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Imam’s wife: Nixing mosque ‘not option’

BDBoop

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MANAMA, Bahrain - The imam behind a controversial plan to build a mosque near the Manhattan site of the Sept. 11 attacks, refused to discuss the political firestorm yesterday, but his wife in New York said organizers are sticking with their plans.

Imam Feisal Abdul Rauf is on the first leg of a 15-day Mideast tour funded by the U.S. State Department, and said yesterday in Bahrain that he preferred to speak about shared concerns that radical religious views pose to security in both the West and the Muslim world.

“This issue of extremism is something that has been a national security issue - not only for the United States, but also for many countries and nations in the Muslim world,” Rauf said. “This is why this particular trip has a great importance, because all countries in the Muslim world - as well as the Western world - are facing this . . . major security challenge.”
 

PeteEU

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Wow a muslim extremist jihadist terrorist allowing his woman to speak for him... .. wait a minute that is impossible if he was a muslim extremist jihadist terrorist..
 

The Uncola

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I'll bet you one million dollars she made this statement while wearing a Hijab or a Burqa.
So what if she is (or isn't) dressed in her cuitural preference? What the Hell is wrong with that? Who died and appointed you fashion cop? Anyone telling you how to dresss?

Gawd, hypocrites and bigots make me wanna puke.
 

Gardener

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From the article: "In Bahrain, Rauf said he has been working on a way to “Americanize Islam.”

I think they might have it backwards.
 

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So what if she is (or isn't) dressed in her cuitural preference? What the Hell is wrong with that? Who died and appointed you fashion cop? Anyone telling you how to dresss?

Gawd, hypocrites and bigots make me wanna puke.
The Hihab and the Burqa are both signs of the subservient roll of women within Islam.
 

Jetboogieman

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Ground Zero Mosque Thread Count:


Seriously, why do we need to continue talking about this?

Most NOT ALL people are against this mosque because they believe most of Islam represents Terror. If that's the case, the non-practising muslim somali-Canadian girl I've gone on a couple of dates with is just biding her time til she can cut my head off in my own apartment /facepalm

You've tried to paint the Imam as a radical... but the far right tries to paint ANYONE they don't like as a radical, including the president, forgive me if it seems a little disengenious.

You've tried to call it a "Victory Mosque" Or "Mosque of Conquest" some have even gone as far as to call it "A base of operations for Jihadists". It is ONLY that way if you think most Islam means terror. This thing will not Tower over Ground Zero.

You've tried to claim for your own political expediency that the president "Endorses the mosque". You pull up the entire transcript of his original speech and you show me EXACTLY where he endorsed it, no, he said what the conciense of America the "Land of the free" should be saying, that

"They have the right, to build a place of worship, just like everybody else"

What is wrong with that statement? But you'll say BUT NO MR President, we KNOW THAT! But you should be as bigoted and fearful as we are!

I don't agree with any religion for that matter, but this has gone far beyond just the ground zero mosque, people are opposing it by citing how terrible Islam is... so if all you say is correct then you must be in favour of all muslims being deported? I mean surely ANY mosque could be a base of operations for jihadists? Not just one at ground zero?

Yes maybe some Muslims want Sharia Law, there might be some christains who want a similar thing imposed... but they have the right to those views, but if they ever tried to impose it on the rest of the country, I'd be the first to stand up and stop them. But until such time, they can have those backward views if they wish... it is not a reason to deny them what is theirs.

Mosques have begun being opposed across the country, you watch a single politician run on an Anti-Islamic platform, and we're gonna start having problems.

As I have said before, theirs a fine line between Prejudice, Discrimination and finally persecution.

One day, maybe it'll take 10 years, but you COULD find yourself on the other side of that line... it isn't hard.

And don't tell me "Oh well they persecute christains in Saudi Arabia" OK! So your answer is to be just like them to show how free and fair you are? Yep that makes sense.

I retire from these ****ing threads. It's a brickwall debate.

:peace
 
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Gardener

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You've tried to paint the Imam as a radical... but the far right tries to paint ANYONE they don't like as a radical, including the president, forgive me if it seems a little disengenious.

Speaking of disingenuous, here is an Imam who supports sharia law, and here you are trying to frame those who might oppose such as being some sort of radical right winger.

Heaven help us if we have actually arrived at point where a person cannot oppose the brutality of Sharia without being accused of being a racist or a fear monger or a ...gasp ....a "right winger" for doing so.
 

iangb

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The Hihab and the Burqa are both signs of the subservient roll of women within Islam.
From the article: "In Bahrain, Rauf said he has been working on a way to “Americanize Islam.”

I think they might have it backwards.
Taken from a recent blog:
iangb said:
Don't get so disproportionately scared about Muslims who 'think the world would be better if it was all Muslim'; wouldn't many Christians believe the same about Christianity? And whatever you do, don't tell all Muslims 'This is what you believe, and you're violent because of it'; quite apart from the fact that they're better qualified than you are to know what they personally believe, imagine what would happen if they all suddenly decided you were right!
/relevance
 

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You've tried to paint the Imam as a radical... but the far right tries to paint ANYONE they don't like as a radical, including the president, forgive me if it seems a little disengenious.
The man labeled the U.S. an accessory to 9-11 and OBL as made in the USA less than 3 weeks after the attacks, he has called for a Sharia compliant U.S., and refuses to condemn Hamas as a terrorist organization, and now he wants to build a victory Mosque at Ground Zero. Sounds pretty radical to me.

You've tried to call the it a "Victory Mosque" Or "Mosque of Conquest" some have ever one as far as to call it "A base of operations for Jihadists". It is ONLY that way if you think most Islam means terror. This thing will not Tower over Ground Zero.
No it's that way because that's what it is, there is no other reason to build the Mosque there at that specific location, there is no giant Muslim community in pressing need of more space to pray, in fact they already have 2 Mosques less than 12 blocks away. This would be like building an Orthodox Cathedral at Srebrenica, are all Christians responsible for the genocide of Muslims at Srebrenica? No but you would certainly have to question the motivations behind the specific people who wished to build an Orthodox Cathedral there.

You've tried to claim for your own political expediency that the president "Endorses the mosque". You pull up the entire transcript of his original speech and you show me EXACTLY where he endorsed it, no he said what the conciense of America the "Land of the free" should be saying, that
Well he endoresed their right to build the Mosque at a dinner at which two Islamist were present one of which is the President of an organization listed as an unindicted terrorist financing co-conspirator. But no he has not actually endorsed the building of the Mosque itself only their right to do so.


Yes maybe some Muslims want Sharia Law,
This Imam wants Sharia law.

there might be some christains who want a similar thing imposed...
Which mainstream Christian sects actively promote the criminilization of Apostasy and Homosexuality?
 

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Taken from a recent blog:

/relevance
Except the Ulama in all five mainstream Schools of Islamic Fiqh (Hanafi, Maliki, Shafi'i, Hanbali, and Ja'fari) have ruled through Ijma that apostasy, homosexuality, adultery, and/or premarital sex are capital and/or corporal offenses. Call me when any mainstream Christian sect starts calling for the death penalty or lashings for those non-crimes, or even calling for the criminilization of those actions.
 

The Uncola

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The Hihab and the Burqa are both signs of the subservient roll of women within Islam.
Because you say so? Why should I listen to anyone that is doing nothing more trying infest others with hatred and bigotry? Save for it for your next Teabagger Rally, I'm not fooled.
 

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Because you say so?
What other reason is there for women to cover themselves from head to toe? Are you one of those people who makes the laughable assertion that the Burqa represents the liberation of women rather than the inverse?

Why should I listen to anyone that is doing nothing more trying infest others with hatred and bigotry? Save for it for your next Teabagger Rally, I'm not fooled.
Yes I'm a bigot because I'm opposed to overt symbols of gender discrimination. :roll:
 

Gardener

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Because you say so? Why should I listen to anyone that is doing nothing more trying infest others with hatred and bigotry? Save for it for your next Teabagger Rally, I'm not fooled.
I think the word you are looking for is "infect", not "infest".


How is the opposition to a legal system that regards half the population as chattel indicative of hatred or bigotry, though? I would think any actual liberal would oppose such obvious misogyny, and you must be full of hatred and bigotry against women, since you would oppose it, too, if not .
 

deltabtry

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Even if this Mosque goes ahead with this plan, good luck to them in trying to get it built. NYC is a union town and nothing is built without it. Also being in the trucking industry, good luck to them in trying to get building materials delivered. Having talk with others in my industry, most companies will not deliver to this proposed site and for those who will, the drivers themselves will most likely refuse such as myself. Also if this organization tries to have this built with non union labor, the sh*t will hit the fan and it is standing policy for most non union trucking companies NOT to cross union lines.
 

PeteEU

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I'll bet you one million dollars she made this statement while wearing a Hijab or a Burqa.
You most likely owe me a million dollars then, since she rare if at all wears a Hijab or Burqa. She is in fact quite the activist her self.
 

The Uncola

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I think the word you are looking for is "infect", not "infest".
Wrong buddy, I said infest and I meant infest. Just like cockroaches, in more ways than one.

I'll make a deal with ya. You say what you want, in the way you want and I'll do the same with what I want to say. That work for you?


How is the opposition to a legal system that regards half the population as chattel indicative of hatred or bigotry, though? I would think any actual liberal would oppose such obvious misogyny, and you must be full of hatred and bigotry against women, since you would oppose it, too, if not .
We're weren't discussing "a legal system that regards half the population as chattel," you should try to keep up. That guy was making a completely false inference that what clothes a person was wearing somehow affected what they said.

As to the rest of your drivel, I'll place it in the circular file where it belongs.
 

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We're weren't discussing "a legal system that regards half the population as chattel," you should try to keep up. That guy was making a completely false inference that what clothes a person was wearing somehow affected what they said.

As to the rest of your drivel, I'll place it in the circular file where it belongs.
Yes yes the Burqa and Hijab are not overt signs of gender discrimination. In fact they're a sign of woman's liberation. :roll:
 

Gardener

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Wrong buddy, I said infest and I meant infest. Just like cockroaches, in more ways than one.

I'll make a deal with ya. You say what you want, in the way you want and I'll do the same with what I want to say. That work for you?




We're weren't discussing "a legal system that regards half the population as chattel," you should try to keep up. That guy was making a completely false inference that what clothes a person was wearing somehow affected what they said.

As to the rest of your drivel, I'll place it in the circular file where it belongs.
Too much coffee this morning, little fella?
 

iangb

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Except the Ulama in all five mainstream Schools of Islamic Fiqh (Hanafi, Maliki, Shafi'i, Hanbali, and Ja'fari) have ruled through Ijma that apostasy, homosexuality, adultery, and/or premarital sex are capital and/or corporal offenses. Call me when any mainstream Christian sect starts calling for the death penalty or lashings for those non-crimes, or even calling for the criminilization of those actions.
Page 16 of the relevant report. To paraphrase from the table: To the statement "Homosexuality is a way of life that should be discouraged by society"; 61% of Muslims agreed, 64% of evangelical Protestants agreed, 68% of Mormons agreed and 76% of Jehova's Witnesses agreed. (Oh, and 10% of agnostics; the lowest group :))

Clearly churches should only be built if they're not Evangelical or Mormon. Other tables in the report show a similar pattern, for example Muslims see less 'conflict between religion and modern society' than all of the Cristian faiths, and find that their 'values are threatened by Hollywood' less than all groups but historically black Protestant churches (page 14).

Islam is adapting, especially in (comparatively liberal) places like the US, where an alternative to fundamentalism is clearly visible and legally protected. Alienating Muslims by insisting that they're all really secret fundamentalists will only drive them in that direction; it's a self-fulfilling prophecy.
 
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j-mac

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Even if this Mosque goes ahead with this plan, good luck to them in trying to get it built. NYC is a union town and nothing is built without it. Also being in the trucking industry, good luck to them in trying to get building materials delivered. Having talk with others in my industry, most companies will not deliver to this proposed site and for those who will, the drivers themselves will most likely refuse such as myself. Also if this organization tries to have this built with non union labor, the sh*t will hit the fan and it is standing policy for most non union trucking companies NOT to cross union lines.

Absolutely!!!!! From the Daily News today:


A growing number of New York construction workers are vowing not to work on the mosque planned near Ground Zero.

snip

Louis Coletti, president of the Building Trades Employers' Association, said unions have not yet taken a "formal position" on Park51, but he understands why members would be hesitant to work there.

"It's a very difficult dilemma for the contractors and the organized labor force because we are experiencing such high levels of unemployment," he said. "Yet at the same time, this is a very sacred sight to the union guys."

"There were construction workers killed on 9/11 and many more who got horribly sick cleaning up Ground Zero," Coletti said. "It's very emotional."


L.V. Spina, a Manhattan construction worker who created anti-mosque stickers that some workers are slapping on their hardhats, said he would "rather pick cans and bottles out of trash cans" than build the Islamic center near Ground Zero.

"But if they moved it somewhere else, we would put up a prime building for these people," he said. "Hell, you could do it next to my house in Rockaway Beach, I would be fine with it. But I'm not fine with it where blood has been spilled."

They won't build it! Hardhats vow not to work on controversial mosque near Ground Zero
it is NOT going to get built!


j-mac
 

Thorgasm

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Ground Zero Mosque Thread Count:


Seriously, why do we need to continue talking about this?

Most NOT ALL people are against this mosque because they believe most of Islam represents Terror. If that's the case, the non-practising muslim somali-Canadian girl I've gone on a couple of dates with is just biding her time til she can cut my head off in my own apartment /facepalm

You've tried to paint the Imam as a radical... but the far right tries to paint ANYONE they don't like as a radical, including the president, forgive me if it seems a little disengenious.

You've tried to call it a "Victory Mosque" Or "Mosque of Conquest" some have even gone as far as to call it "A base of operations for Jihadists". It is ONLY that way if you think most Islam means terror. This thing will not Tower over Ground Zero.

You've tried to claim for your own political expediency that the president "Endorses the mosque". You pull up the entire transcript of his original speech and you show me EXACTLY where he endorsed it, no, he said what the conciense of America the "Land of the free" should be saying, that

"They have the right, to build a place of worship, just like everybody else"

What is wrong with that statement? But you'll say BUT NO MR President, we KNOW THAT! But you should be as bigoted and fearful as we are!

I don't agree with any religion for that matter, but this has gone far beyond just the ground zero mosque, people are opposing it by citing how terrible Islam is... so if all you say is correct then you must be in favour of all muslims being deported? I mean surely ANY mosque could be a base of operations for jihadists? Not just one at ground zero?

Yes maybe some Muslims want Sharia Law, there might be some christains who want a similar thing imposed... but they have the right to those views, but if they ever tried to impose it on the rest of the country, I'd be the first to stand up and stop them. But until such time, they can have those backward views if they wish... it is not a reason to deny them what is theirs.

Mosques have begun being opposed across the country, you watch a single politician run on an Anti-Islamic platform, and we're gonna start having problems.

As I have said before, theirs a fine line between Prejudice, Discrimination and finally persecution.

One day, maybe it'll take 10 years, but you COULD find yourself on the other side of that line... it isn't hard.

And don't tell me "Oh well they persecute christains in Saudi Arabia" OK! So your answer is to be just like them to show how free and fair you are? Yep that makes sense.

I retire from these ****ing threads. It's a brickwall debate.

:peace
This is just another one of those wedge issues that we see every election season. In the past it was the 10 Commandments, flag burning, or gay marriage. It does a disservice to political discourse in this country. It's sad that there are some people in Oklahoma are going to vote based on a NY City issue.
 

deltabtry

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This is just another one of those wedge issues that we see every election season. In the past it was the 10 Commandments, flag burning, or gay marriage. It does a disservice to political discourse in this country. It's sad that there are some people in Oklahoma are going to vote based on a NY City issue.
Why did you pick Oklahoma?...I betcha there will be some in Guam who will do the same.
 

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This is just another one of those wedge issues that we see every election season. In the past it was the 10 Commandments, flag burning, or gay marriage. It does a disservice to political discourse in this country. It's sad that there are some people in Oklahoma are going to vote based on a NY City issue.

Wedge Issue? How can you wedge an issue that has bi partisan opposition to it? Nah, no wedge here, just arrogant liberals that want everyone else to say the sky is green.


j-mac
 

Thorgasm

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Why did you pick Oklahoma?...I betcha there will be some in Guam who will do the same.
The media doesn't care about Guam's local elections. It cares about Congressional elections.

Some might say that Oklahoma is the belt buckle of the bible belt. But you can substitute any state. It's not important as to which one.
 
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