In support of Northam

[ecofarm]

When I was a kid in the 80's I watched Marx Brothers at the Circus, which came out in 1939, and during the black face scene I thought, "Well that's not something you could do today."

People are hearkening back to the 20s to excuse his racism. It's ludicrous. It reads like someone apologizing for their favorite football team, total BS.

 

[Rexedgar]

What he did was not acceptable in the 80s. I dunno where you lived, but around here overt racism has been frowned upon since at least the 70s.

Sup, eco? What do you remember about the ‘70s? :2wave: :mrgreen:

 

[ecofarm]

Sup, eco? What do you remember about the ‘70s? :2wave: :mrgreen:

I remember crawling/walking to the living room, looking out the sliding glass door and seeing a most bizarre creature. It had four legs and fur, and looked rather happy. I crawled/walked, using the walls, to the kitchen to get my parents attention. They adopted the dog. That musta been about '73.

You were already collecting pension then, right?

 

[Skeptic Bob]

What he did was not acceptable in the 80s. I dunno where you lived, but around here overt racism has been frowned upon since at least the 70s.

Public elementary schools had kids wearing red face for Thanksgiving plays and pageants in the early 80s. It doesn’t surprise me if black face was labeled racist before red face was, but I wonder by how many years?

 

[ecofarm]

Public elementary schools had kids wearing red face for Thanksgiving plays and pageants in the early 80s. It doesn’t surprise me if black face was labeled racist before red face was, but I wonder by how many years?

Racism was not okay in the 80s.

 

[Rexedgar]

I remember crawling/walking to the living room, looking out the sliding glass door and seeing a most bizarre creature. It had four legs and fur, and looked rather happy. I crawled/walked, using the walls, to the kitchen to get my parents attention. They adopted the dog. That musta been about '73.

You were already collecting pension then, right?

That was “Tower Week.” Nice stealth edit, memory is the first thing that goes, I forget what the second thing is.........

 

[Skeptic Bob]

Racism was not okay in the 80s.

No, but what society as a whole considers racist has changed over the years.

 

[Cardinal]

No, but what society as a whole considers racist has changed over the years.

Granted, I was just a kid during the 80's, but I remember that decade well enough to know that black face was most assuredly not cool by then. Doing black face didn't exist in any kind of gray area. It was known to be unacceptable.

 

[SoCal]

...memory is the first thing that goes, I forget what the second thing is.........

Thankfully, some things never get old...

 

[ecofarm]

That was “Tower Week.” Nice stealth edit, memory is the first thing that goes, I forget what the second thing is.........

I heard there's no more tower because too many idiots ran into it. Dunno if that's true.

 

[vesper]

The practice of digging back in some politicians life is nothing new and has been that way forever and has been used against their opponent. Ironically what many people are finding baffling is how did Gillespie's team miss this one? And why was this brought up just a day after Northam expressed his support for infanticide explaining it in detail on a radio program? Some are suggesting that his comments were so explosive and damaging to the Democratic party that someone wanted to bring him down to get rid of him.


Don't know about any of that only that this governor's own words changing his story now three times has cooked his own goose. And what he revealed in his press conference today he shared he dressed up in black face for a dance contest portraying Michael Jackson in San Antonio Texas the same year. But it isn't just the photo but the man in med school had a racist nickname "Coonman" which was also printed on that page.

Well he refuses to resign so he may be around for awhile.

 

[Rexedgar]

I heard there's no more tower because too many idiots ran into it. Dunno if that's true.

They only used three sides.........in 1860..:mrgreen:

 

[calamity]

While I do kind of get a kick out of all the media and politicians squirming in their seats over this guy and the picture I do want to be fair to him, as I'd hope others would be fair in different circumstances.

This picture was taken in 1984. That's 35 years ago and, frankly, a lifetime ago from a sociological perspective. Back then it wasn't uncommon to look at issues of race from a sarcastic perspective. We often made fun of racial issues as a way of pointing out the silliness of ever having had any real hatred. TV shows such as The Jeffersons, Benson, Different Strokes and The Cosby Show, among others, poked fun at racists. This episode of Saturday Night Live features Billy Crystal in blackface talking to Joe Piscopo. Does anyone really think Billy Crystal was doing that because he was a racist?

Times change. People change. Things we thought were funny or "cool" in one generation are often looked at with scorn in subsequent generations. It's just the way things go. It's also rather unfair to expect someone to look 35 years in the future and envision an act which is seen as relevant and provocative in the current time to be offensive in the later time.

There is plenty of reason to dislike Northam. His support of a vile "abortion" bill is enough. But the "racism" bit is, in my opinion, very much overblown. Unless the guy has a history of disenfranchising blacks it's rather unfair to use one picture from a generation ago to judge him today.

Remember, in Right WingLand, racist pictures are only acceptable when they are attached to treason.

 

[MrMike]

He needs to resign. The Democrats set the bar for his ejection from that role. If he doesn't then Democrats (like in many other instances) have little to stand on when they harp about others.

 

[maxparrish]

While I do kind of get a kick out of all the media and politicians squirming in their seats over this guy and the picture I do want to be fair to him, as I'd hope others would be fair in different circumstances.

This picture was taken in 1984. That's 35 years ago and, frankly, a lifetime ago from a sociological perspective. Back then it wasn't uncommon to look at issues of race from a sarcastic perspective. We often made fun of racial issues as a way of pointing out the silliness of ever having had any real hatred. TV shows such as The Jeffersons, Benson, Different Strokes and The Cosby Show, among others, poked fun at racists. This episode of Saturday Night Live features Billy Crystal in blackface talking to Joe Piscopo. Does anyone really think Billy Crystal was doing that because he was a racist?

Times change. People change. Things we thought were funny or "cool" in one generation are often looked at with scorn in subsequent generations. It's just the way things go. It's also rather unfair to expect someone to look 35 years in the future and envision an act which is seen as relevant and provocative in the current time to be offensive in the later time.

There is plenty of reason to dislike Northam. His support of a vile "abortion" bill is enough. But the "racism" bit is, in my opinion, very much overblown. Unless the guy has a history of disenfranchising blacks it's rather unfair to use one picture from a generation ago to judge him today.

All of what you wrote is common sense, but common sense is rarely employed on issues of race or gender. Northam is a hypocrite and a fool, but like the resignation of Al Franken, the demand for his resignation is totally unwarranted, at least on this basis.

He didn't loot, rape, assault, cheat, or abuse anyone, in college he got dressed into a tasteless costuming for some social function. He's not, for example, Senator Bryd who was a KKK recruiter and enjoyed a life long career as a Democratic Senator. He wasn't one the of Southern politicians that continually voted for segregation (in order to get reelected) while touted as a liberal (e.g. Fulbright).

He was a college kid doing a riff.

Fact is, we have regressed. "All in the Family", a show created by a liberal on behalf of liberal views of race, is now out-of-date and discomforting to the new mindset. Even more recent shows of the last two decades, such as "Living Color" was only a bit more tolerated because it was primarily done by black actors mocking blacks, homosexuals, the disabled, etc. Today, we are as intolerant of humor regarding social decorum on race as we were in the 1950s starch necked south, i.e. its two sides of the same coin.

When the day comes that you can attend a costume party dressed as a sheik, a cowboy, a tramp, a doctor, an A. Indian, or a vaudevillian, gold miner, a Liberace, or a even a tampon box in any face color or cultural regalia is the day in which we are truly liberated from the repression of being offended.

Apparently we are further from that than the 70s.

 

[Puigb]

Remember, in Right WingLand, racist pictures are only acceptable when they are attached to treason.

good lord, has McConnell always looked old?

 

[Amelia]

I find it hard to buy that initially Northam apologized, and now he denies ever posing in blackface or a Klucker outfit.

Seems to me I would certainly remember if such an event occurred, even that many years ago. (provided I wasn't Kavanaugh drunk that is).

Did he finally outright deny posing?

The mealy-mouthed retraction I saw made it sound like he was only denying having been photographed in the costume. Stepping around the subject of him having worn it.

Whatever. The order of events stunk, either way.

 

[Amelia]

Oh brother ... now he's admitting to blackface ... but saying it was only a Michael Jackson costume and he won a contest with his moonwalk.

Yeah, that's a reason to confess to being in that racist yearbook photo and apologizing for it. Because of that one time that he dressed up like Michael Jackson.

*face palm*

 

[Lutherf]

Racism was not okay in the 80s.

Racism wasn't OK but making a provocative or ironic statement about racism was fine. There wasn't a "zero tolerance" thing like we have today. Back them people were more or less expected to look at not only the overt act but also the context in which the act was presented. They were expected to understand that ideas could be challenged in various ways, including irony.

 

[trouble13]

While I do kind of get a kick out of all the media and politicians squirming in their seats over this guy and the picture I do want to be fair to him, as I'd hope others would be fair in different circumstances.

This picture was taken in 1984. That's 35 years ago and, frankly, a lifetime ago from a sociological perspective. Back then it wasn't uncommon to look at issues of race from a sarcastic perspective. We often made fun of racial issues as a way of pointing out the silliness of ever having had any real hatred. TV shows such as The Jeffersons, Benson, Different Strokes and The Cosby Show, among others, poked fun at racists. This episode of Saturday Night Live features Billy Crystal in blackface talking to Joe Piscopo. Does anyone really think Billy Crystal was doing that because he was a racist?

Times change. People change. Things we thought were funny or "cool" in one generation are often looked at with scorn in subsequent generations. It's just the way things go. It's also rather unfair to expect someone to look 35 years in the future and envision an act which is seen as relevant and provocative in the current time to be offensive in the later time.

There is plenty of reason to dislike Northam. His support of a vile "abortion" bill is enough. But the "racism" bit is, in my opinion, very much overblown. Unless the guy has a history of disenfranchising blacks it's rather unfair to use one picture from a generation ago to judge him today.

I dont know what the intent was behind the picture. That seems to be a question that isnt being asked nor an explanation being offered.

I commend you for treating him the same as you would anyone else even though you do not share his political views. It's too bad the left does not share the same sense of fairness.

If this guy were a member of the Republican party their reaction would be much more eviscerating. That does not mean we should react in kind toward him but it is something to remember when the left goes after someone. They suffer from selective outrage that is in many instances manufactured

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[SonOfDaedalus]

While I do kind of get a kick out of all the media and politicians squirming in their seats over this guy and the picture I do want to be fair to him, as I'd hope others would be fair in different circumstances.

This picture was taken in 1984. That's 35 years ago and, frankly, a lifetime ago from a sociological perspective. Back then it wasn't uncommon to look at issues of race from a sarcastic perspective. We often made fun of racial issues as a way of pointing out the silliness of ever having had any real hatred. TV shows such as The Jeffersons, Benson, Different Strokes and The Cosby Show, among others, poked fun at racists. This episode of Saturday Night Live features Billy Crystal in blackface talking to Joe Piscopo. Does anyone really think Billy Crystal was doing that because he was a racist?

Times change. People change. Things we thought were funny or "cool" in one generation are often looked at with scorn in subsequent generations. It's just the way things go. It's also rather unfair to expect someone to look 35 years in the future and envision an act which is seen as relevant and provocative in the current time to be offensive in the later time.

There is plenty of reason to dislike Northam. His support of a vile "abortion" bill is enough. But the "racism" bit is, in my opinion, very much overblown. Unless the guy has a history of disenfranchising blacks it's rather unfair to use one picture from a generation ago to judge him today.

I do agree there is a general problem where we reevaluate actions out of the context of the time they occurred. Culture has changed significantly in the past 30 years. It doesn't make much sense to go into the past and judge people's past actions 30 years ago by today's standards.

I have no problem cutting some slack here.

 

[Lutherf]

I dont know what the intent was behind the picture. That seems to be a question that isnt being asked nor an explanation being offered.

I commend you for treating him the same as you would anyone else even though you do not share his political views. It's too bad the left does not share the same sense of fairness.

If this guy were a member of the Republican party their reaction would be much more eviscerating. That does not mean we should react in kind toward him but it is something to remember when the left goes after someone. They suffer from selective outrage that is in many instances manufactured

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I'm a firm believer that we should treat others as we would like to be treated. That doesn't mean we can't throw a jab here and there but I'm not really inclined to destroy anyone's life or career without knowing for sure what they did. I grew up in upstate New York. We had a different view on race than other may have had.

I remember one day when I was in the service and on a TDY to Warner Robins, GA. I was talking to a black guy I was working with and he kept calling me "sir". I noted that we were the same rank and that neither of us were officers. He proceeded to tell me that, having grown up in the south, he called all white guys "sir". It was one of those eye-opening experiences for me as I figured we were equals and shouldn't have any qualms about joking around.

 

[VanceMack]

Say 1-I'm sorry...that was wrong..I'm bad.
Day 2-"I believe now and then that I am not either of the people in this photo"

Son...if you werent the person in that photo, day 1 you wouldnt have admitted guilt. There is no ****ing way you dont know if you are a clown wearing blackface or standing in a Klan outfit. And if that was in your yearbook? Theres no way in hell you didnt know it was there.

 

[ecofarm]

They only used three sides.........in 1860..:mrgreen:

And still Joe hit the tower. One did during my class. I suspect the instructors had some fun occasionally, knowing the winds meant only 2 should be used.

 

[ecofarm]

Racism wasn't OK but making a provocative or ironic statement about racism was fine. There wasn't a "zero tolerance" thing like we have today. Back them people were more or less expected to look at not only the overt act but also the context in which the act was presented. They were expected to understand that ideas could be challenged in various ways, including irony.

Why are you gas lighting racism via false history and false equivalence?