JFK: Destiny Betrayed

[RIP U.S. Democracy]

JFK is among my favorite presidents because of his fight for civil rights, his push-back against Hoover's FBI, and his understanding that the CIA was and is a dangerous entity to the world.

Oliver Stone has gotten closer to the truth of his assassination than any official report, which were crafted to divert attention and muddy the waters. The Oswald-Alone story is bunk propaganda. The inclusion of Allen Dulles on the Warren Commission is the worst crime committed second only to the murder of JFK itself.

Bullshit. Read Gerald Posner's book Case Closed.

Oswald was the lone shooter. There was no "magic bullet", either. The ballistics evidence is easily explained.

The fact is that Oswald was a mentally disturbed loner who had no friends. Posner was the first author to actually interview Oswald's wife for his book, and she confirmed that Oswald did not have a big social circle. Oswald also tried to assassinate a right-wing politician in Dallas in March 1963 and admitted it to his wife.

And Jack Ruby was also a whack job. He loved Kennedy and that's why he killed Oswald.

 

[RIP U.S. Democracy]

His movies are dramatized historical fiction.

JFK is an enjoyable, very well-directed movie. However, it's still pure fantasy.

Jim Garrison, the New Orleans DA portrayed by Kevin Costner, was kicked out of the Army in the 1950s for being a paranoid schizophrenic. Gee...maybe that partially explains his insane crusade to pin the murder on Clay Shaw, a totally innocent man who had his life completely ruined by Garrison.

 

[RealityNow]

Bullshit. Read Gerald Posner's book Case Closed.

Oswald was the lone shooter. There was no "magic bullet", either. The ballistics evidence is easily explained.

The fact is that Oswald was a mentally disturbed loner who had no friends. Posner was the first author to actually interview Oswald's wife for his book, and she confirmed that Oswald did not have a big social circle. Oswald also tried to assassinate a right-wing politician in Dallas in March 1963 and admitted it to his wife.

And Jack Ruby was also a whack job. He loved Kennedy and that's why he killed Oswald.

Maybe you should invest the time and simply "watch the series'.

 

[SenorXm/Sirius]

I was 10 years old when JFK was assassinated. I still remember that day the teachers called us out in the hallways to tell us that he was dead.

In the next 30 to 40 years I heard the NSA, CIA, the KGB, the f b i, LBJ, and the Italian mafia assassinated him. In other words there was like 50,000 people involved in this assassination. But none of those 50,000 people talked... Lol...

Oswald acted alone.
. End of story...

 

[Integrityrespec]

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JFK: Destiny Betrayed​

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a "four-part 'deep dive' into the infamous Kennedy assassination." The original version, titled JFK Revisited: Through The Looking Glass (watch that trailer) premiered at the Cannes Film Festival this year and is still set to be released later (likely in 2022) in the US. Maybe it will be re-cut, too?
Fresh evidence reveals the truth behind the lies and misinformation like no other JFK documentary has done before.

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‘JFK: Destiny Betrayed’: Oliver Stone digs even deeper into his conspiracy theories​

Four-part assassination doc revisits the familiar evidence and spotlights some little-known clues.​

By Richard Roeper
March 07, 2022 05:07 PM

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What If Robert F. Kennedy Had Lived? | America's Lost President | Timeline​

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end quote

More and more info and documents will over time come to light. This happed 58+yrs Ago... Therefore: Some of the people involved who were in their 20's and 30's during that time are in their 80's, 90's... many of the older one who weilded power are long dead, but some of their offsprings are still living.

At one time I considered myself very knowledgable on the Kennedy assassination, in fact on Kennedy, MLK, Abe Lincoln. I read a lot of books, watched a lot of films. Now my memory is not as good as it was years ago when I read something like 15 books on the Kennedy assassination. I never felt the facts presented by the Warren commission fit the known evidence nor the timeline of events that day.. Hope this comes out soon.

 

[Integrityrespec]

Why is it so hard to accept that Oswald was the lone shooter? Why do we have to continually have to make JFK's assassination into some murder-mystery conspiracy carnival? I guess there's an easy answer to that... there's money to made by pushing conspiracy theories - not so much in the truth.

The true tragedy is that JFK's real legacy is lost under all of this trash. Hardly anybody born in the years since knows much about his Presidency. It's all about his death and gossip about his sex life.

Using that analogy, there is money to be made by those who publish on the other side of the conspiracy theorist. Also the power players of the time had lots of influence in how the investigation including the autopsy was conducted. Those people like to protect the status quo. Many unanswered questions on the Kennedy "evidence" and things not considered or ruled out for no reason.

 

[Helix]

JFK is an enjoyable, very well-directed movie. However, it's still pure fantasy.

Jim Garrison, the New Orleans DA portrayed by Kevin Costner, was kicked out of the Army in the 1950s for being a paranoid schizophrenic. Gee...maybe that partially explains his insane crusade to pin the murder on Clay Shaw, a totally innocent man who had his life completely ruined by Garrison.

I read Ray Manzarek's book, and he was pissed off about the dramatization in The Doors movie. That one also had a lot of bullshit in it. It was a good movie and Val Kilmer was fantastic in it. However, if you want to know more about The Doors, I wouldn't get the info from Stone.

 

[Cordelier]

JFK is an enjoyable, very well-directed movie. However, it's still pure fantasy.

Jim Garrison, the New Orleans DA portrayed by Kevin Costner, was kicked out of the Army in the 1950s for being a paranoid schizophrenic. Gee...maybe that partially explains his insane crusade to pin the murder on Clay Shaw, a totally innocent man who had his life completely ruined by Garrison.

Well said... I remember walking out of the theater and thinking to myself... "A bunch of homosexual Nazis killed Kennedy??"

Even the story he laid out didn't make any sense.... it was like he took a pile of threads, threw them on the table, and said "Look at all the loose ends!"

 

[Craig234]

I was 10 years old when JFK was assassinated. I still remember that day the teachers called us out in the hallways to tell us that he was dead.

In the next 30 to 40 years I heard the NSA, CIA, the KGB, the f b i, LBJ, and the Italian mafia assassinated him. In other words there was like 50,000 people involved in this assassination. But none of those 50,000 people talked... Lol...

Oswald acted alone.
. End of story...

That's not a very good argument. If some people were to say that Russia, Korea, Mexico, Canada, Japan, and France attacked Pearl Harbor, would that change that Japan did? Yes, by definition all but one of the theories are wrong, but that doesn't answer which is correct.

 

[Integrityrespec]

JFK is among my favorite presidents because of his fight for civil rights, his push-back against Hoover's FBI, and his understanding that the CIA was and is a dangerous entity to the world.

Oliver Stone has gotten closer to the truth of his assassination than any official report, which were crafted to divert attention and muddy the waters. The Oswald-Alone story is bunk propaganda. The inclusion of Allen Dulles on the Warren Commission is the worst crime committed second only to the murder of JFK itself.

I agree with the many questionable actions surrounding the assassination. As for Kennedy as President, he was decent but his legacy is tarnished by his own misbehavior. He has many, many episodes of reprehensible behavior. The Kennedy family is plagued with it from pappa Joe through all the sons. I think his work on civil rights was a high point for him, Johnson got it finished, but I find his stand during the Cuban Missile crisis to be maybe his bravest act as it could have ended in another world war, and maybe nuclear.

 

[Cordelier]

Using that analogy, there is money to be made by those who publish on the other side of the conspiracy theorist. Also the power players of the time had lots of influence in how the investigation including the autopsy was conducted. Those people like to protect the status quo. Many unanswered questions on the Kennedy "evidence" and things not considered or ruled out for no reason.

Do you have any idea just how many people would have had to have been in on the "conspiracy" even to just alter the autopsy results?? I remember reading Vince Bugliosi's book where he did an exhaustive accounting of just that aspect of the assassination, and I recall he came up with a list of over 200 people who would have had to play a part.

 

[RIP U.S. Democracy]

I read Ray Manzarek's book, and he was pissed off about the dramatization in The Doors movie. That one also had a lot of bullshit in it. It was a good movie and Val Kilmer was fantastic in it. However, if you want to know more about The Doors, I wouldn't get the info from Stone.

I read John Densmore's book a long time ago, the Doors drummer. It was a good book, all of those guys in the Doors were brighter than your typical rock musicians.

The Doors was a decent movie, although I think it could have been better. There was just too much glamorizing of Morrison's self-destructive drug use. It would have been more interesting if the movie had actually focused on the relationships within the band and why they broke up.

 

[RIP U.S. Democracy]

Well said... I remember walking out of the theater and thinking to myself... "A bunch of homosexual Nazis killed Kennedy??"

Even the story he laid out didn't make any sense.... it was like he took a pile of threads, threw them on the table, and said "Look at all the loose ends!"

It was just a bunch of incoherent garbage. You couldn't make heads or tails of the murder "plot" in that movie.

 

[Cordelier]

It was just a bunch of incoherent garbage. You couldn't make heads or tails of the murder "plot" in that movie.

History according to Oliver Stone. It got to the point where I was beginning to doubt that Kennedy was assassinated at all! *L* Like @Luce 's thread over in Conspiracy Theories - maybe his head just did that?

 

[RealityNow]

JFK Assassination Records - 2021 Additional Documents Release​

 

[SenorXm/Sirius]

That's not a very good argument. If some people were to say that Russia, Korea, Mexico, Canada, Japan, and France attacked Pearl Harbor, would that change that Japan did? Yes, by definition all but one of the theories are wrong, but that doesn't answer which is correct.

But we know the Japanese attacked PH... There's proof..

60 years later where is the proof the CIA, FBI, KGB, Etc.. Assassinated JFK? Not a peep from those supposedly involved...

This country don't keep secrets that well..

The magic bullet has been proven it could have been just 1 bullet... No evidence at all that there was another shooter in the grassy knoll.. I heard for decades Oswald couldn't have fired 3 shots from that type of rifle in that short of time... That's been proven 100% wrong
. People have used that type of rifle to accurately shoot 3 shots in less time...

Give me something... Some kind of proof he wasn't alone...

 

[Cordelier]

JFK Assassination Records - 2021 Additional Documents Release​

What's the big bombshell, Reality? Did they finally release Agent Hosty's toilet paper requisition form for December '63?

 

[RIP U.S. Democracy]

But we know the Japanese attacked PH... There's proof..

60 years later where is the proof the CIA, FBI, KGB, Etc.. Assassinated JFK? Not a peep from those supposedly involved...

This country don't keep secrets that well..

The magic bullet has been proven it could have been just 1 bullet... No evidence at all that there was another shooter in the grassy knoll.. I heard for decades Oswald couldn't have fired 3 shots from that type of rifle in that short of time... That's been proven 100% wrong
. People have used that type of rifle to accurately shoot 3 shots in less time...

Give me something... Some kind of proof he wasn't alone...

There was one thing that the Warren Commission got wrong....they said Oswald fired all 3 shots in 6 seconds. Actually, it was really about 9 seconds. And 9 seconds was plenty of time to fire all 3 shots.

The book Case Closed discusses this in detail. It's very interesting to read.

 

[Craig234]

But we know the Japanese attacked PH... There's proof..

60 years later where is the proof the CIA, FBI, KGB, Etc.. Assassinated JFK? Not a peep from those supposedly involved...

You missed my point. Out of the theories, you picked one because there are multiple theories. That's not proof the one you picked is correct.

This country don't keep secrets that well..

That's a fairly silly argument also. You can't generalize like that. Plenty of secrets are kept - as we've seen from many kept for a long time. What really happened with Marilyn Monroe? Dorothy Kilgallen? Robert Kennedy? We see many cases of people convicted of murder overturned decades later with DNA evidence where 'no one talked'.

The magic bullet has been proven it could have been just 1 bullet... No evidence at all that there was another shooter in the grassy knoll.. I heard for decades Oswald couldn't have fired 3 shots from that type of rifle in that short of time... That's been proven 100% wrong. People have used that type of rifle to accurately shoot 3 shots in less time...

It's a bit more complicated than that, but I agree - my point was criticizing your argument, not that you can't get to your conclusion with better arguments, which you've started to make.

Give me something... Some kind of proof he wasn't alone...

You do understand that the more important question isn't asking for evidence of something, but rather identifying what possibilities fit the evidence we do have. One question is, 'do we have proof of a shooter behind the fence', but an important question if that one is no, is is it possible there was a shooter behind the fence based on the evidence we have?

 

[Integrityrespec]

It's a bit more complicated than that. The FBI, the CIA, the NSA were all created with more limits intended than they came to have; the CIA was to be for gathering information except for a small clause that it might do tasks as directed by the NSC from time to time - which became the 90% of the CIA's activities that were covert action - a change which Truman, who created the CIA, came to say was bad and should be reversed.



It's interesting, the Dulles brothers came from a family with a line of Secretaries of State, who were used to being powerful; they ran the most powerful law firm in Washington, doing covert things for the most powerful corporations globally. Eisenhower remarked that he couldn't control them (it's rather clear he didn't want to). If you DID want to find a CIA Director who would think he had the right to kill a president, you'd probably be close to Allen Dulles.

Dulles just points to one of the fallacies of our government. We don't allow a President (since FDR) to sit in the office for more than 2 elected terms. Yet, we have many people in our government and it's bureaucracy who live their for decades. Many of them their entire adult careers. Think about it, if you first served as VP you could be there 16 years, Congress members consist of many who serve 30 and 40+ years in total. Those like Dulles who is the longest serving director of CIA. Plus Dulles was well connected in business in banking and politics. So the connections and power obtained in those jobs often surpasses what a President can build and a President can be stymied by these people or have his policies changed after 8 years. Guys like Dulles are often very influential after they leave.

 

[Integrityrespec]

Bullshit. Read Gerald Posner's book Case Closed.

Oswald was the lone shooter. There was no "magic bullet", either. The ballistics evidence is easily explained.

The fact is that Oswald was a mentally disturbed loner who had no friends. Posner was the first author to actually interview Oswald's wife for his book, and she confirmed that Oswald did not have a big social circle. Oswald also tried to assassinate a right-wing politician in Dallas in March 1963 and admitted it to his wife.

And Jack Ruby was also a whack job. He loved Kennedy and that's why he killed Oswald.

How so? When there is more bullet fragments left in John Connally's body than missing from the so called "Magic Bullet" you have to wonder how that works. Also the original information all points to the "magic bullet" being recovered from a gurney in the hospital ER that Kennedy nor Connally ever were on.

 

[Cordelier]

I was 10 years old when JFK was assassinated. I still remember that day the teachers called us out in the hallways to tell us that he was dead.

Here's a weird family parallel... when Kennedy was assassinated, my old man was taking a High School junior French exam. When the Challenger blew up, where was I? Taking a High School junior French exam. Sacré bleu!

 

[SenorXm/Sirius]

You missed my point. Out of the theories, you picked one because there are multiple theories. That's not proof the one you picked is correct.



That's a fairly silly argument also. You can't generalize like that. Plenty of secrets are kept - as we've seen from many kept for a long time. What really happened with Marilyn Monroe? Dorothy Kilgallen? Robert Kennedy? We see many cases of people convicted of murder overturned decades later with DNA evidence where 'no one talked'.



It's a bit more complicated than that, but I agree - my point was criticizing your argument, not that you can't get to your conclusion with better arguments, which you've started to make.



You do understand that the more important question isn't asking for evidence of something, but rather identifying what possibilities fit the evidence we do have. One question is, 'do we have proof of a shooter behind the fence', but an important question if that one is no, is is it possible there was a shooter behind the fence based on the evidence we have?

Your comparison was bad.. We know the Japanese attacked PH... Everything about the JFK assassination is conspiracy theories...

There is absolutely no proof there was a shooter on the grassy knoll.. None...

Now you are moving onto a conspiracy with Rfk and Monroe?

Is everything a conspiracy?

Again the conspiracy were wrong about Oswalds rifle.. And the magic bullet... 2 biggies in the Oswald wasn't the lone shooter theory..

 

[RIP U.S. Democracy]

How so? When there is more bullet fragments left in John Connally's body than missing from the so called "Magic Bullet" you have to wonder how that works. Also the original information all points to the "magic bullet" being recovered from a gurney in the hospital ER that Kennedy nor Connally ever were on.

Easily...the bullet passed through Kennedy and lodged itself in Connally. It's not difficult to explain at all.

The bullet fell out of Connally at the hospital because it had barely penetrated his leg, after exiting his chest.

 

[911Sparky]

Do you have any idea just how many people would have had to have been in on the "conspiracy" even to just alter the autopsy results?? I remember reading Vince Bugliosi's book where he did an exhaustive accounting of just that aspect of the assassination, and I recall he came up with a list of over 200 people who would have had to play a part.

In David Lifton's book, he actually goes so far as to say that Kennedy's body was switched for a lookalike body between Dallas and Bethesda, as a means to
address the difference in bullet wound locations reported by the doctors in Dallas and Bethesda.