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It's time - the rich must pay their way!

TurtleDude

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mrjurrs

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But some pay far more than others. The "rich" buy more and higher priced wine. Million dollar cars rather than the Ford Focus. Not to mention pay far more in property taxes.

That argument widens the gap rather than decreases it.
How many cars can a rich person buy? Compare that to 1,000 middle class people. Rich people don't move money around as much as people with fewer means. Movement of money drives economic activity. The rich contribute, but not as much as they should.
 

Lafayette

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Listen I know you are trying to lecture that I don't know what I am talking about but statewide offices cant be gerrymandered, representative districts drawn by the legislature are. You seemed to be stating statewide officers could be gerrymandered and that isn't the case.

From here: What is gerrymandering?

Gerrymandering is the act of drawing congressional, state legislative or other political boundaries to favor a political party or one particular candidate for elected office. Gerrymandering is the act of drawing congressional, state legislative or other political boundaries to favor a political party or one particular candidate for elected office.
 

bomberfox

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Why should our ability to live depend on lowering the top bracket’s tax? Think about that. What about the people that make all the widgets for those big shots huh?
 

bomberfox

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Republicans trot out Adam smith all the time but they forgot that even he was for the rich to shoulder most of the tax burden.
 

jimbo

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How many cars can a rich person buy? Compare that to 1,000 middle class people. Rich people don't move money around as much as people with fewer means. Movement of money drives economic activity. The rich contribute, but not as much as they should.
As many as they want. And that number is substantial. Gates reportedly has 16, and they're not Ford Focus's either. Gates is not known for being a car guy. Seriously, you have to compare 1000 middle class to one rich person to support your position?

The rich don't move money around? Assume hypothetically a 100' boat. Cost a million plus. Cost of ownership: Crew, 3+at $70K. Maintenance? Easily $100K. Fuel? Saw one the other day that held 43,000 liters/fill up. Residences mostly the same. Property tax 100K home? 1,000. Million dollar home? 20K +.

I'm afraid you need backup for that statement.
 

bave

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Republicans trot out Adam smith all the time but they forgot that even he was for the rich to shoulder most of the tax burden.

Again, the US has the *most progressive* tax code in the world. The rich pay more in relative taxes here than anywhere else in the developed world, let that sink in.

As to why you can't just keep taxing them more, take some economics classes. The problem is as you increase taxation and regulation businesses and capital tend to flow out, which in turn causes more negative pressure and creates a feedback loop.
 

aociswundumho

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calamity

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Eriech

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Yeah
Half of America doesn't make enough money to pay taxes. Do you see anything wrong with that?

And that top 10% (which I am one) earns half of all income generated.

Leaving 50% for 90% of Americans.

"All income generated " is not a fixed number. Every single American could have earned more.
 

OpportunityCost

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I'm a Yank but I don't give a damn about what "most Americans think". If I am in this forum today, I think America is genuinely an Unfair Nation in terms of Income Distribution.

I live abroad in a country that is of a nature Social Democrat. And I think precisely that is the formula that Uncle Sam should adopt. Rather than genuflecting at the statue of the Almighty Buck (at whatever the social cost).

I'm no "socialist". But I bend further to the left than most Democrats. And I see the Right for what it is. Wholly consumed by an idea that the accumulation of capital is the Prime Mover of any country.

Nothing could be further from the truth. It is the fair-and-equitable distribution of income that should be a country's objective. Given the fact that economically the country remains capitalist in nature, which it should.

But what does that mean, "the fair and equitable distribution of Income". What it does NOT mean is what is happening today. Whereby today there is a small group accumulating a huge portion of the Wealth on the Right. And on the far Left of the income grid, there is a substantial portion of the nation bereft of a decent standard-of-living.

The evolution of Income Distribution in America 1989 to 2016:
iu


As indicated above, the bottom 50% of the population (in 2016) garnered barely 13% of total Income! And of the total Household Income Pie-chart 50% goes to the top 10% of income earners.

So, you might like to think-and-complain that "all that money is being wasted on supporting the poor", but the factual evidence is different. Read that evidence above.

In the aggregate the poor are getting unfairly far, far less NET-of-taxation per-capita income than the top Wage Earners! Which is due to the fact that even before Donald Dork reduced it further, upper-income taxation was already too low!

(And I'll bet that if that pie-chart was redone for 2019 (pre-covid) the numbers would look even worse!)


Now, weep at the truth of today's Income Distribution in America. If you will, which I seriously doubt ... !
Your entire premise is built on America being something it isn't. You are tilting hard at those windmills.
 

mrjurrs

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As many as they want. And that number is substantial. Gates reportedly has 16, and they're not Ford Focus's either. Gates is not known for being a car guy. Seriously, you have to compare 1000 middle class to one rich person to support your position?

The rich don't move money around? Assume hypothetically a 100' boat. Cost a million plus. Cost of ownership: Crew, 3+at $70K. Maintenance? Easily $100K. Fuel? Saw one the other day that held 43,000 liters/fill up. Residences mostly the same. Property tax 100K home? 1,000. Million dollar home? 20K +.

I'm afraid you need backup for that statement.
The amount of money is so small compared to aggregate demand it doesn't require proof. It is common understanding.
 

bave

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So, your graph proves that our wealthiest people need to pay more tax. Thanks.

Again, the US has the most progressive tax system in the world. The wealthier in the US pay a higher relative tax rate than in UK, Denmark, Sweden, France, Belgium, Germany, Spain etc.
 

bomberfox

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Again, the US has the *most progressive* tax code in the world. The rich pay more in relative taxes here than anywhere else in the developed world, let that sink in.

As to why you can't just keep taxing them more, take some economics classes. The problem is as you increase taxation and regulation businesses and capital tend to flow out, which in turn causes more negative pressure and creates a feedback loop.
:ROFLMAO: Given my ****in degree is in economics this is laughable. I tire of being at the mercy of the sociopathic jeff bezos of the world while he openly steals the tips of his workers and works them so much they have to urinate in bottles. That was actually proven in internal memos. He has ambulances parked outside his warehouses for cryin out loud.
The only tax rate that could be considered the highest is the corporate marginal rate and thats before deductions.

 
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highroller

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Again, the US has the most progressive tax system in the world. The wealthier in the US pay a higher relative tax rate than in UK, Denmark, Sweden, France, Belgium, Germany, Spain etc.
🤣🤣🤣🤣

no….
 

bave

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:ROFLMAO: Given my ****in degree is in economics this is laughable. I tire of being at the mercy of the sociopathic jeff bezos of the world while he openly steals the tips of his workers and works them so much they have to urinate in bottles. That was actually proven in internal memos. He has ambulances parked outside his warehouses for cryin out loud.
The only tax rate that could be considered the highest is the corporate marginal rate and thats before deductions.


Not sure where you got your economics degree, but....


Btw, a million sources on this, it's not even a debated fact. Hell, The Atlantic and WashPo both had articles on it.

You should seek a refund on your education.


See above. Thanks for the insightful rebuttle.
 

jimbo

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The amount of money is so small compared to aggregate demand it doesn't require proof. It is common understanding.
You got Nuthin'
 

MTAtech

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The top 10% pay 71% of the income tax, how much more should they pay, what is the correct %?
That top 10% figure hides the fact that the top 0.1% pay a lower p% than workers.
 

TurtleDude

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That top 10% figure hides the fact that the top 0.1% pay a lower p% than workers.
that ignores the top .1% pay billions more of actual dollars than "workers" and I doubt your claims.
 

MTAtech

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Not sure where you got your economics degree, but....


Btw, a million sources on this, it's not even a debated fact. Hell, The Atlantic and WashPo both had articles on it.

You should seek a refund on your education.



See above. Thanks for the insightful rebuttle.
That link uses the top 10% as comparison, not the rich.
 

MTAtech

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that ignores the top .1% pay billions more of actual dollars than "workers" and I doubt your claims.
They should at least pay the same rate. They can afford to.

I must ask, with all the moral issues to fight, why do you choose to defend the ultra-Rich’s right to keep more of their money?
 
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