might be right or it might not be. Stating so IMHO without any historical data to back it up is in my humble opinion probably just activism. Nothing wrong with that as long as we recognize it for what it is.
 

Smeagol

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MSNBC acknowledges their bias, so unless they get caught lying, threads about them don't really belong in this sub-forum. This is a very important topic, but it belongs somewhere else.


I'm so sorry. I get confused by the rules of this section and for this reason I tend to be reluctant to start media/news threads. I saw MSNBC listed by name in the headers so I assumed it was the appropriate place.
 

Smeagol

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One of the main problems in our society is these young women who go around spreading their legs for every man that looks at them twice. What we end up with is illegitimate young boys that look to gangs for male role models and young girls who follow their moms example and perpetuate the cycle. At one time "bastard" children and women that had them were ostracized but unfortunately it has become accepted as a norm now and IMO this is one of if not the biggest threat our society faces.

I sort of agree but not fully. As someone who knows more than a few young ladies who found themselves in unplanned pregnancies, none that I know were loose ladies. They honestly thought they'd (probably) found Mr. Right and after which engaged in activities that should be reserved for after marriage but in this day and age many if not most suitors are unwilling to delay intimacy and would rather move on to someone else. This places a tremendous amount of pressure on ladies give in or risk being alone their whole lives, in part because not only men but consenting women have lowered their standards and created a larger field other options men who are slow at making commitments can choose instead. Then pregnancy occurs and she's a single mom thinking all along marriage was inevitable. I'm sure there are cases where some ladies are just promiscuous. I don't think most are and probably never imagined being in that situation until it happened.

I do agree with the rest however. Way too many kids are forced to be raised without a dad in the home and that has consequences.
 

Smeagol

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How are those kids faring who had Sandusky for a father figure?

You just shed light another important danger of single mom families. Pedophiles actually seek out kids in families where the father is absent or non-custodial because unlike the PC culture they realize those kids are more vulnerable than kids from homes where Dad was married to Mom and living under the same roof together as a family. A father figure is not the same thing as their own father. I don't have time to look up the source right now but I understand that simply being from a broken home or a home where the biological parents were never married increases a child's likelihood of being sexually violated as a kid by 400% be it from new boyfriends, stepfathers or whomever.
 

Kal'Stang

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I personally don't think the relatively new family dynamic of gay adoption has enough history to observe any trusted data. You might be right or it might not be. Stating so IMHO without any historical data to back it up is in my humble opinion probably just activism. Nothing wrong with that as long as we recognize it for what it is.

It actually has more history to observe than climate change. ;) Gays have raised children long before the Americas were even discovered...much less the US established.
 

lolabird

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You just shed light another important danger of single mom families. Pedophiles actually seek out kids in families where the father is absent or non-custodial because unlike the PC culture they realize those kids are more vulnerable than kids from homes where Dad was married to Mom and living under the same roof together as a family. A father figure is not the same thing as their own father. I don't have time to look up the source right now but I understand that simply being from a broken home or a home where the biological parents were never married increases a child's likelihood of being sexually violated as a kid by 400% be it from new boyfriends, stepfathers or whomever.

I agree that a family comprised of a loving mother and father offers a slight advantage, but a strong, intelligent, and motivated single mother can move the world.
Sexual abuse can and does occur within a family where the father is seemingly devoted and loving to his children.
Parents, whether married or divorced, have a responsibility to nurture and raise their children to become intelligent and caring human beings. Children should be their number priority, superseding boyfriends, girlfriends, etc. But as we all know, that's not the case. It all comes down to personal responsibility, doesn't it?
 

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I agree that a family comprised of a loving mother and father offers a slight advantage, but a strong, intelligent, and motivated single mother can move the world.
Sexual abuse can and does occur within a family where the father is seemingly devoted and loving to his children.
Parents, whether married or divorced, have a responsibility to nurture and raise their children to become intelligent and caring human beings. Children should be their number priority, superseding boyfriends, girlfriends, etc. But as we all know, that's not the case. It all comes down to personal responsibility, doesn't it?

To an extent yes but I'm talking about data and statistical outcomes, not if and then isolated cases. The fact is children of unmarried and divorced parents are the victims of sexual abuse at 400% the rate of kids of married parents, although we all wish the number was 0% in every case. Similar troubling statistics are seen in the lives of children in school performance, teen pregnancy, literacy rates, crime numbers, etc. compared to ideal kids who are the products of more ideal backgrounds. We can say if everybody just did this then everything would be okay. The problem is everybody doesn't do this so everything is not okay.

Secondly, I'm of the strong opinion that certain personality types make rearing children alone with good outcomes very difficult if not impossible. IMHO there are innate characteristics in certain people that prevent them from thriving in a less than ideal environment due to no fault of their own. For example, we all know in the wild lions congregate and live in what we call prides. In every case and with no one getting all the lions together to attend a workshop on the Social Engineering of Lions in Africa, every pride is headed up by a leader of the pride who is always MALE. I think the similar instinct that drives geese to fly south for the winter, prevents some boys from receiving the leadership of a woman while growing up, including their own mother. Thankfully its not true for every case but I think it is true for some cases. When these boys are forced to then grow up in a fatherless home, I think the outcomes of these boys are adversely affected and ultimately society at large pays a price for their lack of proper socialization to fit their innate characteristics in their formative years.

There are probably a host of other innate characteristics that some kids are born with then grow up in single parent homes that adversely affect their life outcomes and ultimately all of society. I can even see a potential problem with your example of an ideal mom, the strong, intelligent, and motivated single mother, which is admittedly the best scenario under the immediate situation. Suppose that hypothetical mother has 3 children, an oldest daughter and 2 younger sons. Being forced to raise her children alone, making the best of her situation she has to sometimes and possibly often put on her disciplinarian hat to keep her sons in line. The older daughter never sees male leadership in the home modeled while growing up and the strongest impressions she repeatedly sees is female leadership and discipline exercised by her mom over her brothers. Fast forward 15 to 20 years and she has little to no reference on male leadership in the home and only knows what she saw modeled, women have to keep the boys in line and under the strict discipline of the woman of the house. She is now married herself and is literally driving her husband out of the home by being overbearing and domineering toward him because that's all she saw and all she knows. Men, at the same time innately crave the honor and respect of the woman in their lives, which she neither understands or is equipped to offer and tbo thinks he's on an ego trip. Before long he's getting what he thinks is that honor and respect from inappropriate places compounding the cyclical negative statistics of the disintegration of the black home.

And btw, I do not consider a 2 parent home a "slight" advantage by any measurement.
 

opendebate

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I can't find the video clip online but she basically ridiculed the late democratic Sen. Daniel Moynihan and conservative newspaper columnist George Will for talking about the adverse affect unmarried single parent homes have had on the black community. In her response, she made it seem all they were saying is a ring around the finger is the only distinction between homes where there are two parents raising kids alone vs. female parent. I really like Harris-Perry and have found myself gravitating more to liberal pundits because of what I consider to be greater level of intellectual honesty than what I've seen on the right as of late. Needless to say, I think on this topic she is allowing her feminist agenda biases to trump the truth and this is more than disappointing.

Harris-Perry who is a professional educator must be aware of the sad statistics that show overwhelmingly the poor educational outcomes from kids raised by single mothers. Then there are the crime statistics, the incarceration rates, the drug use, the teen pregnancy rate, the poverty rates that have become multi-generational and on and on. And please don't feed me the line about the one in a million (exaggerating) kid who made it despite insurmountable odds so because it didn't make a difference with them, it doesn't make a difference with any kid; that's what the conservative pundits who I've lost faith in do. I'm talking about the overwhelming majority.

Its not about whether or not there's a piece of metal on her left hand finger. Its about children who need the discipline of a strong but loving and protective father along with the loving nurturing of a mother to have the best possible life outcomes, some more than others depending on their dispositions. I love and honor mothers, especially my own but I'm honest enough to acknowledge the vast majority of kids do best when they have both their mother and father living under the same roof.

I still like her, will keep watching and think the braids are bangin'! I just felt I needed to say something.

First of all, I love her. I think she is passionate, very intelligent and articulate. This is a tough one. I understand where she is coming from also understand the need for a father in the home; or at least a similar presence.

I was a single mom. My kids father was not very involved in their lives; I have a son and a daughter. I first believed like she does, that I could do it myself. Then one day I realized how profoundly different the natural temperament of my son was compared to my daughter. My daughter and I could talk and reason and she would listen and discuss, even at a very very young age. My son on the other hand, I needed to get in a head lock, stubborn little ****.

When he was in grade school I signed him up for peewee football. I watched the coaches with him. What an eye opener. It was a distinctly male kind of interaction. They were tough and exercised their authority, but there was this quiet undercurrent of that very different connection that men have with one another. Like somehow they communicated to the boys, we are the alpha males, we have your best interests at heart, you need to shut up and follow my lead but not in a petty or self aggrandizing way or overtly aggressive way. I find it hard to articulate but I saw it. From that day forward I parented him very different then my daughter, I tried to put on that man hat. He just needed it. Most boys need a strong presence in their lives. There is a whole other layer to being a male that I think woman have a hard time understanding how to teach her son. Not in every case, obviously, but if we are speaking in generalities I have to reluctantly concede it as such.

One thing I question about the feminist movement is when women think that to be powerful they need to exhibit the same qualities as men. I would like to see more insistence on being respected for what women naturally bring to the table as women. (I'm gonna get my ass kicked for that one aren't I)

As for MHP, we are all human and the good far out weighs the bad in my opinion.
 
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