Jesus Was A Communist Or A Capitalist?

[Makhno]

Err. . . Might be getting ahead of myself a bit here but, being relatively aquainted with the Bible and the teaching of Jesus . . . I must ask: was he an Capitalist or Communist? The Bible is a bit like poor Vs rich, I read somewhere that he disliked the rich and said that only a few of them would make it into heaven . . . and he also hated the tax collectors of course.

. . . you have the so called "religious left", but also there are plenty of capitalist Christians obviously. But to me Jesus sounds more like a Communist than a Capitalist, Does that make any kind of sense at all?:shock:

 

[faithful_servant]

Look at what the Bible says about those who prosper by their labors and smarts. It's not too difficult to figure out that capitalism is the means by which the wealth that we are supposed to use to help others is created. Jesus was a carpenter by trade and my guess is that he was pretty successful at it (his clothes were of good enough quality that they were worth gambling for, which indicates some measure of wealth by the standards of that time). Don't get confused by the basic and consistent instruction in the Bible to help those in need with communism. The Bible is VERY clear that those who can work, should work and that is how they should be supported. Not supported by the labor of others, but by their own labors. In Acts, when Luke writes of the Believers all sharing what they had, is a picture of how people should be acting. They earn enough to help those who NEED help and to finance those who can provide help. Read I Timothy and see Pauls instructions regarding how widows are to be taken care of. Read Proverbs 31 and see what virtues a wife should have. As far as how difficultit is fo rthose who are rich to get into heaven, Jesus was not speaking about their wealth, but rather their attitude. He stated that it was easier for a camel to pass through the eye of the needle than for a rich man to get into Heaven. Do you understand what "the eye of the needle" was. It wasn't a sewing needle, but a "man door" next to the gates of a city. In a time of war, the gates would be closed and the only way in or out of the city was through this man-sized door. You could take a camel through it, but only after completely unloading all of it's goods (not giving them away, but just putting them aside) and then forcing the camel to pass through the gate on it's knees. It's not an easy task. This paints a picture of someone who has decided that entering the Kingdom was more important than thier goods and were willing to humble themselves in order to do so. It's a picture of the attitude problem that many rich people have and not the wealth that they have.

 

[MSgt]

What a question. I would say he was more like a (uncorrupted) Communist.

He was also the world's greatest (uncorrupted) Liberal. It's amazing his picture isn't on every university dorm room wall. Perhaps sporting a snazzy beret.

 

[ARealConservative]

The writings attributed to Jesus would indicate we have free will and man is a flawed being loved by god regardless of his shortcomings.

Communism is a theory that doesn't account for free will and the short comings of man in anyway whatsoever. In fact it is very much like faith. It can't be proved and seems illogical that all disputes are based on class boundaries, you just have to accept that it is the truth.

I suppose the Jesus we know in these writings is precisely the type of person needed to make such a society function, but his wisdom would prevent him from encouraging us to do something he knows we could not do.

 

[Australianlibertarian]

Err. . . Might be getting ahead of myself a bit here but, being relatively aquainted with the Bible and the teaching of Jesus . . . I must ask: was he an Capitalist or Communist? The Bible is a bit like poor Vs rich, I read somewhere that he disliked the rich and said that only a few of them would make it into heaven . . . and he also hated the tax collectors of course.

. . . you have the so called "religious left", but also there are plenty of capitalist Christians obviously. But to me Jesus sounds more like a Communist than a Capitalist, Does that make any kind of sense at all?:shock:

Well initally the son of the great spaghetti monster demonstrated his great support of the poor. Put then the great spaghetti monster son's suggested that it is better to teach the masses how to make a good carbinara, rather than just give them a good carbinara. And lastly the son of the great spaghettis monster suggested that the true believers start up a chain of cheap Italian resturaunts, but that 10% of the earning is given to the poor. Only if those poor believe in the great spaghetti monster?

Does this answer the relevance of religion and economics?

 

[laska]

Communism uses force to equalize. Capitalism elevates competition and greed into a virtue mechanism to create wealth. The economic system of the early Christians was to freely consecrate and share their talents and wealth to create equality. This system does not undermine free agency and unlike capitalism, the motives of creating wealth in this system uplifts spiritually.

 

[rqoi]

"Render unto Caesar the things which are Caesar’s, and unto God the things that are God’s"

Sounds like the redistribution of wealth to me.

 

[Rhapsody1447]

"Render unto Caesar the things which are Caesar’s, and unto God the things that are God’s"

Sounds like the redistribution of wealth to me.

How so? It sounds more like he is telling his followers to obey the law of the land as well as the law of God. Capitalists pay taxes too; what does this have to do with redistribution?

 

[Billo_Really]

Jesus was a Buddist, like his Dad!

 

[rqoi]

How so? It sounds more like he is telling his followers to obey the law of the land as well as the law of God. Capitalists pay taxes too; what does this have to do with redistribution?

If you were a true free market capitalist, you wouldn't pay taxes that go to public works like roads and other such "communist" programs. Capitalism would say if you want a road, pay for it yourself.

 

[Rhapsody1447]

If you were a true free market capitalist, you wouldn't pay taxes that go to public works like roads and other such "communist" programs. Capitalism would say if you want a road, pay for it yourself.

I am not a true free market capitalist because I obey the laws of the land? Because I submit to authority? :rofl Taxes are inevitable, no matter what system of government you implement, you will always pay some form of taxes. Now what a true capitalist can do is elect leaders that will cut spending towards public works programs and social welfare programs; but just because someone pays taxes doesn't mean they aren't a true free market capitalist.

 

[RightOfCenter]

Jesus was a Buddist, like his Dad!

Think they take their own names in vain?

 

[Red_Dave]

Err. . . Might be getting ahead of myself a bit here but, being relatively aquainted with the Bible and the teaching of Jesus . . . I must ask: was he an Capitalist or Communist? The Bible is a bit like poor Vs rich, I read somewhere that he disliked the rich and said that only a few of them would make it into heaven . . . and he also hated the tax collectors of course.

. . . you have the so called "religious left", but also there are plenty of capitalist Christians obviously. But to me Jesus sounds more like a Communist than a Capitalist, Does that make any kind of sense at all?:shock:

What many forget is the socialism was origionally a very christian influenced concept. People assume socialism started with Marx but the ideas that make up what we would call socialism today where a promient influence over the english Peasants' Revolt of 1381. John Ball, a lollard [a catholic sect] preist and one of the leaders of the peasants revolt is on record as having once said "things will not not go well in england, untill all property shall be held in common". The first person to put these ideas into print was Claude Henri de Rouvroy, comte de Saint-Simon who was strongly influenced by the teachings of christ.

 

[Karmashock]

Err. . . Might be getting ahead of myself a bit here but, being relatively aquainted with the Bible and the teaching of Jesus . . . I must ask: was he an Capitalist or Communist? The Bible is a bit like poor Vs rich, I read somewhere that he disliked the rich and said that only a few of them would make it into heaven . . . and he also hated the tax collectors of course.

. . . you have the so called "religious left", but also there are plenty of capitalist Christians obviously. But to me Jesus sounds more like a Communist than a Capitalist, Does that make any kind of sense at all?:shock:

economics were very different around the time of jesus... you have to understand that there were a lot of slaves, rich land owners, and feudal war lords.


The rich in those days often got their wealth through violence or exploitation. Now some might argue that today the rich get money by exploiting the working class or something. But it's ENTIRELY different. Our world bares very little resemblance to that world economically. So I don't know if jesus or the bible can really comment on modern economics with any authority. you'd have to do so much "interpreting" along the way that the end product would be more a product of your own personal biases then it would be the bible or jesus.


Here's something that might be relevant.

God said to man, "be fruitful and multiply and fill the earth and subdue it."


Consider the vast wealth of capitalism... consider the great prosperity and happiness there in. Yes it does exploit some people but no one is exploited who would not be in more dire straights without capitalism.


Go to the sweat shops and ask the people there what htey would do if they didn't have those jobs? Because they wouldn't have them without capitalism. Go to the third world and ask the factory workers what they would do without those factory jobs... they'll tell you that those factory jobs pay much more then they could make otherwise... and most of them would be doing subsistance farming without those jobs. I have to believe that Jesus loves humanity and wants us to be successful. Well... god didn't give us a perfect world... perhaps its' perfect for his purposes but it's certainly not an easy one to live in much of the time. We're doing our best... capitalism is today means fat babies... look in areas where it doesn't exist... and you'll see ribs... starvation... death...


that's my bias... Capitalism feeds people.