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Intimidation? Violation of Student's Bill of Rights?

TimmyBoy

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I found this article posted on another forum. Don't really know how true it is. If it is true, I think if I was the student, I would lodge a formal complaint against the Secret Service and try to push for an internal investigation. Maybe a Defamation of Character lawsuit against Wal Mart. I seriously doubt the Secret Service had the legal authority to arrest this student. Of course, they did not arrest this student. Poor judgement on the law by the Secret Service. However, if that student was, after getting any charges dismissed in the original court appearance, I would be filing a False Arrest lawsuit against the Secret Service and perhaps a Defamation of Character suit, if that particular suit is possible. Certainly a False Arrest lawsuit. Sounds like the Secret Service might have been trying to engage in intimidation tatics without technically breaking the law or opening themselves up to lawsuit. I don't see where they had any Reasonable Articuable Suscpicion to question this student. I might have been tempted to tell the Secret Service, "hey look, I have no hostile intent, no criminal intent, I don't appreciate you trying to mess with me, but you have no Articuable Reasonable Suscipicion to question me, therefore, I do not have to talk with you and so therefore will not talk to you. Good Bye." Here is the article:

Wal-Mart Turns in Student’s Anti-Bush Photo, Secret Service Investigates Him
http://progressive.org/
October 4, 2005

Selina Jarvis is the chair of the social studies department at Currituck County High School in North Carolina, and she is not used to having the Secret Service question her or one of her students.

But that’s what happened on September 20.

Jarvis had assigned her senior civics and economics class “to take photographs to illustrate their rights in the Bill of Rights,” she says. One student “had taken a photo of George Bush out of a magazine and tacked the picture to a wall with a red thumb tack through his head. Then he made a thumb’s down sign with his own hand next to the President’s picture, and he had a photo taken of that, and he pasted it on a poster.”

According to Jarvis, the student, who remains anonymous, was just doing his assignment, illustrating the right to dissent.

But over at the Kitty Hawk Wal-Mart, where the student took his film to be developed, this right is evidently suspect.

An employee in that Wal-Mart photo department called the Kitty Hawk police on the student. And the Kitty Hawk police turned the matter over to the Secret Service.

On Tuesday, September 20, the Secret Service came to Currituck High.“At 1:35, the student came to me and told me that the Secret Service had taken his poster,” Jarvis says. “I didn’t believe him at first. But they had come into my room when I wasn’t there and had taken his poster, which was in a stack with all the others.”

She says the student was upset.

“He was nervous, he was scared, and his parents were out of town on business,” says Jarvis.

She, too, had to talk to the Secret Service.

“Halfway through my afternoon class, the assistant principal got me out of class and took me to the office conference room,” she says. “Two men from the Secret Service were there. They asked me what I knew about the student. I told them he was a great kid, that he was in the homecoming court, and that he’d never been in any trouble.”

Then they got down to his poster.

“They asked me, didn’t I think that it was suspicious,” she recalls. “I said no, it was a Bill of Rights project!”

At the end of the meeting, they told her the incident “would be interpreted by the U.S. attorney, who would decide whether the student could be indicted,” she says.

The student was not indicted, and the Secret Service did not pursue the case further.

“I blame Wal-Mart more than anybody,” she says. “I was really disgusted with them. But everyone was using poor judgment, from Wal-Mart up to the Secret Service.”

A person in the photo department at the Wal-Mart in Kitty Hawk said, “You have to call either the home office or the authorities to get any information about that.”

Jacquie Young, a spokesperson for Wal-Mart at company headquarters, did not provide comment within a 24-hour period.

Sharon Davenport of the Kitty Hawk Police Department said, “We just handed it over” to the Secret Service. “No investigative report was filed.”

Jonathan Scherry, spokesman for the Secret Service in Washington, D.C., said, “We ertainly respect artistic freedom, but we also have the responsibility to look into incidents when necessary. In this case, it was brought to our attention from a private citizen, a photo lab employee.”

Jarvis uses one word to describe the whole incident: “ridiculous.”
 

aps

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How utterly pathetic. I am sure that the Wal Mart employee is a total Bush fan and could not stand to see his wittle Bushy Wushy attacked by someone. After all, this is a red state, and red states won't tolerate anyone who dissents with their beloved president.

I am so glad that my tax dollars are being spent on the Secret Service flying down to North Carolina, staying in a hotel, and questioning people about a stupid poster. If this poster showed holes in Bush with blood coming out, that could be perceived as a threat to the President. But a picture of Bush with a picture of a "thumbs down"? Absolutely pathetic.
 

TimmyBoy

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aps said:
How utterly pathetic. I am sure that the Wal Mart employee is a total Bush fan and could not stand to see his wittle Bushy Wushy attacked by someone. After all, this is a red state, and red states won't tolerate anyone who dissents with their beloved president.

I am so glad that my tax dollars are being spent on the Secret Service flying down to North Carolina, staying in a hotel, and questioning people about a stupid poster. If this poster showed holes in Bush with blood coming out, that could be perceived as a threat to the President. But a picture of Bush with a picture of a "thumbs down"? Absolutely pathetic.
Well, you have to be careful, I don't know if this story is BS or not. Their is no way a District Attorney or a US Attorney General would try to prosecute this kid based on the evidence given in the article. See, alot of citizens don't know their rights and if they did, the police would be in alot of trouble. But then again, so long as their is no video cameras or secret recordings rolling, police can do something technically illegal by the law and then turn around and lie about it. That's not to say that policemen are bad. I have alot of respect for cops. They certainly do not get the pay and respect that they deserve where I live. You have good and bad people in every profession. But most people simply do not understand their rights. See, cops cannot make you stop and talk to them unless they have Articuable Reasonable Suscipicion. Now, you can voluntarily talk to the police if they do not have ARS but they cannot make you talk to them unless they have ARS. But police, legally, they can lie to you. It's perfectly legal for them to lie to you. They can lie and say you are a suspect in a burgulary even though you really are not, just to get you to talk with them. Generally, my response would be "well, if I am a suspect in a crime, then I would like to excercise my right to remain silent. Are you now detaining me?" They could then detain, maybe not legally, but in your court appearance a judge would determine that. If they detained you illegally, the police could be opening themselves up to civil and maybe criminally liabilities; because, even the police have to follow the law, but they have the same rights as any citizen as well.
 

TimmyBoy

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My disclaimer to prevent myself from being sued heh heh:

I am not a practicing attorney. One should seek the legal advice of an attorney regarding any questions concerning the law.
 

walrus

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aps said:
How utterly pathetic. I am sure that the Wal Mart employee is a total Bush fan and could not stand to see his wittle Bushy Wushy attacked by someone. After all, this is a red state, and red states won't tolerate anyone who dissents with their beloved president.
Afflicted with stereotypes a bit, are you? It must be awfully convenient to be able to lump an entire state together for purposes of condemning them. Let's see how else we could make this statement...

"After all, he is black, and blacks won't tolerate..."

"After all, he is gay, and gays won't tolerate..."

"After all, this is a blue state, and blue states won't tolerate anyone who dissents from their beloved perceptions of the world."

You may or may not realize this, but all a "red state" means is that at least 50% of the citizens voted for Bush. Wonder how the other 50% of citizens feel about having their views dictated by someone suffering from geographical prejudice? How intolerant and close-minded of you! And I thought you blue state folks represented tolerance, and acceptance, and love, and compassion, and little bunnies and kittens in the grass. It is always interesting when one of you shows that you are just as prejudiced, intolerant, and close-minded as the people you hate.

BTW, oh wise one from the land of blue; have you ever actually been to any of these red states you hate so much? I have lived in one for more than 25 years and I have never noticed any particular animus against people who don't support Bush. You might be aware that most red states (mine included) remained solidily Democratic for the better part of 150 years. I found far more hostility as a Conservative in New York than I have ever seen brought against a Liberal in the evil red states.
 
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aps

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walrus said:
Afflicted with stereotypes a bit, are you? It must be awfully convenient to be able to lump an entire state together for purposes of condemning them. Let's see how else we could make this statement...

"After all, he is black, and blacks won't tolerate..."

"After all, he is gay, and gays won't tolerate..."

"After all, this is a blue state, and blue states won't tolerate anyone who dissents from their beloved perceptions of the world."

You may or may not realize this, but all a "red state" means is that at least 50% of the citizens voted for Bush. Wonder how the other 50% of citizens feel about having their views dictated by someone suffering from geographical prejudice? How intolerant and close-minded of you! And I thought you blue state folks represented tolerance, and acceptance, and love, and compassion, and little bunnies and kittens in the grass. It is always interesting when one of you shows that you are just as prejudiced, intolerant, and close-minded as the people you hate.

BTW, oh wise one from the land of blue; have you ever actually been to any of these red states you hate so much? I have lived in one for more than 25 years and I have never noticed any particular animus against people who don't support Bush. You might be aware that most red states (mine included) remained solidily Democratic for the better part of 150 years. I found far more hostility as a Conservative in New York than I have ever seen brought against a Liberal in the evil red states.
OMG, Walrus, all this because I made a JOKE? Okaaaaaaaaaaaay.

BTW, I went to college and law school in a red state. I currently live in a red state. (But I was born and raised in Massachusetts. ;) )
 

walrus

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aps said:
How utterly pathetic. I am sure that the Wal Mart employee is a total Bush fan and could not stand to see his wittle Bushy Wushy attacked by someone. After all, this is a red state, and red states won't tolerate anyone who dissents with their beloved president.

I am so glad that my tax dollars are being spent on the Secret Service flying down to North Carolina, staying in a hotel, and questioning people about a stupid poster. If this poster showed holes in Bush with blood coming out, that could be perceived as a threat to the President. But a picture of Bush with a picture of a "thumbs down"? Absolutely pathetic.
Which part was the joke? Apparently I missed it.
 

ANAV

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The disrespectful prick got what he deserved. Any preceived physical threat against the president, verbal or otherwise, must be investigated. The secret service did their job and found the threat not credible. And the picture had nothing to do with the assigned project. I hope he failed the assignment too.
 
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Canuck

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it has been like a slow train coming
but nazi AMerica has arrived
they will arrest yo and lock you
worse is coming
the truth of it is that the neocons are pushing for all out above the law
nazi tactics everywhere
 

TechDad

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TimmyBoy said:
The student was not indicted, and the Secret Service did not pursue the case further.

“I blame Wal-Mart more than anybody,” she says. “I was really disgusted with them. But everyone was using poor judgment, from Wal-Mart up to the Secret Service.”
The secret service is obligated to take threats to the president seriously. Here it looks like someone felt a threat was made and it was investigated and dismissed. Juding from the information provided (which could be a tad biased) they were perhaps heavy-handed in their investigation but no one was detained or charged as far as I can tell.
 

TechDad

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ANAV said:
Any preceived physical threat against the president, verbal or otherwise, is a crime.
Perceived is a precarious word here. Percieved by whom? Are you saying that the walmart employee getting bent out of shape by a photo makes it a crime? I'm not an expert in the law but I'm pretty sure that it is a credible threat, not a percived one.
 

aps

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walrus said:
Which part was the joke? Apparently I missed it.

Ummmm, the paragraph you quoted right before you lectured me. Look above.
 

aps

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ANAV said:
The disrespectful prick got what he deserved. Any preceived physical threat against the president, verbal or otherwise, must be investigated. The secret service did their job and found the threat not credible. And the picture had nothing to do with the assigned project. I hope he failed the assignment too.
Awwww, did someone upset you because he had a picture that was not favorable for your Bushy wushy?
 
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