Israeli Strike Kills 10 Palesitinians

[Gandhi>Bush]

http://www.taipeitimes.com/News/world/archives/2006/06/14/2003313513

I hope that is a sufficient source. I don't know that Taipei has any thing to gain for bias in either direction.

An Israeli air strike targeting a key figure in Palestinian rocket attacks killed 10 people yesterday, including the militant and an accomplice, two schoolchildren and three medical workers who rushed to the scene of an initial blast.

The deaths of eight civilians in the Gaza City attack was sure to heighten anti-Israel passions already inflamed by a blast on Friday in Gaza that killed eight beachgoers. It was also likely to further complicate efforts by moderate Palestinian President Mahmoud Abbas to persuade the balking Hamas government to endorse a proposal implicitly recognizing Israel.

(Snip)

The Israeli military said its aircraft targeted militants on a mission to launch Katyusha rockets at southern Israel. Palestinian witnesses said the first missile missed the vehicle, which then crashed into a curb and was struck by two other missiles.

The last two missiles killed the civilians and wounded 32 others. Also killed was Hamoud Wadiya, Islamic Jihad's top rocket launcher, and Shawki Sayklia, a militant whose affiliation wasn't immediately known.

What do you think? An ethical action, a justified and well rounded trade off or a grotesquely immoral action completely unjustified by any stretch of the imagination? Perhaps you feel that the scenario is morally neutral, all the same I would like to hear your thoughts.

I find myself leaning toward the sentiment of "unjustified" which surely shocks those of you that know me. 32 wounded, 10 dead including two school children for two murders does not appear to be a wise trade in my book. Not if the motive of Israel is peace or security, that is.

I feel that these school children had a right to live, certainly a right not to be harmed. Israel, I would say has the right to defend itself, but I would also say that they have a duty to consider the consequences of their actions and to actively do all that they can to reduce the chances of killing two children. I would also say that the government of Palestine has a duty to stop these men, and while they are on the verge of civil war, in more stable times these men probably wouldn't have been stopped anyway.

From an egotist point of view I would say that the more missles Israel sends in to the West Bank, the more likely it would be that missles, or rockets rather, would be sent back into their own country, that they are trying to protect. So one could say that to fire missles with hopes of safety is only to aid in unsafety. In this case a rocket firing terrorist was killed so maybe you could say that Israel could kill them all in the end, but with stats like 32 wounded and 10 killed including 2 schoolchildren I don't see how this will ever end.

Have a missle and rocket free nice day.

 

[Deegan]

Well..........I guess since the target was two long range missiles, that could have killed scores of innocent people in Israel, I would call it a good day, a really good day.

 

[Captain America]

I am certainly no Isreali apologist as I wish both Isreal and Palestine would fall off the planet and quit being a pain in my countrys arse.

But Isreal didn't do anything that we don't do on a daily basis. Civilians have a tendancy to die when bombs are dropped on neighborhoods.

However, I wouldn't blame Isreal at all if they turned Palestines into a glass parking lot. Those people are incouragable. (sp?) There will never be peace with them. Never.

I say they both just start blasting and the last man standing wins. Get this over with once and for all.

 

[oldreliable67]

I feel that these school children had a right to live, certainly a right not to be harmed. Israel, I would say has the right to defend itself, but I would also say that they have a duty to consider the consequences of their actions and to actively do all that they can to reduce the chances of killing two children. I would also say that the government of Palestine has a duty to stop these men, and while they are on the verge of civil war, in more stable times these men probably wouldn't have been stopped anyway.

These are sentiments with which few would disagree. So which country has the over-arching duty to act, if such a concept can be ascribed to this set of circumstances? Seems to me that the country from whom these actions are being initiated have the responsibility to stop them, while the country that is being attacked has a duty to protect its citizens.

Though I can't know with any certainty, I'm fairly confident that like the US, Israeli ROE take into consideration the likelihood of civilian casualties when contemplating such an action. I'm also guessing but I would also bet that the outcome of the situation presented to them differed significantly from their assessment of the probability of civilian casualties. In short, this appears to be an outcome in which civilian casualties far exceeded those expected from the rules of engagement.

 

[Captain America]

Let's put this in perspective... sorta.......

A long time ago, through hook or by crook, the US annexed a lot of land from Mexico.

If Mexico demanded it back (Texas, Calif, etc..) today, what would we do?

If they started lobbing bombs into El Paso, what would we do? If they started marching suicide bombers into our public markets killing our friends and family, what would we do?

I think Isreal knows what it has to do.

I used to be somewhat sympathetic to the Palestian cause. Not anymore. Fuggem.

 

[Gandhi>Bush]

Well..........I guess since the target was two long range missiles, that could have killed scores of innocent people in Israel, I would call it a good day, a really good day.

Hekmat Mughrabi, tears streaming down her face and her veil soaked with blood, said her 30-year-old son, Ashraf, and a 13-year-old family member died when a missile hit the curb outside her home.

Perhaps you could explain to Mrs/Ms Mughrabi how that day was a good day?

I will not deny the danger of Katyusha rockets, but to call it a "good day" is what I would call barabaric. I would at least expect you to conceed that maybe waiting until these men were not in front of a home filled with innocent people would have been the better choice. I don't really understand how you can dismiss the deaths of 10 people, two children included, and declare a day, probably the worst day of Mrs/Ms Mughrabi's life as a "good day."

 

[Gandhi>Bush]

...Isreal didn't do anything that we don't do on a daily basis.

Perhaps we should also take a look at ourselves then.

Civilians have a tendancy to die when bombs are dropped on neighborhoods.

Perhaps we should not drop bombs on neighborhoods then.

However, I wouldn't blame Isreal at all if they turned Palestines into a glass parking lot.

Good luck convincing the other six billion people on the Earth of your sentiment.

Those people are incouragable. (sp?) There will never be peace with them. Never.

Really? How many Palestinians do you know?

I say they both just start blasting and the last man standing wins. Get this over with once and for all.

Industrialized nation v. 3rd world country... hmm.

 

[Gandhi>Bush]

These are sentiments with which few would disagree. So which country has the over-arching duty to act, if such a concept can be ascribed to this set of circumstances? Seems to me that the country from whom these actions are being initiated have the responsibility to stop them, while the country that is being attacked has a duty to protect its citizens.

I have no problem with this.

Does Israel's duty give it the right to disregard the lives of ten people including two schoolchildren and the safety of 32 others who were wounded in the attack?

 

[Gardener]

(Snip)


I find myself leaning toward the sentiment of "unjustified" which surely shocks those of you that know me.

I suppose I would say that I don't know you.

At least well enough to know with 100% certainty that you were being entirely facetious here.

 

[Gandhi>Bush]

Let's put this in perspective... sorta.......

A long time ago, through hook or by crook, the US annexed a lot of land from Mexico.

?

Okay I think you're disregarding ohh... a thousand years of history plus several other factors of the more recent past that differ significantly between the two scenarios.

If Mexico demanded it back (Texas, Calif, etc..) today, what would we do?

If they started lobbing bombs into El Paso, what would we do? If they started marching suicide bombers into our public markets killing our friends and family, what would we do?

I think Isreal knows what it has to do.

Drop bombs on more children?

 

[oldreliable67]

I have no problem with this.

Does Israel's duty give it the right to disregard the lives of ten people including two schoolchildren and the safety of 32 others who were wounded in the attack?

Of course not. Israel has a duty to implement ROE that will preclude or at least minimize civilian casualties. I believe they have done so. Whether those ROE were ignored for some reason in this instance, or if the Israelis were for some reason working with faulty information that lead to a bad decision, we simply don't know. For example, perhaps the Israeli assessment of the situation was such that they felt they were weighing an unknown number of possible civilian casualties against a much, much larger more certain number of Israeli dead if the Palestinians successfully launched their Katyusha rockets. We don't know.

But of this I feel fairly confident: the Israelis are very methodical and purposeful. It is completely unlike them to not have ROE to cover these situations.

 

[scipian]

Perhaps we should also take a look at ourselves then.

How are you supposed to defeat cowards who kill your people and then hide among civilians? Send your soldiers in and watch them get massacred in the streets? Let your people get killed over and over? While sometimes sending in soldiers is the best way, other times the least deadly is to do tactical bombing. Inevitably, innocent people die. But that's a part of war. And, BTW, the Palestinians want a war.

Perhaps we should not drop bombs on neighborhoods then.

We drop bombs and accidentally kill a few civilians while killing terrorists. These terrorists are cowards and hide among civilians. (These civilians aren't always blameless either. They often support the terrorists). We save many more of our people by stopping the missile attacks. Do you want us to sit around, let them shoot rockets at us, kill dozens, hundreds? There is a point where you HAVE to respond to a threat to your people.

Good luck convincing the other six billion people on the Earth of your sentiment.

We nuked Hiroshima and Nagosaki. Turned them into glass Sorry, not funny. But, seriously, there isn't a need for unilateral agreement among the entire world. While everyone(and me) would condemn it, they probably(sadly) wouldn't do much. Just look at Africa. People who've done nothing wrong have been massacred by the millions.

Really? How many Palestinians do you know? (how do you know Palestinians don't want peace.)

Well, they break the peace over and over. When given valuable hydroponic systems, they destroy them as if they were "conquerors". They purposely kill unarmed civilians and avoid soldiers. Their religious and political leaders openly advocate genocide and extreme dictatorship. They elect terrorists and genocidal maniacs to be their leaders. They have been killed or thrown out of every other Arab nation because of their antics. Not a very friendly people, eh?

Industrialized nation v. 3rd world country... hmm.

Okay, so since they're weak that means that they can't be attacked? Ex. I have a gun. You have a knife. You stab me in the leg. Can I shoot you or not? I'd shoot you in a heart-beat. Personally, I wouldn't advocate a full scale war. I would advocate a full scale invasion to take out the terrorists, though. Then convince the neighboring Arabs to take in their countrymen. The Israelis assimilated all the jews (and Arabs) who fled to Israel. The Arabs kicked out the Palestinians from their land and didn't let in any refugees. The Arabs are rich; they can support the Palestinians.

BTW- The Palestinians were on the losing side. They were trying to commit genocide. Israel beat them. Currently the Palestinians are killing civilians mercilessly. And the Israelis have to look after the Palestinians and give them a nation? Would someone explain to me why they DESERVE a nation. They've been on the losing side of WWII, the Cold War, all the Arab-Israeli Wars, and both Intifadas. They've been shown to be corrupt, violent, and dictatorial. I don't think they deserve a nation. The Kurds, Nepalese, Africans, deserve freedom moreso than the Palestinians, IMHO.

Also, please take my passage with a grain of salt Just thought I'd throw some stuff out there. See how you respond. I'm interested in how the Pro-Palestinian people think.

 

[cherokee]

Who knows maybe a civil war will rip them apart.
When the dust settles maybe the only ones
left alive will want to live in peace.

 

[Jay R]

I have no problem with this.

Does Israel's duty give it the right to disregard the lives of ten people including two schoolchildren and the safety of 32 others who were wounded in the attack?

Let's try and bear in mind that while not technically recognised as such the territory of the Palestinians functions and has the offices of a state. A state that adopts a very casual attitude to the violence that some of its citizens inflict on their neighbours with considerable regularity. It's romantic nonsense to think of the Palestinians as being beseiged and bombed by Israel when they give just as good as they get, worse during the Intifadas. Let's also remember that this was a strike on a couple of guys in a van with home made missiles out to spend the day launching them at Israeli civilians. A tragedy that two children were killed, but less than the outrages we've seen when the Palestinians actively seek to target Israeli children and civilians. I sincerely doubt that those people were 'disregarded', the Israelis know the score with the propaganda war, they wouldn't hand Hamas a scoop like that if they could have prevented it.

 

[DivineComedy]

Have a missle and rocket free nice day.

If the “Palesitinians” don’t want their children blown up they should prove it by gutting every Hamas, otherwise this is all I see when I look at what they consider love for their children:

 

[jallman]

I used to sympathize with Palestine until Israel graciously pulled out of an occuppied territory...and at considerable protest from some of their citizens. What did Palestine do in return? "Elect" the most rabid Israel haters and then continue the suicide bombing. It is as if negotiation is beneath them whatsoever. Plus, it isnt as if Israel hasnt given fair warning that retaliation is a policy now. It's out there on the table for everyone's general knowledge. So if these terrorists really cared about their country...knowing that they are just bringing enemy rockets back to their doorsteps with every lemming rush into Israeli schools and cafes and hotels...then they would stop sending suicide bombers.

There is always the idea that maybe we are seeing Darwinism in its most pure form here. It is possible that Palestine is just a stupid nation and their time in history is at an end. I mean...send your own people with bombs strapped to themselves...doesnt seem like sound strategy, especially when the lemming cant even take out the tank that is on its way back to you in retaliation.

But in all seriousness...the insanity of Palestine is more an more evident. They are not interested in peace, they are not interested in negotiation, and they are not interested in living in a world where Israel exists. Israel has a rabid enemy on its very border and so it has a right to defend itself with all necessary force. Palestine should be thankful that Israel hasnt rolled over their neighborhoods in force...Israel is still using diplomacy after all that they have suffered at Palestinian hands. They are just increasing the clarity of whats on the table in justified increments.

 

[akyron]

There will never be peace with them. Never.

Its been looking that way for quite a while now.
They did however have a tenuous year of cease fire. I cannot fathom the unimaginable stress locals on either side have to face daily.

Only this happened.

Imagine how bad it could have been if pals had really had their hearts into it.

Bombing it to glass then building recreational facilities and condos wont help for long either. The Arab states that are propping them now would just send in more Arabs and call them Palestinians who would stake a claim to the land again. Perhaps Israel needs to take it over under high security and build proper schools instead of Islamic ones and in half a century there will be local peace. Expand that out and eventually there will be national peace.
There is no easy solution to this complex deep rooted problem. Islamic violence is a vicious toothache in the mouth of the world and someone strong enough an willing to put up with the pain just needs to tie a string to it and a heavy door and slam it. No matter what its going to bleed for a long time.


"Jan 5, 2005 - A terrorist infiltrated the Erez crossing terminal in the Gaza Strip, activated an explosive device, hurled grenades and opened fire. An IDF force shot and killed the terrorist. The Islamic Jihad and the Al-Aqsa Martyrs' Brigades claimed responsibility for the attack.

Jan 12, 2005 - One Israeli civilian was killed and three IDF soldiers wounded when a bomb was detonated as a military vehicle patrolled the route near Morag in the southern Gaza Strip. Two terrorists were killed by IDF forces. The area was booby-trapped with explosive devices, in addition to the bomb that exploded. The Islamic Jihad claimed responsibility for the attack.

Jan 13, 2005 - On Thursday night, shortly before the closing of the Karni Crossing, terrorists activated an explosive device on the Palestinian side of the crossing, blowing a hole in the door through which Palestinian terrorists infiltrated the Israeli side of the crossing and opened fire at Israeli civilians. As a result of the explosion and during exchanges of fire, six Israeli civilians and three Palestinian terrorists were killed, and five Israeli civilians were wounded. Hamas and the Fatah al-Aqsa Martyrs' Brigades claimed joint responsiblity for the attack.

Jan 18, 2005 - An ISA officer was killed, an IDF officer seriously wounded, and 4 IDF soldiers and 3 members of the ISA were lightly wounded in a suicide bombing attack at the Gush Katif junction in the central Gaza Strip. While search procedures were being carried out, the suicide bomber with explosives strapped to his body detonated himself. Hamas claimed responsibility for the attack.

Feb 25, 2005 - Five people were killed and 50 wounded Friday night, when a suicide bomber blew himself up outside the Stage club on the Tel Aviv promenade at around 11:20 P.M., on the corner of Herbert Samuel and Yonah Hanavi streets. The Islamic Jihad claimed responsibility for the attack.

July 12, 2005 - Five people were killed and about 90 wounded when a suicide bomber detonated himself outside Hasharon Mall in Netanya. The bomber was identified as Ahmed Abu Khalil, 18, from the West Bank village of Atil. The Islamic Jihad claimed responsibility for the attack.

Aug 28, 2005 - A suicide bomber detonated himself outside the Beersheba Central Bus Station. Two security guards who stopped the bomber were severely wounded and about 50 people were lightly wounded or treated for shock. Hamas claimed responsibility for the attack.

Oct 26, 2005 - Six people were killed and 55 wounded, six seriously, in a suicide bombing at the Hadera open-air market. The Islamic Jihad claimed responsibility for the attack.

Dec 5, 2005 - Five people were killed and over 50 wounded in a suicide bombing at the entrance to the Sharon shopping mall in Netanya. The terrorist detonated the bomb when he was stopped by security guards, one of whom was killed. The Islamic Jihad claimed responsibility for the attack.

Dec 29, 2005 - Lt. Ori Binamo, 21, of Nesher was killed when a terrorist en route to carry out an attack in Israel detonated himself at roadblock set up near Tulkarm following an intelligence tip. A second intended suicide terrorist was also killed in the blast as well as the taxi driver and a third passenger. Three soldiers and seven Palestinians were wounded.

Jan 19, 2006 - Thirty-one people were wounded in a suicide bombing in a shawarma restaurant near the old central bus station in Tel Aviv. The Jerusalem Battalions of the Palestinian Islamic Jihad claimed responsibility for the attack.

Mar 30, 2006 - Four people were killed when a suicide bomber hitchhiker disguised as an ultra-Orthodox yeshiva student detonated his explosive device in a private vehicle near the entrance to Kedumim.

Apr 17, 2006 - Eleven people were killed and over 60 wounded in a suicide bombing during the Passover holiday near the old central bus station in Tel Aviv, at the Rosh Ha'ir shawarma restaurant, site of the Jan 19 bombing. The Islamic Jihad claimed responsibility for the attack."

 

[akyron]

If the “Palesitinians” don’t want their children blown up they should prove it by gutting every Hamas, otherwise this is all I see when I look at what they consider love for their children:


Pals know that they get tanks in response to this but it really doesnt seem to matter to them anymore. They must be reading the Koran or something.

 

[Volker]

Well, three of the people killed where medical workers who came to help the wounded people? The last missiles were fired, when the truck was destroyed and some people gathered to look what's going on?

This sounds like a terrorist tactic to me.

 

[Nero]

Well, three of the people killed where medical workers who came to help the wounded people? The last missiles were fired, when the truck was destroyed and some people gathered to look what's going on?

This sounds like a terrorist tactic to me.

The truck was destroyed but the missile instead was still intact. The second missile was sent to take it out. Furthermore some of the "onlookers" were trying to take the missile out of the car to stash. As far as the medical workers are concerned, you will recall that the palestinians have been caught smugling weapons in their ambulances, as far as im concerned whatever nutrality there "medical" workers had is long since gone.

Hekmat Mughrabi, tears streaming down her face and her veil soaked with blood, said her 30-year-old son, Ashraf, and a 13-year-old family member died when a missile hit the curb outside her home.

Perhaps you could explain to Mrs/Ms Mughrabi how that day was a good day?

I will not deny the danger of Katyusha rockets, but to call it a "good day" is what I would call barabaric. I would at least expect you to conceed that maybe waiting until these men were not in front of a home filled with innocent people would have been the better choice. I don't really understand how you can dismiss the deaths of 10 people, two children included, and declare a day, probably the worst day of Mrs/Ms Mughrabi's life as a "good day."

While i agree with you that being happy for someone elses missery is barbaric, it is possible to feal sorry about doing the right thing. In this case while im sure israel gains no joy from killing civilians its still something that has to be done.

Perhaps we should not drop bombs on neighborhoods then.

You see the conflict from a nuatral standpoint, all humans as equal. In actuality every goverments goal is to preserve its own citizens, other citizens coming in as a far second. Israel has no obligation to preserve palestinian life, its sole obligation is to protect israel.

Furthermore the israeli air force bombed the truck were it went, it was the palestinian truck that knowinlg moved through a residential area for cover.

 

[Volker]

The truck was destroyed but the missile instead was still intact. The second missile was sent to take it out. Furthermore some of the "onlookers" were trying to take the missile out of the car to stash. As far as the medical workers are concerned, you will recall that the palestinians have been caught smugling weapons in their ambulances, as far as im concerned whatever nutrality there "medical" workers had is long since gone.

So they knowingly attacked civil persons and the excuse is that medical workers may be not neutral?

Again, this sounds like a terrorist tactic to me.

 

[Captain America]

I used to sympathize with Palestine until Israel graciously pulled out of an occuppied territory...

So did I.....

and at considerable protest from some of their citizens. What did Palestine do in return? "Elect" the most rabid Israel haters and then continue the suicide bombing.

Go figure......I felt pretty stupid supporting their cause in the past at this point and time..

It is as if negotiation is beneath them whatsoever.

I'm beginning to think Isreal may have been on to something....

Plus, it isnt as if Israel hasnt given fair warning that retaliation is a policy now. It's out there on the table for everyone's general knowledge. So if these terrorists really cared about their country...knowing that they are just bringing enemy rockets back to their doorsteps with every lemming rush into Israeli schools and cafes and hotels...then they would stop sending suicide bombers.

Nah....that's way too logical.

There is always the idea that maybe we are seeing Darwinism in its most pure form here. It is possible that Palestine is just a stupid nation and their time in history is at an end. I mean...send your own people with bombs strapped to themselves...doesnt seem like sound strategy, especially when the lemming cant even take out the tank that is on its way back to you in retaliation.

Doesn't say much for their sense of preservation.

But in all seriousness...the insanity of Palestine is more an more evident. They are not interested in peace, they are not interested in negotiation, and they are not interested in living in a world where Israel exists. Israel has a rabid enemy on its very border and so it has a right to defend itself with all necessary force. Palestine should be thankful that Israel hasnt rolled over their neighborhoods in force...Israel is still using diplomacy after all that they have suffered at Palestinian hands. They are just increasing the clarity of whats on the table in justified increments.

Considering they (too many of them but not all) raise their children from the ground up to hate jews, who just so happen to be their neighbors, I see no hope on the horizon for them. Sometimes we just have to let nature take it's course I suppose.

 

[Nero]

So they knowingly attacked civil persons and the excuse is that medical workers may be not neutral?

Again, this sounds like a terrorist tactic to me.

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/terrorism :

The unlawful use or threatened use of force or violence by a person or an organized group against people or property with the intention of intimidating or coercing societies or governments, often for ideological or political reasons.

So as you can see, the aim of the atack must be the civilians for it to be terrorism. For suicide bombers in stores is specificly to harm civilians, launching rockets randomly into towns to "make sderot a ghost town" is terrorism.

My mentioning of the medical workers support of terrorism was in response to you claiming that the medical workers should get special treetment

Well, three of the people killed where medical workers who came to help the wounded people?

.
As long as terrorists use palestinian ambulances to transport war material they are fair targets as far as im concerned.


The civilians deaths while tragic, would have been avoided if the palestinians didn't stick the launch sites square in the middle of a residential neighborhood.

 

[Deegan]

Hekmat Mughrabi, tears streaming down her face and her veil soaked with blood, said her 30-year-old son, Ashraf, and a 13-year-old family member died when a missile hit the curb outside her home.

Perhaps you could explain to Mrs/Ms Mughrabi how that day was a good day?

I will not deny the danger of Katyusha rockets, but to call it a "good day" is what I would call barabaric. I would at least expect you to conceed that maybe waiting until these men were not in front of a home filled with innocent people would have been the better choice. I don't really understand how you can dismiss the deaths of 10 people, two children included, and declare a day, probably the worst day of Mrs/Ms Mughrabi's life as a "good day."

I would ask them to examine their own part in this continued conflict, and to ask themselves, "How long are we going to continue to sacrifice our own children in this senseless war of borders?" Of course I feel for the innocent among them that were killed, but I just wonder how many were actually innocent, and how many condone this on a daily basis? I have yet to see you start a thread when a bus load of children in Israel are killed, or express your undying grief for that loss, perhaps you should think about that, then you may begin to see what has hardened so many to these losses.

 

[Gandhi>Bush]

Perhaps we should also take a look at ourselves then.

How are you supposed to defeat cowards who kill your people and then hide among civilians? Send your soldiers in and watch them get massacred in the streets? Let your people get killed over and over? While sometimes sending in soldiers is the best way, other times the least deadly is to do tactical bombing. Inevitably, innocent people die. But that's a part of war. And, BTW, the Palestinians want a war.

Terrorists want war. Not all Palestinians are terrorists. I am willing to bet that at the very least Mrs. Mughrabi wants justice, though a better wager would be for revenge. These actions are not actions of a country that wants peace. Following this attack there was a parade where the bodies of the deceased were carried through the town wrapped in a Fatah flag, not a Hamas flag, and during this parade more rockets were vowed to be launched on Israel. I'm not saying that those that make such vows were different men before the attack on Tuesday, but it is a hard place to be in: To speak against war and for peace when rockets are raining down on schoolchildren in your country.

Perhaps we should not drop bombs on neighborhoods then.

We drop bombs and accidentally kill a few civilians while killing terrorists. These terrorists are cowards and hide among civilians. (These civilians aren't always blameless either. They often support the terrorists). We save many more of our people by stopping the missile attacks. Do you want us to sit around, let them shoot rockets at us, kill dozens, hundreds? There is a point where you HAVE to respond to a threat to your people.[/quote]

So you launched missles into a busy Gaza street. Wait 5 minutes for medical crews and onlookers to respond and fire again. Truly you have done a service to your people through such actions.

Good luck convincing the other six billion people on the Earth of your sentiment.

We nuked Hiroshima and Nagosaki. Turned them into glass Sorry, not funny. But, seriously, there isn't a need for unilateral agreement among the entire world. While everyone(and me) would condemn it, they probably(sadly) wouldn't do much. Just look at Africa. People who've done nothing wrong have been massacred by the millions.

I find it hard to believe that the world would sit idly by as an industrialized nation nukes a third world country. Then again I'm an idealist.

Really? How many Palestinians do you know? (how do you know Palestinians don't want peace.)

Well, they break the peace over and over. When given valuable hydroponic systems, they destroy them as if they were "conquerors". They purposely kill unarmed civilians and avoid soldiers. Their religious and political leaders openly advocate genocide and extreme dictatorship. They elect terrorists and genocidal maniacs to be their leaders. They have been killed or thrown out of every other Arab nation because of their antics. Not a very friendly people, eh?

So... you don't know any Palestinians either?

Industrialized nation v. 3rd world country... hmm.

Okay, so since they're weak that means that they can't be attacked? Ex. I have a gun. You have a knife. You stab me in the leg. Can I shoot you or not? I'd shoot you in a heart-beat.

That's a fairly silly comparison.

Personally, I wouldn't advocate a full scale war. I would advocate a full scale invasion to take out the terrorists, though.

What, pray tell, is the difference?

Then convince the neighboring Arabs to take in their countrymen. The Israelis assimilated all the jews (and Arabs) who fled to Israel. The Arabs kicked out the Palestinians from their land and didn't let in any refugees. The Arabs are rich; they can support the Palestinians.

Convince them ehh? What would you suggest? Invade these countries as well and then say please?

The fact is the Palestinians don't want to go to Jordan or Lebanon or Egypt. Their Grandfathers had a home for them in the land known today as Israel.

BTW- The Palestinians were on the losing side. They were trying to commit genocide.

What are you refering to here?