Income goes up...especially for the rich

[randel]

Income goes up...especially for the rich - Economy



After two years of declines, Americans' income finally rose in 2010. The Internal Revenue Service provided a first peek at taxpayers' returns and it showed that adjusted gross income totaled $8 trillion, up 5.2% from 2009.


snip


Taxpayers earning more than $250,000 saw their total adjusted gross incomes rise by 13.8%, while those bringing home between $200K and $250K enjoyed at 6.7% increase, according to a CNNMoney analysis. Middle-class Americans? Not so fortunate. Those making between $50K and $100K saw their incomes creep up only 1.5%.

snip


Overall, salaries and wages grew 2.1%. But the super-rich saw an 11.2% hike, and those just below them enjoyed a 4.6% increase.
But the middle class saw a drop of 0.7% in wages

 

[randel]

Income goes up...especially for the rich - Economy



After two years of declines, Americans' income finally rose in 2010. The Internal Revenue Service provided a first peek at taxpayers' returns and it showed that adjusted gross income totaled $8 trillion, up 5.2% from 2009.


snip


Taxpayers earning more than $250,000 saw their total adjusted gross incomes rise by 13.8%, while those bringing home between $200K and $250K enjoyed at 6.7% increase, according to a CNNMoney analysis. Middle-class Americans? Not so fortunate. Those making between $50K and $100K saw their incomes creep up only 1.5%.

snip


Overall, salaries and wages grew 2.1%. But the super-rich saw an 11.2% hike, and those just below them enjoyed a 4.6% increase.
But the middle class saw a drop of 0.7% in wages

wages for the middle class drops....

 

[haymarket]

wages for the middle class drops....

get ready for the deluge about the talented and smart deserving their rewards while the rest of us lazy dullards get the crumbs we deserve.

 

[randel]

get ready for the deluge about the talented and smart deserving their rewards while the rest of us lazy dullards get the crumbs we deserve.

i'm ready....lol

 

[1Perry]

Correlates with the policies of Bernanke and Geithner. Seems funny that the arguement is that we should tax people more, not change those policies.

 

[mpg]

get ready for the deluge about the talented and smart deserving their rewards while the rest of us lazy dullards get the crumbs we deserve.

Not likely. There aren't many rich folks in these forums. The opposite seems more likely. People who are in the middle class and oppose the ruling party, are the ones most likely to complain about their wages going down.

 

[imagep]

Not likely. There aren't many rich folks in these forums. The opposite seems more likely. People who are in the middle class and oppose the ruling party, are the ones most likely to complain about their wages going down.

It's mostly poor and middle class on this forum because this forum is fairly inexpensive, and not nearly elite enough for our upper class citizens.

Of course if I was rich, I could probably find something better to do with my time anyway.

 

[imagep]

Income goes up...especially for the rich - Economy



After two years of declines, Americans' income finally rose in 2010. The Internal Revenue Service provided a first peek at taxpayers' returns and it showed that adjusted gross income totaled $8 trillion, up 5.2% from 2009.


snip


Taxpayers earning more than $250,000 saw their total adjusted gross incomes rise by 13.8%, while those bringing home between $200K and $250K enjoyed at 6.7% increase, according to a CNNMoney analysis. Middle-class Americans? Not so fortunate. Those making between $50K and $100K saw their incomes creep up only 1.5%.

snip


Overall, salaries and wages grew 2.1%. But the super-rich saw an 11.2% hike, and those just below them enjoyed a 4.6% increase.
But the middle class saw a drop of 0.7% in wages

Adjusted for inflation?

 

[TurtleDude]

people who have money to invest after t hey pay their tax bills and other expenses are going to see increases in their yearly incomes. Those who spend everything they earn or are given won't

Bravo Foxtrot Delta

 

[StillBallin75]

Income goes up...especially for the rich - Economy



After two years of declines, Americans' income finally rose in 2010. The Internal Revenue Service provided a first peek at taxpayers' returns and it showed that adjusted gross income totaled $8 trillion, up 5.2% from 2009.


snip


Taxpayers earning more than $250,000 saw their total adjusted gross incomes rise by 13.8%, while those bringing home between $200K and $250K enjoyed at 6.7% increase, according to a CNNMoney analysis. Middle-class Americans? Not so fortunate. Those making between $50K and $100K saw their incomes creep up only 1.5%.

snip


Overall, salaries and wages grew 2.1%. But the super-rich saw an 11.2% hike, and those just below them enjoyed a 4.6% increase.
But the middle class saw a drop of 0.7% in wages

Pretty much to be expected.

 

[MKULTRABOY]

Not likely. There aren't many rich folks in these forums. The opposite seems more likely. People who are in the middle class and oppose the ruling party, are the ones most likely to complain about their wages going down.

I'm sorry, those ready to bown-nose the rich number in the dozens of millions.

 

[imagep]

people who have money to invest after t hey pay their tax bills and other expenses are going to see increases in their yearly incomes. Those who spend everything they earn or are given won't

Bravo Foxtrot Delta

Thats true, and should be expected. I don't have an issue with the rich getting richer. It's normal.

I do have an issue with only investments increasing in value/profits while wages and salaries from actually doing work are declining or just barely staying steady. So I guess instead of wondering if income is increasing, we should be wondering how salaries/wages/commissions/compensation from non-passive work are doing.

 

[Neomalthusian]

Thats true, and should be expected. I don't have an issue with the rich getting richer. It's normal.

I do have an issue with only investments increasing in value/profits while wages and salaries from actually doing work are declining or just barely staying steady. So I guess instead of wondering if income is increasing, we should be wondering how salaries/wages/commissions/compensation from non-passive work are doing.

I don't understand why people expect wages to grow indefinitely and concurrently with population (which pushes demand for jobs higher and wages lower) as well as technological advancement (which displaces jobs) while also expecting low unemployment.

Not putting words in your mouth, just speaking in general.

 

[1Perry]

Thats true, and should be expected. I don't have an issue with the rich getting richer. It's normal.

I do have an issue with only investments increasing in value/profits while wages and salaries from actually doing work are declining or just barely staying steady. So I guess instead of wondering if income is increasing, we should be wondering how salaries/wages/commissions/compensation from non-passive work are doing.

It's the governments policy. It's funny how so many who complain about income disparacy are simply unable to complain about the governments policy that is widening this gap.

 

[imagep]

I don't understand why people expect wages to grow indefinitely and concurrently with population (which pushes demand for jobs higher and wages lower) as well as technological advancement (which displaces jobs) while also expecting low unemployment.

Not putting words in your mouth, just speaking in general.

I really don't think it has anything to do with population. you are suggesting that population growth should force wages down because there would be more worker, but as population grows, so does consumer demand, and thus changes in population more or less create or distroy jobs at about the same rate population changes.

Of course there are exceptions to this, like after the black plague in Europe when all of a sudden there were 50% fewer people and just as many castles to live in and just as much land and gold. After the plagues the survivors tended to have a higher standard of living, mostly because they had more land per capita to farm and hunt on, but we are not really talking plagues here.

But technology is what I am talking about. Why shouldn't the entire population expect to make standard of living gains as we become more productive? This includes not only being able to own more stuff, but also being able to have shorter work weeks. For the past 10,000 years as human knowlege and technology increased, our standard of living has increased, even for the relatively poor.

So why shouldn't we expect this to keep happening? Is there something inheritantly bad about having a large prosperous middle class? Should the manager of McDonalds not make a salary that allows him to own a nice middle class home, a late model car in good operating condition, some retirment savings, and to be able to afford to send his kids to college?

 

[imagep]

It's the governments policy. It's funny how so many who complain about income disparacy are simply unable to complain about the governments policy that is widening this gap.

Yes, I have to agree with you. Our government has been steadily cutting the top tax rate for 70 years now. Now most rich people pay a lower marginal tax rate on it's ownership of title (15% capital gains) than the middle class pays on it's income from work. It's a pathetic situation.

The progressive income tax and the inheritance tax are the two main ways that our government can incourage less wealth disparity, unfortunately those who are currently speaking with the loudist voices today are those who wish to reduce the progressivness of income tax and eleminate inheritance tax.

It's my theory that when all income classes are gaining wealth at about the same rate, then taxes are progressive enough. I could even deal with the top 1% having a slight bit more gains than the 99% because thats the normal nature of capitalism, but when the top few percent are getting ALL of the gains, and the middle class is loosing economic power, then we have a problem.

 

[Camlon]

Income goes up...especially for the rich - Economy



After two years of declines, Americans' income finally rose in 2010. The Internal Revenue Service provided a first peek at taxpayers' returns and it showed that adjusted gross income totaled $8 trillion, up 5.2% from 2009.


snip


Taxpayers earning more than $250,000 saw their total adjusted gross incomes rise by 13.8%, while those bringing home between $200K and $250K enjoyed at 6.7% increase, according to a CNNMoney analysis. Middle-class Americans? Not so fortunate. Those making between $50K and $100K saw their incomes creep up only 1.5%.

snip


Overall, salaries and wages grew 2.1%. But the super-rich saw an 11.2% hike, and those just below them enjoyed a 4.6% increase.
But the middle class saw a drop of 0.7% in wages

Why so dishonest? If you know anything about this topic, which I assume you do or you wouldn't make a thread about it, then you would know that incomes declined much more for the rich in 2008 and 2009 than for other groups. The reason they are rising faster again, is because they lost more during the crisis.

Why do you choose to not mention that? Are you trying to drive a political agenda?

 

[KevinKohler]

The rich are also making more now because they are paying less to operate, in terms of what they pay the help. Lot's of reasons for this...some of the work has been shipped out of country, where US labor laws can't touch them (inexplicably), and where the labor costs are low enough even to offset the added cost of shipping (understandably). Then there is automation. And finally, there is a corrupt lobbyist system that is hell bent on ensuring that the majority of all new legislation is pro big business, which results in less competition, because it's harder and harder for start ups and new businesses, greater tax benefits, more rights (lol), etc etc etc.

You wanna fix this trend? Apply US non wage labor laws to the factories that exist over seas, but are considered US companies....no, **** it...ANYTHING sold in the US, apply labor laws to their employees. Then get rid of all the legislation that is designed to protect large corporations from competition, and for god's sake, corps are NOT ****ing people. Lastly, hang all the current corrupt senators, congressmen and women, appointees, etc, and replace them.


Maybe we should change out the order there....but either way, these things would go a long way to fix our issues. THEN we can get into government spending, and from there, address taxes.

 

[randel]

The rich are also making more now because they are paying less to operate, in terms of what they pay the help. Lot's of reasons for this...some of the work has been shipped out of country, where US labor laws can't touch them (inexplicably), and where the labor costs are low enough even to offset the added cost of shipping (understandably). Then there is automation. And finally, there is a corrupt lobbyist system that is hell bent on ensuring that the majority of all new legislation is pro big business, which results in less competition, because it's harder and harder for start ups and new businesses, greater tax benefits, more rights (lol), etc etc etc.

You wanna fix this trend? Apply US non wage labor laws to the factories that exist over seas, but are considered US companies....no, **** it...ANYTHING sold in the US, apply labor laws to their employees. Then get rid of all the legislation that is designed to protect large corporations from competition, and for god's sake, corps are NOT ****ing people. Lastly, hang all the current corrupt senators, congressmen and women, appointees, etc, and replace them.


Maybe we should change out the order there....but either way, these things would go a long way to fix our issues. THEN we can get into government spending, and from there, address taxes.

"Apply US non wage labor laws to the factories that exist over seas, but are considered US companies....no, **** it...ANYTHING sold in the US, apply labor laws to their employees." OK..how would we go about enforcing this?

 

[mpg]

I'm sorry, those ready to bown-nose the rich number in the dozens of millions.

Dozens of millions of people think it's OK for middle class income to go down? I never heard of a single person who feels that way.

 

[MKULTRABOY]

Dozens of millions of people think it's OK for middle class income to go down? I never heard of a single person who feels that way.

I can probably find a quote of a pastor in a megachurch being cheered on while he preaches that the lazy must starve, etc.

I'll see if i can find it, it was on young turks like a year ago.

 

[MKULTRABOY]

LoL here we go.

 

[cpwill]

get ready for the deluge about the talented and smart deserving their rewards while the rest of us lazy dullards get the crumbs we deserve.

:shrug: well, the market will price the worth of your labor based on your net benefit to the employer. the problems with our middle class as far as economic success are concerned are several, but here I would bring up twofold: 1. they are competing in many venues with people who have lower costs of living overseas and 2. those people overseas often benefit from a superior education system than our own, despite the fact that we spend much more money than them per student.

now, as far as falling household income, the actual driving factor in that over the past couple of decades is divorce and single parenthood.

but the increasing liquidity of capital investment means that Americans will have to compete more and more (including "intellectual" white collar workers), and our failure of a public education system means they will be poorly prepared to do so. It's a stereotype because it's true - our schools teach our children to appreciate Lesbian Native American Poetry Month.... but not math. And so currently your Indian student works at school 10-12 hours a day and pays for it by putting in two 10 hour shifts on the weekend at the plant building iPods that will be purchased by the college student currently failing out of his second year of "General Education Studies" at "IWentIntoTooMuchStudentDebt University". Yet it is the second student who assumes that a life of relative ease and wealth is his natural state of existence - because he has been taught to have high self esteem, but not a strong work ethic. That is a disparity of effort and focus that can only survive for so long.

 

[imagep]

The rich are also making more now because they are paying less to operate, in terms of what they pay the help. Lot's of reasons for this...some of the work has been shipped out of country, where US labor laws can't touch them (inexplicably), and where the labor costs are low enough even to offset the added cost of shipping (understandably). Then there is automation. And finally, there is a corrupt lobbyist system that is hell bent on ensuring that the majority of all new legislation is pro big business, which results in less competition, because it's harder and harder for start ups and new businesses, greater tax benefits, more rights (lol), etc etc etc.

You wanna fix this trend? Apply US non wage labor laws to the factories that exist over seas, but are considered US companies....no, **** it...ANYTHING sold in the US, apply labor laws to their employees. Then get rid of all the legislation that is designed to protect large corporations from competition, and for god's sake, corps are NOT ****ing people. Lastly, hang all the current corrupt senators, congressmen and women, appointees, etc, and replace them.


Maybe we should change out the order there....but either way, these things would go a long way to fix our issues. THEN we can get into government spending, and from there, address taxes.

Double Like

 

[imagep]

"Apply US non wage labor laws to the factories that exist over seas, but are considered US companies....no, **** it...ANYTHING sold in the US, apply labor laws to their employees." OK..how would we go about enforcing this?

We have different levels of free trade with different countries. There is something that is called "most prefered trading partner" (or something like that) where there are virtually no taxes involved at all, then their are lower levels where we have lots of import duties. We would most likely have to get serious with this rating system and only give "prefered trading" status to countries that have similar worker and enviromental protections as ours. That not that difficult, info like that is already pretty much in the "CIA Factbook", and if we were missing something our Prez could just pick up the phone and call the Prez or Dictator of another country and say "homie, how much you be paying for minimum wage". Imports from countries that don't have similar protections would have a huge import tax put on them. We could also certify individual companies for prefered trading status if they can prove that they meet our minimum wage requirements, don't overly polute the enviroment, and that their subcontractors all do the same - but we would pass the cost of such certification onto the individual company (it could be expensive to prove and monitor all that).

Free trade is great, but we should only have free trade if we have FAIR trade, and for trade to be fair foreign competition should have to meet our standards or else we have penilized our own companies.