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Is Feminism Devisive ?

Is Feminism Divisive


  • Total voters
    8
  • Poll closed .

Naughty Nurse

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Windy said:
:doh

Sorry you misunderstood me..I meant I don't intend to; although I have, and no doubt I will in future.
And there's nothing you can do about it, except maybe improve yourself so you can compete more effectively? Why not give that a try instead of just moaning on about it?
 

Arthur Fonzarelli

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loverofpeace said:
You have a wife?

And do you honestly think that average women use their sexuality to get ahead? I will have to sorely disagree with you here. I'm sure female movie stars and such use this tactic, as they are directed to do... but let's not count out all the men who have used their sexuality to get ahead as well... What it really sounds to me is that men just don't want to let women be anything but housewives and sex icons.

I'm really confused about where you stand on females. You say that women in the workforce caused the degrading of morality, then you say that you don't have a problem with women in the workforce. You talk about how it's actually the women oppressing the men in regards to salary, but then you speak of your wife. And I'm surprised that you're basing ALL women on just the small experiences you've had at home. Yes, I would agree that there is a poverty problem here in the United States, but that has more to do with the welfare system and government aid than feminism.

I understand if you are the traditional kind of guy, but I ask that you please do not let your traditions cause you to become prejudiced.
Yes I have a wife...of 13 years so far.

First: it's not that I think women need to stay at home or not be employed at all. I just think our children suffer when both parents must work outside the home just to make ends meet. So many kids are raising themselves today...so many have zero respect for adults or authority of any kind. I believe there are two root causes of this...1) bad parenting...2) the lack of parenting.

Second: I was pointing out the fact that women have been discriminated in the work place for years & that they claim to have come a long way in getting their fair wage is a bit backwards. In my experience in manufacturing the wages have dropped for men working in places that employ large numbers of women...thus eliminating the discrimination...& thus making it harder for one parent to work outside the home to support the family financially.

All this results in parents spending much less time involved with their children's education (public). Many parents don't find out about troubles with their children until things have gotten out of hand...whether it be a problem with behavior or a problem with academics. I have been told by many educators that it's the rare parent who is informed & involved with their children's education (I have been called a rare parent). This could also include the pre-school education they may be getting from a daycare center (in which I addressed in another post).

The most important job I do is NOT the one I am paid an hourly wage for...it is the job I do raising my son. Problem is; far too many parents don't see it that way. Jobs & careers take precedence over raising their kids. That is the sad state of our country created by both parents needing to work to do what one parent used to be able to do; financially support a family.

Now, do I believe the "woman's movement" is to blame or responsible for this? Yes, to some degree, but certainly not completely. Nothing can be blamed on just one thing/person/or movement, but to claim that it isn't a contributing factor is not facing reality.
 

Rev.

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Naughty Nurse said:
It's not a matter of differences, which do of course exist. It's a matter of equality - equal pay for work of equal value etc.
Not really. It's about independance. Women are superior to men and therefore should not stoop to depend on them financially or emotionally. I'm against that kind of rhetoric. Women should not be made to feel ashamed of liking men just because men are men. Men provide a different kind of dynamic to relationships which can be equally fulfilling.

As a man working in a female dominated profession I too suffer from the inequality of women.
As a woman working in a male-dominated profession, I know what you mean. :)
 

Rev.

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Urethra Franklin said:
Except in rare cases, people called Rev. are usually religiously motivated, and therefore deranged in the head.
So am I the exception or the rule?
 

Windy

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Naughty Nurse said:
And there's nothing you can do about it, except maybe improve yourself so you can compete more effectively? Why not give that a try instead of just moaning on about it?
ROFL ...seems your feminists buddies could use some of that advice to....
:rofl
 

Urethra Franklin

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Rev. said:
So am I the exception or the rule?
Well, your views would suggest not.
I'm sorry to be harsh on you, but when I read signatures like yours I reach for an IV anti-emetic. Women like you have held us back more than the men who profit from our subjugation. And the church more than any institiution has done women no favours whatsoever.
You choose your lifestyle; I respect your choice, but all that bio-claptrap really incenses me. I may be physically weaker than many men, but that doesn't mean I will accept being put upon.
You vote, you have choices, you have the right to be a pastor, the right to voice your opinions because feminists have fouight for those rights. They weren't just given up willingly by men, and no, they didn't come from god.
 
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Windy

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Urethra Franklin said:
It's lose, darling not loose. Are you from the US? Then I wouldn't expect English to be your strong point.
It's an internet forum. Nobody takes it seriously. People get as personal with me. Debates get heated. You come accross people you think are out of their box. At the end of day we only come here for a laugh (we're very sad if we come HERE for intelligent debate).
Get over it.
Urethra Franklin said:
It's lose, darling not loose.
Urethra Franklin said:
You come accross people you think are out of their box.
Not your strong point either Urethra?
Get over it to hon :rofl
 

Windy

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Arthur Fonzarelli said:
Yes I have a wife...of 13 years so far.

First: it's not that I think women need to stay at home or not be employed at all. I just think our children suffer when both parents must work outside the home just to make ends meet. So many kids are raising themselves today...so many have zero respect for adults or authority of any kind. I believe there are two root causes of this...1) bad parenting...2) the lack of parenting.

Second: I was pointing out the fact that women have been discriminated in the work place for years & that they claim to have come a long way in getting their fair wage is a bit backwards. In my experience in manufacturing the wages have dropped for men working in places that employ large numbers of women...thus eliminating the discrimination...& thus making it harder for one parent to work outside the home to support the family financially.

All this results in parents spending much less time involved with their children's education (public). Many parents don't find out about troubles with their children until things have gotten out of hand...whether it be a problem with behavior or a problem with academics. I have been told by many educators that it's the rare parent who is informed & involved with their children's education (I have been called a rare parent). This could also include the pre-school education they may be getting from a daycare center (in which I addressed in another post).

The most important job I do is NOT the one I am paid an hourly wage for...it is the job I do raising my son. Problem is; far too many parents don't see it that way. Jobs & careers take precedence over raising their kids. That is the sad state of our country created by both parents needing to work to do what one parent used to be able to do; financially support a family.

Now, do I believe the "woman's movement" is to blame or responsible for this? Yes, to some degree, but certainly not completely. Nothing can be blamed on just one thing/person/or movement, but to claim that it isn't a contributing factor is not facing reality.
HOORAY SIR :cool:
 

Rev.

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Dig a little deeper, Urethra. You missed my point.

Urethra Franklin said:
Women like you have held us back more than the men who profit from our subjugation.
Women like me understand that women are not superior to men, and men are not superior to women. We are equal as persons, but not in abilities. Therefore, since there are differences in abilities, there will be differences in they ways we chose to live out our lives, and it should ALL be acknowledged as important regardless of who is doing what.

And I'm sorry that my signature line offends you, but there is a truth there you ought to acknowledge: women gained equal rights because mothers raised their daughters to understand the value in being a woman. "One diaper at a time" is more effective in the long term that picketing city hall.

Where exactly is the ERA today?

BTW, I have three daughters and four sons. I take my job seriously.
 

Urethra Franklin

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Rev. said:
Dig a little deeper, Urethra. You missed my point.



Women like me understand that women are not superior to men, and men are not superior to women. We are equal as persons, but not in abilities. Therefore, since there are differences in abilities, there will be differences in they ways we chose to live out our lives, and it should ALL be acknowledged as important regardless of who is doing what.

And I'm sorry that my signature line offends you, but there is a truth there you ought to acknowledge: women gained equal rights because mothers raised their daughters to understand the value in being a woman. "One diaper at a time" is more effective in the long term that picketing city hall.

Where exactly is the ERA today?

BTW, I have three daughters and four sons. I take my job seriously.
Picketing city hall got more things changed in a hundred years than your potty training did in a thousand.
In fact the Icelandic women had the best idea going on sex strike. Though I have to admit that would kill me. Still, there's always the fur cup.
 

Naughty Nurse

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Rev. said:
Not really. It's about independance. Women are superior to men and therefore should not stoop to depend on them financially or emotionally. I'm against that kind of rhetoric.
Obviously United Statesian feminists are a little different from most of the ones I've met here!
 

Naughty Nurse

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Rev. said:
Dig a little deeper, Urethra. You missed my point.



Women like me understand that women are not superior to men, and men are not superior to women. We are equal as persons, but not in abilities. Therefore, since there are differences in abilities, there will be differences in they ways we chose to live out our lives, and it should ALL be acknowledged as important regardless of who is doing what.
You know, Rev, if I, as an out gay man, started spouting homophobic stuff people would think it a little weird. That's how Urethra no doubt feels when she hears women spouting sexist stuff.

Honey, the bible was allegedly written 2000 years ago by a bunch of MEN, who claimed they were recording the word of a deity, who they called He. Why do you think it discriminates against women? Because the deity is sexist, or because it served the purpose of the men who were doing the writing?

Discuss.
 

Pulaskee

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Do a search in the bible on women, you will find that they, ruled citys, saved spys, ruled contrys, led groups of people. I find it interesting that you say they had no rights.

shifting thought,I think that the faminist work has moved to the illogical side of things.


Picketing city hall got more things changed in a hundred years than your potty training did in a thousand.
In the past maby, when people up in the high spots cared. and i think that the potty training is importent. after all, as your picketing isnt the crudy public school system teaching your kids?

P.S. Forgive my spelling and gramer, i never much carred for it so i didnt learn it well, im working on it.
 

Urethra Franklin

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Pulaskee said:
P.S. Forgive my spelling and gramer, i never much carred for it so i didnt learn it well, im working on it.
Apologies for my earlier dig. It was unkind.

However, I still think your logic is way off.
 

Windy

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Naughty Nurse said:
You know, Rev, if I, as an out gay man, started spouting homophobic stuff people would think it a little weird. That's how Urethra no doubt feels when she hears women spouting sexist stuff.

Honey, the bible was allegedly written 2000 years ago by a bunch of MEN, who claimed they were recording the word of a deity, who they called He. Why do you think it discriminates against women? Because the deity is sexist, or because it served the purpose of the men who were doing the writing?

Discuss.


The thing is nurse that if you are right about the bible we all have nothing to worry about.....What if the Rev is right?
 

Rev.

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Naughty Nurse said:
You know, Rev, if I, as an out gay man, started spouting homophobic stuff people would think it a little weird. That's how Urethra no doubt feels when she hears women spouting sexist stuff.
What is sexist about what I said?

Honey, the bible was allegedly written 2000 years ago by a bunch of MEN, who claimed they were recording the word of a deity, who they called He. Why do you think it discriminates against women? Because the deity is sexist, or because it served the purpose of the men who were doing the writing?

Discuss.
Do you have any idea why God is referred to with a masculine pronoun? Because the word Eli (translated God) is masculine. Furthermore, it's Elohim which is not only masculine, it's plural.
 

Rev.

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Pulaskee said:
Do a search in the bible on women, you will find that they, ruled citys, saved spys, ruled contrys, led groups of people. I find it interesting that you say they had no rights.
Not only that, they owned property, conducted businesses, supported Jesus and the disciples out of their own means and preached the gospel.
 

Naughty Nurse

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Rev. said:
What is sexist about what I said?
The fact that you seem to want to prevent women from achieving full equality.

Rev. said:
Do you have any idea why God is referred to with a masculine pronoun? Because the word Eli (translated God) is masculine. Furthermore, it's Elohim which is not only masculine, it's plural.
In Portuguese the word "problema" (problem) is masculine. Yet if we were to translate it into English and use a pronoun, we would use "it" rather than "he". Your point is?
 

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I think I have started out on the wrong foot. My display of my logic has not been the best and because of it im afraid that my pont was not conveyed. So forgive me as I step in to past 2 or 3 pages to a post that I wanted to make but never did. This forum moves WAY faster then the ones im used to.

Naughty Nurse said
Well, mate, I wish you luck in your search for Mrs Neanderthal.
By this im assuming you mean some that will comply with my wishes and stay at home, cooking, washing and training kids all day long. Some one that could be like a slave. I would not want a Miss Neanderthal. I dated a girl that had no spine or direction when she was around me, it was really irritating. I would want some one of this age, some one I could experience life with, a woman of this age, of my generation. Why? Couse they can think with me, help me in the bad time and the good. When I have kids we can take turns teaching the children, we can work TOGETHER to get things around the house done, ( I personally like doing dishes). I would still want to be the only working person, maby take a night job or some thing. My wife would be more suited for the job of raring kids, and I would want them to be able to understand that we care for them. After kids? She gets her own job if she wants one. Now why can I have this woman? Because of the Womens’ movements yes. They made it possible for women to work with men side by side, it took years and they pulled it off, tis something to take pride in. Maby they have taken to much. Enter 05, In an age were I go to work and say hi to my brilliant and loved Female managers, were some wives drive there husbens and its just as common to see a female officer as a male one. What is left for the womans movement? Nothing really, a woman can sue any one if she feels discriminated, and there is no more rights to be gained. they already got us to the equal point. Yet we still see them. Why? Well the only thing I can think of is ether misguided info so they think there still discriminated against, or they feel they need revenge, or maby they think women are superior to men. Which ever way it is it starting to push men to a lower rung on the totem poll. Its there to see, no way around it.

Hope this has been more clear, and Franklin were good. If one person had not brought it up I would have been seriously concerned. I sincerely hope this is better...its amazing what sleep can do.
 

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Pulaskee said:
I think I have started out on the wrong foot. My display of my logic has not been the best and because of it im afraid that my pont was not conveyed. So forgive me as I step in to past 2 or 3 pages to a post that I wanted to make but never did. This forum moves WAY faster then the ones im used to.



By this im assuming you mean some that will comply with my wishes and stay at home, cooking, washing and training kids all day long. Some one that could be like a slave. I would not want a Miss Neanderthal. I dated a girl that had no spine or direction when she was around me, it was really irritating. I would want some one of this age, some one I could experience life with, a woman of this age, of my generation. Why? Couse they can think with me, help me in the bad time and the good. When I have kids we can take turns teaching the children, we can work TOGETHER to get things around the house done, ( I personally like doing dishes). I would still want to be the only working person, maby take a night job or some thing. My wife would be more suited for the job of raring kids, and I would want them to be able to understand that we care for them. After kids? She gets her own job if she wants one. Now why can I have this woman? Because of the Womens’ movements yes. They made it possible for women to work with men side by side, it took years and they pulled it off, tis something to take pride in. Maby they have taken to much. Enter 05, In an age were I go to work and say hi to my brilliant and loved Female managers, were some wives drive there husbens and its just as common to see a female officer as a male one. What is left for the womans movement? Nothing really, a woman can sue any one if she feels discriminated, and there is no more rights to be gained. they already got us to the equal point. Yet we still see them. Why? Well the only thing I can think of is ether misguided info so they think there still discriminated against, or they feel they need revenge, or maby they think women are superior to men. Which ever way it is it starting to push men to a lower rung on the totem poll. Its there to see, no way around it.

Hope this has been more clear, and Franklin were good. If one person had not brought it up I would have been seriously concerned. I sincerely hope this is better...its amazing what sleep can do.
Good for you mate ..dont let these fems bully you into believing you are different.
There are millions of us out here who think the same as you.
The problem is that most fems only know and associate with others of the
same opinions.
They keep themselves going by actually believing what they are telling themselves.
For us mere mortals; life is alot different to how they perceive it to be....
the problem being is that we start to believe it ourselves lol.
All any of us can do is just live life as good as we can showing respect and equality in the hope that maybe some may be given back
 

26 X World Champs

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Rev. said:
I would be against feminism.

It is disrespectful to the natural differences between women and men.
Surely you are bright enough to grasp that the "natural differences" have nothing to do with respect? Ever hear of Rosie the Riveter? WWII? Back then women had to assume jobs that were traditionally male only jobs. Tell me, how'd they do? Why not look up the productivity of manufacturing in the US from 1941-1945....maybe you'd develop some more respect for people, as their gender is not a determining factor in their ability to succeed. Did you ever stop to consider that a job that requires brute strength (physical, not mental) doesn't attract women to apply the way almost all other jobs do?
Rev. said:
Except in rare cases, women do not have the same strength and speed as men. It's a biological difference that can't be changed. And writing legislation that "women shall be considered as strong and as fast as men." won't change the truth any.
See above....meaningless really as you're point is based on the exception (women wanting a physically challenging job) vs. the vast majority of women who just want a job that pays equally to a man. Are you against equal pay for equal work? I don't think you are?
Rev. said:
Except in rare cases, men are not as able in language as women. Again, there is some biology associated with that.
Listen, for you to post claims like this you really need to show facts, especially ones that show us how in the work force this makes one bit of difference, cuz that is what we're talking about. Don't forget to show the scientific evidence (biology) that you mentioned.
Rev. said:
Except in rare cases, women are not as able in math's and sciences as men.
Wow! This is a really pointless and prejudiced comment. Ever stop to consider that attitudes likes yours on this subject are the main reason for more men being involved in science than women? What do I mean? People like you DISCOURAGE women from these fields by their built-in prejudiced. If you have a daughter and throughout her childhood you teach her that women aren't as good as men are in science how will that effect her self-esteem and her choosing of a trade? The problem isn't the ability of a woman, the problem is the inability of women and men who beleive as you do to allow their children to be the best they can be. No offense intended, but it really is an insidious scheme to hold women back. It really is shameful.
Rev. said:
Except in rare cases, men are not as adept with non-verbal intelligences, which affects their abilities in social situations.

Except in rare cases, women live longer and are prone to fewer genetic illnesses and disabilities.

Except in rare cases, men are taller and have less body fat.

Physical difference=differences in abilities and aptitudes. Why can't we just accept that and move on?
All of these points are exceptions to the rule, not the rule. By that I mean that the vast, vast majority of women are not interested in being football players. They are interested in being treated with respect and being paid equally. When you write this stuff you are perpetuating the bigotry against women, sorry. Fortunately what you write and what is legal and Constitutional are very different.

All we need to do is encourage women to be whatever they want to be, in any field and the vast, vast majority of them will achieve equally to any man.

Want to know what I really think of your post? I think that you're basing your point of view on religious prejudice in the Bible. You are certainly smart enough to evolve (is that a bad word to use when discussing the Bible?) your ideas beyond the Bible and into the real world, especially the 21st Century.

Surely you're not one of those small thinking people who would teach their daughter that they're not as good as men and that they should forgo a career to be subservient to a man? This subservience is not only about taking care of kids, to the most prejudiced and the most blinded by the Bible it is about keeping women down, not allowing them to be equal to men. That is the really sickest portion of this discussion.
 
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