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Israeli troops kill Palestinian teenager by shooting him in stomach

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Your crocodile tears won't win you any points.

The facts are that Hamas targets civilians. The IDF targets Hamas.

Tell me. When was the last time the Dahiya Doctrine was implemented....


There are no "crocodile tears", just the ability to see the crimes committed by both sides and to also see how those crimes, and the conflict generally, have had a corrosive/degrading impact on the moral standards of people on both sides.

Your posts don't take into account the full facts. All's they show is a doggered determination to defend the crimes of one side only , as they are doing here ,again. They are vile and confer a bias that engenders a callous disregard for lives on one side only.

I will let someone else reply to your ugly and extremist posts for a night.
 
There are no "crocodile tears", just the ability to see the crimes committed by both sides and to also see how those crimes, and the conflict generally, have had a corrosive/degrading impact on the moral standards of people on both sides.

Your posts don't take into account the full facts. All's they show is a doggered determination to defend the crimes of one side only , as they are doing here ,again. They are vile and confer a bias that engenders a callous disregard for lives on one side only.

I will let someone else reply to your ugly and extremist posts for a night.

So, the last time the Dahiya Doctrine was implemented?
 
There are no "crocodile tears", just the ability to see the crimes committed by both sides and to also see how those crimes, and the conflict generally, have had a corrosive/degrading impact on the moral standards of people on both sides.

Your posts don't take into account the full facts. All's they show is a doggered determination to defend the crimes of one side only , as they are doing here ,again. They are vile and confer a bias that engenders a callous disregard for lives on one side only.

I will let someone else reply to your ugly and extremist posts for a night.
I'm afraid you have fallen into the trap of an equivalency between the targeting of Palestinian children and civilians at a phenomenal and daily humiliation, collective punishments, and murder by the Israel Defense Forces with practically no Israeli deaths over a period of decades by your condemnation of "both sides". There is no comparison between the policies of the well-equipped Israel Army, Navy, and Air Force and the Palestinians in the occupied West Bank, including East Jerusalem, and blockaded Gaza. You have lost perspective.
 
I'm afraid you have fallen into the trap of an equivalency between the targeting of Palestinian children and civilians at a phenomenal and daily humiliation, collective punishments, and murder by the Israel Defense Forces with practically no Israeli deaths over a period of decades by your condemnation of "both sides". There is no comparison between the policies of the well-equipped Israel Army, Navy, and Air Force and the Palestinians in the occupied West Bank, including East Jerusalem, and blockaded Gaza. You have lost perspective.


Terror from Gaza
March 2018 – August 2019

  • Eight killed
  • 282 wounded
  • 1,932 rockets/mortar bombs
  • 841 petrol bombs
  • 25 shootings
  • 128 IEDs
  • 2,155 fires ignited by arson kites/balloons (updated 2 July 2019)
  • 8,747 acres of land – farmland, forests, nature reserves – burned
Estimated cost of the damage done by the rockets, mortar bombs and arson: NIS 35million; direct damage caused by the fires: NIS 14 million.
An additional cost that cannot be estimated only in money is the cost of the trauma suffered by the civilian population in southern Israel, especially the children.
 
I'm afraid you have fallen into the trap of an equivalency between the targeting of Palestinian children and civilians at a phenomenal and daily humiliation, collective punishments, and murder by the Israel Defense Forces with practically no Israeli deaths over a period of decades by your condemnation of "both sides". There is no comparison between the policies of the well-equipped Israel Army, Navy, and Air Force and the Palestinians in the occupied West Bank, including East Jerusalem, and blockaded Gaza. You have lost perspective.


Well, you are entitled to your opinion Jean-s, but if we are to be honest ,the fact is that both sides have committed crimes and for us to not want to acknowledge/accept this is where a person has lost any sense of objectivity,imo. I have been responding to posts here that are about as clear an example of this as there is to witness and I have no intention of allowing myself to sink to such depths. Fabricating events and denying reality are the corner stones for every hate group that has ever existed and posts that deliberately set out to do this don't belong here, they belong on the likes of Stormfront, imo.

I fully understand why you have taken acception to my comment and understand also the point you make about the huge disparity of suffering found within this conflict, I am as aware of it as anyone else here. That said, I believe you can acknowledge that there are crimes committed by both sides AND discuss, not only the disparity of suffering, which is immense, but also the circumstances under which these crimes happen and highlight the equally vast disparity in military capabilities and thus justifications/mitigating circumstances surrounding them. These two things are not mutually exclusive and I believe it is essential to acknowledge the truth at all times or else we are edging towards those we should all reject.

If you look at the work from every human rights group that has investigated/covered the events in the I/P conflict they too will acknowledge the crimes on both sides. That's not " losing perspective" ,it's actually an honest assessment of those events and it doesn't disqualify them, like it doesn't disqualify me, from understanding or sympathizing with the huge disparity of suffering and abuses of the Palestinian people themselves.
 
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Well, you are entitled to your opinion Jean-s, but if we are to be honest ,the fact is that both sides have committed crimes and for us to not want to acknowledge/accept this is where a person has lost any sense of objectivity,imo. I have been responding to posts here that are about as clear an example of this as there is to witness and I have no intention of allowing myself to sink to such depths. Fabricating events and denying reality are the corner stones for every hate group that has ever existed and posts that deliberately set out to do this don't belong here, they belong on the likes of Stormfront, imo.

I fully understand why you have taken acception to my comment and understand also the point you make about the huge disparity of suffering found within this conflict, I am as aware of it as anyone else here. That said, I believe you can acknowledge that there are crimes committed by both sides AND discuss, not only the disparity of suffering, which is immense, but also the circumstances under which these crimes happen and highlight the equally vast disparity in military capabilities and thus justifications/mitigating circumstances surrounding them. These two things are not mutually exclusive and I believe it is essential to acknowledge the truth at all times or else we are edging towards those we should all reject.

If you look at the work from every human rights group that has investigated/covered the events in the I/P conflict they too will acknowledge the crimes on both sides. That's not " losing perspective" ,it's actually an honest assessment of those events and it doesn't disqualify them, like it doesn't disqualify me, from understanding or sympathizing with the huge disparity of suffering and abuses of the Palestinian people themselves.
I began this topic about a 13-year-old unarmed Palestinian boy who was murdered by the lying IDF who initially denied using live ammunition. This comes a week after another teenager was beaten to death by the IDF. You have used this topic to condemn "both sides". What you have done is shameful to the memory of so many Palestinian children and civilians. These boys were totally innocent.
 
I began this topic about a 13-year-old unarmed Palestinian boy who was murdered by the lying IDF who initially denied using live ammunition. This comes a week after another teenager was beaten to death by the IDF. You have used this topic to condemn "both sides". What you have done is shameful to the memory of so many Palestinian children and civilians. These boys were totally innocent.

Correct, and I have commented on the subject to the point of citing, and quoting, from two human rights organizations that have stats available so people can see what a farce any notions of justice and/or Israeli action against any criminality their forces get up to in the OPTs. Not only that I also linked a video to show just how bankrupt of any semblance of justice the system of Israeli military courts offers that interviews the judges themselves.

In the previous thread you referred to I actually supplied a link, albeit in another thread, to the autopsy report that showed the child had died of asphyxiation most likely caused by the choke hold he was under while he was being beaten. That showed that the IDF were responsible for his death. Where were you ?

My crime, apparently , is that I engaged someone else over their blanket denials/defences of the crimes committed by the IDF against the Palestinians and during that course stated, correctly, that both sides commit crimes. I don't think that that is worthy of the ridiculous claims in your post above.

You spend your time here ignoring the obvious propagandists from the Israeli side of the discussion and leaving the junk they pass off as informed opinion to others like me to debunk but have no problem rounding on people who have been fighting the corner of the Palestinians here and elsewhere since well before you were even a member for the petulent reason that they don't think exactly the same as you do about certain aspects of the conflict or the tactics people should use.

I disagreed with Craig234 with the tactics of the BDS movement and we had our exchange , respected each others opinions even though they differed and ended the debate on good terms. That happens because we knew, well at least I knew, that his intentions and heart where in the right place and that we are on the same side. You ? Nope, say on thing wrong out of a hundred and you fair game to get accused of the most base behaviour. Wow,

You too crossed the rubicon in this thread, for me. Making out that I don't really care about the suffering of the Palestinians is so far wrong, that you can even make the accusation, tells me you don't read my posts properly or you have a closet authoritarian streak that compels you to attack people for daring to hold a different opinion even if they are on the same side.

You want those who care about the plight of Palestinians , and incidentally Israelis, to form a circular firing squad , be my guest but from now on I'm out of your circle.
 
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Correct, and I have commented on the subject to the point of citing, and quoting, from two human rights organizations that have stats available so people can see what a farce any notions of justice and/or Israeli action against any criminality their forces get up to in the OPTs. Not only that I also linked a video to show just how bankrupt of any semblance of justice the system of Israeli military courts offers that interviews the judges themselves.

In the previous thread you referred to I actually supplied a link, albeit in another thread, to the autopsy report that showed the child had died of asphyxiation most likely caused by the choke hold he was under while he was being beaten. That showed that the IDF were responsible for his death. Where were you ?

My crime, apparently , is that I engaged someone else over their blanket denials/defences of the crimes committed by the IDF against the Palestinians and during that course stated, correctly, that both sides commit crimes. I don't think that that is worthy of the ridiculous claims in your post above.

You spend your time here ignoring the obvious propagandists from the Israeli side of the discussion and leaving the junk they pass off as informed opinion to others like me to debunk but have no problem rounding on people who have been fighting the corner of the Palestinians here and elsewhere since well before you were even a member for the petulent reason that they don't think exactly the same as you do about certain aspects of the conflict or the tactics people should use.

I disagreed with Craig234 with the tactics of the BDS movement and we had our exchange , respected each others opinions even though they differed and ended the debate on good terms. That happens because we knew, well at least I knew, that his intentions and heart where in the right place and that we are on the same side. You ? Nope, say on thing wrong out of a hundred and you fair game to get accused of the most base behaviour. Wow,

You too crossed the rubicon in this thread, for me. Making out that I don't really care about the suffering of the Palestinians is so far wrong, that you can even make the accusation, tells me you don't read my posts properly or you have a closet authoritarian streak that compels you to attack people for daring to hold a different opinion even if they are on the same side.

You want those who care about the plight of Palestinians , and incidentally Israelis, to form a circular firing squad , be my guest but from now on I'm out of your circle.

Lashing out at those who would be your allies...

SOSAD.
 
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Correct, and I have commented on the subject to the point of citing, and quoting, from two human rights organizations that have stats available so people can see what a farce any notions of justice and/or Israeli action against any criminality their forces get up to in the OPTs. Not only that I also linked a video to show just how bankrupt of any semblance of justice the system of Israeli military courts offers that interviews the judges themselves.

In the previous thread you referred to I actually supplied a link, albeit in another thread, to the autopsy report that showed the child had died of asphyxiation most likely caused by the choke hold he was under while he was being beaten. That showed that the IDF were responsible for his death. Where were you ?

My crime, apparently , is that I engaged someone else over their blanket denials/defences of the crimes committed by the IDF against the Palestinians and during that course stated, correctly, that both sides commit crimes. I don't think that that is worthy of the ridiculous claims in your post above.

You spend your time here ignoring the obvious propagandists from the Israeli side of the discussion and leaving the junk they pass off as informed opinion to others like me to debunk but have no problem rounding on people who have been fighting the corner of the Palestinians here and elsewhere since well before you were even a member for the petulent reason that they don't think exactly the same as you do about certain aspects of the conflict or the tactics people should use.

I disagreed with Craig234 with the tactics of the BDS movement and we had our exchange , respected each others opinions even though they differed and ended the debate on good terms. That happens because we knew, well at least I knew, that his intentions and heart where in the right place and that we are on the same side. You ? Nope, say on thing wrong out of a hundred and you fair game to get accused of the most base behaviour. Wow,

You too crossed the rubicon in this thread, for me. Making out that I don't really care about the suffering of the Palestinians is so far wrong, that you can even make the accusation, tells me you don't read my posts properly or you have a closet authoritarian streak that compels you to attack people for daring to hold a different opinion even if they are on the same side.

You want those who care about the plight of Palestinians , and incidentally Israelis, to form a circular firing squad , be my guest but from now on I'm out of your circle.
I have very many times 'Liked' your posts but you were out of order to use my topic about the murder of a Palestinian boy to attack "both sides". You disappointed me but I saw it as a momentary lapse that you were drawn into by someone who is a broken record about Hamas. The topic of this thread is a boy who lived in the occupied West Bank and had nothing to do with Hamas. You made a mistake.
 
The Mandate ended and the decision/control was given to the UN . They called two states, the Israeli one became a state, the Palestinian one was occupied/controlled by Jordan and Egypt. You are referring to the Balfour Declaration , there is no Balfour mandate.

Maybe you think it was right for Europeans to decide how the former Ottoman territories should have been divided/named/governed , no sense of irony there about European supremacism so it's a pretty safe bet.

Both the PA and Hamas , along with all of the Arab nations ,have stated that they will support a two state solution on the 67 lines, as per international law, so your claim seems out of date.

Since the Ottomans started a war of aggression against Europe, damn right the British were right to mandate the division of territory. The did a remarkably fair job - it's just that Muslims don't want fair, Muslims want supremacy.
 
I have very many times 'Liked' your posts but you were out of order to use my topic about the murder of a Palestinian boy to attack "both sides". You disappointed me but I saw it as a momentary lapse that you were drawn into by someone who is a broken record about Hamas. The topic of this thread is a boy who lived in the occupied West Bank and had nothing to do with Hamas. You made a mistake.


I stand by what I said in the last post addressed to you Jean s. To ignore all the effort and work I put into fleshing out the treatment of Palestinians killed/abused in these circumstances to focus on about 1% of what I wrote, which was correct, to claim I " shamed" the death of that boy by doing so, is deeply offensive.

IMO you " made the mistake" Jean and I'm okay with my record of supporting Palestinian rights. You want to disagree ? that's fine too. I will continue to debunk the Israeli propaganda found on this site and others, as I have done for many years, and I am happy to do it without the assistance of anyone else.
 
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I stand by what I said in the last post addressed to you Jean s. To ignore all the effort and work I put into fleshing out the treatment of Palestinians killed/abused in these circumstances to focus on about 1% of what I wrote, which was correct, to claim I " shamed" the death of that boy by doing, so is deeply offensive.

IMO you " made the mistake" Jean and I'm okay with my record of supporting Palestinian rights. You want to disagree ? that's fine too. I will continue to debunk the Israeli propaganda found on this site and others, as I have done for many years, and I am happy to do it without the assistance of anyone else.

Triggered... As usual.
 
Since the Ottomans started a war of aggression against Europe, damn right the British were right to mandate the division of territory. The did a remarkably fair job - it's just that Muslims don't want fair, Muslims want supremacy.

You're off topic, so one reply and then I'm away.


They sided with some Europeans against other Europeans. There was nothing fair about using Arab and Jewish national aspirations to their own advantage as a divide and rule tactic.
 
I think the people of Lebanon like those of Syria, Egypt, Palestine, Jordan and Israel are all victims of a decision made by Europeans for their own self interest. That's the baseline I opt to work from

What you fail to understand in your post,imo, is that the Palestinian diaspora, those scattered into the neighbouring states and beyond, have lived as refugees and have become huge internal problems for the people of the state they have fled to. In Lebanon the Palestinians have been, rightly or wrongly, historically marginalized and what you have as " Muslim supremacism " is the fight to be represented in the country they have been forced to live in.

Hezbollah was formed as a group with the intention of resisting a foreign occupation by Israel and has grown into a fully fledged political entity that has seats in the Lebanese parliament. That it is turning into a state within a state is just the result of the history of the region since the Europeans decided to carve it up for their own interests and then bail out when the consequences of those poor decisions came home to roost.

Thus the members of Hezbollah are just as much the victim of the above as any other group in the region.

This thread isn't about Hezbollah and thus if you want to carry this on start another one.


Before Hezbollah, a branch of Iran, began the conquest of Christian Lebanon to impose the Muslim Supremacist doctrine, there was no "foreign occupation." Hezbollah is foreign occupying force in that they are stooges for Iran.

There is no "Palestinian diaspora" as there has never been a nation or country of "Palestine." These are Arabs, they speak Arabian and are Muslim. This conflict is nothing less than the Muslim demand of Supremacy. Not one grain of sand is to be under the dominion of Infidels or Kafirum.
 
Before Hezbollah, a branch of Iran, began the conquest of Christian Lebanon to impose the Muslim Supremacist doctrine, there was no "foreign occupation." Hezbollah is foreign occupying force in that they are stooges for Iran.

There is no "Palestinian diaspora" as there has never been a nation or country of "Palestine." These are Arabs, they speak Arabian and are Muslim. This conflict is nothing less than the Muslim demand of Supremacy. Not one grain of sand is to be under the dominion of Infidels or Kafirum.

off topic
 
You're off topic, so one reply and then I'm away.


They sided with some Europeans against other Europeans. There was nothing fair about using Arab and Jewish national aspirations to their own advantage as a divide and rule tactic.

YOU diverted the topic, so knock off the "off topic" crap. The Ottomans sought to expand their territory, simple as that.
 
In other words accurate.

I have already shown what was inaccurate but it's still off topic. Why are you continuing posting to this even though you know it's off topic ? Your posts are testimonies to major league hypocrisy.
 
I have already shown what was inaccurate but it's still off topic. Why are you continuing posting to this even though you know it's off topic ? Your posts are testimonies to major league hypocrisy.

Did or did not 1,500 Revolutionary Guard members enter Lebanon by way of Syria though Syrian occupied territory in 1982?
 
Did or did not 1,500 Revolutionary Guard members enter Lebanon by way of Syria though Syrian occupied territory in 1982?
Your posts are testimonies to major league hypocrisy
 
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