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Is Affirmative Action good for Colleges and Universities

wxcrazytwo

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I think so, because it creates a much diverse school and it gives those in less fortunate areas a chance. Comments welcome! (Flame on)
 
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It's a terrible system nowadays. Colleges and Universities are no longer interested in admitting an applicant based on their academic record..they're more concerned now with filling their racial quotas and how many zeros daddy can pencil in on his checks.
 
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Technocratic_Utilitarian said:
Which universities use quotas? ANy sources?
ALL universities use quotas..thats the point of the affirmative action policy. For example, my university OSU has what it calls a "Diversity Action Plan." It's more concerned with "diversity" than an applicants academic record which sudgests a racial quota. "The committee considered all of these comments, including the call to be more inclusive of many other groups, but reaffirmed that the focus of the proposed diversity plan would remain on increasing the number of women and racial/ethnic minorities..", "In order to achieve this recognition, bold steps must be taken to recruit and retain greater numbers of women and minority faculty, staff and students and to create a supportive environment in which they can succeed and reach their fullest potential.", "The short-term goal of this plan is to create a faculty, student and staff profile that reflects the demographic profile of the state.Long term, however, the university population must reflect national demographics."

http://www.osu.edu/diversityplan/index_1.php
 

MrFungus420

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Affirmative action is nothing but institutionalized racism.
 
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Indeed, in fact the "Diversity Action Plan" I just wrote about specifically states in it's "Objectives" section:

"Recruit and retain greater numbers of women and minorities into faculty, staff and administrative positions (including deans, chairs, and vice presidents)."

"Recruit, retain, and graduate greater numbers of ethnic minority students."

and the "Action Plan" section states:

"Modify the faculty hiring and assistance program in Fiscal Year 2001 to focus those funds in two ways: 1. For departments with small pools of women and minority candidates who are successful in recruiting them, and 2. For units that have been successful in increasing diversity to be able to hire at the senior rank."

"Develop a plan to increase the pool of women and minority candidates in those fields that have small pools."

"Doing so will be particularly important to the goal of improving the record on retention and graduation for African-Americans that is substantially below the overall rate and the rate for white students."

"The overall goal of our recruitment should be to have the student body mirror Ohio's projected demographics in ten years."
 
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galenrox said:
It is true affirmative action is institutionalized racism, and I'm opposed to it, but here's something to think about, if I may play the devil's advocate for a moment:
When my girlfriend first moved out to Iowa City, her best friend was jewish, and over the course of their first semester on several occasions they encountered several people who had never met a jew before. She's also a member of a traditionally jewish sorority, and so I've talked to the girls in there, and apparently every single one of them has had several of these people.
This points out how undiverse things can be. The only reason we have anything even remotely representing diversity is because we're the largest of the Universities in Iowa.
And these kids aren't from ridiculously small towns. I've been to some "small towns" in Iowa, and they don't strike me as all that small. Their relatively small and spread out, but the idea of that many people living together and someone making it all the way to the age of 18 without ever meeting a jew is fascinating.

How do I sign my kids up?:rofl

:rofl Which brings the point to light. Socialization is the responisbility of the parents of these children not the University itself and the University should not be basing it's admissions policies on the socialization of society.
 

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When AA was first instituted it was a needed tool to keep a level playing field but it has long since outlived it usefulness...........I have even heard prominent African Americans say people should be judged by their qualifications not the color of their skin......
 

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I was informed that such policies were illegal in many colleges. Where does it say they have a quota and they take certain per centages regardless of merit?

It's very ambiguous a topic anyway. If you have two equally qualified candiates, you cannot prove they hired one due to race or didn't hire the other unless they say so. Is there some way to delve into the minds of others?
 
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I feel like a university should base its admissions on what you are told from the time you are in grade school...and that is performance in high school and your standardized tests. Every student, I dont care what ethnicity, has the idea drilled in from a reasonably early age that you perform well in high school and do well on your SAT or ACT, then you get into college. We are also told to take part in community activism and extra curriculars and you are assured a place in a college. Taking advice has nothing to do with ethnicity. It has to do with a drive to be a good student and to succeed. It is infuriating that, because of affirmative action, admission slots that should go to students who have done their best, are being filled with mediocrity and that same mediocrity is often being given a scholarship to boot. And its all in the name of filling a diversity quota. Well here is my thought on that...mediocrity, no matter what color or range of colors, does not create diversity. Diversity is created by an exchange of innovative ideas promoted by a thirst for knowledge and excellence. The university system is tainted by hand-out students who are there for the free ride on the "diversity" wagon who never gave much to their high school, arent giving much to the university, and wont be giving much to society.
 

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Technocratic_Utilitarian said:
I was informed that such policies were illegal in many colleges. Where does it say they have a quota and they take certain per centages regardless of merit?

It's very ambiguous a topic anyway. If you have two equally qualified candiates, you cannot prove they hired one due to race or didn't hire the other unless they say so. Is there some way to delve into the minds of others?
well there is one way to stop that. take the ethnicity question off the admissions application entirely.
 
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Technocratic_Utilitarian said:
I was informed that such policies were illegal in many colleges. Where does it say they have a quota and they take certain per centages regardless of merit?

It's very ambiguous a topic anyway. If you have two equally qualified candiates, you cannot prove they hired one due to race or didn't hire the other unless they say so. Is there some way to delve into the minds of others?

Apparently you never read the doccument. It states "The overall goal of our recruitment should be to have the student body mirror Ohio's projected demographics in ten years." Do you know what demographics are?It also provides percentages of racial diversity at the university and states the goal of the policy is to improve the percentage of ethnic minorities admitted by the university. The only way to do that is to set the academic reccord of it's applicants aside because ethnic minorities tend to be less academically qualified. Jallman inadvertantly brough up a good point. If universities base their admissions policy on an applicants academic record then why do they ask your ethnicity?
 

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Napoleon's Nightingale said:
Apparently you never read the doccument. It states "The overall goal of our recruitment should be to have the student body mirror Ohio's projected demographics in ten years." Do you know what demographics are?It also provides percentages of racial diversity at the university and states the goal of the policy is to improve the percentage of ethnic minorities admitted by the university. The only way to do that is to set the academic reccord of it's applicants aside because ethnic minorities tend to be less academically qualified. Jallman inadvertantly brough up a good point. If universities base their admissions policy on an applicants academic record then why do they ask your ethnicity?
It was not inadvertant, Napoleon...it was a very pointed statement. Ethnicity should have no bearing on admissions into a university. The prestige and benefits of a college education are to be attained through hard work and dilligent study. It really is a vicious cycle...we want more minorities in schools, yet we feed the problem by giving handouts and thus, not motivating the minority student to strive for excellence. I was actually told upon my discharge from the navy that I should apply to NC A&T or to St Augustine because they were black colleges and that I would get a free ride being that I am white. Sick for two reasons. First, there should not be black and white colleges to start with and sick secondly because there should not be a hand out based on your ethnicity. And like I said, matters are made worse by feeding this cycle. And here you have universities (and corporations) in fear of the ACLU and the NAACP and any other number of societies legal thugs disguised as civil watchdogs. They extort quotas out of these institutions with threats of bad press, law suits, and tarnished public images. If you take the ethnicity question off the admissions application altogether, assign the applications a number and black out the names...strip it down to achievement records, essay, and test scores, then there is no way these social scourges can cry wolf every time a minority doesnt make the cut.
 

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I was informed that such policies were illegal in many colleges. Where does it say they have a quota and they take certain per centages regardless of merit?
they don't say it, but colleges want it and are required to have it. Its so funny how the valedictorian from a highschool who did all clubs, excelled in extracurrics, great recs etc... gets rejected from harvard, while smart, priveleged, but not as qualified girl with native american heritage gets scholarship to harvard. Its stories like these that show that affirmative action is not doing what it should be.

Its even getting unfair for minorities like asians.
 

wxcrazytwo

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nkgupta80 said:
they don't say it, but colleges want it and are required to have it. Its so funny how the valedictorian from a highschool who did all clubs, excelled in extracurrics, great recs etc... gets rejected from harvard, while smart, priveleged, but not as qualified girl with native american heritage gets scholarship to harvard. Its stories like these that show that affirmative action is not doing what it should be.

Its even getting unfair for minorities like asians.
Its understandable that the valedictorian would be upset becuase she was not allowed in t Harvard, but the native girl did. However, wrong it may be diversity is always the number one goal in universities and colleges. There are always going to be flaws in any program.
 

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George_Washington said:
Affirmative action is reverse racism towards European Americans and should absolutely be opposed at all costs. It's a stupid, clever tool used by minorities that want to undermine the majority.
It's not reverse racism. It is racism. Giving people preferential treatment based on their race is racism.
 

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Its understandable that the valedictorian would be upset becuase she was not allowed in t Harvard, but the native girl did. However, wrong it may be diversity is always the number one goal in universities and colleges. There are always going to be flaws in any program.
Very true. I actually think that if we were to get rid of affirmative actoin, college boards would still look for diversity in their universities. Diversity has become essential in the college experience for many universities.

George_Washington said:
Affirmative action is reverse racism towards European Americans and should absolutely be opposed at all costs. It's a stupid, clever tool used by minorities that want to undermine the majority.
Its not racism against European Americans, as much as its the leaning towards diversity. Take a look at UCLA. White american protested against affirmative action quotas. The university got rid of them. The next year, the incoming class had almost double the asians. The affirmative action in that school had been actually working for the European amdericans. So The college admissions boards aren't racist, they just want a balanced university.
 

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galenrox said:
lol, off topic but funny thing...my mom told me that I need to make friends with more asians so I can do well in school!!!
:rofl its funny cuz its true.
 

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George_Washington said:
It's not true, I know people of European decent that are just as smart at math related fields as any Asian I've ever met.
oh georgie...learn to laugh a bit. And I never, nor did galen say anything about math related fields, so please, stop your stereotyping.:stars:

I was merely commenting that Asians are brought up with more of an emphasis on study and hard work academically than people of European descent, as a generalization. What were you talking about?
 

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Hey.... Anytime we can give something to those that don't deserve it is a good day.

Just kiddin
 

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Well, I guess its pretty much agreed then, affirmative action blows donkey balls.
 

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It's fairly obvious that admission and jobs should not be based on factors that do not have any influence on merit. You should only get the job/admission based on merit. You should not be allowed to refuse someone for a reason not based on merit/pragmatic concerns (room).

Academic Institutions should, ideally, be based on a mix of need/merit.
 

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Technocratic_Utilitarian said:
It's fairly obvious that admission and jobs should not be based on factors that do not have any influence on merit. You should only get the job/admission based on merit. You should not be allowed to refuse someone for a reason not based on merit/pragmatic concerns (room).

Academic Institutions should, ideally, be based on a mix of need/merit.


but who do you think the colleges would and should want more. The kid with the 4.0 and the 1600 who's lived his whole life in a sheltered suburbian environment, or the kid with the 3.7 and 1450 who has lived in 5 different countries around the world and has a diverse cultural background?
 
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