Is atheism a religion[W:711:831]

[Cephus]

Re: Is atheism a religion

It depends on how you define religion. If you mean something that has beliefs and goals inherent in it, then absolutely not, it doesn't meet any of those criteria, but if you mean something that defines a position with regard to religious belief, I have no problem identifying atheism along that continuum, it is the lack of belief in any of the supernatural things that other religions believe in.

 

[Cephus]

Re: Is atheism a religion

... if you're asking whether atheism is an unproveable belief, then yeah it is... the existence of God can neither be proven nor disproven scientifically at this time.

Luckily, that has nothing to do with what atheism actually is. Atheism is the rejection of claims made by the religious about the supernatural, based on a lack of objective evidence to support them.

 

[Cephus]

Re: Is atheism a religion

Atheist, agnostic, potato, tomato... I think that's a hair-splitting definition but whatever works for ya. :shrug:

Words have meanings for a reason. You don't get to reject what words mean, just because it makes you uncomfortable.

 

[Cephus]

Re: Is atheism a religion

I always chuckle when I see atheists claim "belief that no god exists" is not a definition of atheism when all they have to do is go to the dictionary to find out that that is not true. For a group of people who are always on their high horses about evidence and not making false claims, you guys sure do seem to lack the latter and do the former often.

In case it hasn't occurred to you, dictionaries are written by people and people's personal biases can, and do, translate to what gets written there.

 

[Cardinal]

Re: Is atheism a religion

Is atheism a religion

Oh, for ****'s sake, no.

 

[obvious Child]

Re: Is atheism a religion

Religion | Define Religion at Dictionary.com

a set of beliefs concerning the cause, nature, and purpose of the universe, esp. when considered as the creation of a superhuman agency or agencies, usually involving devotional and ritual observances, and often containing a moral code governing the conduct of human affairs.

This defines Science as a religion if you ignore the expanded definition. Furthermore, atheism has no beliefs on superhuman creation, ritual observances or a moral code.

a specific fundamental set of beliefs and practices generally agreed upon by a number of persons or sects: the Christian religion; the Buddhist religion.
3.
the body of persons adhering to a particular set of beliefs and practices: a world council of religions.
4.
the life or state of a monk, nun, etc.: to enter religion.
5.
the practice of religious beliefs; ritual observance of faith.
6.
something one believes in and follows devotedly; a point or matter of ethics or conscience: to make a religion of fighting prejudice.
7.
religions, Archaic . religious rites.
8.
Archaic . strict faithfulness; devotion: a religion to one's vow.

How the heck does lack of belief meet any of these?

 

[polisciguy]

Re: Is atheism a religion

Is atheism a religion

No, but it can certainly be as passionate and, unfortunately on both accounts, just as bigoted.

 

[jamesrage]

Re: Is atheism a religion

This defines Science as a religion if you ignore the expanded definition. Furthermore, atheism has no beliefs on superhuman creation, ritual observances or a moral code.



How the heck does lack of belief meet any of these?

If you are an atheist then you most likely believe in the theory of evolution, the big bag theory and any numerous theories not rooted in a belief of a deity. So you do believe something.

 

[TiredOfLife]

Re: Is atheism a religion

If you are an atheist then you most likely believe in the theory of evolution, the big bag theory and any numerous theories not rooted in a belief of a deity. So you do believe something.

I believe in single-malt 16-year-olds. Do I get a tax break? Believe me, I pray to them, often nightly and sometimes several times a night.

 

[Boo Radley]

Re: Is atheism a religion

No, by pretty much every definition of religion it isn't. I don't understand why this is something that a lot of people feel the need to argue for. If atheism is a religion it makes all atheists hypocrites I guess. I just think there are better ways to attack it if that's what you want.

True that.

 

[Peter Grimm]

Re: Is atheism a religion

Most atheists don't believe that no god exists.

They simply don't believe claims made by the religious, because there's no evidence for them.

Rejecting someone else's positive claim is not a belief.

I think the term you are looking for is "agnostic," they are the ones who claim to neither believe nor disbelieve in God. However, in my opinion, such a middle-of-the-road stance is impossible for the human mind to take.

If I tell you not to imagine a pink elephant, the first thing you will do is imagine a pink elephant. That's because the human mind can't deal in negatives, it only deals in concepts and constructs. Thus, a person who is atheistic generally believes that no god exists. They may, however, concede that there is no evidence to support the assertion that no god exists, and that it's simply an opinion.

 

[Cardinal]

Re: Is atheism a religion

Thus, a person who is atheistic generally believes that no god exists.

Er...yes and no...it's an oversimplification. If an atheist says "there is no god," that's usually an abbreviated version of the more formal "As there is no evidence to support the claim that there is a god, it is reasonable to conclude until such evidence comes to light that there is no god."

They may, however, concede that there is no evidence to support the assertion that no god exists, and that it's simply an opinion.

You can't demand that someone prove a negative.

 

[obvious Child]

Re: Is atheism a religion

If you are an atheist then you most likely believe in the theory of evolution, the big bag theory and any numerous theories not rooted in a belief of a deity. So you do believe something.

People do not believe in the theory of evolution.

You either understand it or you don't.

That alone hardly constitutes a religion any more than believing in the Declaration of Independence.

Atheism is not a religion.

 

[Cardinal]

Re: Is atheism a religion

If you are an atheist then you most likely believe in the theory of evolution, the big bag theory and any numerous theories not rooted in a belief of a deity. So you do believe something.

Which has absolutely zip to do with being non-theistic.

 

[Peter Grimm]

Re: Is atheism a religion

Er...yes and no...it's an oversimplification. If an atheist says "there is no god," that's usually an abbreviated version of the more formal "As there is no evidence to support the claim that there is a god, it is reasonable to conclude until such evidence comes to light that there is no god."

It's not an oversimplification, it's the product of a mind who can organize his thoughts. You have a claim, and then you have supporting (and implied) logic to back up that claim.

Claim: There is no God

Supporting Logic: Since there is no evidence to support the claim that God exists

Implied Logic: Evidence is required in order for one to reasonably believe in God


Thus, the belief (or claim) is simply that God does not exist, just like I said.

You can't demand that someone prove a negative.

I never demanded anything. I pointed out the fact that one cannot prove that God does not exist, therefore the atheist who does not believe in God is not basing his belief on concrete proof of anything.

 

[Peter Grimm]

Re: Is atheism a religion

People do not believe in the theory of evolution.

You either understand it or you don't.

Such arrogance. I understand the theory probably better than you do, and I don't believe it. Sue me.

 

[obvious Child]

Re: Is atheism a religion

Which has absolutely zip to do with being non-theistic.

Did you catch the logic there that deems that the Catholic Church is a bunch of atheists per James's criteria?

 

[obvious Child]

Re: Is atheism a religion

Such arrogance. I understand the theory probably better than you do, and I don't believe it. Sue me.

Your postings suggests you do not even have the most pedestrian grasp of any of the concepts that make up the foundation of the Theory of Evolution much less the finer points it makes.

Especially the fact that you never refute anything said and you run away from long technical posts.

Furthermore, if you truly believe you understand the theory, you shouldn't have any problem convincing PHds in the hard sciences that evolution is false here.

 

[TiredOfLife]

Re: Is atheism a religion

Such arrogance. I understand the theory probably better than you do, and I don't believe it. Sue me.

Care to put that to the test? What does "fittest" mean?

 

[Cardinal]

Re: Is atheism a religion

It's not an oversimplification, it's the product of a mind who can organize his thoughts. You have a claim, and then you have supporting (and implied) logic to back up that claim.

Claim: There is no God

Supporting Logic: Since there is no evidence to support the claim that God exists

Implied Logic: Evidence is required in order for one to reasonably believe in God


Thus, the belief (or claim) is simply that God does not exist, just like I said.

Do you have a problem with evidence being required in order to make the claim that god exists?

I never demanded anything. I pointed out the fact that one cannot prove that God does not exist, therefore the atheist who does not believe in God is not basing his belief on concrete proof of anything.

You may not be "demanding" that proof of the negative be given, but you sure are putting the burden on atheists to prove that there is no god. The result is convenient (and painfully obvious): divert attention away from those making the claim that god exists.

 

[obvious Child]

Re: Is atheism a religion

Care to put that to the test? What does "fittest" mean?

Grim is going to run as he always does from demonstrating expertise.

Furthermore, only one creationist I've seen actually went to the forum I linked. He got a proverbial new one ripped. The rest were way too cowardly to attempt to argue with PhDs in the hard sciences who actively study evolution out in the field. When push comes to shove about demonstrating their alleged knowledge, they all run in the end. IMO, anyone who accepts YEC has issues with maturity and reality acceptance.

Furthermore, I generally don't wade into what or who is a Christian, but I cannot consider a YEC to be a Christian as YEC deems God to be the Supreme Liar of all time.

 

[Cardinal]

Re: Is atheism a religion

Did you catch the logic there that deems that the Catholic Church is a bunch of atheists per James's criteria?

I don't know if I'd agree his statement could arrive at that conclusion, but he was certainly trying to say, "hey, since atheists also think these other unrelated things are true, atheists are religious!"

 

[obvious Child]

Re: Is atheism a religion

I don't know if I'd agree his statement could arrive at that conclusion, but he was certainly trying to say, "hey, since atheists also think these other unrelated things are true, atheists are religious!"

But when we turn that around, anyone who believes in the same theories that alleged atheists do is an atheist as well.

"theory of evolution, the big bag theory and any numerous theories not rooted in a belief of a deity"

Huh.

Therefore, accepting evolution, big bang, gravity, germ, radioactivity and other theories not rooted in a diety makes you an atheist.

Seems that under Rage's criteria there are more atheists then theists.

 

[SmokeAndMirrors]

Re: Is atheism a religion

I think the term you are looking for is "agnostic," they are the ones who claim to neither believe nor disbelieve in God. However, in my opinion, such a middle-of-the-road stance is impossible for the human mind to take.

If I tell you not to imagine a pink elephant, the first thing you will do is imagine a pink elephant. That's because the human mind can't deal in negatives, it only deals in concepts and constructs. Thus, a person who is atheistic generally believes that no god exists. They may, however, concede that there is no evidence to support the assertion that no god exists, and that it's simply an opinion.

Nope.

Agnosticism is a stance about knowledge and what is knowable. Atheism is practical philosophy. It has nothing to do with what can or cannot be known.

 

[Peter Grimm]

Re: Is atheism a religion

Do you have a problem with evidence being required in order to make the claim that god exists?

Allow me to point out that I didn't make any value judgement on that. I simply stated the fact that said premise is implied as part of the supporting logic to your claim.

The point, lest it be lost, was that "there is no God" is the belief held by most atheists.

You may not be "demanding" that proof of the negative be given, but you sure are putting the burden on atheists to prove that there is no god. The result is convenient (and painfully obvious): divert attention away from those making the claim that god exists.

I'm not doing any such thing - and so perhaps what's "painfully obvious" is your lack of reading comprehension.

Who has the burden of proof was never even peripheral to the point I was making.

Again, what I said was that while many atheists believe that God does not exist (this being a positive claim), they would acknowledge the inherent inability to prove this claim. Which is indisputable.

Again, this is fact, and I made no value judgment on that fact either way. You cannot disprove the existence of God.