• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every persons position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

Joe Miller Security Guards Detain Journalist At Town Hall Meeting (VIDEO)

pbrauer

DP Veteran
Joined
Jun 6, 2010
Messages
25,394
Reaction score
7,206
Location
Oregon
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Liberal

Ockham

Noblesse oblige
DP Veteran
Joined
Oct 12, 2009
Messages
23,909
Reaction score
11,001
Location
New Jersey
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Libertarian - Right
What's outrageous about it?
 

Whovian

Banned
Joined
Oct 5, 2010
Messages
7,153
Reaction score
2,250
Location
dimensionally transcendental
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Conservative
What's outrageous about it?

being detained by NON-police officers? having your right to due process stepped on?

Hopfinger was held in a hallway of the school until Anchorage police arrived. They did not charge him, but said they would forward the case to the district attorney's office.
Apparently, the police didn't think he had actually broken any laws, or they would have arrested him when they arrived.

I'd sue.
 

Ockham

Noblesse oblige
DP Veteran
Joined
Oct 12, 2009
Messages
23,909
Reaction score
11,001
Location
New Jersey
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Libertarian - Right
being detained by NON-police officers? having your right to due process stepped on?

I didn't see anyone's due process being stepped on. I saw private security secure a potential threat and move that person.
Apparently, the police didn't think he had actually broken any laws, or they would have arrested him when they arrived.

I'd sue.
So maybe he sues. Big deal. And security isn't there to arrest anyone - they are there to control a situation or percieved threat and negate that threat. Again, I saw no problem with any video shot.
 

Deuce

Outer space potato man
DP Veteran
Joined
Feb 6, 2010
Messages
76,967
Reaction score
33,996
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Undisclosed
I didn't see anyone's due process being stepped on. I saw private security secure a potential threat and move that person.
So maybe he sues. Big deal. And security isn't there to arrest anyone - they are there to control a situation or percieved threat and negate that threat. Again, I saw no problem with any video shot.

When you hold someone against their will it's a felony.
 

Ockham

Noblesse oblige
DP Veteran
Joined
Oct 12, 2009
Messages
23,909
Reaction score
11,001
Location
New Jersey
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Libertarian - Right
When you hold someone against their will it's a felony.

Then why weren't the security members arrested?

Wait --- let me get my hip waders on... okay go ahead now and answer.


Edit: oh and Alaska law citation needed please... :)
 

pragmatic

"Pawn in game of life"
DP Veteran
Joined
Jul 31, 2009
Messages
2,221
Reaction score
1,031
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Independent
So much for the freedom of the press... this is outrageous!!!


Doesn't really sound that "outrageous" when you read the whole article.

William Fulton heads up DropZone Security, the firm hired by Miller for the event, and said in a statement that Hopfinger "repeatedly pushed a camera into the face of Mr. Miller. He continued to aggressively pursue him. I told the reporter several times that he needed to stop and that he was trespassing, he ignored me. He then proceeded to stalk Mr. Miller and even shoved an individual into a locker. Based upon this trespass and his assault, we detained him and escorted him from the premises."

Fulton also said he didn't realize Hopfinger was a reporter until he said so. Fulton says he told Hopfinger: "Sir, that doesn't matter: you've been asked to leave, this is a private event."
Hopfinger was held in a hallway of the school until Anchorage police arrived. They did not charge him, but said they would forward the case to the district attorney's office.



.
 

Ockham

Noblesse oblige
DP Veteran
Joined
Oct 12, 2009
Messages
23,909
Reaction score
11,001
Location
New Jersey
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Libertarian - Right
Doesn't really sound that "outrageous" when you read the whole article.

William Fulton heads up DropZone Security, the firm hired by Miller for the event, and said in a statement that Hopfinger "repeatedly pushed a camera into the face of Mr. Miller. He continued to aggressively pursue him. I told the reporter several times that he needed to stop and that he was trespassing, he ignored me. He then proceeded to stalk Mr. Miller and even shoved an individual into a locker. Based upon this trespass and his assault, we detained him and escorted him from the premises."

Fulton also said he didn't realize Hopfinger was a reporter until he said so. Fulton says he told Hopfinger: "Sir, that doesn't matter: you've been asked to leave, this is a private event."
Hopfinger was held in a hallway of the school until Anchorage police arrived. They did not charge him, but said they would forward the case to the district attorney's office.

.

Yeah - that just so... so... Outrageous.

:rofl


outrage4yv.jpg
 

Manc Skipper

Wrinkly member
DP Veteran
Joined
Jan 25, 2008
Messages
33,630
Reaction score
22,439
Location
Southern England
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Slightly Liberal
So the thugs' boss defends them with his prejudicial characterisation of the reporter's behaviour. "Pushed a camera in the face" "aggressively pursued" "stalked" In his opinion.
 

Whovian

Banned
Joined
Oct 5, 2010
Messages
7,153
Reaction score
2,250
Location
dimensionally transcendental
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Conservative
The video in the OP only shows a small portion of the incident of the detention. It does not show anything that led up to it. We are left with a he said/she said.

That being the case, I opt to side with the detained party until evidence is provided that the detained party acted in a manner that justified his detention by civilian security personnel.
 

Ockham

Noblesse oblige
DP Veteran
Joined
Oct 12, 2009
Messages
23,909
Reaction score
11,001
Location
New Jersey
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Libertarian - Right
So the thugs' boss defends them with his prejudicial characterisation of the reporter's behaviour. "Pushed a camera in the face" "aggressively pursued" "stalked" In his opinion.

They told him to stop, he wouldn't. Dunno what else to tell ya.

I can see being outraged if they beat the **** out of the guy, or they even roughed him up. Or, if they broke his camera or something else --- but everything was nice an calm, he was walked out and removed from the area. Sounds like a typical political gathering to me.
 
Last edited:

Whovian

Banned
Joined
Oct 5, 2010
Messages
7,153
Reaction score
2,250
Location
dimensionally transcendental
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Conservative
They told him to stop, he wouldn't. Dunno what else to tell ya.

I can see being outraged if they beat the **** out of the guy, or they even roughed him up. Or, if they broke his camera or something else --- but everything was nice an calm, he was walked out and removed from the area. Sounds like a typical political gathering to me.

Is there any video showing this part of the exchange? Anyone other than the guards or the candidate to corroborate their end of the story? Also, one post in this thread mentions that the guards to ld the blogger this was a private event, and others call it a public event.

Also, I have a problem with civilians handcuffing someone and detaining them.
 

pbrauer

DP Veteran
Joined
Jun 6, 2010
Messages
25,394
Reaction score
7,206
Location
Oregon
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Liberal
Doesn't really sound that "outrageous" when you read the whole article.

William Fulton heads up DropZone Security, the firm hired by Miller for the event, and said in a statement that Hopfinger "repeatedly pushed a camera into the face of Mr. Miller. He continued to aggressively pursue him. I told the reporter several times that he needed to stop and that he was trespassing, he ignored me. He then proceeded to stalk Mr. Miller and even shoved an individual into a locker. Based upon this trespass and his assault, we detained him and escorted him from the premises."

Fulton also said he didn't realize Hopfinger was a reporter until he said so. Fulton says he told Hopfinger: "Sir, that doesn't matter: you've been asked to leave, this is a private event."
Hopfinger was held in a hallway of the school until Anchorage police arrived. They did not charge him, but said they would forward the case to the district attorney's office.



.
The event was held at a public school and according to the reporter there was no indication that it was a private event. My guess Sen. Lisa Murkowski is loving this.
 

Taylor

DP Veteran
Joined
Aug 31, 2009
Messages
16,141
Reaction score
6,310
Location
US
Political Leaning
Undisclosed
The event was held at a public school and according to the reporter there was no indication that it was a private event.
Why should it matter that it was a public school?
 

Councilman

DP Veteran
Joined
Apr 25, 2009
Messages
4,454
Reaction score
1,654
Location
Riverside, County, CA.
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Conservative
So what he may have been disruptive and disrespectful after all he is a liberal and they are by nature jerks.

This is a nothing story for and by liberal idiots who asr out to cause trouble because they can't get press with their brilliance because it's none existent.

Now if they had kicked his sorry ass and put him in a coma that would be a story but only if if he died later.

Wow, "I WAS CHANNELING A LIBERAL THERE FOR A SECOND HOW DID I DO?"

Seriously freedom of the press comes with restrictions and there are lines you don't cross.

I have help press credentials for many years and they are not a free pass to be an idiot ever.

We have no idea what really took place and this story is just a story and means or proves nothing.
 
Last edited:

Ockham

Noblesse oblige
DP Veteran
Joined
Oct 12, 2009
Messages
23,909
Reaction score
11,001
Location
New Jersey
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Libertarian - Right
Is there any video showing this part of the exchange? Anyone other than the guards or the candidate to corroborate their end of the story? Also, one post in this thread mentions that the guards to ld the blogger this was a private event, and others call it a public event.

Also, I have a problem with civilians handcuffing someone and detaining them.

No other video - and since the cops didn't arrest anyone, there probably wasn't a police report either. No police report - no reason to assume the private security is lying any more than the guy in handcuffs is lying. I give the beneift of the doubt to the security guys - they're just doing their job for a paycheck. One could say the same about the reporter though, it seemed he was a little too over zealous and according to the article didn't take no for an answer. What was his motivation ? Why didn't he take the hint ?

But there's nothing outrageous here at all... this thread was a dud from the start.
 

pbrauer

DP Veteran
Joined
Jun 6, 2010
Messages
25,394
Reaction score
7,206
Location
Oregon
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Liberal
So what he may have been disruptive and disrespectful after all he is a liberal and they are by nature jerks.

This is a nothing story for and by liberal idiots who asr out to cause trouble because they can't get press with their brilliance because it's none existent.

Now if they had kicked his sorry ass and put him in a coma that would be a story but only if if he died later.

Wow, "I WAS CHANNELING A LIBERAL THERE FOR A SECOND HOW DID I DO?"

Seriously freedom of the press comes with restrictions and there are lines you don't cross.

I have help press credentials for many years and they are not a free pass to be an idiot ever.

We have no idea what really took place and this story is just a story and means or proves nothing.

Where is the proof the reporter is a liberal? The story may indeed mean nothing, however it certainly doesn't help his campaign.
 

MKULTRABOY

Banned
DP Veteran
Joined
Oct 5, 2009
Messages
10,621
Reaction score
2,104
Location
In your dreams...
Gender
Undisclosed
Political Leaning
Independent
The reporter in question is going to be on MSNBC tomorrow.
 

Whovian

Banned
Joined
Oct 5, 2010
Messages
7,153
Reaction score
2,250
Location
dimensionally transcendental
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Conservative
No other video - and since the cops didn't arrest anyone, there probably wasn't a police report either. No police report - no reason to assume the private security is lying any more than the guy in handcuffs is lying. I give the beneift of the doubt to the security guys - they're just doing their job for a paycheck. One could say the same about the reporter though, it seemed he was a little too over zealous and according to the article didn't take no for an answer. What was his motivation ? Why didn't he take the hint ?

But there's nothing outrageous here at all... this thread was a dud from the start.

I agree this is not 'outrageous'. I also agree it's pretty much he said/she said. However, I do not agree with private citizens detaining (in handcuffs, mind you), another private citizen. I find that unacceptable, regardless of the liberal/conservative/moderate/what-freaking-ever leaning of the people involve.
 

Deuce

Outer space potato man
DP Veteran
Joined
Feb 6, 2010
Messages
76,967
Reaction score
33,996
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Undisclosed
Security guards are not law enforcement. They do not have the authority to handcuff and detain you. Doing so is false imprisonment, which is a felony.

They had the right to stop him from entering, or eject him if he refused to leave. (they leased the building which made it a private event) However, they can't handcuff and arrest you except under very specific circumstances, usually involving direct witness of a felony, and even that varies by state.
 
Top Bottom