Jimmy Dore tells Progressive about RussiaGate

[Trump]

Do progressives dislike Dore because he doesn’t buy into RussiaGate?

 

[HumblePi]

Do progressives dislike Dore because he doesn’t buy into RussiaGate?

Democrats don't dislike him because nobody knows who the the hell Jimmy Dore is and why would anyone care who he is?

 

[Surrealistik]

Do progressives dislike Dore because he doesn’t buy into RussiaGate?

Dem centrists typically dislike him, progressives run the gamut in their assessments, but I'd say those that know of him tend towards liking him on the whole (his politics are fundamentally progressive, but he despises corporatist 'third way' Dems almost as much as he does the Republicans).

Personally I think he's inconsistent; sometimes he hits the nail on the head, sometimes he overreacts.

Here, he seems to be in the right overall; this is some withering hypocrisy.

 

[Craig234]

Democrats don't dislike him because nobody knows who the the hell Jimmy Dore is and why would anyone care who he is?

He's a pretty well-known youtube political commentator. He's very acerbic and of the 'sort of progressive, but fanatically opposed to any criticisms of Russian interference' variety. Kid Showbusiness on Twitter: "VIDEO: @jimmy_dore wonders why Bernie Sanders won't come on his show. #SethRich #HillaryHasParkinsons… "

 

[Redress]

Do progressives dislike Dore because he doesn’t buy into RussiaGate?

Why would we give a **** about him?

 

[Redress]

He's a pretty well-known youtube political commentator. He's very acerbic and of the 'sort of progressive, but fanatically opposed to any criticisms of Russian interference' variety. Kid Showbusiness on Twitter: "VIDEO: @jimmy_dore wonders why Bernie Sanders won't come on his show. #SethRich #HillaryHasParkinsons… "

Youtuber? When I want political commentary, I ask myself what I think. I don't need some random guy on the internets or TV to tell me what to think.

 

[Surrealistik]

He's a pretty well-known youtube political commentator. He's very acerbic and of the 'sort of progressive, but fanatically opposed to any criticisms of Russian interference' variety. Kid Showbusiness on Twitter: "VIDEO: @jimmy_dore wonders why Bernie Sanders won't come on his show. #SethRich #HillaryHasParkinsons… "

Yeah, that's the main thing that devalues him for me as a commentator: the guy really does go the extra mile in covering for Russia and downplaying/minimizing the unflattering nature of Putin's regime more generally.

Having said that, he certainly does tend to make compelling points when he's not being an apologist in this regard, and often does his homework.

 

[Cardinal]

Do progressives dislike Dore because he doesn’t buy into RussiaGate?

I hate him so much I have no words for it. I hope he dies. I hope he gets brain cancer. I hope he and everyone he loves dies in a fire.

Just one question: Who is Jimmy Dore?

 

[Checkerboard Strangler]

Yeah, that's the main thing that devalues him for me as a commentator: the guy really does go the extra mile in covering for Russia and downplaying/minimizing the unflattering nature of Putin's regime more generally.

Having said that, he certainly does tend to make compelling points when he's not being an apologist in this regard, and often does his homework.

So does Glen Greenwald.
Sorry but this Russia business is a dangerous development and Jimmy Dore thinks, it's (A) not a big deal, or what...(B)justified because "we did it to them?"

To which I would say, "Hey guess what, a-hole, I live HERE, I don't live THERE."

Defending the FBI does not automatically equal blanket approval of everything we've ever done.
Dore thinks he sounds "iconoclast".
He should sport a man-bun.

 

[Surrealistik]

So does Glen Greenwald.
Sorry but this Russia business is a dangerous development and Jimmy Dore thinks, it's (A) not a big deal, or what...(B)justified because "we did it to them?"

To which I would say, "Hey guess what, a-hole, I live HERE, I don't live THERE."

Defending the FBI does not automatically equal blanket approval of everything we've ever done.
Dore thinks he sounds "iconoclast".
He should sport a man-bun.

Yes, that's where Jimmy goes awry: he's too transfixed by certain bugbears. Having said that, like with Glen Greenwald, while it can be arduous to slog through his Russia minimizing rants, there is certainly wheat to be separated from the chaff. I would never dismiss him off-hand despite the temptation to at times, because he's right and compelling at least often enough to merit that hazing.

 

[Craig234]

Youtuber? When I want political commentary, I ask myself what I think. I don't need some random guy on the internets or TV to tell me what to think.

That's kind of a ridiculous statement. So I guess when Tom Paine wrote his pamphlet that moved the colonies to support revolution, you would have said 'not gonna read it, don't need someone's opinion'. So why are you on this forum, you don't need anyone's commentary, and like you, they don't need yours, right?

 

[Craig234]

So does Glen Greenwald.
Sorry but this Russia business is a dangerous development and Jimmy Dore thinks, it's (A) not a big deal, or what...(B)justified because "we did it to them?"

To which I would say, "Hey guess what, a-hole, I live HERE, I don't live THERE."

I wouldn't say that. Dore takes our wrongdoing and says, 'so don't talk about either side'. I say, 'talk about the wrongdoing of both'. I don't think we should ignore what we do wrong because we live here, quite the opposite, we're the only ones who DO get a vote about things we do to people who get no vote.

 

[Checkerboard Strangler]

Yes, that's where Jimmy goes awry: he's too transfixed by certain bugbears. Having said that, like with Glen Greenwald, while it can be arduous to slog through his Russia minimizing rants, there is certainly wheat to be separated from the chaff. I would never dismiss him off-hand despite the temptation to at times, because he's right and compelling at least often enough to merit that hazing.

Oh I don't dismiss anyone out of hand unless they are pure siloed conspiracy slurping whackos.
Jimmy isn't any of that. I indeed grant that he brings up plenty of legitimate R-O-N-G wrongness in the Democratic Party, and progressives are valuable for that.

But Dore's timing and tone-deafness on his own optics is both bush league and tragic.
He's gotta be smart enough to understand that we're being frog-marched into pure authoritarianism with an amazingly vindictive tone that summons nightmare visions seen most often in the "Purge" TV series and The Handmaid's Tale.

If you're a well heeled young single guy, it might just be a lot of fun to just burn it all down.
We have a lot of "just burn tha mofo to the ground" types right here at DP.

I bet that gets him laid a lot, too.
I totally get it, and I also totally get radical chic and mau-mauing the flack catchers.
I also totally get where this bullcrap leads, too.
Right into an express ticket to the Boulevard of Broken Dreams...unless you can afford to ride it out.

Jimmy Dore, Glen Greenwald and all these other "iconoclastic" armchair revolutionary new media idols have created their very own silo, which of course comes with their very own fecal iceberg attached.

For the rest of us, the Third Class and Steerage passengers, the view is different.
Carrying along the baggage of wives, kids, tough jobs or tougher retirements, and other responsibilities, may seem depressing to such tragically hip kiddies like Jimmy.
Jimmy doesn't have a berth next to his own fecal iceberg.
He's up in First Class.

We have to help row and do the dishes after Jimmy and his tragically hip icons finish feasting on the carcass of revolution.

Jimmy might as well be this guy, far as I'm concerned.

 

[Airyaman]

Who is Jimmy Dore?

 

[Checkerboard Strangler]

I wouldn't say that. Dore takes our wrongdoing and says, 'so don't talk about either side'. I say, 'talk about the wrongdoing of both'. I don't think we should ignore what we do wrong because we live here, quite the opposite, we're the only ones who DO get a vote about things we do to people who get no vote.

But right here and right now, we have to save ourselves from being drowned.
Does Jimmy understand that we are rats trapped in a large driveway refuse bin filled with water?

 

[Checkerboard Strangler]

WWJDD if this was 1934 and the press suddenly labeled Henry Ford an antisemitic fascist who cozies up to Hitler? ( which by the way, he was, and which he did do)

Would Jimmy Dore haughtily say we had no right to criticize ole Hank because we're not pure enough to have the right to?
**** Dore, he's a purity pony.

 

[Craig234]

But right here and right now, we have to save ourselves from being drowned.
Does Jimmy understand that we are rats trapped in a large driveway refuse bin filled with water?

No, he has no perspective as far as I can tell. I often point out that the mindset of the Bernie supporter who would say if Bernie isn't nominated, burn it down are few in number, but Dore pretty much seems to have that mindset - as you say, sometimes helpfully pointing out things wrong with Democrats, but then getting those facts drunk and giving them a megaphone and a knife.

He seems to have trying to look like the guy who will point out Democrats' wrongs no one else will, screaming, as a schtick, his main message, and to be mostly blind to the concept of 'lesser evil', attacking anyone who actually criticizes the bigger wrongs.

 

[Redress]

That's kind of a ridiculous statement. So I guess when Tom Paine wrote his pamphlet that moved the colonies to support revolution, you would have said 'not gonna read it, don't need someone's opinion'. So why are you on this forum, you don't need anyone's commentary, and like you, they don't need yours, right?

If I have access to the facts, I will form my own opinion. I may very well arrive at the same conclusion, but I do not need someone else to tell me what to think. One of the worst things to happen in America(and the world) is the mainstreaming of propaganda. Admittedly, it has been going on since before there even was an America, but I do think it is destructive.

 

[Craig234]

If I have access to the facts, I will form my own opinion. I may very well arrive at the same conclusion, but I do not need someone else to tell me what to think. One of the worst things to happen in America(and the world) is the mainstreaming of propaganda. Admittedly, it has been going on since before there even was an America, but I do think it is destructive.

You completely ignored my question, which is an understandable choice when you can't answer it. Your straw man about 'telling you what to think' needs no response, sounding like a petulant child, misrepresenting the issue. You can't make me!

 

[Cardinal]

Who is Jimmy Dore?

I don’t know, but he’s just the worst.

 

[HumblePi]

He's a pretty well-known youtube political commentator. He's very acerbic and of the 'sort of progressive, but fanatically opposed to any criticisms of Russian interference' variety. Kid Showbusiness on Twitter: "VIDEO: @jimmy_dore wonders why Bernie Sanders won't come on his show. #SethRich #HillaryHasParkinsons… "

I thought Trump supporters were only uniformed because of Fox brainwashing and never imagined anyone could be so vulnerable and so hungry for anything positive to Trump that they would put any credibility on unverified crap that a YouTuber planted in their consciousness. And just yesterday, republican Congressman John Ratcliff said, "Absolutely it's okay to ask a foreign government to involve themselves in our election."

There's a big problem among Trump supporters when the major news network that Trump supporters are faithful to, begins seeping in more and more flattering comments about Russia than what the reality is. Fox hosts like Tucker Carlson and Congressmen like Ted Cruz and John Kennedy are right out there in the public eye spewing pro-Russia talking points and disinformation. The right has been compromised by Russia entirely. Do we have to spell this out for them -- 'Russia = bad'

I think back 10 or 20 years and try to imagine mainstream well-known people like those I mentioned trying to insert any Russian propaganda into the mainstream consciousness of Americans and I can't fathom how any of them would get away with it.

 

[Craig234]

I thought Trump supporters were only uniformed because of Fox brainwashing and never imagined anyone could be so vulnerable and so hungry for anything positive to Trump that they would put any credibility on unverified crap that a YouTuber planted in their consciousness.

I think some people have youtube figures as primary sources. Cenk Uyger has one of the better 'channels' and is now running for Congress, endorsed yesterday by Bernie Sanders. He was a co-founder of "Justice Democrats" which is running dozens of progressive Congressional Democrats.

There's a big problem among Trump supporters when the major news network that Trump supporters are faithful to, begins seeping in more and more flattering comments about Russia than what the reality is. Fox hosts like Tucker Carlson and Congressmen like Ted Cruz and John Kennedy are right out there in the public eye spewing pro-Russia talking points and disinformation. The right has been compromised by Russia entirely. Do we have to spell this out for them -- 'Russia = bad'

I think back 10 or 20 years and try to imagine mainstream well-known people like those I mentioned trying to insert any Russian propaganda into the mainstream consciousness of Americans and I can't fathom how any of them would get away with it.

It's not quite that 'Russia = bad'; I'd suggest another view is that we blew the post-Soviet relationship with Russia, leading to a massive corruption of their country, which Putin - who I've seen estimates as having $200 billion - has become effectively dictator of, and that we should oppose a lot wrong with Russia included pretty much everything Putin stands for in his opposition to western democracy, his intelligence activities to interfere with and harm western democracies, and his pursuit of restoring a Russian empire including illegal hostilities to Ukraine, but that we want good things for the Russian people and would to try to help Russia get to a better situation. But 'current Russian government = bad', ya.

The basic issue about the Republican Party's pro-Russia shift seems to be bizarrely all about trump, that because he has a corrupt relationship with Putin, and beat all other Republican candidates to become president and had high party support and gives them the presidency, they in turn do what he wants in adopting his pro-Russia positions. That seems to be all there is to it.

 

[danielpalos]

Do progressives dislike Dore because he doesn’t buy into RussiaGate?

I haven't listened very much to his program. He seems more like the right wing.

In 1998, Page joined the Eurasia Group, a strategy consulting firm, but left three months later. In 2017, Eurasia Group president Ian Bremmer recalled on his Twitter feed that Page's strong pro-Russian stance was "not a good fit" for the firm and that Page was its "most wackadoodle" alumnus.[23] Stephen Sestanovich later described Page's foreign-policy views as having "an edgy Putinist resentment" and a sympathy to Russian leader Vladimir Putin's criticisms of the United States.[2] Over time, Page became increasingly critical of United States foreign policy toward Russia, and more supportive of Putin, with a United States official describing Page as "a brazen apologist for anything Moscow did".[4] Page is frequently quoted by Russian state television, where he is presented as a "famous American economist".
Carter Page - Wikipedia

 

[Trump]

I haven't listened very much to his program. He seems more like the right wing.

You are aware Page worked as agent for CIA in Russia

 

[danielpalos]

You are aware Page worked as agent for CIA in Russia

Your guy is a US citizen and chief magistrate of our Union.